I will say whatever Apple wants me to say if they pay me 75,000. Buying off witness and call him a designer?!?!?!?!?!?
Irrelevant. Expert witnesses are almost always compensated by one side (in a few cases, both sides pay, but that's quite rare). It does not negate the testimony in any way.
It was worth mentioning, as that is the angle that Samsung was using as a foil.
For AI to ignore that completely, and frame him solely as a design expert, is disingenuous.
AI ignored a lot of irrelevant details - like what color the guy's shirt was, what he had for breakfast that morning, and the bra size of his wife.
It's standard practice for the attorneys to bring it up and it's standard practice for everyone else to ignore it because it's meaningless. If they attorneys were able to demonstrate that the expert's opinion were invalid, they would have to do that directly. Simply taking money from one side doesn't prove it.
Of course, if they did what you are suggesting, then you'd have to invalidate most of Samsung's defense since Samsung employees are receiving money from Samsung. Apple is backing up their opinion with documents and photographs while Samsung is simply saying "that's not what happened". I guess we should not let them speak since they're biased, right?
Spot on.
This case needs to be handled by an international court!
There is absolutely no doubt that this biased bitch koh is going to hand Crapple the "victory".
South Korea 5ting!
Your evidence that she's biased? In fact, she's been quite tolerant of Samsung's blatant violations of her orders. She could have essentially awarded Apple the victory already due to Samsung's jury tampering, but chose not to.
And why would an international court handle a U.S. patent case? Since when did the U.S. cede domestic affairs to an international court?
And why did you sign up simply to spew anti-Apple garbage when you clearly have no understanding of legal realities?
I honestly believe that in the long run, it's Apple who will win most of the patent lawsuits that actually matter. No matter what those lawyers say, there's no way that a judge is going to ignore the plain clear fact (that you can clearly see in the photos even with zero knowledge about the matter) that Samsung is in some way too heavily inspired by Apple's design choices.
OK, I have a serious question. If Samsung can be sued for design infringement, then why don't refrigerator, microwave, washing machine/dryer, vacuum cleaner, DVD/Blu-ray player, TV manufacturers, etc. sue each other into oblivion for similar designs?
Your evidence that she's biased? In fact, she's been quite tolerant of Samsung's blatant violations of her orders. She could have essentially awarded Apple the victory already due to Samsung's jury tampering, but chose not to.
Because then her bias would have been too obvious. Fear not, she will award Apple the victory soon enough.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
And why would an international court handle a U.S. patent case? Since when did the U.S. cede domestic affairs to an international court?
Because Samsung is not a US company (yes, companies do exist outside of the country of god and guns).
It is clear the Samsung cannot expect fairness in the current US.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
... when you clearly have no understanding of legal realities?
We might not know the details of US "law", but we know unfairness and racial bias when we see it!
Your evidence that she's biased? In fact, she's been quite tolerant of Samsung's blatant violations of her orders. She could have essentially awarded Apple the victory already due to Samsung's jury tampering, but chose not to.
Because then her bias would have been too obvious. Fear not, she will award Apple the victory soon enough.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
And why would an international court handle a U.S. patent case? Since when did the U.S. cede domestic affairs to an international court?
Because Samsung is not a US company (yes, companies do exist outside of the country of god and guns).
It is clear the Samsung cannot expect fairness in the current US.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
... when you clearly have no understanding of legal realities?
We might not know the details of US "law", but we know unfairness and racial bias when we see it!
Your evidence that she's biased? In fact, she's been quite tolerant of Samsung's blatant violations of her orders. She could have essentially awarded Apple the victory already due to Samsung's jury tampering, but chose not to.
Because then her bias would have been too obvious. Fear not, she will award Apple the victory soon enough.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
And why would an international court handle a U.S. patent case? Since when did the U.S. cede domestic affairs to an international court?
Because Samsung is not a US company (yes, companies do exist outside of the country of god and guns).
It is clear the Samsung cannot expect fairness in the current US.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
... when you clearly have no understanding of legal realities?
We might not know the details of US "law", but we know unfairness and racial bias when we see it!
I think that's because that particular industry doesn't really seem to care. They knów that it happens, but they all need it in order to sell a reasonable amount of devices. And the high-end brands that have their designs copied don't care because they have very different types of clients.
Besides, their technology is also very patented and probably heavily licensed
Is it just me or does the question asking whether the design expert had actually witnessed anyone mistakenly purchasing the Samsung product thinking it was an Apple product objectionable? The witness is not an expert in the observation of retail point of purchase habits, but an expert on design. Yes I see that may be the crux o the matter, whether the design similarity has actually in fact led to any confusion on the part of the consumer, but this witness might never have had an opportunity to witness first hand any one purchasing wither device.
That is like asking a structural engineer their assessment of the ability of a structure to withstand (fill in some natural disaster here) and then to follow up by asking him whether or not he has personally witnessed a building collapse under the conditions he described. You don't need to have lived through a first hand earthquake for example to calculate the impact such an event would have on a structure.
Maybe what they should do is take everyone in the court house and run them through a test where each product flashed briefly on a screen and they have to push a button indicating whether it was a Samsung product or an Apple product on screen and then count up how many people got it wrong and how long they hesitate while trying to decide. Studies like that are done all the time to measure lots of things so should not be hard to do.
OK, I have a serious question. If Samsung can be sued for design infringement, then why don't refrigerator, microwave, washing machine/dryer, vacuum cleaner, DVD/Blu-ray player, TV manufacturers, etc. sue each other into oblivion for similar designs?
Because none of those manufacturers have design patents that are as detailed as Apple's. Furthermore, none of them revolutionized their industry the way that Apple did. For refrigerators, microwaves, etc, they really DID get to the current design via a natural progression - or at least everyone thought so and never bothered to patent their designs.
Is it just me or does the question asking whether the design expert had actually witnessed anyone mistakenly purchasing the Samsung product thinking it was an Apple product objectionable? The witness is not an expert in the observation of retail point of purchase habits, but an expert on design. Yes I see that may be the crux o the matter, whether the design similarity has actually in fact led to any confusion on the part of the consumer, but this witness might never have had an opportunity to witness first hand any one purchasing wither device.
An expert must be certified as an expert to be able toe express an OPINION. Anyone (expert or not) can state facts that they observed. It is certainly allowable to ask someone what they've observed. Of course, Apple could then ask him how much time he spent hanging around the cash registers of big box stores to show that even if people were mis-buying Samsung products every day he probably wouldn't have seen it.
It's really a moot point. Samsung's own documents state that the #1 reason for returns of their products at Best Buy was because people thought they were buying an iDevice and bought Samsung instead. That's going to carry a lot more weight than someone who probably doesn't hang out at Best Buy's cash register - and even if he did, the consumers didn't realize their error until they got home.
... was because people thought they were buying an iDevice and bought Samsung instead. That's going to carry a lot more weight than someone who probably doesn't hang out at Best Buy's cash register - and even if he did, the consumers didn't realize their error until they got home.
These consumer must be really dumb (if the whole thing is not a lie by Applekoh) -- they must be Americans.
Samsung went from geek to sheik after the iPad came out. Their tablet attempt looked like a large Sony PSP (Probably copied that too), and their phone was a complete abomination. Based on these pictures, I can't believe they are even having a trial. Guilty as charged. Let's move on.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fairness
I will say whatever Apple wants me to say if they pay me 75,000. Buying off witness and call him a designer?!?!?!?!?!?
Spot on.
This case needs to be handled by an international court!
There is absolutely no doubt that this biased bitch koh is going to hand Crapple the "victory".
South Korea 5ting!
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR
I'm sorry. It has to be said.
You Stupid. Dumb. F*ck.
I knew nobody would moderate this sort of language.
J. Ive, Dieter Rams wants his designs back.
Irrelevant. Expert witnesses are almost always compensated by one side (in a few cases, both sides pay, but that's quite rare). It does not negate the testimony in any way.
AI ignored a lot of irrelevant details - like what color the guy's shirt was, what he had for breakfast that morning, and the bra size of his wife.
It's standard practice for the attorneys to bring it up and it's standard practice for everyone else to ignore it because it's meaningless. If they attorneys were able to demonstrate that the expert's opinion were invalid, they would have to do that directly. Simply taking money from one side doesn't prove it.
Of course, if they did what you are suggesting, then you'd have to invalidate most of Samsung's defense since Samsung employees are receiving money from Samsung. Apple is backing up their opinion with documents and photographs while Samsung is simply saying "that's not what happened". I guess we should not let them speak since they're biased, right?
Your evidence that she's biased? In fact, she's been quite tolerant of Samsung's blatant violations of her orders. She could have essentially awarded Apple the victory already due to Samsung's jury tampering, but chose not to.
And why would an international court handle a U.S. patent case? Since when did the U.S. cede domestic affairs to an international court?
And why did you sign up simply to spew anti-Apple garbage when you clearly have no understanding of legal realities?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
Explain for me how those devices look anything alike? I'm sure not seeing it.
I think the rectangular shape with semi-rounded edges is self-explained and self-expressed in the photos.
I honestly believe that in the long run, it's Apple who will win most of the patent lawsuits that actually matter. No matter what those lawyers say, there's no way that a judge is going to ignore the plain clear fact (that you can clearly see in the photos even with zero knowledge about the matter) that Samsung is in some way too heavily inspired by Apple's design choices.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Your evidence that she's biased? In fact, she's been quite tolerant of Samsung's blatant violations of her orders. She could have essentially awarded Apple the victory already due to Samsung's jury tampering, but chose not to.
Because then her bias would have been too obvious. Fear not, she will award Apple the victory soon enough.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
And why would an international court handle a U.S. patent case? Since when did the U.S. cede domestic affairs to an international court?
Because Samsung is not a US company (yes, companies do exist outside of the country of god and guns).
It is clear the Samsung cannot expect fairness in the current US.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
... when you clearly have no understanding of legal realities?
We might not know the details of US "law", but we know unfairness and racial bias when we see it!
South Korea 5ting!
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Your evidence that she's biased? In fact, she's been quite tolerant of Samsung's blatant violations of her orders. She could have essentially awarded Apple the victory already due to Samsung's jury tampering, but chose not to.
Because then her bias would have been too obvious. Fear not, she will award Apple the victory soon enough.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
And why would an international court handle a U.S. patent case? Since when did the U.S. cede domestic affairs to an international court?
Because Samsung is not a US company (yes, companies do exist outside of the country of god and guns).
It is clear the Samsung cannot expect fairness in the current US.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
... when you clearly have no understanding of legal realities?
We might not know the details of US "law", but we know unfairness and racial bias when we see it!
South Korea 5ting!
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Your evidence that she's biased? In fact, she's been quite tolerant of Samsung's blatant violations of her orders. She could have essentially awarded Apple the victory already due to Samsung's jury tampering, but chose not to.
Because then her bias would have been too obvious. Fear not, she will award Apple the victory soon enough.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
And why would an international court handle a U.S. patent case? Since when did the U.S. cede domestic affairs to an international court?
Because Samsung is not a US company (yes, companies do exist outside of the country of god and guns).
It is clear the Samsung cannot expect fairness in the current US.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
... when you clearly have no understanding of legal realities?
We might not know the details of US "law", but we know unfairness and racial bias when we see it!
South Korea 5ting!
I think that's because that particular industry doesn't really seem to care. They knów that it happens, but they all need it in order to sell a reasonable amount of devices. And the high-end brands that have their designs copied don't care because they have very different types of clients.
Besides, their technology is also very patented and probably heavily licensed
Is it just me or does the question asking whether the design expert had actually witnessed anyone mistakenly purchasing the Samsung product thinking it was an Apple product objectionable? The witness is not an expert in the observation of retail point of purchase habits, but an expert on design. Yes I see that may be the crux o the matter, whether the design similarity has actually in fact led to any confusion on the part of the consumer, but this witness might never have had an opportunity to witness first hand any one purchasing wither device.
That is like asking a structural engineer their assessment of the ability of a structure to withstand (fill in some natural disaster here) and then to follow up by asking him whether or not he has personally witnessed a building collapse under the conditions he described. You don't need to have lived through a first hand earthquake for example to calculate the impact such an event would have on a structure.
Maybe what they should do is take everyone in the court house and run them through a test where each product flashed briefly on a screen and they have to push a button indicating whether it was a Samsung product or an Apple product on screen and then count up how many people got it wrong and how long they hesitate while trying to decide. Studies like that are done all the time to measure lots of things so should not be hard to do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
Very poor attempt at trolling. Sorry.
If you only want to see what you want then be my guest. Just because we disagree on the photo makes me a troll, huh? Really?
Because none of those manufacturers have design patents that are as detailed as Apple's. Furthermore, none of them revolutionized their industry the way that Apple did. For refrigerators, microwaves, etc, they really DID get to the current design via a natural progression - or at least everyone thought so and never bothered to patent their designs.
An expert must be certified as an expert to be able toe express an OPINION. Anyone (expert or not) can state facts that they observed. It is certainly allowable to ask someone what they've observed. Of course, Apple could then ask him how much time he spent hanging around the cash registers of big box stores to show that even if people were mis-buying Samsung products every day he probably wouldn't have seen it.
It's really a moot point. Samsung's own documents state that the #1 reason for returns of their products at Best Buy was because people thought they were buying an iDevice and bought Samsung instead. That's going to carry a lot more weight than someone who probably doesn't hang out at Best Buy's cash register - and even if he did, the consumers didn't realize their error until they got home.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Furthermore, none of them revolutionized their industry the way that Apple did.
LOL
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
... was because people thought they were buying an iDevice and bought Samsung instead. That's going to carry a lot more weight than someone who probably doesn't hang out at Best Buy's cash register - and even if he did, the consumers didn't realize their error until they got home.
These consumer must be really dumb (if the whole thing is not a lie by Applekoh) -- they must be Americans.
Quote:
Originally Posted by eric475
J. Ive, Dieter Rams wants his designs back.
What...?
Samsung went from geek to sheik after the iPad came out. Their tablet attempt looked like a large Sony PSP (Probably copied that too), and their phone was a complete abomination. Based on these pictures, I can't believe they are even having a trial. Guilty as charged. Let's move on.