You're missing the entire point here. That not everyone is using this exclusively means nothing when applied to whether this is a computer. I hope your major isn't in computing.
We can go back to the old car analogy. Sports cars are a small percentage of the car market. Does that mean they aren't cars? Think carefully. If you answer the wrong way, you've destroyed your iPad argument. If you answer the other wrong way, you show that you know nothing about cars.
But I need a personal computer that does 3D modeling, not a business computer, yet; but a personal computer, but crap my iPad doesn't do that grrrrrr
Granted, an iPad will do what a good amount of people need. I've argued that before. However, I notice a lot of people that don't need a computer to do work, love to play flash game (i'll be the first one to say, i don't want/miss flash) but you can't do that and even if you could, it'd be miserable to play without a mouse.
The iPad can't download many programs that people get off the internet. The iPad is a great device, but it's a better supplementary device than a true "PC" and is by no means a "computer" according to your definition.
Everyone I know has a PC and an iPad. They still need the PC more than the iPad. Because at the end of the day, how in the hell are people going to get those digital pictures off their digital camera (everyone doesn't have a smartphone yet, especially with a good camera in it; the iphone camera is great but it'll be a couple of years before the stand alone cameras take a huge hit)
That said, I still love my iPad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna
It isn't a computer, full stop
The catch is that not everyone needs a computer. A vast majority of folks just need something that will read email, show them photos etc. Before they had to get a computer because that was the only option. Or at least the only decent one. Smartphones were okay for some folks, but tablets really provided an option for a greater group. And they are going for it. And they vastly outnumber those that truly need a real computer.
What about flash videos and games? that the vast majority of people play? That said, i understand all the app store games and flash dying out blah blah
I also wish the iPad would gain mouse support, its nice on the go to have a touchscreen, but what about hooking it up to the TV to use it on the big monitor and sitting back to use only a mouse (easier than holding the iPad). I know a ton of people that do that with their PCs.
Anyway, it is based on opinion whether or not the iPad is a full PC or not. I think its a great supplementary device, but even with school work aside, the iPad doesn't deliver in some areas. Anyone who does only web surfing (even the experience there isn't prefect; example, on apple's website, i was unable to get a popup to come up for the education website, which may or may not be fixed by now, but it worked on my PC 1 minute later.
The iPad most certainly is a computer. The question isn't is is a computer, it's is it a PC. My answer is it's the most personal computer ever made.
By that logic, the iPhone too is a computer, and given that phones are shared much less often than tablets, the iPhone is the most Personal Computer ever made.
But why twist words? "Personal" in the context of PC has an established meaning. Apple calls it a tablet, and not a PC.
This argument is getting old. Of course it's a computer. It does far more than the first computers (mainframes, minicomputers, workstations and microcomputers) did.
99% of the work 99% of the people using conputers for personal use do, can easily be done on an iPad. There is a lot of work that 99% don't do, that can be done on an iPad as well.
And what do most people do with their computers?
Browse the web.
Look something up on the web.
Buy something on the web.
Do e-mail.
Play simple games.
Do light printing such as pictures and letters.
Some homework.
That covers almost everything for most people. If a device can do that, then it's all those people need. And a computer is a device that is something that computes. Even a smartphone is a computer.
You guys are not talking about what is a computer. You're defining what you think is sufficient for your own needs, and you think that if it isn't sufficient for your own needs, then by YOUR definition, it isn't a computer.
In my three person household, we have two iMacs, two MacBook Pro's, and one Mac Pro. Those are in addition to the four iPads we have.
By your definitions, none of those are computers, because enterprise users can't replace their mainframes with them. After all, they can't do any of that work. Or that of a supercomputer, or a minicomputer, or some high end workstations.
So where does the definition stop? After all that first Altair 8080 didn't do much of anything, but it was acknowledged as being a computer.
A few things:
"play simple games" which are usually done with flash, well that is out. So iPad can't do that
I don't play games on my computers, if i ever do, they aren't "simple" and a mouse is needed. However, of the people I know that play games a lot. They say playing games on a computer is more enjoyable, and i would agree. But it is certainly more handy to play them on an iPad.
Printing letters/pictures? I know I am not "up-to-date" considering I have other places my money needs to go. But, the iPad doesn't support USB printers? Given, it has no USB. Plus it can not get the pictures off of a digital camera.
Anyway, even my mom will need that dumb PC to back up her iPhone and iPad. If only the iPad had a USB, it'd win a lot more people over.
Is it responsible for all the loss? Of course not. Is it responsible for most of it? No. Is it responsible for some of it? Of course it is.
A recent survey has shown that a remarkable 30%+ number of people with iPads have them as their only computer (other than perhaps a smartphone.). Thats almost double the percentage from last years survey, usi g double the number of iPads in the market. When the number of iPads sold is looked at, that's a large number, over 5 million for last quarter alone. I believe it, as I know of two people who only have iPads.
It could have kicked several hundred thousand sales from Hp's computers to the iPad. That would certainly contribute to a loss.
Even if people aren't using iPads alone, they are putting off buying a new computer in favor of an iPad, and that slows down computer sales as well, and just as effectively.
I believe that a lot of people who have taken a look at Win 8 have been scared off. It's receiving terrible press, both consumer and business. This will lead, m sure, to increased Mac and iPad sales.
My daughter would be one of the people that decided to use an iPad instead of a Dell laptop. At first she said an iPad wouldn't work for school because she needed MS Office. I downloaded Pages for her on my iPad and within an hour she had me return the Dell and get her a New iPad. So I don't disagree with you. My comments were mostly directed at the fact that there is a surge of ultrabooks. Clearly Apple is moving towards blurring the lines between OSX and iOS. Mountain Lion does a great job at bring that line even closer.
While I have no doubt the data is correct that many are using the iPad as their primary computer I don't believe that is what Apple wants to happen. I also believe that the primary problem with HP is their stuff sucks and is loaded with bloatware. If Apple wanted the iPad to be a primary computer they wouldn't be creating Retina display Macbook pros. While I could be wrong on this I do believe the iMac and Mac mini are going to see very few upgrades and have the same fate as the Mac Pro where it will be around if you really want one.
I also find that articles like this are just too vague. As far as Windows 8 I believe Windows 7 will be around for a long time because people are going to freak out when they see Windows 8. That is a huge learning curve for the average consumer.
"play simple games" which are usually done with flash, well that is out. So iPad can't do that
I don't play games on my computers, if i ever do, they aren't "simple" and a mouse is needed. However, of the people I know that play games a lot. They say playing games on a computer is more enjoyable, and i would agree. But it is certainly more handy to play them on an iPad.
Printing letters/pictures? I know I am not "up-to-date" considering I have other places my money needs to go. But, the iPad doesn't support USB printers? Given, it has no USB. Plus it can not get the pictures off of a digital camera.
Anyway, even my mom will need that dumb PC to back up her iPhone and iPad. If only the iPad had a USB, it'd win a lot more people over.
Honestly, I don't think you can attribute the theoretical pending loss to Apple iPad demand. If HP posts a big loss, it will be due to two issues: 1. The overall world economy. 2. HP's products.
Sales. Consumer PC sales are down across the board due to the fact that people have no money to spend. Sales to companies are way down (HP's biggest source of income) because companies are slashing budgets due to the economy. Companies & individuals that do have money, spend it on Apple products. All the other people (the lowest common denominator) who the PC industry has historically targeted, don't have any money. And then the kinds of people who can't bring themselves to buy high quality products when times are good, are certainly not going to be buying anything now.
Products. HP needs to rethink their entire product line(s). Simplify. Take advantage of economies of scale. For example, there are literally dozens of preconfigured DL-3xx servers offered, and a near infinite number of customizations. WHY?!? HP needs to shrink that down to just TWO (a 1U and a 2U). Preconfigure nothing. Start with the chassis+motherboard, and then customize it all online... Why do you need a dozen CPU choices? Why do you need ~50 different choices of RAM? Why do you need to choose between 8 different power supplies? Answer: You don't.
For the CPU(s) have a choice of 3 - one low end, one mid-performance/efficiency, and one high end. Choose your CPU type, then choose quantity (1-4). For RAM, have a choice of maybe 3 types, but with smart selection so that you can't pair the wrong type of RAM with the CPU choice. Choose your RAM type (registered, non), then choose quantity (8-192GB). Eliminate the RAID choice entirely - make the best RAID product a standard feature on all systems, it's on the logic board now anyway. For power supplies, 2 choices (smart selection depending on power consumption of CPUs, RAM, etc).
Don't get me started on HP laptops. Our company uses them. They are not always reliable. And they're big, thick, and ugly. Try to look one up on HP.com... There are so many models, it's impossible to keep track of what's already out there, let alone what new models one should choose from. Simplify! HP needs to cut down all the models to just FOUR - one each of 11, 13, 15, & 17". Customize online. Might as well keep the design aesthetic that looks like a MacBook, but make them black anodized aluminum to keep the corporate suits happy and so they don't look quite so much like a direct rip-off of Apple's designs.
HP has the same problem with too many models of desktop PCs... And printers... And...
Good. What a shitty company. Never had a single product form them that did not have repeated hardware failures.
I'm an Apple fan, but it's amazing to see HP go downhill like this. They were a great company. 9 BILLION in a quarter. Wow.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribalogical
HP is in the red, and it's POSSIBLE the iPad is "contributing" in some way (significantly? Maybe… or maybe JUST a little?) to that loss… Fairly vague supposition of a headline there, no?
I think it's more likely a competitive combination of Apple iMacs, Laptops, AND iPads (since the quarterly numbers for all three keep growing year on year)… PLUS other players who are growing dramatically… I'd give the most weight to that last one, actually...
Uh, that opinion has been put forth by many industry experts. I don't think we need to give too much credibility to your guesses about what's doing the damage.
Also, many simple games exist (for free) on the app store.
I said there were games on app store. However, you can easily buy a 80gb external for 40 bucks vs 25gb iCloud. And the hard drive could easily last 10 years given its low usage. So, 400 vs 40 bucks. U pick
The iPad is great but most people still need a PC, just dont need to refresh them as much
But I need a personal computer that does 3D modeling, not a business computer, yet; but a personal computer, but crap my iPad doesn't do that grrrrrr
Granted, an iPad will do what a good amount of people need. I've argued that before. However, I notice a lot of people that don't need a computer to do work, love to play flash game (i'll be the first one to say, i don't want/miss flash) but you can't do that and even if you could, it'd be miserable to play without a mouse.
The iPad can't download many programs that people get off the internet. The iPad is a great device, but it's a better supplementary device than a true "PC" and is by no means a "computer" according to your definition.
Everyone I know has a PC and an iPad. They still need the PC more than the iPad. Because at the end of the day, how in the hell are people going to get those digital pictures off their digital camera (everyone doesn't have a smartphone yet, especially with a good camera in it; the iphone camera is great but it'll be a couple of years before the stand alone cameras take a huge hit)
That said, I still love my iPad.
What about flash videos and games? that the vast majority of people play? That said, i understand all the app store games and flash dying out blah blah
I also wish the iPad would gain mouse support, its nice on the go to have a touchscreen, but what about hooking it up to the TV to use it on the big monitor and sitting back to use only a mouse (easier than holding the iPad). I know a ton of people that do that with their PCs.
Anyway, it is based on opinion whether or not the iPad is a full PC or not. I think its a great supplementary device, but even with school work aside, the iPad doesn't deliver in some areas. Anyone who does only web surfing (even the experience there isn't prefect; example, on apple's website, i was unable to get a popup to come up for the education website, which may or may not be fixed by now, but it worked on my PC 1 minute later.
This is a useless argument though lol
I understand what you need. I also need my Mac Pro. But what does that have to do with your definition that the iPad isn't a computer?
My daughter would be one of the people that decided to use an iPad instead of a Dell laptop. At first she said an iPad wouldn't work for school because she needed MS Office. I downloaded Pages for her on my iPad and within an hour she had me return the Dell and get her a New iPad. So I don't disagree with you. My comments were mostly directed at the fact that there is a surge of ultrabooks. Clearly Apple is moving towards blurring the lines between OSX and iOS. Mountain Lion does a great job at bring that line even closer.
While I have no doubt the data is correct that many are using the iPad as their primary computer I don't believe that is what Apple wants to happen. I also believe that the primary problem with HP is their stuff sucks and is loaded with bloatware. If Apple wanted the iPad to be a primary computer they wouldn't be creating Retina display Macbook pros. While I could be wrong on this I do believe the iMac and Mac mini are going to see very few upgrades and have the same fate as the Mac Pro where it will be around if you really want one.
I also find that articles like this are just too vague. As far as Windows 8 I believe Windows 7 will be around for a long time because people are going to freak out when they see Windows 8. That is a huge learning curve for the average consumer.
Ok, that works for me.
I wonder what Apple intended, or even thought about. Remember what SJ said in an interview shortly before he came back to Apple, when he was asked what he would do IF he came back to Apple:
" I would milk the Mac for all it was worth, and then I'd go on to the next big thing."
Isn't that EXACTLY what he did? Would Apple object to selling ten times as many iPads as Macs? 20 times as many? 100 times as many? And if that obsoleted Mac sales, would they really care? I don't know, maybe not.
I understand what you need. I also need my Mac Pro. But what does that have to do with your definition that the iPad isn't a computer?
It's a computing device but not what a computer is currently considered. In 3-5 years. This conversation will probably fall in favor of the iPad. But not ATM in the opinion of 50% of people I'm sure.
I said there were games on app store. However, you can easily buy a 80gb external for 40 bucks vs 25gb iCloud. And the hard drive could easily last 10 years given its low usage. So, 400 vs 40 bucks. U pick
The iPad is great but most people still need a PC, just dont need to refresh them as much
Interestingly enough, the lifetime of a HDD has little to do with its useage. A study done a couple of years ago showed that even new, unopened drives had the same reliability issues as drives that were used for the same amount of time that the other drives were on the shelf. I've got a bunch of bad HDD's in my computer room. I don't keep a drive after three years of use, as that's when failures begin to rise. You may get lucky though. Some drives last much longer. But it's still a crapshoot.
Ok, that works for me.
I wonder what Apple intended, or even thought about. Remember what SJ said in an interview shortly before he came back to Apple, when he was asked what he would do IF he came back to Apple:
" I would milk the Mac for all it was worth, and then I'd go on to the next big thing."
Isn't that EXACTLY what he did? Would Apple object to selling ten times as many iPads as Macs? 20 times as many? 100 times as many? And if that obsoleted Mac sales, would they really care? I don't know, maybe not.
iPads are the future of computing, almost no one will use a laptop or desktop in a few years.
Why would they.
It's a computing device but not what a computer is currently considered. In 3-5 years. This conversation will probably fall in favor of the iPad. But not ATM in the opinion of 50% of people I'm sure.
It's only some people who think that way. Even the companies that evaluate sales, and who don't dump tablets in with "computers" in the rankings yet, say they are computers, but don't know where to put them. But that already changing, as Changewave, and a couple of others are putting them in with computer sales.
There are more powerful, and less powerful computers, we don't seperate them into computers, and non computers, just as we don't say that sports cars aren't cars because they can't carry six people and a lot of luggage.
Printing letters/pictures? I know I am not "up-to-date" considering I have other places my money needs to go. But, the iPad doesn't support USB printers?
So what? It supports WiFi printers just fine. And if you really MUST use a USB-only printer, you can put a cheap print server on the network and solve the problem.
Hint: Your Mac Pro won't support Serial or Parallel printers out of the box. Does that mean that it's not a 'real' computer?
Given, it has no USB. Plus it can not get the pictures off of a digital camera.
Yes, it can. You can use the iPad Camera Connection Kit. Or with some cameras, you can transfer the photos by WiFi. Or, worst case, you can transfer the photos to your computer and then to the iPad.
Anyway, even my mom will need that dumb PC to back up her iPhone and iPad. If only the iPad had a USB, it'd win a lot more people over.
Based on what? Where's your evidence? And please explain how it is that you know more than Apple about what the iPad needs.
Yes, most people use a computer to back up an iPad or iPhone (although you can use the Cloud if you wish and if you are only using apps that support iCloud). So what? I can't use my convertible to transport 100 bags of mulch to my house every spring. Does that mean that the convertible isn't a transportation device?
The issue in this thread is that most people already have a computer. If they're looking for another one, an iPad will often meet their needs so an iPad may may more sense for some people than buying another desktop computer. Not ALL people. Maybe not even a large percentage of people. But SOME people can use an iPad instead of a desktop computer (and a few of them have posted here), so the concept that the iPad is cutting into HP's sales is not that difficult to comprehend.
iPads are the future of computing, almost no one will use a laptop or desktop in a few years.
Why would they.
J.
I'm willing to bet that you're mostly right. I agree with what SJ said, about desktops and laptops becoming trucks. I doubt I'll never need a Mac Pro, or equivelant, assuming I'm still bothering with what I do on it. But I'll be doing more of that on an iPad.
Even now, when I design parts and such, I use a 3D CAD app on my iPad. The retina display has made that better. Next year, a more powerful CPU and GPU will make it faster.
iPad demand expected to contribute to HP's largest-ever quarterly loss
I call bullcrap and double bullcrap! Everyone knows the iPad is completely useless for EVERYTHING. It's just an overpriced toy that only idiot consumers buy. H-P makes Windows computers which are supposedly great for EVERYTHING because they're cheap, have lots of ports, run Adobe Flash and especially Microsoft Office. Ask any Windows fanboi and they'll tell you that much. How could a useless iPad possibly put a hurting on H-P sales? Don't consumers know what's important in this world? I'm sure I've heard you can't do ANYTHING on a computing device that doesn't come with Windows. Hell, even Steve Ballmer said that they're selling more Windows licenses now than they ever did in history. Since when has Steve Ballmer ever been wrong?
It must be their investment in the TouchPad because there is no way that the iPad could be affecting traditional PC sales seeing as how the iPad isn't a [I]real[/I] PC¡ /s /sarcasm lol [SIZE=0](is that obvious enough)[/SIZE]
Lol, once again, being an Apple form. Of course this will happen.
Now thats where it comes in as "is and is not." Your opinion = is; mine = is,is not Why? I can't run heavy programs on it, I can't do 3D modeling, and even if i could, it'd be hell without a mouse or a stylus (a fine point). However, my mom has replaced her computer altogether with the iPad (3). So is it? Nope Is it not? Nope
It's simply opinion, IMO haha If the iPad were a full computer, why would I just have ordered a Macbook to finish out my college career?
Just because you can do some things on some other computer doesn't make the iPad not a computer. I can't use a macbook to run the web server for our company because we have too much traffic, does that mean the macbook isn't a computer? Of course not.
I'm willing to bet that you're mostly right. I agree with what SJ said, about desktops and laptops becoming trucks. I doubt I'll never need a Mac Pro, or equivelant, assuming I'm still bothering with what I do on it. But I'll be doing more of that on an iPad.
Even now, when I design parts and such, I use a 3D CAD app on my iPad. The retina display has made that better. Next year, a more powerful CPU and GPU will make it faster.
Numbers on the iPad is a real power tool. With almost no learning curve I managed to import (.csv files) and edit lots of spreadsheets. Even layout and export to PDF was easy to do. And all without a computer (as some would say).
The point is that learning Numbers and using it is a lot easier on the iPad.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
You're missing the entire point here. That not everyone is using this exclusively means nothing when applied to whether this is a computer. I hope your major isn't in computing.
We can go back to the old car analogy. Sports cars are a small percentage of the car market. Does that mean they aren't cars? Think carefully. If you answer the wrong way, you've destroyed your iPad argument. If you answer the other wrong way, you show that you know nothing about cars.
But I need a personal computer that does 3D modeling, not a business computer, yet; but a personal computer, but crap my iPad doesn't do that grrrrrr
Granted, an iPad will do what a good amount of people need. I've argued that before. However, I notice a lot of people that don't need a computer to do work, love to play flash game (i'll be the first one to say, i don't want/miss flash) but you can't do that and even if you could, it'd be miserable to play without a mouse.
The iPad can't download many programs that people get off the internet. The iPad is a great device, but it's a better supplementary device than a true "PC" and is by no means a "computer" according to your definition.
Everyone I know has a PC and an iPad. They still need the PC more than the iPad. Because at the end of the day, how in the hell are people going to get those digital pictures off their digital camera (everyone doesn't have a smartphone yet, especially with a good camera in it; the iphone camera is great but it'll be a couple of years before the stand alone cameras take a huge hit)
That said, I still love my iPad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna
It isn't a computer, full stop
The catch is that not everyone needs a computer. A vast majority of folks just need something that will read email, show them photos etc. Before they had to get a computer because that was the only option. Or at least the only decent one. Smartphones were okay for some folks, but tablets really provided an option for a greater group. And they are going for it. And they vastly outnumber those that truly need a real computer.
What about flash videos and games? that the vast majority of people play? That said, i understand all the app store games and flash dying out blah blah
I also wish the iPad would gain mouse support, its nice on the go to have a touchscreen, but what about hooking it up to the TV to use it on the big monitor and sitting back to use only a mouse (easier than holding the iPad). I know a ton of people that do that with their PCs.
Anyway, it is based on opinion whether or not the iPad is a full PC or not. I think its a great supplementary device, but even with school work aside, the iPad doesn't deliver in some areas. Anyone who does only web surfing (even the experience there isn't prefect; example, on apple's website, i was unable to get a popup to come up for the education website, which may or may not be fixed by now, but it worked on my PC 1 minute later.
This is a useless argument though lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by alandail
The iPad most certainly is a computer. The question isn't is is a computer, it's is it a PC. My answer is it's the most personal computer ever made.
By that logic, the iPhone too is a computer, and given that phones are shared much less often than tablets, the iPhone is the most Personal Computer ever made.
But why twist words? "Personal" in the context of PC has an established meaning. Apple calls it a tablet, and not a PC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
This argument is getting old. Of course it's a computer. It does far more than the first computers (mainframes, minicomputers, workstations and microcomputers) did.
99% of the work 99% of the people using conputers for personal use do, can easily be done on an iPad. There is a lot of work that 99% don't do, that can be done on an iPad as well.
And what do most people do with their computers?
Browse the web.
Look something up on the web.
Buy something on the web.
Do e-mail.
Play simple games.
Do light printing such as pictures and letters.
Some homework.
That covers almost everything for most people. If a device can do that, then it's all those people need. And a computer is a device that is something that computes. Even a smartphone is a computer.
You guys are not talking about what is a computer. You're defining what you think is sufficient for your own needs, and you think that if it isn't sufficient for your own needs, then by YOUR definition, it isn't a computer.
In my three person household, we have two iMacs, two MacBook Pro's, and one Mac Pro. Those are in addition to the four iPads we have.
By your definitions, none of those are computers, because enterprise users can't replace their mainframes with them. After all, they can't do any of that work. Or that of a supercomputer, or a minicomputer, or some high end workstations.
So where does the definition stop? After all that first Altair 8080 didn't do much of anything, but it was acknowledged as being a computer.
A few things:
"play simple games" which are usually done with flash, well that is out. So iPad can't do that
I don't play games on my computers, if i ever do, they aren't "simple" and a mouse is needed. However, of the people I know that play games a lot. They say playing games on a computer is more enjoyable, and i would agree. But it is certainly more handy to play them on an iPad.
Printing letters/pictures? I know I am not "up-to-date" considering I have other places my money needs to go. But, the iPad doesn't support USB printers? Given, it has no USB. Plus it can not get the pictures off of a digital camera.
Anyway, even my mom will need that dumb PC to back up her iPhone and iPad. If only the iPad had a USB, it'd win a lot more people over.
But i still love my iPad 2 haha
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
Is it responsible for all the loss? Of course not. Is it responsible for most of it? No. Is it responsible for some of it? Of course it is.
A recent survey has shown that a remarkable 30%+ number of people with iPads have them as their only computer (other than perhaps a smartphone.). Thats almost double the percentage from last years survey, usi g double the number of iPads in the market. When the number of iPads sold is looked at, that's a large number, over 5 million for last quarter alone. I believe it, as I know of two people who only have iPads.
It could have kicked several hundred thousand sales from Hp's computers to the iPad. That would certainly contribute to a loss.
Even if people aren't using iPads alone, they are putting off buying a new computer in favor of an iPad, and that slows down computer sales as well, and just as effectively.
I believe that a lot of people who have taken a look at Win 8 have been scared off. It's receiving terrible press, both consumer and business. This will lead, m sure, to increased Mac and iPad sales.
My daughter would be one of the people that decided to use an iPad instead of a Dell laptop. At first she said an iPad wouldn't work for school because she needed MS Office. I downloaded Pages for her on my iPad and within an hour she had me return the Dell and get her a New iPad. So I don't disagree with you. My comments were mostly directed at the fact that there is a surge of ultrabooks. Clearly Apple is moving towards blurring the lines between OSX and iOS. Mountain Lion does a great job at bring that line even closer.
While I have no doubt the data is correct that many are using the iPad as their primary computer I don't believe that is what Apple wants to happen. I also believe that the primary problem with HP is their stuff sucks and is loaded with bloatware. If Apple wanted the iPad to be a primary computer they wouldn't be creating Retina display Macbook pros. While I could be wrong on this I do believe the iMac and Mac mini are going to see very few upgrades and have the same fate as the Mac Pro where it will be around if you really want one.
I also find that articles like this are just too vague. As far as Windows 8 I believe Windows 7 will be around for a long time because people are going to freak out when they see Windows 8. That is a huge learning curve for the average consumer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seankill
A few things:
"play simple games" which are usually done with flash, well that is out. So iPad can't do that
I don't play games on my computers, if i ever do, they aren't "simple" and a mouse is needed. However, of the people I know that play games a lot. They say playing games on a computer is more enjoyable, and i would agree. But it is certainly more handy to play them on an iPad.
Printing letters/pictures? I know I am not "up-to-date" considering I have other places my money needs to go. But, the iPad doesn't support USB printers? Given, it has no USB. Plus it can not get the pictures off of a digital camera.
Anyway, even my mom will need that dumb PC to back up her iPhone and iPad. If only the iPad had a USB, it'd win a lot more people over.
But i still love my iPad 2 haha
http://store.apple.com/ca/product/MC531ZM/A/apple-ipad-camera-connection-kit + http://store.apple.com/ca/browse/campaigns/airprint
Also, you can back it up via iCloud.
Also, many simple games exist (for free) on the app store.
Honestly, I don't think you can attribute the theoretical pending loss to Apple iPad demand. If HP posts a big loss, it will be due to two issues: 1. The overall world economy. 2. HP's products.
Sales. Consumer PC sales are down across the board due to the fact that people have no money to spend. Sales to companies are way down (HP's biggest source of income) because companies are slashing budgets due to the economy. Companies & individuals that do have money, spend it on Apple products. All the other people (the lowest common denominator) who the PC industry has historically targeted, don't have any money. And then the kinds of people who can't bring themselves to buy high quality products when times are good, are certainly not going to be buying anything now.
Products. HP needs to rethink their entire product line(s). Simplify. Take advantage of economies of scale. For example, there are literally dozens of preconfigured DL-3xx servers offered, and a near infinite number of customizations. WHY?!? HP needs to shrink that down to just TWO (a 1U and a 2U). Preconfigure nothing. Start with the chassis+motherboard, and then customize it all online... Why do you need a dozen CPU choices? Why do you need ~50 different choices of RAM? Why do you need to choose between 8 different power supplies? Answer: You don't.
For the CPU(s) have a choice of 3 - one low end, one mid-performance/efficiency, and one high end. Choose your CPU type, then choose quantity (1-4). For RAM, have a choice of maybe 3 types, but with smart selection so that you can't pair the wrong type of RAM with the CPU choice. Choose your RAM type (registered, non), then choose quantity (8-192GB). Eliminate the RAID choice entirely - make the best RAID product a standard feature on all systems, it's on the logic board now anyway. For power supplies, 2 choices (smart selection depending on power consumption of CPUs, RAM, etc).
Don't get me started on HP laptops. Our company uses them. They are not always reliable. And they're big, thick, and ugly. Try to look one up on HP.com... There are so many models, it's impossible to keep track of what's already out there, let alone what new models one should choose from. Simplify! HP needs to cut down all the models to just FOUR - one each of 11, 13, 15, & 17". Customize online. Might as well keep the design aesthetic that looks like a MacBook, but make them black anodized aluminum to keep the corporate suits happy and so they don't look quite so much like a direct rip-off of Apple's designs.
HP has the same problem with too many models of desktop PCs... And printers... And...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy
Good. What a shitty company. Never had a single product form them that did not have repeated hardware failures.
I'm an Apple fan, but it's amazing to see HP go downhill like this. They were a great company. 9 BILLION in a quarter. Wow.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribalogical
HP is in the red, and it's POSSIBLE the iPad is "contributing" in some way (significantly? Maybe… or maybe JUST a little?) to that loss… Fairly vague supposition of a headline there, no?
I think it's more likely a competitive combination of Apple iMacs, Laptops, AND iPads (since the quarterly numbers for all three keep growing year on year)… PLUS other players who are growing dramatically… I'd give the most weight to that last one, actually...
Uh, that opinion has been put forth by many industry experts. I don't think we need to give too much credibility to your guesses about what's doing the damage.
I said there were games on app store. However, you can easily buy a 80gb external for 40 bucks vs 25gb iCloud. And the hard drive could easily last 10 years given its low usage. So, 400 vs 40 bucks. U pick
The iPad is great but most people still need a PC, just dont need to refresh them as much
I understand what you need. I also need my Mac Pro. But what does that have to do with your definition that the iPad isn't a computer?
Ok, that works for me.
I wonder what Apple intended, or even thought about. Remember what SJ said in an interview shortly before he came back to Apple, when he was asked what he would do IF he came back to Apple:
" I would milk the Mac for all it was worth, and then I'd go on to the next big thing."
Isn't that EXACTLY what he did? Would Apple object to selling ten times as many iPads as Macs? 20 times as many? 100 times as many? And if that obsoleted Mac sales, would they really care? I don't know, maybe not.
It's a computing device but not what a computer is currently considered. In 3-5 years. This conversation will probably fall in favor of the iPad. But not ATM in the opinion of 50% of people I'm sure.
Interestingly enough, the lifetime of a HDD has little to do with its useage. A study done a couple of years ago showed that even new, unopened drives had the same reliability issues as drives that were used for the same amount of time that the other drives were on the shelf. I've got a bunch of bad HDD's in my computer room. I don't keep a drive after three years of use, as that's when failures begin to rise. You may get lucky though. Some drives last much longer. But it's still a crapshoot.
iPads are the future of computing, almost no one will use a laptop or desktop in a few years.
Why would they.
J.
It's only some people who think that way. Even the companies that evaluate sales, and who don't dump tablets in with "computers" in the rankings yet, say they are computers, but don't know where to put them. But that already changing, as Changewave, and a couple of others are putting them in with computer sales.
There are more powerful, and less powerful computers, we don't seperate them into computers, and non computers, just as we don't say that sports cars aren't cars because they can't carry six people and a lot of luggage.
Wow. You sure managed to get a lot of things wrong in one post.
Starting with this one. There are plenty of games for the iPad. What in the world would make you think that ALL games required Flash?
Ignoring, of course, the thousands of games available for the iPad - which don't require a mouse.
So what? It supports WiFi printers just fine. And if you really MUST use a USB-only printer, you can put a cheap print server on the network and solve the problem.
Hint: Your Mac Pro won't support Serial or Parallel printers out of the box. Does that mean that it's not a 'real' computer?
Yes, it can. You can use the iPad Camera Connection Kit. Or with some cameras, you can transfer the photos by WiFi. Or, worst case, you can transfer the photos to your computer and then to the iPad.
Based on what? Where's your evidence? And please explain how it is that you know more than Apple about what the iPad needs.
Yes, most people use a computer to back up an iPad or iPhone (although you can use the Cloud if you wish and if you are only using apps that support iCloud). So what? I can't use my convertible to transport 100 bags of mulch to my house every spring. Does that mean that the convertible isn't a transportation device?
The issue in this thread is that most people already have a computer. If they're looking for another one, an iPad will often meet their needs so an iPad may may more sense for some people than buying another desktop computer. Not ALL people. Maybe not even a large percentage of people. But SOME people can use an iPad instead of a desktop computer (and a few of them have posted here), so the concept that the iPad is cutting into HP's sales is not that difficult to comprehend.
I'm willing to bet that you're mostly right. I agree with what SJ said, about desktops and laptops becoming trucks. I doubt I'll never need a Mac Pro, or equivelant, assuming I'm still bothering with what I do on it. But I'll be doing more of that on an iPad.
Even now, when I design parts and such, I use a 3D CAD app on my iPad. The retina display has made that better. Next year, a more powerful CPU and GPU will make it faster.
iPad demand expected to contribute to HP's largest-ever quarterly loss
I call bullcrap and double bullcrap! Everyone knows the iPad is completely useless for EVERYTHING. It's just an overpriced toy that only idiot consumers buy. H-P makes Windows computers which are supposedly great for EVERYTHING because they're cheap, have lots of ports, run Adobe Flash and especially Microsoft Office. Ask any Windows fanboi and they'll tell you that much. How could a useless iPad possibly put a hurting on H-P sales? Don't consumers know what's important in this world? I'm sure I've heard you can't do ANYTHING on a computing device that doesn't come with Windows. Hell, even Steve Ballmer said that they're selling more Windows licenses now than they ever did in history. Since when has Steve Ballmer ever been wrong?
/S
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seankill
Lol, once again, being an Apple form. Of course this will happen.
Now thats where it comes in as "is and is not." Your opinion = is; mine = is,is not Why? I can't run heavy programs on it, I can't do 3D modeling, and even if i could, it'd be hell without a mouse or a stylus (a fine point). However, my mom has replaced her computer altogether with the iPad (3). So is it? Nope Is it not? Nope
It's simply opinion, IMO haha If the iPad were a full computer, why would I just have ordered a Macbook to finish out my college career?
Just because you can do some things on some other computer doesn't make the iPad not a computer. I can't use a macbook to run the web server for our company because we have too much traffic, does that mean the macbook isn't a computer? Of course not.
Numbers on the iPad is a real power tool. With almost no learning curve I managed to import (.csv files) and edit lots of spreadsheets. Even layout and export to PDF was easy to do. And all without a computer (as some would say).
The point is that learning Numbers and using it is a lot easier on the iPad.
J