Time for Apple to become a carrier ...make it all VOIP. Snooze, you lose.
That would be pretty cool. I've been suggesting that for awhile. I would like Apple to copy Google and start running fiber in residential neighborhoods which would be an added benefit for whatever TV offerings they have in mind. Having fiber would also allow them to install external WiFi hotspots around the city and only permit Apple devices. To use your phone you would port your AT&T phone number to Apple but it would use VoIP whenever possible.
I read somewhere else Verizon won't block FaceTime because of a Net Neutrality Agreement.
Verizon seems to be running off a different definition of Net Neutrality. Theirs appears to be that data is data and if you want to run up your bill with crazy shit like tethering your computer etc, they are happy to take your money.
Regardless of FaceTime, these new plans are a total joke and do nothing but needlessly charge single users more.
My current AT&T plan: $40 (450 minutes + rollover) + $25 (2GB data) = $65 + taxes and such
With the New AT&T Share Plan: $40 (unlimited minutes and text) + $45 (unlimited data) = $85 + taxes and such
So with the new Share Plan single users gain unlimited talk, text and data, but at a very high rate. In a typical month I use about 150 phone minutes (300 or more in free nights and weekends) and a measley 200MB of data since I am on WiFi nearly all the time. So as it is, I'm being vastly overcharged for my usage. The new Share Plan only makes that overcharge even worse.
Does anyone know of a reputable pay for what you use cell phone company? There is NO WAY that I'll ever sign up for a Share Plan.
I don't understand your point about Skype in this regard, though. Could you elaborate?
Skype presents an even greater threat to AT&T's revenue than FaceTime ever could.
The regulation in this complaint blocks a cell service company (AT&T, Verizon etc) from blocking data access to non carrier applications that copy the carriers services. In other words, they can't stop you from using Skype or a similar VoIP app in place of getting a higher voice pln, paying long distance fees etc.
AT&T is focusing on FaceTime as a 3rd party VIDEO chat program. AT&T doesn't have native video chatting (FaceTime is an Apple not AT&T service) so the rule doen't apply.
Verizon seems to be running off a different definition of Net Neutrality. Theirs appears to be that data is data and if you want to run up your bill with crazy shit like tethering your computer etc, they are happy to take your money.
Last week in a similar thread, Soli was discussing that FaceTime is not like regular data which is not prioritized. FaceTime actually needs to be the same priority as voice because dropped data packets are not really acceptable for real time communication. Because it is a higher priority it costs more.
Not at all. They are focusing on the video feature of FaceTime, which they don't offer. And because they don't offer their own video chat service the quoted rule doesn't apply.
That the iPhone has it built in would only regulate Apple, not AT&T.
And unfortunately for us it is a legit legal argument under this particular rule.
Facetime has a voice part which competes with AT&T voice.
So does this mean if I bring my own iPhone not purchased or subsidized by ATT that FaceTime would work over cellular with an unlimited contract? Seems that the logic used in the AT&T post would require it.
Even if your iPhone is unlocked, once you put in AT&T SIM card then all AT&T network restrictions will be applied to your iPhone. No tethering without tethering plan. No FaceTime over 3G without shared data plan. iOS will recognize AT&T network and put the brakes on your iPhone.
I just posted a complaint stating something like this:
"AT&T is forcing me to buy a more expensive plan to use FaceTime video-call service over cellular connection. AT&T is blocking FaceTime on my existing Data plan despite the fact that I pay monthly for a 3GB data allotment and only intend to use FaceTime within the limits of my plan. I believe this is a violation of the network neutrality rules"
It is inevitable that one day, Cellular provider will become Internet provider and VOiP will get real Quality of Service (QOS), comparable, i hope to current voice technology.
BUT, as a result, they will loose all the money they make on voice, and SMS, and since they hate making less money, the will rise the price of the MB...
I was thinking something along these lines as well.
Many people no longer have home phones because their cell service is reliable enough to avoid the additional monthly cost. As cellular data reliability and speeds improve over time why pay for minutes & a set number of texts when you can use data to accomplish the same functions with no loss of quality? This is the REAL revolution that the iPhone introduced but it is taking time to "blossom" as the cellular infrastructure does not improve as quickly as advancements in the personal electronics industry would prefer. But you can see it is coming ... or something similar.
Imagine if there were reliable city-wide or nation-wide Wi-Fi available today where you pay a subscription fee for the internet speed you want. How many people would drop their monthly minutes & texts immediately? The less tech-savvy would follow suit bit by bit and cell phone service as we know it would go the way of Tower Records.
p.s. I cut the cable cord a few years back and haven't missed it at all. Netflix, Hulu Plus, Redbox, iTunes Store … good to go. Fewer commercials (ZERO Political Commercials!!!), less crap TV to sort through, and with the savings I put some toward faster home internet speeds so all the streaming & download services work better/faster.
With the New AT&T Share Plan: $40 (unlimited minutes and text) + $45 (unlimited data) = $85 + taxes and such
So with the new Share Plan single users gain unlimited talk, text and data, but at a very high rate. In a typical month I use about 150 phone minutes (300 or more in free nights and weekends) and a measley 200MB of data since I am on WiFi nearly all the time. So as it is, I'm being vastly overcharged for my usage. The new Share Plan only makes that overcharge even worse.
Does anyone know of a reputable pay for what you use cell phone company? There is NO WAY that I'll ever sign up for a Share Plan.
You got your rate information wrong there...check again.
As a single user, you will not get on a "shared" plan. The key word is "shared" meaning additional users on the same plan.
For the record, the new share plan, so far, is an OPTION to replace family plans if you CHOOSE to. Individuals will just keep going as they were.
Since you have an ATT phone, check out Straight Talk. Just buy their SIM and away you go.
Last week in a similar thread, Soli was discussing that FaceTime is not like regular data which is not prioritized. FaceTime actually needs to be the same priority as voice because dropped data packets are not really acceptable for real time communication. Because it is a higher priority it costs more.
Except there is absolutely no reason at this time to believe that FaceTime will receive any QoS priority, so that argument doesn't fly.
And, even if it did, it would mean that AT&T would degrade other traffic, so while you FT traffic might (and, again, there's no reason to think it will) receive higher priority, your other traffic, as an inevitable consequence, will be degraded. So, it really evens out, and you aren't getting any additional bandwidth, so the whole QoS argument is just a red herring.
The bottom line is that AT&T doesn't want to upgrade their network to support new technologies, when they can get away with not doing it but simply raising rates. In other words, AT&T, and other carriers, are, through well orchestrated collusion (is it really a coincidence that AT&T and Verizon are pushing people into pretty much exactly the same sorts of data plans?), choking the life out of innovation in mobile. And the Feds don't have the spine to do anything about it.
If FaceTime could do audio only, which would be easier on the network, then it would be Clear that AT&T blocked similar service.
My Guess is that Apple never offer this iChat Feature because of the talk they had with AT&T before the first iPhone.
FaceTime can do audio only, therefore according to your argument it is clear AT&T is blocking a similar service.
Comments
That would be pretty cool. I've been suggesting that for awhile. I would like Apple to copy Google and start running fiber in residential neighborhoods which would be an added benefit for whatever TV offerings they have in mind. Having fiber would also allow them to install external WiFi hotspots around the city and only permit Apple devices. To use your phone you would port your AT&T phone number to Apple but it would use VoIP whenever possible.
Verizon seems to be running off a different definition of Net Neutrality. Theirs appears to be that data is data and if you want to run up your bill with crazy shit like tethering your computer etc, they are happy to take your money.
The rule here only applies to the service carriers, not the hardware/software makers. So Apple is legally in the clear.
Regardless of FaceTime, these new plans are a total joke and do nothing but needlessly charge single users more.
My current AT&T plan: $40 (450 minutes + rollover) + $25 (2GB data) = $65 + taxes and such
With the New AT&T Share Plan: $40 (unlimited minutes and text) + $45 (unlimited data) = $85 + taxes and such
So with the new Share Plan single users gain unlimited talk, text and data, but at a very high rate. In a typical month I use about 150 phone minutes (300 or more in free nights and weekends) and a measley 200MB of data since I am on WiFi nearly all the time. So as it is, I'm being vastly overcharged for my usage. The new Share Plan only makes that overcharge even worse.
Does anyone know of a reputable pay for what you use cell phone company? There is NO WAY that I'll ever sign up for a Share Plan.
The regulation in this complaint blocks a cell service company (AT&T, Verizon etc) from blocking data access to non carrier applications that copy the carriers services. In other words, they can't stop you from using Skype or a similar VoIP app in place of getting a higher voice pln, paying long distance fees etc.
AT&T is focusing on FaceTime as a 3rd party VIDEO chat program. AT&T doesn't have native video chatting (FaceTime is an Apple not AT&T service) so the rule doen't apply.
Last week in a similar thread, Soli was discussing that FaceTime is not like regular data which is not prioritized. FaceTime actually needs to be the same priority as voice because dropped data packets are not really acceptable for real time communication. Because it is a higher priority it costs more.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna
Not at all. They are focusing on the video feature of FaceTime, which they don't offer. And because they don't offer their own video chat service the quoted rule doesn't apply.
That the iPhone has it built in would only regulate Apple, not AT&T.
And unfortunately for us it is a legit legal argument under this particular rule.
Facetime has a voice part which competes with AT&T voice.
Originally Posted by jason98
Facetime has a voice part which competes with AT&T voice.
It isn't voice-ONLY, like Skype can be, which is the kicker, I think.
Even if your iPhone is unlocked, once you put in AT&T SIM card then all AT&T network restrictions will be applied to your iPhone. No tethering without tethering plan. No FaceTime over 3G without shared data plan. iOS will recognize AT&T network and put the brakes on your iPhone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jason98
I just posted a complaint stating something like this:
"AT&T is forcing me to buy a more expensive plan to use FaceTime video-call service over cellular connection. AT&T is blocking FaceTime on my existing Data plan despite the fact that I pay monthly for a 3GB data allotment and only intend to use FaceTime within the limits of my plan. I believe this is a violation of the network neutrality rules"
Guys, I encourage all of you to do the same.
Isnt pergery a federal crime?
Quote:
Originally Posted by haar
the (late steve jobs) said (i am paraphasing) "i dont ask what people want, because by the time it is built they want something different"
i think henry ford also said " any color you want as long as it is black".
Henry Ford quote - “If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.”
hmm - how do you fully delete a comment on here?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
It isn't voice-ONLY, like Skype can be, which is the kicker, I think.
Facetime can be too. Just click on your favorite Home button
Quote:
Originally Posted by Franco Borgo
It is inevitable that one day, Cellular provider will become Internet provider and VOiP will get real Quality of Service (QOS), comparable, i hope to current voice technology.
BUT, as a result, they will loose all the money they make on voice, and SMS, and since they hate making less money, the will rise the price of the MB...
I was thinking something along these lines as well.
Many people no longer have home phones because their cell service is reliable enough to avoid the additional monthly cost. As cellular data reliability and speeds improve over time why pay for minutes & a set number of texts when you can use data to accomplish the same functions with no loss of quality? This is the REAL revolution that the iPhone introduced but it is taking time to "blossom" as the cellular infrastructure does not improve as quickly as advancements in the personal electronics industry would prefer. But you can see it is coming ... or something similar.
Imagine if there were reliable city-wide or nation-wide Wi-Fi available today where you pay a subscription fee for the internet speed you want. How many people would drop their monthly minutes & texts immediately? The less tech-savvy would follow suit bit by bit and cell phone service as we know it would go the way of Tower Records.
p.s. I cut the cable cord a few years back and haven't missed it at all. Netflix, Hulu Plus, Redbox, iTunes Store … good to go. Fewer commercials (ZERO Political Commercials!!!), less crap TV to sort through, and with the savings I put some toward faster home internet speeds so all the streaming & download services work better/faster.
damn it - this is annoying. can't delete additional comments. talk about 'less tech savvy'. d'oh
Originally Posted by AppleZilla
They don't 'believe,' eh?
Do they 'believe' in class action lawsuits? I 'believe' the time has come.
I think when you signed your contract, you revoked your right to sue them.
Or maybe that was Verizon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by yensid98
...
With the New AT&T Share Plan: $40 (unlimited minutes and text) + $45 (unlimited data) = $85 + taxes and such
So with the new Share Plan single users gain unlimited talk, text and data, but at a very high rate. In a typical month I use about 150 phone minutes (300 or more in free nights and weekends) and a measley 200MB of data since I am on WiFi nearly all the time. So as it is, I'm being vastly overcharged for my usage. The new Share Plan only makes that overcharge even worse.
Does anyone know of a reputable pay for what you use cell phone company? There is NO WAY that I'll ever sign up for a Share Plan.
You got your rate information wrong there...check again.
As a single user, you will not get on a "shared" plan. The key word is "shared" meaning additional users on the same plan.
For the record, the new share plan, so far, is an OPTION to replace family plans if you CHOOSE to. Individuals will just keep going as they were.
Since you have an ATT phone, check out Straight Talk. Just buy their SIM and away you go.
Originally Posted by icoco3
For the record, the new share plan, so far, is an OPTION to replace family plans if you CHOOSE to.
I don't think that's right… I think all multi-plans have to be share…
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone
Last week in a similar thread, Soli was discussing that FaceTime is not like regular data which is not prioritized. FaceTime actually needs to be the same priority as voice because dropped data packets are not really acceptable for real time communication. Because it is a higher priority it costs more.
Except there is absolutely no reason at this time to believe that FaceTime will receive any QoS priority, so that argument doesn't fly.
And, even if it did, it would mean that AT&T would degrade other traffic, so while you FT traffic might (and, again, there's no reason to think it will) receive higher priority, your other traffic, as an inevitable consequence, will be degraded. So, it really evens out, and you aren't getting any additional bandwidth, so the whole QoS argument is just a red herring.
The bottom line is that AT&T doesn't want to upgrade their network to support new technologies, when they can get away with not doing it but simply raising rates. In other words, AT&T, and other carriers, are, through well orchestrated collusion (is it really a coincidence that AT&T and Verizon are pushing people into pretty much exactly the same sorts of data plans?), choking the life out of innovation in mobile. And the Feds don't have the spine to do anything about it.
FaceTime can do audio only, therefore according to your argument it is clear AT&T is blocking a similar service.