Apple adapters for new 9-pin dock to cost $10, cables will be $19 - report

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 56

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


    How nice of them to provide bulk in just the number I'll need…



     


    The bulk discount seems pretty miserly though.  3 1/3% off if you buy 3!


     


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Bakamono View Post


    Does the pictured design strike anyone else as flawed (if it isn't fake)? Exposed contacts would have poor durability and would increase the risk of static discharge from someone's hand into a computer's USB port, no?  Whatever happened to the industry-wide agreement (following the EU's 2009 Common External Power Supply initiative) to adopt Micro USB-B connectors for new mobile devices?  Wasn't Apple one of the original signatories to the MoU? Based on Micro USB's thin profile, what possible reason is there NOT to implement a Micro USB-B 3.0 receptacle on the upcoming iPhone besides a misguided desire to control the third-party accessory market using proprietary-connector patents as a cudgel?  



     


    I think the EU directive basically agreed upon specs for the power supplies that were needed, and actual connectors to the device can be offered using an adaptor from micro USB.  I would guess Apple can still do that.




    It seems to me that what everyone is standardizing on anyway is a power adaptor that has a standard USB port on it, then you just plug in whichever cable you need.  The power brick for my iPad now happily charges my Kindle and powers my Raspberry Pi (which if you've not seen it is a nice little toy!) happily, all I need to do is switch which USB cable I use.

  • Reply 22 of 56


    Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post

    The bulk discount seems pretty miserly though.  3 1/3% off if you buy 3!


     


    *shrug* It's Apple. I'd rather my adapters look good and work indefinitely than be shoddily made and break.

  • Reply 23 of 56
    moxommoxom Posts: 326member


    As long as the adapter works with my new Apogee Jam, I'll be happy...

  • Reply 24 of 56

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post


    I think the EU directive basically agreed upon specs for the power supplies that were needed, and actual connectors to the device can be offered using an adaptor from micro USB.  I would guess Apple can still do that.



    I believe you are correct that there is an adapter "loophole" in the EU directive. So Apple can go proprietary and be in compliance. But if there is no technical reason not to adopt Micro USB 3.0 connectors, I'd suggest that they aren't keeping with the "spirit" of the original Memorandum of Understanding. Which is their prerogative, no matter how disappointing.

  • Reply 25 of 56
    oflifeoflife Posts: 120member


    It is this greed and total lack of imagination by Apple (such imagination ended with the iPhone 1/2G on the phone front) that will be their downfall.


     


    Nokia have just launched a phone (the Lumia 920) whose innovations are each more useful than any iPhone feature, and save the user money and hassle. the wireless charging means you won't NEED any cables for charging and the NFC means you won't need any cables for music streaming/transfer. (Wireless charging hotspots will be everywhere soon, so we won't need to buy them except for our desks.)


     


    Further, the PureView lens will offer pictures better than any other phone.


     


    I'm an Apple guy (using a MBA to type this), but I am saddened at how Apple have totally failed to innovate since MagSafe.


     


    Even iOS 6 is way dated over Android 4.1 Jelly Bean.


     


     


    If the industrial design of the new iPhone really is the same as the 4 series, except for size, then I predict their gradual downfall.


     


    I hope they have a surprise, such as a wrist controller, or a radical new form factor and these leaked pictures are the result of a massive deception by Apple and their suppliers.

  • Reply 26 of 56


    Originally Posted by Bakamono View Post

    But if there is no technical reason not to adopt Micro USB 3.0 connectors…




    Fortunately there are a dozen or more reasons not to waste time with Mini or MicroUSB proper. 

  • Reply 27 of 56
    slurpyslurpy Posts: 5,385member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by malax View Post


    "One source notes that Apple will reap a windfall by limiting competition in this manner, generating revenues of $100 million for every 10 million Dock Connector Adapters it sells for $10," author Jeremy Horwitz wrote. "According to the source, Apple estimates that it will sell the first 10 million Adapters by the end of 2012."


     


     


    They needed to quote someone to multiple some number by $10 to calculate total revenue from selling a $10 item?

     



     


    A "windfall"? Seriously? The sensationalist nature of these reports is always ridiculous. A hundred million isn't a windfall for a company that makes almost a 10 figure quarterly profit. I love how ilounge and macrumors also make it seem as if the primary reason Aple changed the conector is because it wants to sell new cables and accessories. What a ridiculously false and cynical (not to mention trollish) perspective. 

  • Reply 28 of 56

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

    Fortunately there are a dozen or more reasons not to waste time with Mini or MicroUSB proper. 


    Would you please elaborate? Photos have circulated of adapters converting Micro USB-B to the new 9-pin dock connector, such as those republished here on August 28 ("Rumor: Next-gen iPhone accessories with 9-pin dock connector revealed"), which would be consistent with an adapter loophole in the EU mandate.

  • Reply 29 of 56
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    slurpy wrote: »
    I love how ilounge and macrumors also make it seem as if the primary reason Aple changed the conector is because it wants to sell new cables and accessories. What a ridiculously false and cynical (not to mention trollish) perspective. 

    It's an evil plot to change the connector ONCE EVERY 10 YEARS¡ It's pretty much the most absurd thing one can imagine.
  • Reply 30 of 56
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    bakamono wrote: »
    I believe you are correct that there is an adapter "loophole" in the EU directive. So Apple can go proprietary and be in compliance. But if there is no technical reason not to adopt Micro USB 3.0 connectors, I'd suggest that they aren't keeping with the "spirit" of the original Memorandum of Understanding. Which is their prerogative, no matter how disappointing.

    I recall the issue being with the power supply, not the cable attached to it. Note that Apple's power supplies have a detachable cable and it's been 7 or 8 years since they started including USB-A on them. That means any reasonable phone vendor's cable will plug into Apple's power supply if the one end has USB-A. Again, a few stranded or plastic coated copper is the not the reason this mandate was set, it's the power supply.
  • Reply 31 of 56


    Originally Posted by Bakamono View Post

    Photos have circulated of adapters converting Micro USB-B to the new 9-pin dock connector, such as those republished here on August 28 ("Rumor: Next-gen iPhone accessories with 9-pin dock connector revealed"), which would be consistent with an adapter loophole in the EU mandate.


     


    Sure, and that's needed because the EU not only thinks it can tell manufacturers what to make, it thinks it knows what's best for the future of technology, too. It doesn't. There's nothing wrong with it existing, but wanting to forgo it for the sake of replacing Dock Connector or Dock Connector 2 with straight up USB is ignoring the benefits thereof.

  • Reply 32 of 56
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    oflife wrote: »
    It is this greed and total lack of imagination by Apple (such imagination ended with the iPhone 1/2G on the phone front) that will be their downfall.
    Yep, greed for using the same connector for nearly a decade that work across 3 class of devices, and have a power supply with a detachable cable that uses the standard USB-A¡ What assholes¡
    Nokia have just launched a phone (the Lumia 920) whose innovations are each more useful than any iPhone feature, and save the user money and hassle. the wireless charging means you won't NEED any cables for charging
    How do that work with the EU law since you need an entirely new device for charging?
    and the NFC means you won't need any cables for music streaming/transfer.
    NFC for steaming music? First I've heard of that.
    (Wireless charging hotspots will be everywhere soon, so we won't need to buy them except for our desks.)
    It's always soon. Soooon. Soooooon! Is Godot bringing it?
    Further, the PureView lens will offer pictures better than any other phone.
    OK, so it's about a name brand of a lens... and nothing else? Personally, I would wait for a review of all these new phones before saying which will be better based on a single marketable component, but I'm crazy that way.
    I'm an Apple guy (using a MBA to type this), but I am saddened at how Apple have totally failed to innovate since MagSafe.
    You claim that nothing rom Apple after January, 10th 2006 has been innovative and you expect people to take you serious?
    Even iOS 6 is way dated over Android 4.1 Jelly Bean.
    And yet Project Butter is only starting with Jelly Bean to address horrendous lag issues for an OS that I've heard since 1.0 is just as fast, just as fluid and just as smoother as iOS.
    If the industrial design of the new iPhone really is the same as the 4 series, except for size, then I predict their gradual downfall.
    If you have eyes and believe the the images of the leaks are real then you'll be able to see it's a completely different industrial design.
    I hope they have a surprise, such as a wrist controller, or a radical new form factor and these leaked pictures are the result of a massive deception by Apple and their suppliers.
    You want something innovative but you reference a 1930's comic strip? So much for nothing innovative since the beginning of 2006.
  • Reply 33 of 56
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    Sure, and that's needed because the EU not only thinks it can tell manufacturers what to make, it thinks it knows what's best for the future of technology, too. It doesn't. There's nothing wrong with it existing, but wanting to forgo it for the sake of replacing Dock Connector or Dock Connector 2 with straight up USB is ignoring the benefits thereof.

    Then people can complain that their video and audio out no longer work. If Apple fixed all the problems people like to complain about we'd have too many people complaining about having nothing to complain about. We can't have that, can we?
  • Reply 34 of 56

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

    I recall the issue being with the power supply, not the cable attached to it. Note that Apple's power supplies have a detachable cable and it's been 7 or 8 years since they started including USB-A on them. That means any reasonable phone vendor's cable will plug into Apple's power supply if the one end has USB-A. Again, a few stranded or plastic coated copper is the not the reason this mandate was set, it's the power supply.


    My recollection may be colored by the Micro USB hype at the time the MoU was signed. I pulled "Annex II to MoU regarding Harmonisation of a Charging Capability for Mobile Phones, June 5th, 2009" <http://ec.europa.eu/enterprise/sectors/rtte/files/chargers/chargers_annex_ii_to_mou_january_12_2010_en.pdf>. This looks to be the relevant section (internal cites omitted): "2. DC Plug Connector Specification. The cable assembly shall terminate in a Micro-B plug. The plug shall meet the USB-IF Connector Test Requirements, shall be compliant to the Micro-USB Cables and Connectors Specification, Rev 1.01 (Micro-USB 1.01), and shall be rated to meet all electrical specifications. An EPS provided with a detachable cable shall be equipped with a USB Standard-A receptacle. Standard detachable cable assembly, supplied for use with the EPS, shall have Standard-A and Micro-B plugs and meet the USB-IF Cable Assembly Test Requirements for Compliant Usage of Connectors and Cables in Micro-USB 1.01. Above requirement also applies to detachable cables used as adaptor i.e. where the Micro-B is replaced by a proprietary plug." -- So we have a "shall terminate in a Micro-B plug" combined with a loophole for proprietary plugs at the end.

  • Reply 35 of 56

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post





    Then people can complain that their video and audio out no longer work. If Apple fixed all the problems people like to complain about we'd have too many people complaining about having nothing to complain about. We can't have that, can we?


     


    Graham Chapman: I think all righthtinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that ordinary, decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired.


    All: Yes, yes...


    Graham Chapman: I'm certainly not! And I'm sick and tired of being told that I am.


    Not Sure?: Mrs. Havoc-Jones.


    Mrs. Havoc-Jones: Well, I meet a lot of people and I'm convinced that the vast majority of wrongthinking people are right.


     


    And there you have it. Bring on the keynote.

  • Reply 36 of 56
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    bakamono wrote: »
    My recollection may be colored by the Micro USB hype at the time the MoU was signed. I pulled "Annex II to MoU regarding Harmonisation of a Charging Capability for Mobile Phones, June 5th, 2009" <http://ec.europa.eu/enterprise/sectors/rtte/files/chargers/chargers_annex_ii_to_mou_january_12_2010_en.pdf>. This looks to be the relevant section (internal cites omitted): "2. DC Plug Connector Specification. The cable assembly shall terminate in a Micro-B plug. The plug shall meet the USB-IF Connector Test Requirements, shall be compliant to the Micro-USB Cables and Connectors Specification, Rev 1.01 (Micro-USB 1.01), and shall be rated to meet all electrical specifications. An EPS provided with a detachable cable shall be equipped with a USB Standard-A receptacle. Standard detachable cable assembly, supplied for use with the EPS, shall have Standard-A and Micro-B plugs and meet the USB-IF Cable Assembly Test Requirements for Compliant Usage of Connectors and Cables in Micro-USB 1.01. Above requirement also applies to detachable cables used as adaptor i.e. where the Micro-B is replaced by a proprietary plug." -- So we have a "shall terminate in a Micro-B plug" combined with a loophole for proprietary plugs at the end.

    It's not a loophole as there is ambiguity to skate around an intended rule. It's very clear. If your EPS has a detachable cable you can use a proprietary plug to connect to your device while the EPS has a USB-A port.

    Again, the intent was to reduce EPS waste and Apple is not the problem here. If everyone else had used a USB-A port on their EPS there would have been no ruling. On top of that, Apple has used the same plug for all but one of their iPods (which uses the 3.5mm headphone jack for charging and syncing), their iPhone and iPads. That's pretty damn impressive when you consider the number of years and devices all being compatible that way. Walk into many stores and you'll see a revolving stand of different EPS for different phones and I doubt you'll find just one type for all phones from a single vendor.
  • Reply 37 of 56

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

    Sure, and that's needed because the EU not only thinks it can tell manufacturers what to make, it thinks it knows what's best for the future of technology, too. It doesn't. There's nothing wrong with it existing, but wanting to forgo it for the sake of replacing Dock Connector or Dock Connector 2 with straight up USB is ignoring the benefits thereof.


    Apple wasn't forced into signing the MoU, and I only see three "benefits" over Micro USB-B: (1) there is no upside-down, right-side-up problem; (2) the potential for extra data lines when not connecting at the other end to a USB port; (3) Apple's ability to use the proprietary connector to control the accessories market. I am assuming the two connectors have similar dimensions. Acknowledging (1) and (2), based on the exposed contacts, the pictured connector still looks to be a flawed design.

  • Reply 38 of 56

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

    It's not a loophole as there is ambiguity to skate around an intended rule. It's very clear. If your EPS has a detachable cable you can use a proprietary plug to connect to your device while the EPS has a USB-A port.

    Again, the intent was to reduce EPS waste and Apple is not the problem here. If everyone else had used a USB-A port on their EPS there would have been no ruling. On top of that, Apple has used the same plug for all but one of their iPods (which uses the 3.5mm headphone jack for charging and syncing), their iPhone and iPads. That's pretty damn impressive when you consider the number of years and devices all being compatible that way. Walk into many stores and you'll see a revolving stand of different EPS for different phones and I doubt you'll find just one type for all phones from a single vendor.


    Agreed.  My recollection had been it was an adapter loophole (Micro-USB to proprietary), but reading the passage, the last line does seem to gut the entire point of using "shall" at the beginning.

  • Reply 39 of 56


    I've found that price is rarely an indication of cable quality.


     


    All my HDMI cables, even the one I got for $5 works fine.


    On the flip side I have three FireWire 800 cables and the only one that works is the generic Chinese one I got at a discount PC shop. The one that came with my now dead Mediasonic case never worked at all and the one that came with my LaCie drive refuses to maintain a connection.


    I don't use Apple earbuds, but I've heard that they don't last very long. I've been using a set of Sennheiser earbuds every day for three years now.


     


    It's very annoying that Apple won't license MagSafe. Everybody else can get DC transformers for $30-40, but Mac owners are forced to pay $79 for a device that manages to get only 1.5 or 2 stars on Apple's own website. It's gouging a captive market pure and simple. I actually have a Chinese transformer with a MagSafe connector, purchased before Apple put the fear of lawsuits into all the importers. The cables are thicker than the ones Apple uses and all the typical break points are nicely reinforced. I'm confident it'll outlive my Apple one.

  • Reply 40 of 56
    wovelwovel Posts: 956member
    bakamono wrote: »
    Apple wasn't forced into signing the MoU, and I only see three "benefits" over Micro USB-B: (1) there is no upside-down, right-side-up problem; (2) the potential for extra data lines when not connecting at the other end to a USB port; (3) Apple's ability to use the proprietary connector to control the accessories market. I am assuming the two connectors have similar dimensions. Acknowledging (1) and (2), based on the exposed contacts, the pictured connector still looks to be a flawed design.

    Keep in mind that you can not do anything on USB port that is not part of the standard. If Apple wants to one day implement Thunderbolt or anything else, they could not do so on a USB port.

    Without understanding the specifics of how this port is designed, I believe you are over stating the problem with the exposed contacts. It would be easy to design that connector in a manner that would not allow it to short out.
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