Wow 48 <span style="background-color:rgb(226,225,225);color:rgb(24,24,24);font-family:'lucida grande', verdana, helvetica, sans-serif;line-height:normal;">physicians</span>
, man talk about a large survey and only one in three plans on buying one or 15 of them are planning on purchasing them. Everyone you only need 48 in order to have an accurate sample size, remember that everyone.
There are 'Android is more popular than iOS' surveys that are just as bad.
Giant lab coat pockets may be the only ones that work.
I was curious about pocketability so I went to the Apple Store. I left disappointed.
The iPad Mini is not mini enough. My Nexus 7 fits in my jacket and jeans pocket. At the store, the iPad Mini was a very tight fit in the jacket pocket. Zipper wouldn't close. Wasn't even close to fitting in my jeans pockets.
At the size the Mini is, it's not just portability. It's hard to grip the thing with one hand. The extra 15mm compared to the Nexus 7 made a big difference with a wide grip.
I was kind of disappointed when Apple showed some guy taking one out of his jacket pocket in the video. I did not really anticipate it being advertised as pocketable. Pocketability is a minimum benefit in stowing the device but in no way adds to its usability. In fact being small enough to be pocketable actually detracts from its intended purpose in my opinion.
Even though you can conceivably put a Nexus in your jeans back pocket it certainly wouldn't be comfortable walking around like that and you clearly couldn't sit down without breaking it, so what is the point? I plan to get a folio style case for my mini. Whenever I go out for the day I either have a vehicle or a day pack or both, When I travel I have multiple options for carrying it.
For those docs who didn't already know, of course there is a company that makes lab coats that fit any iPad, rather than the other way around. Medelita, for instance http://www.medelita.com/ipad-labcoats.html
I was kind of disappointed when Apple showed some guy taking one out of his jacket pocket in the video. I did not really anticipate it being advertised as pocketable. Pocketability is a minimum benefit in stowing the device but in no way adds to its usability. In fact being small enough to be pocketable actually detracts from its intended purpose in my opinion.
Even though you can conceivably put a Nexus in your jeans back pocket it certainly wouldn't be comfortable walking around like that and you clearly couldn't sit down without breaking it, so what is the point? I plan to get a folio style case for my mini. Whenever I go out for the day I either have a vehicle or a day pack or both, When I travel I have multiple options for carrying it.
There's a difference between a lab coat and your jeans pocket. A lab coat is a perfectly reasonable place to store a Mini. The fact that it's pocketable in large pockets is a real advantage and should be advertised as such. Why shouldn't they? A number of Android tablets did the same thing. Of course, since that was their ONLY advantage, they sort of had to.
Because of these overheated expectations Apple stocks were 700+ in the first place and now when everything (iP5, iPadMini, iPad4) is released the stocks are slipping down where they belong. Why? You got it right; because of the overheated expectations.
So Apple trading at 10 times forward earnings constitutes "overheated expectations" while Google trading at 20 times earnings and Amazon trading at 3,000 times earnings does not?
The scorecard is as follows:
iPhone 5 - huge sales miss by 50%
iPad 4 - medium miss by 25% to 30%
iPad Mini - huge miss likely to be by 50%
These misses total a $130 share price drop. Not good at all.
Really? So you know how much Apple's products that have just been introduced will miss Apple's sales projections? Do you want to pick my lottery numbers?
In reality, Apple's performance has been exceptional by ANY standards.
There's a difference between a lab coat and your jeans pocket. A lab coat is a perfectly reasonable place to store a Mini. The fact that it's pocketable in large pockets is a real advantage and should be advertised as such. Why shouldn't they? A number of Android tablets did the same thing. Of course, since that was their ONLY advantage, they sort of had to.
I agree in so much as this thread is about lab coats however I was replying to a poster who was probably not a physician since he was talking about jacket pockets and jeans pockets which is a reasonable discussion as the ratio of general public to lab coat wearers is quite large. My disappointment in the video shown at the launch was that it depicted a regular guy on the street with it being pocketable, not a physician. Lab coat usage is an insignificantly tiny niche.
I know you're joking, but just sick of people who own Apple stuff being defensive. Let's start taking the high road, guys.
I'm with you Ireland. As for responses here along the lines of "well the Android fanboy's started it", you are missing the point. As a group, Apple fans come off as very defensive which is odd to me. If you know you're good, a little criticism shouldn't bother you.
Anyway, I can see this being a good product for physicians except for one thing...it's a big time germ spreader. Docs are required to wash their hands or use antibacterial gel between patient visits to reduce the spread of germs (though not all do.) Are they washing their tablet devices with an antibacterial wipe as well? My guess is no.
I'm with you Ireland. As for responses here along the lines of "well the Android fanboy's started it", you are missing the point. As a group, Apple fans come off as very defensive which is odd to me. If you know you're good, a little criticism shouldn't bother you.
Did you just read five posts into the thread and skip all the replies to that comment?
Anyway, I can see this being a good product for physicians except for one thing...it's a big time germ spreader. Docs are required to wash their hands or use antibacterial gel between patient visits to reduce the spread of germs (though not all do.) Are they washing their tablet devices with an antibacterial wipe as well? My guess is no.
It seems to be a bit sad to just assume that they're leaving out something so obvious in their cleaning procedure.
Did you just read five posts into the thread and skip all the replies to that comment?
It seems to be a bit sad to just assume that they're leaving out something so obvious in their cleaning procedure.
Uh, no. There are several posts that disagree with Ireland's post. I am jut agreeing with him.
As for the cleaning procedure, it's a little more than an assumption. There have been numerous studies showing a lack of hand washing in hospitals and huge decreases in secondary infections once hand sanitizing programs are implemented. The fact that a program must be implemented shows that there are many health care professionals for which hand sanitizing/washing is not second nature. By extension, I think it's logical to assume that same population may not sanitize their tablet of choice and that even some that are good hand washers will not take the additional step to sanitize a device between patients. While it may be an obvious procedure to you and I, it's not to everyone.
Uh, no. There are several posts that disagree with Ireland's post. I am jut agreeing with him.
So you don't believe the original comment might have just been a sarcastic joke?
As for the cleaning procedure, it's a little more than an assumption. There have been numerous studies showing a lack of hand washing in hospitals and huge decreases in secondary infections once hand sanitizing programs are implemented. The fact that a program must be implemented shows that there are many health care professionals for which hand sanitizing/washing is not second nature. By extension, I think it's logical to assume that same population may not sanitize their tablet of choice and that even some that are good hand washers will not take the additional step to sanitize a device between patients. While it may be an obvious procedure to you and I, it's not to everyone.
If that's the case, then it's more of the same, not a worsening situation. It sounds like the same problem existed before the device was used, if pens, clipboards and paper tablets weren't given any contamination considerations. If anything, it's an opportunity for those that do take those considerations to heart, as I bet an iPad is considerably easier to clean than those other items.
I may not walk around with the Nexus 7 in my pocket but I've travelled with it in my jacket pocket. Very handy when going through airport security to be able to leave it in my jacket. And this is a normal CK windbreaker.
And if Apple didn't make it for portability, what did they make it for?
I think it was a dumb move to make an 8" tablet just so they could claim it wasn't 7". From my handling, I think 7.5" was probably the best. At 7.9", it's not one hand grippable or pocketable. So the only value I can see is the price. It's the cheapest iPad.
I may not walk around with the Nexus 7 in my pocket but I've travelled with it in my jacket pocket. Very handy when going through airport security to be able to leave it in my jacket. And this is a normal CK windbreaker.
And if Apple didn't make it for portability, what did they make it for?
There are many different uses as this thread demonstrates. One being physician lab coats. I think approximately 50% of western adults routinely carry handbags large enough to fit an iPad mini and many of the other 50%, including myself would be willing to carry it in some other way. When I travel through the airport I am usually wearing a sport coat or suit not a wind breaker. Fortunately, I always have my briefcase which has ample room for toting the mini around. There is no one case scenario for this device. Perhaps a Nexus is easier to carry in certain situations but I wouldn't know what to do with a Nexus since it doesn't connect to any of my other Apple ecosystem features or my Macs or applications so it would be just useless baggage for me.
@mstone,
I may not walk around with the Nexus 7 in my pocket but I've travelled with it in my jacket pocket. Very handy when going through airport security to be able to leave it in my jacket. And this is a normal CK windbreaker.
And if Apple didn't make it for portability, what did they make it for?
Obviously they did, but clearly they did not intend for you to use it at the airport, since Passbook is not enabled on it.
I think it's great the mini already has a base in the medical field, but merely being able to slip it in ones pocket does not seem reason enough to me to plunk down $330+ if you already have an iPhone AND an iPad unless, like the physicians, you have a need for it in the workplace. Since the mini cannot be used as a phone, are people really going to pay an extra $330+ to carry around a tablet along with their smart phone if they have an iPad at home unless they have a specific need? As mstone points out, most people carry around a bag of some sort capable of carrying a 10" iPad, be it a back pack, briefcase, purse, etc. however, jackets are not at all universal, especially in the Summer. And the men wearing nice suits, I don't really see carrying this around. Women's suits will not have anything like a big enough pocket.
Giant lab coat pockets may be the only ones that work.
I was curious about pocketability so I went to the Apple Store. I left disappointed.
The iPad Mini is not mini enough. My Nexus 7 fits in my jacket and jeans pocket. At the store, the iPad Mini was a very tight fit in the jacket pocket. Zipper wouldn't close. Wasn't even close to fitting in my jeans pockets.
At the size the Mini is, it's not just portability. It's hard to grip the thing with one hand. The extra 15mm compared to the Nexus 7 made a big difference with a wide grip.
I went to the Apple Store and had the complete opposite experience. The thing is light, easily held in one hand (I wear med size gloves) and easily would fit in my jacket pocket.
A must buy for me. It's portable as hell. White looks good too.
I may not walk around with the Nexus 7 in my pocket but I've travelled with it in my jacket pocket. Very handy when going through airport security to be able to leave it in my jacket. And this is a normal CK windbreaker.
You aren't supposed to wear your jacket through the metal detector. So either way you need to put it into a basket.
Anyway, I can see this being a good product for physicians except for one thing...it's a big time germ spreader. Docs are required to wash their hands or use antibacterial gel between patient visits to reduce the spread of germs (though not all do.) Are they washing their tablet devices with an antibacterial wipe as well? My guess is no.
Less big time than a laptop with keyboard.
There are a many products for iPads in the medical domain. Here's a couple:
Or you can just toss it in a xray cassette sterile bag.
While someone will have do a study to confirm, if the hospital is already very aggressive with their antiseptic hand gels the iPad will be swimming in alcohol. The standard here is to pump in and pump out. The lab coat itself is going to be more of an issue than a glass and aluminum iPad that gets wiped down regularly with a wipe between patients. The sleeves are a freaking petri dish.
You'll remove the oleophobic coating but since you're wiping down the screen so much anyway I wouldn't worry too much about skin oil collecting on clinical ipads.
Lab coat pocket-ability is exactly why I ordered one. An iPad Citrix gives access to most of our hospital's systems, which is useful if a bit awkward. A native system access would be a huge plus, but even emulating a Windows NT screen hospital apps is still invaluable.
While the iPad meets HIPPA and ePHI requirements (with the right apps), keeping access limited to Citrix is one way for IT to continue to use legacy EHR systems...
Win8 tabets may be better in this regard but they aren't lab coat pocket sized yet.
Someone has to explain to me why Epocrates gives a hoot about the pocketability of the iPad mini given it doesn't have an actual iPad version in the app store. Yah yah, they have their iPad EHR beta thingy but who knows when or if that'll come to market.
I may not walk around with the Nexus 7 in my pocket but I've travelled with it in my jacket pocket. Very handy when going through airport security to be able to leave it in my jacket. And this is a normal CK windbreaker.
And if Apple didn't make it for portability, what did they make it for?
I think it was a dumb move to make an 8" tablet just so they could claim it wasn't 7". From my handling, I think 7.5" was probably the best. At 7.9", it's not one hand grippable or pocketable. So the only value I can see is the price. It's the cheapest iPad.
My hands are not particularly large (nor are they particularly small) at 180 mm (7.3 ") long, wrist to fingertip, by 100 mm (4 ") wide, but I had no trouble at all holding an iPad Mini in my left hand for 5 to 10 minutes while typing in my observations of it using one of the Minis at an Apple Store on release day, into the comments section of one of the threads on the AI forums. I barely noticed that I was holding the device most of the time - I was conentrating on typing.
About the only time that I was aware of it from the holding point of view was to think, "Gee, this is light!" At no point did I feel any discomfort or strain. It was very pleasant and easy to hold - and use! I didn't buy one then as I'm waiting for the one with the GPS.
Someone has to explain to me why Epocrates gives a hoot about the pocketability of the iPad mini given it doesn't have an actual iPad version in the app store. Yah yah, they have their iPad EHR beta thingy but who knows when or if that'll come to market.
Unusual that the Android version is very thorough and fully-featured, far outshining their iOS efforts to date. That's despite a survey from May 2011 (yes I know, somewhat old but it's the best I could find) that showed only 3% of the questioned physicians using a tablet at all were using an Android tablet while over half used an Apple iPad. It wasn't mentioned what tablets the other 40% were using.
Comments
There are 'Android is more popular than iOS' surveys that are just as bad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz
Giant lab coat pockets may be the only ones that work.
I was curious about pocketability so I went to the Apple Store. I left disappointed.
The iPad Mini is not mini enough. My Nexus 7 fits in my jacket and jeans pocket. At the store, the iPad Mini was a very tight fit in the jacket pocket. Zipper wouldn't close. Wasn't even close to fitting in my jeans pockets.
At the size the Mini is, it's not just portability. It's hard to grip the thing with one hand. The extra 15mm compared to the Nexus 7 made a big difference with a wide grip.
I was kind of disappointed when Apple showed some guy taking one out of his jacket pocket in the video. I did not really anticipate it being advertised as pocketable. Pocketability is a minimum benefit in stowing the device but in no way adds to its usability. In fact being small enough to be pocketable actually detracts from its intended purpose in my opinion.
Even though you can conceivably put a Nexus in your jeans back pocket it certainly wouldn't be comfortable walking around like that and you clearly couldn't sit down without breaking it, so what is the point? I plan to get a folio style case for my mini. Whenever I go out for the day I either have a vehicle or a day pack or both, When I travel I have multiple options for carrying it.
There's a difference between a lab coat and your jeans pocket. A lab coat is a perfectly reasonable place to store a Mini. The fact that it's pocketable in large pockets is a real advantage and should be advertised as such. Why shouldn't they? A number of Android tablets did the same thing. Of course, since that was their ONLY advantage, they sort of had to.
So Apple trading at 10 times forward earnings constitutes "overheated expectations" while Google trading at 20 times earnings and Amazon trading at 3,000 times earnings does not?
Amazing.
Really? So you know how much Apple's products that have just been introduced will miss Apple's sales projections? Do you want to pick my lottery numbers?
In reality, Apple's performance has been exceptional by ANY standards.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
There's a difference between a lab coat and your jeans pocket. A lab coat is a perfectly reasonable place to store a Mini. The fact that it's pocketable in large pockets is a real advantage and should be advertised as such. Why shouldn't they? A number of Android tablets did the same thing. Of course, since that was their ONLY advantage, they sort of had to.
I agree in so much as this thread is about lab coats however I was replying to a poster who was probably not a physician since he was talking about jacket pockets and jeans pockets which is a reasonable discussion as the ratio of general public to lab coat wearers is quite large. My disappointment in the video shown at the launch was that it depicted a regular guy on the street with it being pocketable, not a physician. Lab coat usage is an insignificantly tiny niche.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland
I know you're joking, but just sick of people who own Apple stuff being defensive. Let's start taking the high road, guys.
I'm with you Ireland. As for responses here along the lines of "well the Android fanboy's started it", you are missing the point. As a group, Apple fans come off as very defensive which is odd to me. If you know you're good, a little criticism shouldn't bother you.
Anyway, I can see this being a good product for physicians except for one thing...it's a big time germ spreader. Docs are required to wash their hands or use antibacterial gel between patient visits to reduce the spread of germs (though not all do.) Are they washing their tablet devices with an antibacterial wipe as well? My guess is no.
Did you just read five posts into the thread and skip all the replies to that comment?
It seems to be a bit sad to just assume that they're leaving out something so obvious in their cleaning procedure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM
Did you just read five posts into the thread and skip all the replies to that comment?
It seems to be a bit sad to just assume that they're leaving out something so obvious in their cleaning procedure.
Uh, no. There are several posts that disagree with Ireland's post. I am jut agreeing with him.
As for the cleaning procedure, it's a little more than an assumption. There have been numerous studies showing a lack of hand washing in hospitals and huge decreases in secondary infections once hand sanitizing programs are implemented. The fact that a program must be implemented shows that there are many health care professionals for which hand sanitizing/washing is not second nature. By extension, I think it's logical to assume that same population may not sanitize their tablet of choice and that even some that are good hand washers will not take the additional step to sanitize a device between patients. While it may be an obvious procedure to you and I, it's not to everyone.
So you don't believe the original comment might have just been a sarcastic joke?
If that's the case, then it's more of the same, not a worsening situation. It sounds like the same problem existed before the device was used, if pens, clipboards and paper tablets weren't given any contamination considerations. If anything, it's an opportunity for those that do take those considerations to heart, as I bet an iPad is considerably easier to clean than those other items.
I may not walk around with the Nexus 7 in my pocket but I've travelled with it in my jacket pocket. Very handy when going through airport security to be able to leave it in my jacket. And this is a normal CK windbreaker.
And if Apple didn't make it for portability, what did they make it for?
I think it was a dumb move to make an 8" tablet just so they could claim it wasn't 7". From my handling, I think 7.5" was probably the best. At 7.9", it's not one hand grippable or pocketable. So the only value I can see is the price. It's the cheapest iPad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz
@mstone,
I may not walk around with the Nexus 7 in my pocket but I've travelled with it in my jacket pocket. Very handy when going through airport security to be able to leave it in my jacket. And this is a normal CK windbreaker.
And if Apple didn't make it for portability, what did they make it for?
There are many different uses as this thread demonstrates. One being physician lab coats. I think approximately 50% of western adults routinely carry handbags large enough to fit an iPad mini and many of the other 50%, including myself would be willing to carry it in some other way. When I travel through the airport I am usually wearing a sport coat or suit not a wind breaker. Fortunately, I always have my briefcase which has ample room for toting the mini around. There is no one case scenario for this device. Perhaps a Nexus is easier to carry in certain situations but I wouldn't know what to do with a Nexus since it doesn't connect to any of my other Apple ecosystem features or my Macs or applications so it would be just useless baggage for me.
I think it's great the mini already has a base in the medical field, but merely being able to slip it in ones pocket does not seem reason enough to me to plunk down $330+ if you already have an iPhone AND an iPad unless, like the physicians, you have a need for it in the workplace. Since the mini cannot be used as a phone, are people really going to pay an extra $330+ to carry around a tablet along with their smart phone if they have an iPad at home unless they have a specific need? As mstone points out, most people carry around a bag of some sort capable of carrying a 10" iPad, be it a back pack, briefcase, purse, etc. however, jackets are not at all universal, especially in the Summer. And the men wearing nice suits, I don't really see carrying this around. Women's suits will not have anything like a big enough pocket.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz
Giant lab coat pockets may be the only ones that work.
I was curious about pocketability so I went to the Apple Store. I left disappointed.
The iPad Mini is not mini enough. My Nexus 7 fits in my jacket and jeans pocket. At the store, the iPad Mini was a very tight fit in the jacket pocket. Zipper wouldn't close. Wasn't even close to fitting in my jeans pockets.
At the size the Mini is, it's not just portability. It's hard to grip the thing with one hand. The extra 15mm compared to the Nexus 7 made a big difference with a wide grip.
Granted Jim is not a small dude...
http://www.loopinsight.com/2012/10/31/ipad-mini-fits-in-your-back-pocket/
I went to the Apple Store and had the complete opposite experience. The thing is light, easily held in one hand (I wear med size gloves) and easily would fit in my jacket pocket.
A must buy for me. It's portable as hell. White looks good too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz
@mstone,
I may not walk around with the Nexus 7 in my pocket but I've travelled with it in my jacket pocket. Very handy when going through airport security to be able to leave it in my jacket. And this is a normal CK windbreaker.
You aren't supposed to wear your jacket through the metal detector. So either way you need to put it into a basket.
Quote:
Originally Posted by oneaburns
Anyway, I can see this being a good product for physicians except for one thing...it's a big time germ spreader. Docs are required to wash their hands or use antibacterial gel between patient visits to reduce the spread of germs (though not all do.) Are they washing their tablet devices with an antibacterial wipe as well? My guess is no.
Less big time than a laptop with keyboard.
There are a many products for iPads in the medical domain. Here's a couple:
http://store.griffintechnology.com/airstrap-med-case
http://www.smartpractice.com/Apps/WebObjects/SmartPractice.woa/wa/style?id=S62036&cid=407057&m=SPD
Or you can just toss it in a xray cassette sterile bag.
While someone will have do a study to confirm, if the hospital is already very aggressive with their antiseptic hand gels the iPad will be swimming in alcohol. The standard here is to pump in and pump out. The lab coat itself is going to be more of an issue than a glass and aluminum iPad that gets wiped down regularly with a wipe between patients. The sleeves are a freaking petri dish.
You'll remove the oleophobic coating but since you're wiping down the screen so much anyway I wouldn't worry too much about skin oil collecting on clinical ipads.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcg878
Lab coat pocket-ability is exactly why I ordered one. An iPad Citrix gives access to most of our hospital's systems, which is useful if a bit awkward. A native system access would be a huge plus, but even emulating a Windows NT screen hospital apps is still invaluable.
While the iPad meets HIPPA and ePHI requirements (with the right apps), keeping access limited to Citrix is one way for IT to continue to use legacy EHR systems...
Win8 tabets may be better in this regard but they aren't lab coat pocket sized yet.
Someone has to explain to me why Epocrates gives a hoot about the pocketability of the iPad mini given it doesn't have an actual iPad version in the app store. Yah yah, they have their iPad EHR beta thingy but who knows when or if that'll come to market.
My hands are not particularly large (nor are they particularly small) at 180 mm (7.3 ") long, wrist to fingertip, by 100 mm (4 ") wide, but I had no trouble at all holding an iPad Mini in my left hand for 5 to 10 minutes while typing in my observations of it using one of the Minis at an Apple Store on release day, into the comments section of one of the threads on the AI forums. I barely noticed that I was holding the device most of the time - I was conentrating on typing.
About the only time that I was aware of it from the holding point of view was to think, "Gee, this is light!" At no point did I feel any discomfort or strain. It was very pleasant and easy to hold - and use! I didn't buy one then as I'm waiting for the one with the GPS.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht
Someone has to explain to me why Epocrates gives a hoot about the pocketability of the iPad mini given it doesn't have an actual iPad version in the app store. Yah yah, they have their iPad EHR beta thingy but who knows when or if that'll come to market.
Unusual that the Android version is very thorough and fully-featured, far outshining their iOS efforts to date. That's despite a survey from May 2011 (yes I know, somewhat old but it's the best I could find) that showed only 3% of the questioned physicians using a tablet at all were using an Android tablet while over half used an Apple iPad. It wasn't mentioned what tablets the other 40% were using.
http://www.informationweek.com/byte/personal-tech/science-technology/medical-apps-on-tablets-gain-popularity/232601963
EDIT: Somewhat related is a more recent article about the FDA stepping in to regulate medical apps intended for mobile use:
http://www.kaiserhealthnews.org/stories/2012/june/27/fda-medical-app-market.aspx
Worth a 2-minute read if you have any interest in med apps, especially developing one.