With the iPhone being the flagship device it does make sense to launch it before other products. It certainly doesn't make sense to launch the iPods, iPhone and iPads all at the same time. I could see the iPhone moving back to Summer with the iPods and iPads being released for the Holidays. However that would mean there is a opening in the Spring. I think we might see a new product category arrive this year to fill that gap. A new Mac Pro, Apple Display and AirPort routers won't cut it.
Do you have any thoughts on what that new category would be?
The smartphone/tablet market is a very hotly contested product category, so the technological pace is accelerating with everybody trying to one up each other. Even though Apple is seemingly doing well, it has to keep up, there-for the need for bi-annual product updates.
Oh and didn't Mr Schiller put to bed any rumour's of a cheaper iPhone already? That particular subject seems to be more a case of wishful thinking on the analysts part rather than an imminent reality - we'll see...
The easy part might be manufacturing a screen size nestled between the iPad mini and iPod touch. I think someone suggested in an earlier thread halving the current iPad mini screen could achieve that at Retina quality. I'm not sure; I haven't run the numbers.
It seems like the larger issue would be branding and pricing. Apple did well enough with the iPod mini, but as screen size/spec/pricing differentiation gets squeezed, the problem appears more confounding.
Perhaps a larger iPod touch and discontinue the 2012 model? Unlikely, as the production lines probably haven't turned a profit yet. And what about pricing?
An iPad nano at ~5"? That seems more likely, but how would they price it?
An iPhone "maxi" ?!?!
A case can be made now, even more than last year with the mini threads, of possible customer confusion around product differentiation.
It would be quite the "magic" trick for Tim and Phil to market and ship a new product category in there that immediately makes sense and has impact.
Do you have any thoughts on what that new category would be?
No idea but I'm hoping for an Apple digibox that has deals with Charter, Time Warner, etc. They can make a lot of money yet only be a monthly fee to customers, they can be updated easily, you wouldn't have to change your cable input on your TV to the Apple TV to use it, and you wouldn't have to get all new TVs.
@tallest skil it may not of hit their predictions but it still took the samsung g3 and wiped it on the floor.. so not the greatest for apple .. still is better then samsung is done.. plus they want to get back on a cycle of once a year releases.. unlike androids 20 per month
I don't agree that Apple wants "to get back on a cycle of once a year releases" -- especially for iDevices. Rather, I believe Apple wants to have multiple releases to:
satisfy seasonal demands -- back to school, holidays, tax refunds
satisfy new markets -- emerging [technology] markets
satisfy needs of worldwide markets and buying patterns
satisfy buying preferences -- subsidized contract vs prepaid
create market for multiple iDevices per person -- own an iPhone andiPad Mini/iPad
exploit new technology advantage -- LTE, WiFi, APU as it becomes available
maintain momentum -- [relatively] continuous new product releases
flesh out product offerings with more SKUs and price points
prevent competition from taking advantage of a predictable release frequency and timing
There's clearly a market for larger display sizes, but since Apple doesn't offer one, Apple loses sales to large screen Android handsets that do. QED.
Now I wouldn't advocate Apple addressing every Android product offering with a corresponding one of its own, but it seems disingenuous to imply that there's not a sales consequence to that. I'd be very surprised if Apple were to introduce a larger display size of any kind; the big honkin' phone just isn't Apple's style.
A more interesting question is just what an iPhone 5S design would consist of. Faster? OK, but the 5 is pretty much state-of-the-art fast as it is. More RAM? The 5 doesn't seem to need it. SoC process shrink? OK, but that's not really something that users can perceive, except maybe in incremental battery life improvement. Up the ante to 128GB of storage? Fine, but that could be a running change that doesn't call for a new model series.
LTE is already here, NFC doesn't look like it's coming, and the iPhone 5 is already almost ridiculously thin. So what's on the tech horizon that could call for an iPhone 5S in a near horizon? IGZO display...?
IMO, the next breakthrough Apple Product is the appliance computer... let's call it the "iDo" or "iAm" -- an iPad Mini LTE with built-in and external earphone/microphone and cell radios to satisfy all relevant tablet and smartphone markets:
For emerging markets, it might be the only computing device/phone that an individual or home/family owns.
For established markets it would provide an individual with an alternative choice -- portibility of iPhone vs capability of iPad Mini
For high-end users it would provide an individual with an additional choice -- buy both and use whichever best fits the need de jour
For the umpteenth time, two times per year refreshes make little to no sense for iPhones that are stuck on two year contracts. Not enough people to buy both models.
I think Apple does need to go back to splitting up the release times for its products. It keeps interest year round and allows people time to save up for each different item.
Valid arguments can be made for both sides of the low cost and screen size debates. Apple will decide which they like better, however to blindly say one or the other side is wrong is shortsighted stupidity.
For the umteenth + ! time -- not everyone buys a new at the same time at the release of the new iPhone. Rather, those who have contracts -- most look around at what is available when their contract ends and choose to:
buy the latest iPhone
wait for the next iPhone
skip an iPhone release
change platforms
do nothing
Having 2 cycles of new iPhones per year, likely, means that Apple could increase sales to 1) and 2) of the contract crowd while increasing appeal to the prepaid crowd.
Periodically, there will be a significant enough breakthrough that people will pay the termination charges and buy the new device -- the original iPhone was one of those breakthroughs.
I wonder about this one. Granted, NFC isn't a perfect technology and doesn't solve all problems - but if every W8 and Android phone/tablet has NFC, plus all the major carriers backing ISIS, not to mention Google & others...doesn't Apple pretty much NEED to put NFC in the next phone?
Just like they "needed" LTE on the 4s. Apple will include it when they think the technology will enhance the product. They waited for LTE until the chips were around to have good batery life and LTE had rolled out to enough of the country (at least on Verizon) to make it meaningful to most. NFC right now is like LTE a year or two ago. A neat idea that isn't realized yet. Also I believe I read that the aluminum in the iPhone 5 and presumably the 5s makes an NFC chip next to impossible.
Apple needs a larger screen phone fast or they will continue to lose share to Samsung. People look at these phones and like it or not think "bigger is better" on the screen size. Apple needs to fill this void quickly.
Apple needs a larger screen phone fast or they will continue to lose share to Samsung. People look at these phones and like it or not think "bigger is better" on the screen size. Apple needs to fill this void quickly.
I don't see any evidence of Apple losing to Samsung. Apple is growing their profits in a very healthy way. If Samsung is taking anything from anyone it's from other Android vendors.
As for you r idea of rushing into a new product lets remember that needed to make a netbook quickly before Acer owned the market and no one wanted Macs anymore. Don't you think it's a good think Apple doesn't make panicked, reactive decisions? I do.
Apple needs a larger screen phone fast or they will continue to lose share to Samsung. People look at these phones and like it or not think "bigger is better" on the screen size. Apple needs to fill this void quickly.
There's zero evidence of this now, just as there was zero evidence of it three years ago when they first said this. All evidence points away from it.
Hopefully Apple will release a big screen iPhone to sell alongside the iPhone 5. Personally I like the size of the 5 and even the 4S is fine for myself, but Apple are losing sales to 'Droids with big screens. A 6" Retina iPhone could nip that trend in the bud.
I actually get it that there are many people who only want 1 device, and for them a slightly oversized phone is the best of all worlds. I could see Apple making one just to round out their line...
"Apple needs a larger screen phone fast or they will continue to lose share to Samsung. People look at these phones and like it or not think "bigger is better" on the screen size. Apple needs to fill this void quickly."
They did a few months back: it's called the cellular data iPad mini.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit
What? Statements like" "but Apple are losing sales to 'Droids with big screens."
I'd say that is pretty much true. The reason might be up for debate.
As far as the 6" part... sure, silly idea in my opinion, but I've seen sillier things said by members who are considered "part of the club".
Wait, there's a club? ;-)
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbf
Wait, there's a club? ;-)
Shhhh...
I could be terminated for letting the cat out of the bag!
[... and please don't respond with: "Wait, there's a cat? ] ;-)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
With the iPhone being the flagship device it does make sense to launch it before other products. It certainly doesn't make sense to launch the iPods, iPhone and iPads all at the same time. I could see the iPhone moving back to Summer with the iPods and iPads being released for the Holidays. However that would mean there is a opening in the Spring. I think we might see a new product category arrive this year to fill that gap. A new Mac Pro, Apple Display and AirPort routers won't cut it.
Do you have any thoughts on what that new category would be?
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1983
The smartphone/tablet market is a very hotly contested product category, so the technological pace is accelerating with everybody trying to one up each other. Even though Apple is seemingly doing well, it has to keep up, there-for the need for bi-annual product updates.
Oh and didn't Mr Schiller put to bed any rumour's of a cheaper iPhone already? That particular subject seems to be more a case of wishful thinking on the analysts part rather than an imminent reality - we'll see...
Less expensive != cheap
The easy part might be manufacturing a screen size nestled between the iPad mini and iPod touch. I think someone suggested in an earlier thread halving the current iPad mini screen could achieve that at Retina quality. I'm not sure; I haven't run the numbers.
It seems like the larger issue would be branding and pricing. Apple did well enough with the iPod mini, but as screen size/spec/pricing differentiation gets squeezed, the problem appears more confounding.
Perhaps a larger iPod touch and discontinue the 2012 model? Unlikely, as the production lines probably haven't turned a profit yet. And what about pricing?
An iPad nano at ~5"? That seems more likely, but how would they price it?
An iPhone "maxi" ?!?!
A case can be made now, even more than last year with the mini threads, of possible customer confusion around product differentiation.
It would be quite the "magic" trick for Tim and Phil to market and ship a new product category in there that immediately makes sense and has impact.
No idea but I'm hoping for an Apple digibox that has deals with Charter, Time Warner, etc. They can make a lot of money yet only be a monthly fee to customers, they can be updated easily, you wouldn't have to change your cable input on your TV to the Apple TV to use it, and you wouldn't have to get all new TVs.
his certainly does for me. but how do you think he got to 20,000+ posts and that fancy user title he's hawking to everyone else?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jecaron
@tallest skil it may not of hit their predictions but it still took the samsung g3 and wiped it on the floor.. so not the greatest for apple .. still is better then samsung is done.. plus they want to get back on a cycle of once a year releases.. unlike androids 20 per month
I don't agree that Apple wants "to get back on a cycle of once a year releases" -- especially for iDevices. Rather, I believe Apple wants to have multiple releases to:
satisfy seasonal demands -- back to school, holidays, tax refunds
satisfy new markets -- emerging [technology] markets
satisfy needs of worldwide markets and buying patterns
satisfy buying preferences -- subsidized contract vs prepaid
create market for multiple iDevices per person -- own an iPhone andiPad Mini/iPad
exploit new technology advantage -- LTE, WiFi, APU as it becomes available
maintain momentum -- [relatively] continuous new product releases
flesh out product offerings with more SKUs and price points
prevent competition from taking advantage of a predictable release frequency and timing
Wait, there's a bag?
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
[citation needed]
There's clearly a market for larger display sizes, but since Apple doesn't offer one, Apple loses sales to large screen Android handsets that do. QED.
Now I wouldn't advocate Apple addressing every Android product offering with a corresponding one of its own, but it seems disingenuous to imply that there's not a sales consequence to that. I'd be very surprised if Apple were to introduce a larger display size of any kind; the big honkin' phone just isn't Apple's style.
A more interesting question is just what an iPhone 5S design would consist of. Faster? OK, but the 5 is pretty much state-of-the-art fast as it is. More RAM? The 5 doesn't seem to need it. SoC process shrink? OK, but that's not really something that users can perceive, except maybe in incremental battery life improvement. Up the ante to 128GB of storage? Fine, but that could be a running change that doesn't call for a new model series.
LTE is already here, NFC doesn't look like it's coming, and the iPhone 5 is already almost ridiculously thin. So what's on the tech horizon that could call for an iPhone 5S in a near horizon? IGZO display...?
IMO, the next breakthrough Apple Product is the appliance computer... let's call it the "iDo" or "iAm" -- an iPad Mini LTE with built-in and external earphone/microphone and cell radios to satisfy all relevant tablet and smartphone markets:
For emerging markets, it might be the only computing device/phone that an individual or home/family owns.
For established markets it would provide an individual with an alternative choice -- portibility of iPhone vs capability of iPad Mini
For high-end users it would provide an individual with an additional choice -- buy both and use whichever best fits the need de jour
it could sold contract or prepaid -- user chooses
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J
For the umpteenth time, two times per year refreshes make little to no sense for iPhones that are stuck on two year contracts. Not enough people to buy both models.
I think Apple does need to go back to splitting up the release times for its products. It keeps interest year round and allows people time to save up for each different item.
Valid arguments can be made for both sides of the low cost and screen size debates. Apple will decide which they like better, however to blindly say one or the other side is wrong is shortsighted stupidity.
For the umteenth + ! time -- not everyone buys a new at the same time at the release of the new iPhone. Rather, those who have contracts -- most look around at what is available when their contract ends and choose to:
buy the latest iPhone
wait for the next iPhone
skip an iPhone release
change platforms
do nothing
Having 2 cycles of new iPhones per year, likely, means that Apple could increase sales to 1) and 2) of the contract crowd while increasing appeal to the prepaid crowd.
Periodically, there will be a significant enough breakthrough that people will pay the termination charges and buy the new device -- the original iPhone was one of those breakthroughs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
New. From Apple. The 30" iPhone. Because now the whiners will finally shut up.
Posted before, but ok
________________________________________________________________________
Damn this 1600 vertical pixels screen; now I need to scroll down to see where the stock is today!
You win the creative sig award!
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbf
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit
What? Statements like" "but Apple are losing sales to 'Droids with big screens."
I'd say that is pretty much true. The reason might be up for debate.
As far as the 6" part... sure, silly idea in my opinion, but I've seen sillier things said by members who are considered "part of the club".
Wait, there's a club? ;-)
Yes, there's a club... And we perform on the stage... There's a stage leaving in half an hour... Be on it!
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbf
I wonder about this one. Granted, NFC isn't a perfect technology and doesn't solve all problems - but if every W8 and Android phone/tablet has NFC, plus all the major carriers backing ISIS, not to mention Google & others...doesn't Apple pretty much NEED to put NFC in the next phone?
Just like they "needed" LTE on the 4s. Apple will include it when they think the technology will enhance the product. They waited for LTE until the chips were around to have good batery life and LTE had rolled out to enough of the country (at least on Verizon) to make it meaningful to most. NFC right now is like LTE a year or two ago. A neat idea that isn't realized yet. Also I believe I read that the aluminum in the iPhone 5 and presumably the 5s makes an NFC chip next to impossible.
Apple needs a larger screen phone fast or they will continue to lose share to Samsung. People look at these phones and like it or not think "bigger is better" on the screen size. Apple needs to fill this void quickly.
I don't see any evidence of Apple losing to Samsung. Apple is growing their profits in a very healthy way. If Samsung is taking anything from anyone it's from other Android vendors.
As for you r idea of rushing into a new product lets remember that needed to make a netbook quickly before Acer owned the market and no one wanted Macs anymore. Don't you think it's a good think Apple doesn't make panicked, reactive decisions? I do.
Originally Posted by mvigod
Apple needs a larger screen phone fast or they will continue to lose share to Samsung. People look at these phones and like it or not think "bigger is better" on the screen size. Apple needs to fill this void quickly.
There's zero evidence of this now, just as there was zero evidence of it three years ago when they first said this. All evidence points away from it.
I actually get it that there are many people who only want 1 device, and for them a slightly oversized phone is the best of all worlds. I could see Apple making one just to round out their line...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
There's zero evidence of this now, just as there was zero evidence of it three years ago when they first said this. All evidence points away from it.
TS... you're slipping. A long answer to this type of statement?
Usually you just cut them off at; "Apple needs...".
"Apple needs a larger screen phone fast or they will continue to lose share to Samsung. People look at these phones and like it or not think "bigger is better" on the screen size. Apple needs to fill this void quickly."
They did a few months back: it's called the cellular data iPad mini.