In spite of how bad as the last couple months have been, I'm holding onto the stock because I think it's going to rise beyond the previous high after the new Apple TV debuts. Investors have been scared because Apple hasn't released any groundbreaking products since Jobs died. They need to see that Apple still has thatmagic touch.
Wall Street obviously believes that the days of making money on hardware will soon be over. They want to see a recurrent revenue model (this is why they LOVE Google and especially Amazon with 1300+ PE ratio ). Maybe they are right but they are betting on it too soon I think. In the mean time Apple should think how to spend their billions to turn the ecosystem into a money making business.
Agreed, but there is some merit to the argument that hardware eventually becomes a commodity. At some point my iPhone will be good enough that I just don't care about the next feature. If people start using their iPhones for 5 years, Apple isn't going to be making very much money.
Investors have been scared because Apple hasn't released any groundbreaking products since Jobs died. They need to see that Apple still has thatmagic touch.
Steve Jobs died a little more than a year ago.
Even when he was alive, it wasn't like Apple was releasing groundbreaking, disruptive products every year. There were many years in between those disruptive products, like from the iPod, to the iPhone.
Apple has released more disruptive products than any other tech company, yet some fools who don't know much about anything expect Apple to re-invent the wheel every 12 months.
Okay the stock has been down now for several months. Wouldn't today's results and guidance already be priced into the stock? I mean what came out of the earnings call that was really unexpected and would warrant a 10% drop?
Exactly, it's all bullshit. There were analysts yesterday saying Apple would report a loss. The whole thing is a joke. I'm going to get a margin call tomorrow. I've lost everything. I was never meant to be a stock trader. Time to get serious about focusing on my acting career.
Exactly, it's all bullshit. There were analysts yesterday saying Apple would report a loss. The whole thing is a joke. I'm going to get a margin call tomorrow. I've lost everything. I was never meant to be a stock trader. Time to get serious about focusing on my acting career.
Hmm...not sure about reporting a loss but I did see some expectations that profit would be down 2%. It came in flat. At most companies that would be a huge beat. Not at Apple. :no:
I don't blame the stock for falling. After Steve Jobs, Tim Cook needs to prove Apple isn't turning into another Sony. And the veil of secrecy Apple keeps doest not provide any comfort to investors in addition to the gigantic mistakes that have been made - Maps, a corporate reshuffling of executives and production problems - you can't buy an iMac without waiting 4 weeks and I had to wait 6 weeks for my iPhone 5.
Apple can't charge $600 for an iPhone in China and take any appreciable amount of the market. I think what we are seeing is saturation of the iPhone in its target market. Everyone that has the money to buy an iPhone has bought one. If Apple refuses to expand its market, it will stop growing. Apple may be fine with that, but many investors have a problem with it.
Other flagship phones are $600 too. But those manufacturers also sell crappy $100 phones in addition to their flagship phones. No wonder they have insane market share numbers across the globe.
Let's say Apple eventually offers a cheaper product line for developing nations. The investors would probably find something wrong with that too.
I know companies are supposed to have "growth" but I'm still trying to figure out if that will be the cure to Apple's problems.
The only other company selling a ridiculous amount of smartphones is Samsung.... and they do it by having tons of products at various price points.
Apple is at a slight disadvantage by only having basically 3 phones that start at $450. (but as we've seen... they have no problems remaining profitable even if they don't capture a large share of the market)
Is a growing number of phones more important than a growing pile of cash?
How is Windows doing? The evolution of Android (and whomever else jumps on the mobile OS bandwagon) will complete itself in about 1/2 the time it took Windows, as they are the same model, except MS profited more from license fees. Apple will grow more slowly, but enjoy much greater retention and expansion in both iOS and Mac OS markets. The frenzy to buy cheap phones with touch screens is just that, an infant market phase. As the market matures, consumers, enterprise and developers will undoubtedly seek security, stability, forward compatibility and functional value in their OS choices. Google has no present ability or future plan to provide that. Google & Partners are simply giving free touch screen candy to children right now. Microsoft has lost much of its credibility in the consumer space and is soooo late to the party. Apple has Mobile + Tablet + Desktop/Laptop + Smart Cloud Service + Living Room integration well evolved already.
How does Apple reach into the bottom of the mobile space barrel and grab some market share with a high probability of retaining it? License iOS 5 to HP and Dell and support the APIs for AppStore development in critical growth markets. Then license each past iOS as it evolves to snag share as needed. Apple faithful will stick to the latest and greatest. The rest will aspire to the latest and greatest.
How is Windows doing? The evolution of Android (and whomever else jumps on the mobile OS bandwagon) will complete itself in about 1/2 the time it took Windows, as they are the same model, except MS profited more from license fees. Apple will grow more slowly, but enjoy much greater retention and expansion in both iOS and Mac OS markets. The frenzy to buy cheap phones with touch screens is just that, an infant market phase. As the market matures, consumers, enterprise and developers will undoubtedly seek security, stability, forward compatibility and functional value in their OS choices. Google has no present ability or future plan to provide that. Google & Partners are simply giving free touch screen candy to children right now. Microsoft has lost much of its credibility in the consumer space and is soooo late to the party. Apple has Mobile + Tablet + Desktop/Laptop + Smart Cloud Service + Living Room integration well evolved already.
How does Apple reach into the bottom of the mobile space barrel and grab some market share with a high probability of retaining it? License iOS 5 to HP and Dell and support the APIs for AppStore development in critical growth markets. Then license each past iOS as it evolves to snag share as needed. Apple faithful will stick to the latest and greatest. The rest will aspire to the latest and greatest.
at these levels, Apple can make a difference in decreasing the number of outstanding shares. And if they are smart, they will start buying back shares until the share price starts going up. The return per share goes up as the share price comes down. Where else can you earn 25% on your money?
How does Apple reach into the bottom of the mobile space barrel and grab some market share with a high probability of retaining it? License iOS 5 to HP and Dell and support the APIs for AppStore development in critical growth markets. Then license each past iOS as it evolves to snag share as needed. Apple faithful will stick to the latest and greatest. The rest will aspire to the latest and greatest.
Apple is a hardware company. Unless they license iOS at $300 a pop, it ain't gonna happen.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by jason98
Wall Street obviously believes that the days of making money on hardware will soon be over. They want to see a recurrent revenue model (this is why they LOVE Google and especially Amazon with 1300+ PE ratio ). Maybe they are right but they are betting on it too soon I think. In the mean time Apple should think how to spend their billions to turn the ecosystem into a money making business.
Agreed, but there is some merit to the argument that hardware eventually becomes a commodity. At some point my iPhone will be good enough that I just don't care about the next feature. If people start using their iPhones for 5 years, Apple isn't going to be making very much money.
It's a sweet day for shorts..iphone 5 is a flop and they have not sold any computers and the competitions are producing better devices
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakefinance
Investors have been scared because Apple hasn't released any groundbreaking products since Jobs died. They need to see that Apple still has thatmagic touch.
Steve Jobs died a little more than a year ago.
Even when he was alive, it wasn't like Apple was releasing groundbreaking, disruptive products every year. There were many years in between those disruptive products, like from the iPod, to the iPhone.
Apple has released more disruptive products than any other tech company, yet some fools who don't know much about anything expect Apple to re-invent the wheel every 12 months.
Exactly, it's all bullshit. There were analysts yesterday saying Apple would report a loss. The whole thing is a joke. I'm going to get a margin call tomorrow. I've lost everything. I was never meant to be a stock trader. Time to get serious about focusing on my acting career.
Originally Posted by daylove22
iphone 5 is a flop and they have not sold any computers and the competitions are producing better devices
And because we've seen recently that it isn't obvious, even when it is, ¡.
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent
That's not really entirely up to you. But there's nothing to worry about.
For Apple to force me to sell my shares, the company would need shareholder approval for the buyout (not just stock repurchase).
There's no way I would invest in Apple right now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ash471
Apple can't go private. The market cap is way too high. Who could possibly afford to buy it?
all Apple needs is more record setting quarters and the price will be down in no time.
Other flagship phones are $600 too. But those manufacturers also sell crappy $100 phones in addition to their flagship phones. No wonder they have insane market share numbers across the globe.
Let's say Apple eventually offers a cheaper product line for developing nations. The investors would probably find something wrong with that too.
I know companies are supposed to have "growth" but I'm still trying to figure out if that will be the cure to Apple's problems.
The only other company selling a ridiculous amount of smartphones is Samsung.... and they do it by having tons of products at various price points.
Apple is at a slight disadvantage by only having basically 3 phones that start at $450. (but as we've seen... they have no problems remaining profitable even if they don't capture a large share of the market)
Is a growing number of phones more important than a growing pile of cash?
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
Is a growing number of phones more important than a growing pile of cash?
So far, for Apple, the answer has been no. And it's working splendidly for them and their employees.
How does Apple reach into the bottom of the mobile space barrel and grab some market share with a high probability of retaining it? License iOS 5 to HP and Dell and support the APIs for AppStore development in critical growth markets. Then license each past iOS as it evolves to snag share as needed. Apple faithful will stick to the latest and greatest. The rest will aspire to the latest and greatest.
How does Apple reach into the bottom of the mobile space barrel and grab some market share with a high probability of retaining it? License iOS 5 to HP and Dell and support the APIs for AppStore development in critical growth markets. Then license each past iOS as it evolves to snag share as needed. Apple faithful will stick to the latest and greatest. The rest will aspire to the latest and greatest.
It wasn't the answer in 1996, it's not the answer now.
at these levels, Apple can make a difference in decreasing the number of outstanding shares. And if they are smart, they will start buying back shares until the share price starts going up. The return per share goes up as the share price comes down. Where else can you earn 25% on your money?
Apple is a hardware company. Unless they license iOS at $300 a pop, it ain't gonna happen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottkatz
Where else can you earn 25% on your money?
NFLX? And in a matter of minutes and hours, forget about months or years. Up almost 36% in after hours today.