I would counter that the reverse is true. Apple should have factories in as many countries as possible. Diversifying countries means if one country goes stupid with their rules it would be more readily possible to nix that production area. And with production in various countries it gives leverage to argue exemption to various import laws if the product selling in the country is being built in said country.
Setting up factories everywhere is no easy task and certainly not cheap. Apple's products also require specialized equipment in many cases, and it seems to me as if this is going to require a huge investment. And what about finding qualified labor? As we see from China, it takes a whole bunch of workers to assemble Apple products. I don't think that Apple should be investing it's money in these countries.
And what about Apple leaks multiplying ten fold? With many more factories, workers and loose mouths, we'll be reading about leaks every five minutes.
Tim Cook: "Hello... Brazil? I just found out about your lawsuit. We're going to tell Foxconn to shut down their manufacturing facility. We no longer require your services."
p.s.3: Apple devices are expensive in Brazil because of HIGH import taxes aimed at fostering local manufacturing (exactly what YOU are asking for now in your own country - LOCAL plants), numerous indirect taxes and the excessive willingness to pay more of many middle- and higher-class Brazilians. This is not Burundi, ya know...
Maybe the US should do what Brazil does, impose a penalty tax on foreign companies by having ridiculously high import taxes, and then Apple products would cost the same in the US, but all Samsung device prices would go up drastically overnight. Samsung sales in the US would drop to almost zero. I'm kind of liking that idea.
Tim Cook: "Hello... Brazil? I just found out about your lawsuit. We're going to tell Foxconn to shut down their manufacturing facility. We no longer require your services."
And remember, Brazil is also where Apple does not have the rights to the iPhone name! I've been against that Foxconn Brazil factory since the beginning.
p.s.3: Apple devices are expensive in Brazil because of HIGH import taxes aimed at fostering local manufacturing (exactly what YOU are asking for now in your own country - LOCAL plants), numerous indirect taxes and the excessive willingness to pay more of many middle- and higher-class Brazilians. This is not Burundi, ya know...
Maybe the US should do what Brazil does, impose a penalty tax on foreign companies by having ridiculously high import taxes, and then Apple products would cost the same in the US, but all Samsung device prices would go up drastically overnight. Samsung sales in the US would drop to almost zero. I'm kind of liking that idea.
Tim Cook: "Hello... Brazil? I just found out about your lawsuit. We're going to tell Foxconn to shut down their manufacturing facility. We no longer require your services."
You're really going to hold an entire country liable for the idiotic actions of a few citizens?
If Apple waits 6 months to release a new product, everyone whines that they're falling behind - because Android phone manufacturers release 20 new products a year. If Apple releases a new product after 6 months, they get sued for planned obsolescence.
I really hope this one gets thrown out quickly. I'd hate to thing that Brazil is getting messed up by a$$hat lawyers as much as we are in the US.
I was just going to say that about Android phones. Where is the logic they can release so many and Apple can't?
[" url="/t/156099/brazilian-lawsuit-accuses-apple-of-planned-obsolescence-with-fourth-gen-ipad/40#post_2281912"]What about Apple losing the rights to the iPhone trademark in Brazil?
Apple didn't lose the iPhone trademark in Brazil. They never had it.
The history is quite simple - someone else was using the trademark long before Apple ever started using it. Then Apple started using it around the world. A recent court case said simply that Apple can't have an exclusive on the trademark, but did not say they can't use it (the other owner would have to sue to stop Apple from using it). But since someone else had it first, Apple actually got off easy.
[" url="/t/156099/brazilian-lawsuit-accuses-apple-of-planned-obsolescence-with-fourth-gen-ipad/40#post_2281852"]
Maybe the US should do what Brazil does, impose a penalty tax on foreign companies by having ridiculously high import taxes, and then Apple products would cost the same in the US, but all Samsung device prices would go up drastically overnight. Samsung sales in the US would drop to almost zero. I'm kind of liking that idea.
Unilateral import duties are not very useful. They create inflation and massive dislocation of your economy.
However, there's some value to simply mirroring the trade laws enacted by other countries - the Ryan doctrine (I think it was from Tom Clancy's Debt of Honor). I think that's actually a reasonable position. We believe in free trade, but if you implement protectionist trade rules, we will use exactly the same rules against your country. After all, if it's fair for your country to have the rule, it should be fair for us to have the same rule.
However, there's some value to simply mirroring the trade laws enacted by other countries - the Ryan doctrine (I think it was from Tom Clancy's Debt of Honor). I think that's actually a reasonable position. We believe in free trade, but if you implement protectionist trade rules, we will use exactly the same rules against your country. After all, if it's fair for your country to have the rule, it should be fair for us to have the same rule.
I agree with that. It sounds like a good, common sense idea. You treat others how they treat you. That sounds fair.
If a certain country has protectionist trade rules which affects the US, then the US should implement those same rules right back at them.
If you have no idea what you're talking about, it's better to remain quiet - just a friendly advice.
Don't blame me if you don't follow the news. Those two things which I mentioned have been widely reported and spoken about, both the iPhone trademark problems and the workers threatening to strike at the Foxconn plant in Brazil.
“…there was a Society of Men among us, bred up from their Youth in the Art of proving by words multiplied for the Purpose, that White is Black, and Black is White, according as they are paid. To this Society all the rest of the People are Slaves.”
“It is a Maxim among these Lawyers, that whatever hath been done before, may legally be done again: And therefore they take special Care to record all the Decisions formerly made against common Justice and the general Reason of Mankind. These, under the Name of Precedents, they produce as Authorities to justify the most iniquitous Opinions; and the Judges never fail of decreeing accordingly.”
“…this Society hath a peculiar Cant and Jargon of their own, that no other Mortal can understand, and wherein all their Laws are written, which they take special Care to multiply; whereby they have wholly confounded the very Essence of Truth and Falshood, of Right and Wrong; so that it will take Thirty Years to decide whether the Field, left me by my Ancestors for six Generations, belong to me, or to a Stranger three Hundred Miles off.”
—Jonathan Swift, Gulliver’s Travels (1726), Part IV, A Voyage to Houyhnhnms, Chapter V
I bought an iPad 3, few months later iPad 4 comes out...no big deal. The iPad 3 is just as good as an iPad 4 for what I use it for. My iPad 3 is fine is in no way obsolete.
[" url="/t/156099/brazilian-lawsuit-accuses-apple-of-planned-obsolescence-with-fourth-gen-ipad/40#post_2281946"]Don't blame me if you don't follow the news. Those two things which I mentioned have been widely reported and spoken about, both the iPhone trademark problems and the workers threatening to strike at the Foxconn plant in Brazil.
Yes, it was widely reported - so there's no excuse for your mis-stating the facts. Apple never lost the trademark as you claimed. It wasn't theirs in the first place.
Yes, it was widely reported - so there's no excuse for your mis-stating the facts. Apple never lost the trademark as you claimed. It wasn't theirs in the first place.
So why is Apple appealing the decision then, if they don't believe that they have a right to it or that it wasn't theirs? Is Apple wrong?
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna
I would counter that the reverse is true. Apple should have factories in as many countries as possible. Diversifying countries means if one country goes stupid with their rules it would be more readily possible to nix that production area. And with production in various countries it gives leverage to argue exemption to various import laws if the product selling in the country is being built in said country.
Setting up factories everywhere is no easy task and certainly not cheap. Apple's products also require specialized equipment in many cases, and it seems to me as if this is going to require a huge investment. And what about finding qualified labor? As we see from China, it takes a whole bunch of workers to assemble Apple products. I don't think that Apple should be investing it's money in these countries.
And what about Apple leaks multiplying ten fold? With many more factories, workers and loose mouths, we'll be reading about leaks every five minutes.
Tim Cook: "Hello... Brazil? I just found out about your lawsuit. We're going to tell Foxconn to shut down their manufacturing facility. We no longer require your services."
Quote:
Originally Posted by brlawyer
p.s.3: Apple devices are expensive in Brazil because of HIGH import taxes aimed at fostering local manufacturing (exactly what YOU are asking for now in your own country - LOCAL plants), numerous indirect taxes and the excessive willingness to pay more of many middle- and higher-class Brazilians. This is not Burundi, ya know...
Maybe the US should do what Brazil does, impose a penalty tax on foreign companies by having ridiculously high import taxes, and then Apple products would cost the same in the US, but all Samsung device prices would go up drastically overnight. Samsung sales in the US would drop to almost zero. I'm kind of liking that idea.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich
Tim Cook: "Hello... Brazil? I just found out about your lawsuit. We're going to tell Foxconn to shut down their manufacturing facility. We no longer require your services."
And remember, Brazil is also where Apple does not have the rights to the iPhone name! I've been against that Foxconn Brazil factory since the beginning.
You might want to think that through a bit more.
You're really going to hold an entire country liable for the idiotic actions of a few citizens?
I was just going to say that about Android phones. Where is the logic they can release so many and Apple can't?
Quote:
Originally Posted by quinney
You might want to think that through a bit more.
I'm not an expert on import laws, so if you think that something that I have written is incorrect, then feel free to point it out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69
You're really going to hold an entire country liable for the idiotic actions of a few citizens?
What about Apple losing the rights to the iPhone trademark in Brazil?
What about the problems at the Foxconn factory, with the workers already threatening to strike?
It seems like there is nothing but problems, and Apple shouldn't be bending over backwards to accommodate every country in the world.
Stupid lawsuit plain and simple....
Apple didn't lose the iPhone trademark in Brazil. They never had it.
The history is quite simple - someone else was using the trademark long before Apple ever started using it. Then Apple started using it around the world. A recent court case said simply that Apple can't have an exclusive on the trademark, but did not say they can't use it (the other owner would have to sue to stop Apple from using it). But since someone else had it first, Apple actually got off easy.
Unilateral import duties are not very useful. They create inflation and massive dislocation of your economy.
However, there's some value to simply mirroring the trade laws enacted by other countries - the Ryan doctrine (I think it was from Tom Clancy's Debt of Honor). I think that's actually a reasonable position. We believe in free trade, but if you implement protectionist trade rules, we will use exactly the same rules against your country. After all, if it's fair for your country to have the rule, it should be fair for us to have the same rule.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][
What about Apple losing the rights to the iPhone trademark in Brazil?
What about the problems at the Foxconn factory, with the workers already threatening to strike?
It seems like there is nothing but problems, and Apple shouldn't be bending over backwards to accommodate every country in the world.
If you have no idea what you're talking about, it's better to remain quiet - just a friendly advice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
However, there's some value to simply mirroring the trade laws enacted by other countries - the Ryan doctrine (I think it was from Tom Clancy's Debt of Honor). I think that's actually a reasonable position. We believe in free trade, but if you implement protectionist trade rules, we will use exactly the same rules against your country. After all, if it's fair for your country to have the rule, it should be fair for us to have the same rule.
I agree with that. It sounds like a good, common sense idea. You treat others how they treat you. That sounds fair.
If a certain country has protectionist trade rules which affects the US, then the US should implement those same rules right back at them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by brlawyer
If you have no idea what you're talking about, it's better to remain quiet - just a friendly advice.
Don't blame me if you don't follow the news. Those two things which I mentioned have been widely reported and spoken about, both the iPhone trademark problems and the workers threatening to strike at the Foxconn plant in Brazil.
“…there was a Society of Men among us, bred up from their Youth in the Art of proving by words multiplied for the Purpose, that White is Black, and Black is White, according as they are paid. To this Society all the rest of the People are Slaves.”
“It is a Maxim among these Lawyers, that whatever hath been done before, may legally be done again: And therefore they take special Care to record all the Decisions formerly made against common Justice and the general Reason of Mankind. These, under the Name of Precedents, they produce as Authorities to justify the most iniquitous Opinions; and the Judges never fail of decreeing accordingly.”
“…this Society hath a peculiar Cant and Jargon of their own, that no other Mortal can understand, and wherein all their Laws are written, which they take special Care to multiply; whereby they have wholly confounded the very Essence of Truth and Falshood, of Right and Wrong; so that it will take Thirty Years to decide whether the Field, left me by my Ancestors for six Generations, belong to me, or to a Stranger three Hundred Miles off.”
—Jonathan Swift, Gulliver’s Travels (1726), Part IV, A Voyage to Houyhnhnms, Chapter V
I bought an iPad 3, few months later iPad 4 comes out...no big deal. The iPad 3 is just as good as an iPad 4 for what I use it for. My iPad 3 is fine is in no way obsolete.
Yes, it was widely reported - so there's no excuse for your mis-stating the facts. Apple never lost the trademark as you claimed. It wasn't theirs in the first place.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Yes, it was widely reported - so there's no excuse for your mis-stating the facts. Apple never lost the trademark as you claimed. It wasn't theirs in the first place.
So why is Apple appealing the decision then, if they don't believe that they have a right to it or that it wasn't theirs? Is Apple wrong?
http://blog.legalzoom.com/intellectual-property/apple-appealing-iphone-trademark-ruling-in-brazil/