Police asking Apple to decrypt seized iPhones must wait their turn

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 60
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,645member
    apple ][ wrote: »

    As for what Apple charges, you're right, it doesn't say anything about that at all in the article, and that is exactly why I wrote that I sure hope that Apple is getting paid for it's services rendered to law enforcement. 

    You do realize that tax payers would be footing the bill.
  • Reply 22 of 60
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 8,360member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by jungmark View Post





    You do realize that tax payers would be footing the bill.


    Yes of course I do.

  • Reply 23 of 60
    seankillseankill Posts: 452member
    apple ][ wrote: »
    Hopefully Apple is billing the various agencies for each case. Why should Apple be doing the police's work for them for free? And I also read that Apple delivers the results on a USB thumb drive. Apple should be making money off of each police request and charging appropriately. Apple should be making a reasonable profit margin on each request.

    It's good that the DEA has a hard time tapping into suspect's messages, as this proves that iPhone to iPhone messages are very secure. 

    In the future, people should be able to buy weed directly from within an app, with one click and zero hassle. The DEA is wasting their time and wasting our tax payer money. Hopefully they will have to wait a lot longer than 7 weeks for each request. The DEA should be downsized or dismantled completely. Talk about a useless and worthless job.


    To your question why should apple pay to decrypt the phones? Because its the right thing for a company to do that is making 13 billion. What is 5 million to ensure public safety?


    As far as drugs being legal, you need to consider. Can we afford the increased health costs, the increased addicted, as far as the economy goes, parasites.
    It's estimated the amount of people that are addicted (also don't work, steal, worthless from an economy stand point) will at least double, pay for that in your own dollar.
  • Reply 24 of 60
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 8,360member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Seankill View Post





    To your question why should apple pay to decrypt the phones? Because its the right thing for a company to do that is making 13 billion. What is 5 million to ensure public safety?





    As far as drugs being legal, you need to consider. Can we afford the increased health costs, the increased addicted, as far as the economy goes, parasites.

    It's estimated the amount of people that are addicted (also don't work, steal, worthless from an economy stand point) will at least double, pay for that in your own dollar.


     


    I don't think that the size of Apple's piggybank is of any relevance to the topic, and I don't believe that Apple should be providing services to any government agencies for free. 


     


    Health care is already a mess and is only going to get much worse and more expensive, thanks to certain health care legislation which I shall not name here. The money already spent and wasted on fighting the "drug war" is astronomical and huge. The government is not at all concerned about saving money.

  • Reply 25 of 60
    sgs46sgs46 Posts: 4member
    The concern, it seems, is that anyone other than the owner would have the keys to 'Decrypt' an encrypted iPhone. If I encrypted my phone I really don't think I would mean to "protect it from everyone except Apple". Why does Apple have a back door? Seems like that's a glaring problem with the entire notion of iPhone encryption.
  • Reply 26 of 60
    normmnormm Posts: 544member
    The remote erase capability of the iPhone is, I believe, based on the use of a strongly encrypted filesystem on the device. If the phone erases the encryption key, then all the data is permanently unreadable. If the criminals have used the remote wipe capability, then Apple can't recover the data. Period.

    If they just need to get past a pass lock, where the user has to type a code in to use the phone, and the encryption key is still stored somewhere on the device, then with some amount of hardware hacking Apple could get at the data. But this requires opening up the device, unless the phone is on a version of iOS where there is a known hack for getting around the pass lock. Or unless Apple has some sort of backdoor way of getting past the pass lock.
  • Reply 27 of 60
    konqerrorkonqerror Posts: 685member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Seankill View Post





    To your question why should apple pay to decrypt the phones? Because its the right thing for a company to do that is making 13 billion. What is 5 million to ensure public safety?

     


     


    The problem is if it was free, then law enforcement would abuse it. Anytime they saw a iPhone they'd send it in to Apple. Ultimately the costs would be passed on consumers who didn't commit crimes.


     


    And the costs, I guarantee you, are much higher than $5 million. It is probably around $2-5K per phone. Work done by a certified forensic examiner is around $300-400 an hour. This is because Apple needs to follow very strict procedures to ensure evidence is not tampered with, or overlooked. Lawyers will have to vet and oversee the process. Ultimately their procedures and the people involved will have to be questioned in a court of law. Any little mistake or omission can lead to critical evidence being thrown out.

  • Reply 28 of 60
    konqerrorkonqerror Posts: 685member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SGS46 View Post



    The concern, it seems, is that anyone other than the owner would have the keys to 'Decrypt' an encrypted iPhone. If I encrypted my phone I really don't think I would mean to "protect it from everyone except Apple". Why does Apple have a back door? Seems like that's a glaring problem with the entire notion of iPhone encryption.


     


    Did you use a PIN on your phone? No password on your phone at all? Then you can easily brute force it.


     


    What you have to realize is that if the cops get a hold of a phone, they cannot turn it on, because that can destroy critical evidence. They need to be able to make a copy of the data without booting the OS, then try all 10k pins, and only Apple can do this properly.

  • Reply 29 of 60
    charlitunacharlituna Posts: 7,205member
    sgs46 wrote: »
    The concern, it seems, is that anyone other than the owner would have the keys to 'Decrypt' an encrypted iPhone. If I encrypted my phone I really don't think I would mean to "protect it from everyone except Apple". Why does Apple have a back door? Seems like that's a glaring problem with the entire notion of iPhone encryption.

    In a sense they do have a back door because they wrote the software so they know how the passcode are encoded and where. And so they would know if there was a way to pull the info off say by copying that bit of data to the area of a computer that is storing it so that it can still back up a phone even if you forget the passcode (so long as it isn't disabled) because it was previously linked to the phone. If you could mock that key you could back up the phone, restore it to a blank phone and have at a lot of info.
  • Reply 30 of 60
    jc crisjc cris Posts: 1member
    Yes Apple should do it FREE and made to do it faster. They receive major tax breaks and take advantage of loopholes. When it comes to solving crimes they want us to pay again!? NO!
  • Reply 31 of 60
    robin huberrobin huber Posts: 3,234member
    My first thought was: is Apple encryption that strong or is law enforcement that weak?
  • Reply 32 of 60
    robin huberrobin huber Posts: 3,234member
    My first thought was: is Apple encryption that strong or is law enforcement that weak?
  • Reply 33 of 60
    welshdogwelshdog Posts: 1,653member


    It would be politically unwise of Apple to be uncooperative with law enforcement.  Charging too much or even at all might create backlash in congress.  Particularly from the law and order types.

  • Reply 34 of 60
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member


    http://mobileforensics.com


     


    Says data acquisition is provided for 4000+ mobile phones including iPhones with their Secure View software

  • Reply 35 of 60
    lostkiwilostkiwi Posts: 583member
    N
    mstone wrote: »
    How do I encrypt my iPhone?
    Not sure if you are kidding or not.. But assuming you aren't: turn on the pass code requirement and make it at least 6 characters, but the more there are the better.
    Done.
  • Reply 36 of 60
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,989member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by lilgto64 View Post


     


    Wow - so it is a waste of tax payer money for the DEA to stop criminals from profiting off illegal drugs...


     



     


    What, so like the money Google made from illegal drugs imported from Canada?

  • Reply 37 of 60
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,989member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    How do I encrypt my iPhone?



    password lock it

  • Reply 38 of 60
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,989member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by konqerror View Post


     


    Not really. They just make it illegal for civilians to own that technology. Look at guns, technologies like night vision and spy satellites, and in the past encryption (clipper chip).



     


    Actually it has moved on to CAD templates of guns for 3D printers, the US Government stepped in just the other day.

  • Reply 39 of 60
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,989member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by konqerror View Post


     


    Did you use a PIN on your phone? No password on your phone at all? Then you can easily brute force it.


     


    What you have to realize is that if the cops get a hold of a phone, they cannot turn it on, because that can destroy critical evidence. They need to be able to make a copy of the data without booting the OS, then try all 10k pins, and only Apple can do this properly.



     


    10,000 pins only if "Simple Passcode" is enabled, flick that little switch and things just got a whole lot harder, then you can set the iOS device to wipe itself after "X" attempts.

  • Reply 40 of 60
    haggarhaggar Posts: 1,568member


    Just don't sieze them that way.  Just don't encrypt that way.

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