"What I'm trying to say is that iOS and Apples stewardship of the platform is certainly worth a little extra Apple "tax". So better margins than the industry standard is good. However so good that you start to look greedy isn't so good."
You keep waffling, writing about "greedy" etc. You are a whiner. Like some YOU want to be in charge because YOU know what the public wants. I doubt that at all. Get a Galaxy 10 or something to satisfy yourself.
Apple doesn’t make feature phones, nor are they trying to. They’ve made no comment as to feature phones; they’re talking about smartphones.
Again, Apple made no comment as to those phones. Stop the FUD. Maybe even read the page title, for heaven’s sake.
Seriously, FUD? Look up the meaning of the word and tell me how my post was any of those three things.
Feature phones, smart phones, don't really care. Collectively describing sections of the market where you have no presence as junk lacks class. It exists, you're not going there, that's all you need to say.
Plastic cases are a great advantage for phones. They are more durable and won't scratch as easily. Plus they come in fun colors that would be almost impossible with metal.
If you hold the 5C you will know its not cheap. Its more like ceramic art than plastic.
Apple managed to reduce the iPod concept to the super-cheap iPod shuffle. I guess it's a lot easier to do that with a music player than a phone/computer/camera/video player/music player/etc.
It is. A music player can have 1 feature, a smart phone cannot.
Ya gotta stick to your core. I'm glad to hear Tim say that that's exactly what they are doing.
The point is Apple has gone for cheaper in terms of casing - but that's not reflected in the price.
How many times have posters on this board dismissed Android or Windows phones as being 'cheap plastic crap'? A U-turn as far as plastic goes.
Now the iPhone 5c brings the worst of both worlds. Plastic casing ... but ... same premium prices. Exactly the same prices they've always charged for last year's technology.
Nobody is expecting any Apple product to be dirt cheap, but instead of using plastic savings to get a bit more competitive on price, Apple is using it to bolster their already healthy profit margins.
Apple can keep marking there prizes the way they do, simply because there is a demand for the the devices they price.
And why is that ? Coz they happen to be the company bringing technology in a way that's highly valued by its customers.
They take the risks, and make those bold moves the rest wouldn't venture into. They can keep pricing there devices at what it's priced as long as they stay innovative and stay cutting edge, and more importantly keep leading the tech industry, playing the role of that Shepard.
Seriously, FUD? Look up the meaning of the word and tell me how my post was any of those three things.
Feature phones, smart phones, don't really care. Collectively describing sections of the market where you have no presence as junk lacks class. It exists, you're not going there, that's all you need to say.
They aren't describing sections of the market. They are describing products that are sub-standard.
Yes, Apple could sell a gazillion models of everything, from the bottom of the price range to the top. But that's not what the company is about. That's not how they got to where they are. I was very worried about the 5C, because I was convinced it would be (relatively) inexpensive, and thus would damage the brand. Thankfully, that's not what happened. They made a quality phone, with excellent build quality (according to the reviews I've read), that simply appeals to a segment of the market that they hadn't appealed to yet (people who want color phones).
What they didn't do is make "junk." And let's face it: A lot of mobile phones out there are just that. Bad build quality, poor components, all thrown together in a race to the bottom.
There's nothing wrong with calling a spade a spade.
The point is Apple has gone for cheaper in terms of casing - but that's not reflected in the price.
How many times have posters on this board dismissed Android or Windows phones as being 'cheap plastic crap'? A U-turn as far as plastic goes.
Now the iPhone 5c brings the worst of both worlds. Plastic casing ... but ... same premium prices. Exactly the same prices they've always charged for last year's technology.
Nobody is expecting any Apple product to be dirt cheap, but instead of using plastic savings to get a bit more competitive on price, Apple is using it to bolster their already healthy profit margins.
Have you actually read any reviews of the 5C? Like at Anandtech? Go ahead, it is on the front page.
This is not a "cheap plastic casing" (unlike some other unnamed companies use). It's a high quality polycarbonate casing. And the reason they used it is not to cut costs. The reason is because some people apparently want a phone in some bright color. And there's no real evidence that this housing is all that much cheaper than the one the 5S uses.
Now, if Apple had thrown some POS together, with some crap plastic? I would agree with you. But that's not what happened.
No, I don't think switching to a plastic case would save $150. But using last years tech in a plastic case would certainly be $150 cheaper if not more.
I feel that Apple is being unnecessarily greedy with the iPhone 5C.
The iPhone 5S is a bargain.
5S a bargain or 5C is expensive?
5C seems expensive to me - iPod touch 32GB $299, iPhone 5C 32GB $649. $350 extra to add in phone functionality!
The point is Apple has gone for cheaper in terms of casing - but that's not reflected in the price.
How many times have posters on this board dismissed Android or Windows phones as being 'cheap plastic crap'? A U-turn as far as plastic goes.
Now the iPhone 5c brings the worst of both worlds. Plastic casing ... but ... same premium prices. Exactly the same prices they've always charged for last year's technology.
Nobody is expecting any Apple product to be dirt cheap, but instead of using plastic savings to get a bit more competitive on price, Apple is using it to bolster their already healthy profit margins.
False !
Apple had to revamp the iPhone, cause the regular consumer wanted to buy tech that's released this year, and not a years old tech.
Hence they did make minor improvements to the 5C in terms of the LTE bands, and even reduced it's weight by going with a plastic case.
And in the process bringing in vibrant color options. There is a cost involved in re-designing a phone, changing its Aluminum / glass structure to plastic.. There's R&D effort that goes into it.. If you notice, they have an antenna system lined across the internals of the plastic body.
Hence it's not as simple as you saying, got rid of the aluminum / glass and moved to plastic case, which cost cheaper.
If you hold onto a 5C you'll still feel it's got a very premium feel to it.. They even go with the Uni-Body design making it sturdy and something that feels premium when held. Hence there's a cost involved to all that production techniques / R&D.
Hence altough a plastic case, it doesn't feel cheap like the rest of the plastic phones in the market.
I feel like people are missing the point of the iPhone 5C. Everyone is looking at it like it's this whole new phone that Apple came out with and it's missing all of these features, etc. No... just no...
What Apple has done is great, really. Instead of doing what they've been doing for years, which is knocking the year-old iPhone model's prices down $100, they've turned it into a new, yet same (if that makes sense), phone. They've redone the looks/components on the outside, yet kept the components on the inside the same(?) (is there anything different on the inside compared to the 5? I'm not positive. I know it's nothing worse, that's for sure.)
So at the end of the day, they have a phone at the $199/$299/$399 price point, a phone at the $99/$199/$299 price point and a phone at the free price point. How is that anything worse than any other year? No one ever complained that the 4S was too much last year, or the 4 was the year before, etc... why is the 5C this catastrophe? They're keeping the same premise, but making it new at the same time. I applaud them for turning a piece of their business into something sort of new.
Indeed, and if you crunch the numbers on the back of an envelope, I think you come up with a bytes/sec number that is so huge that instead of complaining about Apple's unforgivable inability to perfectly manage this (as some did in a post yesterday) we should be thankful that the internet backbone itself didn't implode. (Joking... sort of.) And we should be flat-out amazed that Apple was able to manage it anywhere near the level at which they did. (I'm looking for some of yesterday's complainers to backpeddle a bit - if they can't quite bring themselves to do a complete 180.)
I love it when I here Apple is "Greedy" or "Apple Tax"
It is not that Apple is over priced it is that the competition is in a race to the bottom for 5% profit or less per unit.
Apple does not fall for the pressure of the competition to compete for "junk".
I here how people talking about there 3rd or 4th generation back device like the iPhone 4 and iPhone 4s with the latest iOS 7 on said device and how happy they are.
Do you hear that about Samsung, Black Berry or HTC?
That alone speaks VOLUMES about the quality of Apple devices.
So when fan boys are ripping Apple for not producing a device designed to last 2 years or less take into account they are only doing so because the product they use on a daily basis is no where to quality level that Apple produces.
I believe you can't copy quality because if you are copying some other companies product in the first place you already have a lack of innovation or creativity and are always following and never leading nor will you ever.
Look at all phones in the last 4-5 years, 75% of all the true inovation has come from Apple and the 5s in no different with real useable fingerprint tech and complete 64bit.
Now with in the next 6 months every MFG and Android will offer the same specs but again it will not be as fluid and polished like Apple products because..... they will be copying instead of leading.
Done with my rant, thanks for reading...flame away
When people talk about an Apple Tax, they're looking at the cost of individual components and saying, "I can build that cheaper" (especially with computers).
What they're not looking at is the quality of design, the OS and the ecosystem. And they're also not looking at the productivity improvements when using Apple's versions of these devices. It also doesn't take into account how long these devices last (my Macs especially last forever, unlike the PCs I've been forced to use.)
That's not to say that I've never thought that Apple was too expensive. And I've certainly considered getting my mother a Kindle.
But overall, I think Apple is worth it and I'm always a bit surprised on my daily subway trips where I see tons of Apple devices used by people who, based on appearance or where they got on the subway, wouldn't appear to be earning high wages.
This sort of arrogant and dismissive language toward a group that includes all the people on the edge of becoming our new customers is not at all helpful to us stockholders.
A device that is all it can be at a lower price point is a perfectly valid product. I agree completely that Apple has better opportunity in the high end market it dominates and owns. But trash talking is a lightening rod for the type of social pile on that cost ordinary people billions of dollars the last few days.
Applause rings out from a bunch of fans who probably would be hard pressed to guess three issues to address to stack up a bunch of sapphire lenses. Apple's strength is in is design, engineering and execution. It's not some sort of bizarre reality show.
Comments
You keep waffling, writing about "greedy" etc. You are a whiner. Like some YOU want to be in charge because YOU know what the public wants. I doubt that at all. Get a Galaxy 10 or something to satisfy yourself.
Apple doesn’t make feature phones, nor are they trying to. They’ve made no comment as to feature phones; they’re talking about smartphones.
Again, Apple made no comment as to those phones. Stop the FUD. Maybe even read the page title, for heaven’s sake.
Seriously, FUD? Look up the meaning of the word and tell me how my post was any of those three things.
Apple CEO Tim Cook on cheap smartphones:
'We're not in the junk business'
Larry to The L Team: See, I told ya! We can still sell more android based junks and craps out there!!
Feature phones, smart phones, don't really care.
Really? Because it’s sort of the point. You should care.
Ah, so Apple doesn’t make a smartphone. I see.
Have you actually held the 5C in your hand?
"Section" of the market. They don't make a cheap one. That's straight from the article, so maybe you should read it.
Not engaging with you any more if you're going to insist on being a dick about everything.
Apple managed to reduce the iPod concept to the super-cheap iPod shuffle. I guess it's a lot easier to do that with a music player than a phone/computer/camera/video player/music player/etc.
It is. A music player can have 1 feature, a smart phone cannot.
Here's the cover pic. Man I'm glad I'm ignoring tech sites this week. I can only imagine the coverage and comments, especially after this article.
It's a great cover.
And Samsung has the highest rated cable primetime drama with a multi-ethnic cast at 9 PM!
Arbitrary restrictions are just a kinder way of moving the goalposts.
Ya gotta stick to your core. I'm glad to hear Tim say that that's exactly what they are doing.
Apple can keep marking there prizes the way they do, simply because there is a demand for the the devices they price.
And why is that ? Coz they happen to be the company bringing technology in a way that's highly valued by its customers.
They take the risks, and make those bold moves the rest wouldn't venture into. They can keep pricing there devices at what it's priced as long as they stay innovative and stay cutting edge, and more importantly keep leading the tech industry, playing the role of that Shepard.
Seriously, FUD? Look up the meaning of the word and tell me how my post was any of those three things.
They aren't describing sections of the market. They are describing products that are sub-standard.
Have you actually read any reviews of the 5C? Like at Anandtech? Go ahead, it is on the front page.
No, I do
No, I don't think switching to a plastic case would save $150. But using last years tech in a plastic case would certainly be $150 cheaper if not more.
I feel that Apple is being unnecessarily greedy with the iPhone 5C.
The iPhone 5S is a bargain.
5S a bargain or 5C is expensive?
5C seems expensive to me - iPod touch 32GB $299, iPhone 5C 32GB $649. $350 extra to add in phone functionality!
"New is easy. Right is hard." - Craig Federighi
Bravo, sir.
I feel like people are missing the point of the iPhone 5C. Everyone is looking at it like it's this whole new phone that Apple came out with and it's missing all of these features, etc. No... just no...
What Apple has done is great, really. Instead of doing what they've been doing for years, which is knocking the year-old iPhone model's prices down $100, they've turned it into a new, yet same (if that makes sense), phone. They've redone the looks/components on the outside, yet kept the components on the inside the same(?) (is there anything different on the inside compared to the 5? I'm not positive. I know it's nothing worse, that's for sure.)
So at the end of the day, they have a phone at the $199/$299/$399 price point, a phone at the $99/$199/$299 price point and a phone at the free price point. How is that anything worse than any other year? No one ever complained that the 4S was too much last year, or the 4 was the year before, etc... why is the 5C this catastrophe? They're keeping the same premise, but making it new at the same time. I applaud them for turning a piece of their business into something sort of new.
I'm confused as to why people are confused...
Meanwhile, Mixpanel is showing iOS 7 adoption rate now around 30%. That's 30% in about 16 hours.
https://mixpanel.com/trends/#report/ios_7/from_date:-2,to_date:0
Indeed, and if you crunch the numbers on the back of an envelope, I think you come up with a bytes/sec number that is so huge that instead of complaining about Apple's unforgivable inability to perfectly manage this (as some did in a post yesterday) we should be thankful that the internet backbone itself didn't implode. (Joking... sort of.) And we should be flat-out amazed that Apple was able to manage it anywhere near the level at which they did. (I'm looking for some of yesterday's complainers to backpeddle a bit - if they can't quite bring themselves to do a complete 180.)
When people talk about an Apple Tax, they're looking at the cost of individual components and saying, "I can build that cheaper" (especially with computers).
What they're not looking at is the quality of design, the OS and the ecosystem. And they're also not looking at the productivity improvements when using Apple's versions of these devices. It also doesn't take into account how long these devices last (my Macs especially last forever, unlike the PCs I've been forced to use.)
That's not to say that I've never thought that Apple was too expensive. And I've certainly considered getting my mother a Kindle.
But overall, I think Apple is worth it and I'm always a bit surprised on my daily subway trips where I see tons of Apple devices used by people who, based on appearance or where they got on the subway, wouldn't appear to be earning high wages.
A device that is all it can be at a lower price point is a perfectly valid product. I agree completely that Apple has better opportunity in the high end market it dominates and owns. But trash talking is a lightening rod for the type of social pile on that cost ordinary people billions of dollars the last few days.
Applause rings out from a bunch of fans who probably would be hard pressed to guess three issues to address to stack up a bunch of sapphire lenses. Apple's strength is in is design, engineering and execution. It's not some sort of bizarre reality show.