Review: Apple's late-2013 13-inch MacBook Pro with Retina display

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Comments

  • Reply 41 of 126
    jfanningjfanning Posts: 3,394member
    drblank wrote: »
    So you honestly think that the RAM that Apple buys is only $15 for 4GB of RAM?  Really?  Based on what?  The pricing for the cheap surplus memory that Apple and other top brands reject?


    Do you honestly think Apple will be doing the testing? No, they will make the manufacturers do it. And considering the expensive Kingston etc memory is cheaper that Apple, and this is the same stuff they use you have to question Apple's motives (well you don't, it is to make more money for themelves)
  • Reply 42 of 126
    jfanningjfanning Posts: 3,394member
    akqies wrote: »
    You've been since 2006 and never read any of the articles where Apple has invested in and paid for machinery that they didn't run just so they could get the technology they wanted?


    No, I have never seen an article on AI in the last 7 years stating they have purchased a million dollar testing machine for Kington etc to test RAM. If you have, can you please post a link to it?

    akqies wrote: »
    How much does a quad-core Core i7 cost in a 15" MBP? How much does that ATI GPU COST? How much do all those other parts plus the manufacturing of that board cost? If you really think Apple accepts the same level of testing for a stick of RAM on Newegg that it does for RAM it's soldering to its motherboards you're gravely mistaken.

    No, but the stick of RAM Apple uses is the same stick of RAM that Kington etc sell for much less than Apple resells it for. Don't play dumb and claim that the budget RAM sold by some company called Netegg is the same standard as a number of computer makers put in their machines. But in saying that, that budget RAM has been through the same tests.

    All RAM makes sell a variety of different quality RAM.
  • Reply 43 of 126
    akqiesakqies Posts: 768member
    jfanning wrote: »
    Do you honestly think Apple will be doing the testing? No, they will make the manufacturers do it. And considering the expensive Kingston etc memory is cheaper that Apple, and this is the same stuff they use you have to question Apple's motives (well you don't, it is to make more money for themelves)

    Right, it is to make money for Apple but all of Apple's moves are to make money for Apple. How the hell did you get the impression they were a charity?

    Don't be an idiot about his comment about Apple testing RAM. He neither said nor implied that RAM chips are shipped to Cupertino so they have be tested by Apple employees just as the iPhone isn't hand made by Apple employees in Cupertino. His implication is clear. Apple pays for additional testing to ensure a lower fail rate. These are guaranteed with contracts that will result in huge penalties if Apple loses money either from costly replacement boards as well as from less absolute costs from potential from a damage brand and lost customers. This is standard practice and you're foolish if you think Apple will take any cheap RAM without due diligence when soldering it to a motherboard containing hundreds of dollars in other components.
  • Reply 44 of 126
    virtuavirtua Posts: 207member
    Whether anyone thinks it's expensive is irrelevant - it's how you value the product for the price you want to pay.

    Your not going to know how they weight the costing - it's Pointless conjecture.

    128gb - I'm not sure how anyone wouldn't use it....especially if using iTunes, photos, applications etc. Now how you get around it with external storage etc that's a different thing.
  • Reply 45 of 126
    nofeernofeer Posts: 2,422member
    I retired my white mb c2d 7 years of wonderful service still is a stable very capable machine loved it I was able to upgrade ram and hd easily
    Got the 13 r 256 8 ram TC w external 1 TB hd
    Home networks and uses have changed don't need to keep as much stuff local even pages now are cloud based
    I wish
    Apple included at least TB to Ethernet adapter because even w AC Time capsule restore times are unreasonably long
    From what I've read I can direct connect to TC w Ethernet to restore
    Also-- I wish iCloud was really a cloud storage I shouldn't need Dropbox
    iCloud needs to be a complete cloud service

    This is an awesome fast impressive laptop
    Got my wifey one she is blown away
    LOVING IT hope it is as longived as my trusty MBA c2d
  • Reply 46 of 126
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by akqies View Post





    I would have loved to save a couple hundred getting a 128GB of storage. Unfortunately the options I wanted on my 15" MBP forced me to go for 512GB. I really have absolutely no need for all that. But that's how Apple designed their system. If I don't like it I can go elsewhere but I'm sure Apple is aware that those that want the dGPU with a faster CPU will spend the most for the additional storage or be more likely to want the higher capacity. Whether you do with option 1, which is cynical, or option 2 it's still their choice on how to market the machines and my choice on what I want to buy.

    What options did you want that forced you into the top model?  Or did you not go BTO?

  • Reply 47 of 126
    doumeki wrote: »

    As you point out below this situation your describing above has no relevance to the current situation what so ever. Also why would someone hate you for not being an idiot and being smart with your money? You seem to think this argument is about defending Apple, I don't actually own my Macbook 13" yet its coming on Monday and it will be the first Apple computer I have ever owned. I have zero brand loyalty to Apple, am a PC guy have been for 15 years and will continue that way. 

    Am also a university student in the UK who gets a massive cut from apple products, it cost me £1014 for laptop with my discount and the upgrade I put on the machine. I couldn't actually buy a Windows laptop for that price that was small and light like the 13" pro that offered even close to the performance I got from the so called "overpriced" Apple machine. Granted I did get a 16 percent discount, and without that I would of most likely went elsewhere.

    Let me remind you, this is a review of a 13" laptop, not a 15" one. It's also less than an Inch thick what sort of upgrade path are you expecting, because I can tell you its not a very realistic one. Why I don't disagree that soldering the RAM could cut costs, but unlike you and the posters earlier talking how much the RAM actually costs Apple. I refuse to make blanket statements with zero evidence and figures to back it up. 


    Am willing to go out on a limb here and just assume your simply making this up, I very much doubt a hardware company like Apple would state the reason they are using soldered RAM is so that it "doesn't fall out".
    I'm totally missing your point???
  • Reply 48 of 126
    Originally Posted by darthW View Post

    I'm totally missing your point???

     

    That your notion’s wrong, I think.

     

    A pro computer should have user upgradable ram. Soldered ram simply lets apple manufacture the computer cheaper because access to ram doesn't have to be built in.


     

    These statements aren’t right.

  • Reply 49 of 126
    Or maybe you don’t have any idea what you’re talking about.

    You sound like you don't know what you're talking about either. Do u ever do research before you post all these jerk reactions/replies?
  • Reply 50 of 126
    what about Image Retention on LG Panels? Anybody is mentioning it?
    It is a major issue and that's stopping me from buying one. Pretty bad for Apple.
  • Reply 51 of 126
    runbuhrunbuh Posts: 315member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

     

    These statements aren’t right.


    Actually, they are correct, with the addition that the soldered-on RAM also allows a thinner chassis.

  • Reply 52 of 126
    Originally Posted by daveinpublic View Post

    You sound like you don't know what you're talking about either. Do u ever do research before you post all these jerk reactions/replies?

     

    Try showing me where I’m “wrong”, then.

     

    Originally Posted by runbuh View Post

    Actually, they are correct

     

    Whoop, meant to quote the “falling out” one.

  • Reply 53 of 126
    Why the heck is [B]Cash097[/B] banned? Is there some type of new Taliban AI-posting code that we should know about?

    I see nothing that he said here to be offensive in the least!

    :no:
  • Reply 54 of 126
    akqiesakqies Posts: 768member
    jfanning wrote: »
    No, I have never seen an article on AI in the last 7 years stating they have purchased a million dollar testing machine for Kington etc to test RAM. If you have, can you please post a link to it?

    You claim that Apple doesn't use testings on expensive 3rd-party equipment. They do, which makes your claim false, false, false. They use testing and building on very expensive machinery that they either buy, lease, or contract out. You think this is just about buying some machinery that sits next to Tim Cook's office which is absurd and frankly juvenile. This is how a global enterprise works.

    Yes, they do test RAM. Yes, they do have to use tests for integrated items that are more strict than discreet items. These tests require additional time and/or more price equipment. You even end your stupid comments by saying that there are variety of of different quality RAM. Do you even understand how different performance and quality is had? Do you think they have a machine with a dial that list: DOA, poor quality, decent, OK, and excellent? Of course not, The RAM chips are tested!!!
    No, but the stick of RAM Apple uses is the same stick of RAM that Kington etc sell for much less than Apple resells it for. Don't play dumb and claim that the budget RAM sold by some company called Netegg is the same standard as a number of computer makers put in their machines. But in saying that, that budget RAM has been through the same tests.

    All RAM makes sell a variety of different quality RAM.

    Seriously? Really? You can look at the performance of most the RAM and see they aren't the same, but if technical specs are too complex for you you can look at the very fact they are discreet sticks of RAM and not soldered onto an Apple mother board to see they are clearly not the same.

    Just think about what you're suggesting. You're suggesting the same level of scrutiny for use buying RAM on Newegg is being used by Apple for soldering RAM to an expensive mother board (which also gets tested more than a desktop-class motherboard that has no major components attached) and you're claiming Apple has made no investments in machinery to push innovation. Neither of these can possibly be true as there are plenty of evidence, not just rumors, of Apple doing just that. You may like to think Apple is all marketing and shiny gadgets with no actual technically know how or quality assurance but you'd be very wrong. Just look at the latest Mac Pro video for an example.
  • Reply 55 of 126
    mariomario Posts: 346member
    Something doesn't seem right.

    MacBook Pro (MacBookPro8,3)
    Intel Core i7 @ 2200 MHz
    16 GB - DDR3 @ 1333 MHz
    AMD Radeon HD 6750M 1024 MB

    Nova Score:

    NovaBench Score: 1132
    2013-11-03 15:50:00 0000
    Mac OS X 10.9.0
    Intel Core i7 @ 2200 MHz
    Graphics Card: Intel HD Graphics 3000

    16384 MB System RAM (Score: 218)
    - RAM Speed: 8102 MB/s

    CPU Tests (Score: 696)
    - Floating Point Operations/Second: 271774720
    - Integer Operations/Second: 549159424
    - MD5 Hashes Calculated/Second: 1089930

    Graphics Tests (Score: 194)
    - 3D Frames Per Second: 641

    Hardware Tests (Score: 24)
    - Primary Partition Capacity: 697 GB
    - Drive Write Speed: 83 MB/s

    So overall faster score with 5500 RPM hard drive and slower memory?
  • Reply 56 of 126
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

     
    Oh, and I get by perfectly on 4GB of RAM also. I don't get all this "8GB is the minimum for OSX these days" bullshit. Especially for people that don't even use their computers for anything taxing or worthwhile. Everyone is so damned spoiled these days and feel like they somehow require the highest specs. 


    I usually keep my MBPs for a long time and then hand them down when I buy a new one, hence, I always buy the most maxed out model because you never know what you might need a few years from now. I also use a lot of heavy duty applications so I like having room to work. I also buy the 15" not the smaller screen sizes.

     

    It really comes down to whether you can afford the upgrades or not. If you can, you should go for it. Just my opinion. If you know you will never need it then at least you are making an informed decision.

  • Reply 57 of 126
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,232moderator
    Why the heck is Cash097 banned? Is there some type of new Taliban AI-posting code that we should know about?

    I see nothing that he said here to be offensive in the least!

    :no:

    The offensive parts of posts are removed and infractions issued. Bans aren't for one incident, the infractions accumulate and there are temporary bans, he has had multiple infractions over a period of time and they have now resulted in a temporary ban. He will be back in 3 days. Everyone gets plenty opportunity to correct their posting style to be civil.
  • Reply 58 of 126
    akqiesakqies Posts: 768member
    mario wrote: »
    Something doesn't seem right.

    MacBook Pro (MacBookPro8,3)
    Intel Core i7 @ 2200 MHz
    16 GB - DDR3 @ 1333 MHz
    AMD Radeon HD 6750M 1024 MB

    Nova Score:

    NovaBench Score: 1132
    2013-11-03 15:50:00 0000
    Mac OS X 10.9.0
    Intel Core i7 @ 2200 MHz
    Graphics Card: Intel HD Graphics 3000

    16384 MB System RAM (Score: 218)
    - RAM Speed: 8102 MB/s

    CPU Tests (Score: 696)
    - Floating Point Operations/Second: 271774720
    - Integer Operations/Second: 549159424
    - MD5 Hashes Calculated/Second: 1089930

    Graphics Tests (Score: 194)
    - 3D Frames Per Second: 641

    Hardware Tests (Score: 24)
    - Primary Partition Capacity: 697 GB
    - Drive Write Speed: 83 MB/s

    So overall faster score with 5500 RPM hard drive and slower memory?

    NovaBench Score: 1225
    2013-11-03 16:33:03 +0000
    Mac OS X 10.9.0
    Intel Core i7 @ 2300 MHz
    Graphics Card: Intel Iris Pro

    16384 MB System RAM (Score: 226)
    - RAM Speed: 9845 MB/s

    CPU Tests (Score: 766)
    - Floating Point Operations/Second: 297456192
    - Integer Operations/Second: 593044992
    - MD5 Hashes Calculated/Second: 1230110

    Graphics Tests (Score: 173)
    - 3D Frames Per Second: 550

    Hardware Tests (Score: 60)
    - Primary Partition Capacity: 465 GB
    - Drive Write Speed: 298 MB/s

    AI's numbers do seem very low but I don't know if I trust this short test. Note that my 15" MBP has the Nvidia GeForce GT 750M which I turned with gfxCardStatus and it still shows in both Nova and in About This Mac => More Info as the Intel Iris Pro. I also noted that this app also has the link for Memory Upgrade Instructions under Memory even though that's not possible. This is definitely an un-Apple attention to detail.
  • Reply 59 of 126
    runbuh wrote: »
    Actually, they are correct, with the addition that the soldered-on RAM also allows a thinner chassis.
    Thanks. I had not thought of the thinner chassis being achieved by soldered ram but that's probably true too. It has it's advantages and disadvantages.
  • Reply 60 of 126
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 8,743member

    I haven't tried or tested this new 2013 Macbook Pro yet, but it certainly looks like a really great machine.

     

    I am personally tired of all of the whiners here, complaining about price, or about how it should come with more RAM or more storage space.

     

    If you don't feel that it's worth it, then go buy something else. Whining is not going to change anything, and Apple certainly doesn't care about what you think, and I don't care about the whiners either. Do these people know nothing about Apple?

     

    If you want more RAM, then pay for it, if you need more storage space, then pay for it. Go buy a cheap stick of RAM from Newegg and try to put it in your Macbook Pro, see how that works out for you.<img class=" src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" /> It's called a Macbook Pro, not a Macbook Amateur, and some people are apparently in the wrong business.

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