My 3 posts on dropoutjeep were erased, multiple others disappeared as well. This NSA malware is the worst breach of 4th amendment until today. If they really allowed NSA to install spyware, this is the thing that can sink them down... and I won't cry a bit.
My 3 posts on dropoutjeep were erased, multiple others disappeared as well. This NSA malware is the worst breach of 4th amendment until today. If they really allowed NSA to install spyware, this is the thing that can sink them down... and I won't cry a bit.
Enjoy your FUD. We’re still waiting for proof of your claims.
My 3 posts on dropoutjeep were erased, multiple others disappeared as well. This NSA malware is the worst breach of 4th amendment until today. If they really allowed NSA to install spyware, this is the thing that can sink them down... and I won't cry a bit.
What we are seeing is the beginning of the end of US, dominance on the internet, and all because of NSA/Government spying, the decline has probably already started at the policy (governmental) level internationally, notice hardly anyone in the system is calling for a end to fishing trips without a warrant, to all the companies who caved I hope it was worth the money, because if any company (Apple) can be directly tied to this fiasco a long slow decline will be the result.
What we are seeing is the beginning of the end of US, dominance on the internet, and all because of NSA/Government spying, the decline has probably already started at the policy (governmental) level internationally, notice hardly anyone in the system is calling for a end to fishing trips without a warrant, to all the companies who caved I hope it was worth the money, because if any company (Apple) can be directly tied to this fiasco a long slow decline will be the result.
It's a little hard to say at this point. The Internet communities will fight for their freedom. The other government will complain on the surface, but they may want "in" on US's program, just like UK.
But it does. If iOS requires physical access and Android doesn't, it's a huge difference.
Since you brought it up the only published comment I found was that they almost certainly can spy on Android handsets too but perhaps don't have as thorough and total access as they do with Apple iPhones. As Ireland mentioned the iPhone spyware story doesn't involve Android or any other mobile OS. A followup story dealing with the NSA and other handset OS's wouldn't be unexpected. .
I have a feeling the shit is going to go down in a really big way with all these providers very soon, even more so than it has already.
Remember Snowden appears to have anything and everything of sensitivity from NSA and he's choosing to release it bit by bit for maximum impact and to catch the government and tech companies out even more.
This could go on for years and I for one am glad that an American hero emerged to expose the Five Eyes governments for doing in 2013 what was warned about in 1984, only perhaps 2-2.5 decades later than predicted.
I mean secretly enabling microphones and front facing cameras and accessing and transmitting saved messages and files is truly scary stuff if or when this is confirmed.
Now we know why Apple and the others are truly shitting themselves.
Since you brought it up the only published comment I found was that they almost certainly can spy on Android handsets too but perhaps don't have as thorough and total access as they do with Apple iPhones. As Ireland mentioned the iPhone spyware story doesn't involve Android or any other mobile OS. A followup story dealing with the NSA and other handset OS's wouldn't be unexpected. .
Android is open sourced. NSA have total access to the device given physical access.
They can also tap on the malware to plant stuff on the target device.
I am more interested in iOS7. It is more sophisticated than iOS 1.x/2.x (and the first iOS SDK) in 2008. What can NSA do today ?
We shouldn't be surprised that they are targeting one of the most popular phones. They've clearly demonstrated their willingness to lie, to exaggerate, and to violate our privacy. The NSA isn't doing this because "terrorists" use iPhones. They're doing this because senators, congressmen, and judges use iPhones. They're doing this so when it's time to prosecute them for violating the peoples' rights, they can blackmail and extort. That's what drives me nuts when plebes say "Oh I don't care, I have nothing to hide". It's not about you, it's going to be about who ever represents you, judging (for you), being a (civil rights, gay rights, women's rights, men's rights) activist (for you). And you never, ever had the say in deciding what needs to be hidden or not. If a government decides they want to destroy your life by invading your privacy, then the more tools that they have the easier it'll be.
We need to put a stop to this. Our governments looked at East Germany and have collectively decided, without our consent, that the Stasi had a good idea going, they just didn't go far enough.
Don't blame Apple or Google here. This is a failure of our respective democracies.
um ... this doc is 5 years old! i think maybe that is just too out of date to matter now.
whatever the NSA is doing/trying to do has no doubt become a lot more sophisticated since then. and iOS security has also advanced greatly. none of use really has any idea what is happening now.
Well everybody know what is happening now - APPLE JOIN PIRSM PROJECT. end of story.
We shouldn't be surprised that they are targeting one of the most popular phones. They've clearly demonstrated their willingness to lie, to exaggerate, and to violate our privacy. The NSA isn't doing this because "terrorists" use iPhones. They're doing this because senators, congressmen, and judges use iPhones. They're doing this so when it's time to prosecute them for violating the peoples' rights, they can blackmail and extort. That's what drives me nuts when plebes say "Oh I don't care, I have nothing to hide".
I actually don't believe it really matters why they are doing it at the end of the day. If living in a prison is seen as the only option then we've lost it. At that stage we've leapfrogged the shark and The Fonz, together. People need to wake up. It's time American people and systems had checks and balances in place. Everybody needs to be held accountable for their actions: the common man and government. You only have to look at what's happening to people who try to expose this stuff. From what has been reported by The Guardian Snowden tried every avenue and eventually chose the journalistic one when he was systematically ignored through the 'correct' channels. And he redacted every name. But still he was treated as a terrorist and repeatedly labelled with scary questions by the American media.
There's a whole lot of moss on this slippery slope, folks.
If you have nothing to hide, who cares. The government look at all emails and listen to all telephone calls, they have done for years. They hack into everything without permission because they don't need permission. They have limitless funds and access to the best hackers available and the most powerful computers. They would not need Apple's help.
That's an irrelevant argument. You don't get to decide what's worth hiding, the government does. You can be 100% completely innocent (unlikely, as the US has something like over 18,000 statutes and the average person violates around 3 a day) and then the government decides that something you are doing, even in private, is against the law, and tada. Or, more likely, is that they'll go after congress people, senators, judges, or business leaders. Apple might decide to crack down on some security hole, and before you know it the CEO is being blackmailed by the NSA to prevent that. Or, the NSA could be using inside information to manipulate financial markets. Elections. Etc. It really doesn't matter what you think, if you're innocent or too unimportant to be affected by this. It's such a terrible, stupid, and irrelevant argument to make. And yet here we are, people like you still make it because you haven't thought of the consequences beyond yourself.
One more short anecdote. Recently several people in a small town in the US were pulled over. One did a "california roll" (rolling stop) through a parking lot stop sign. The police decided that this was enough cause for them to search the vehicle, and the driver. So they searched him, thoroughly. And when they didn't find anything, they took him to a hospital to have his insides checked. Several times. The first hospital, btw, refused to do it. The officer's reason for this? The driver appeared to have clenched buttocks. 12 hours of cavity searches. And this guy was completely innocent, with nothing to hide.
Or another episode, recently discussed on NPR. Journalist's family was returning from Canada where they attended a wedding. They are American citizens. They were detained by the DHS, and not told why. 6 hours they were kept in a deliberately cold room, without water, food, or access to medical supplies, or a lawyer. Eventually the father was arrested, and the wife was told that agents were going to take him away. Hours and hours later, the state police showed up. The father had had an unpaid ticket for a license plate that wasn't attached straight. DHS has refused to give any information as to why the family was treated this way. Turns out, this sort of treatment happened to other people who attended the same wedding.
Is that the sort of society you really want to have?
And there are still complete idiots who are able to defend NSA's abhorrent actions, which are not only against basic constitutional principles but also defy every relevant tenet of international law - they should all be sent to the firing squad together with all those who came up this agency in the first place.
"but the document suggests physical contact with a target phone is required to implant the surreptitious software"
So for this software to work they must have my phone or perhaps bump my iPhone to upload the software or perhaps the software just load itself automatically without me doing a single like the guy who claimed iOS7 installed itself in his home.
?The way I look at it it is much ado about nothing unless one is a iHater.
Comments
This has nothing to do with Apple versus Android.
But it does. If iOS requires physical access and Android doesn't, it's a huge difference.
Is 2008 the year where Apple released iOS SDK ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IOS_SDK
If so, they "only" need to jailbreak iOS 1.x (and 2.x) with physical access, change file permissions and load UNIX tools to the phone right ?
Did the presenter give any technical details. Or is he just summarizing Snowden's documents ?
These days, iOS7 is a lot more picky about all sorts of access from camera to user resources.
Do you have any proof of that?
Enjoy your FUD. We’re still waiting for proof of your claims.
My 3 posts on dropoutjeep were erased, multiple others disappeared as well. This NSA malware is the worst breach of 4th amendment until today. If they really allowed NSA to install spyware, this is the thing that can sink them down... and I won't cry a bit.
What we are seeing is the beginning of the end of US, dominance on the internet, and all because of NSA/Government spying, the decline has probably already started at the policy (governmental) level internationally, notice hardly anyone in the system is calling for a end to fishing trips without a warrant, to all the companies who caved I hope it was worth the money, because if any company (Apple) can be directly tied to this fiasco a long slow decline will be the result.
What we are seeing is the beginning of the end of US, dominance on the internet, and all because of NSA/Government spying, the decline has probably already started at the policy (governmental) level internationally, notice hardly anyone in the system is calling for a end to fishing trips without a warrant, to all the companies who caved I hope it was worth the money, because if any company (Apple) can be directly tied to this fiasco a long slow decline will be the result.
It's a little hard to say at this point. The Internet communities will fight for their freedom. The other government will complain on the surface, but they may want "in" on US's program, just like UK.
That the downtime was related to the removal of political threads.
Since you brought it up the only published comment I found was that they almost certainly can spy on Android handsets too but perhaps don't have as thorough and total access as they do with Apple iPhones. As Ireland mentioned the iPhone spyware story doesn't involve Android or any other mobile OS. A followup story dealing with the NSA and other handset OS's wouldn't be unexpected. .
Remember Snowden appears to have anything and everything of sensitivity from NSA and he's choosing to release it bit by bit for maximum impact and to catch the government and tech companies out even more.
This could go on for years and I for one am glad that an American hero emerged to expose the Five Eyes governments for doing in 2013 what was warned about in 1984, only perhaps 2-2.5 decades later than predicted.
I mean secretly enabling microphones and front facing cameras and accessing and transmitting saved messages and files is truly scary stuff if or when this is confirmed.
Now we know why Apple and the others are truly shitting themselves.
Since you brought it up the only published comment I found was that they almost certainly can spy on Android handsets too but perhaps don't have as thorough and total access as they do with Apple iPhones. As Ireland mentioned the iPhone spyware story doesn't involve Android or any other mobile OS. A followup story dealing with the NSA and other handset OS's wouldn't be unexpected. .
Android is open sourced. NSA have total access to the device given physical access.
They can also tap on the malware to plant stuff on the target device.
I am more interested in iOS7. It is more sophisticated than iOS 1.x/2.x (and the first iOS SDK) in 2008. What can NSA do today ?
We shouldn't be surprised that they are targeting one of the most popular phones. They've clearly demonstrated their willingness to lie, to exaggerate, and to violate our privacy. The NSA isn't doing this because "terrorists" use iPhones. They're doing this because senators, congressmen, and judges use iPhones. They're doing this so when it's time to prosecute them for violating the peoples' rights, they can blackmail and extort. That's what drives me nuts when plebes say "Oh I don't care, I have nothing to hide". It's not about you, it's going to be about who ever represents you, judging (for you), being a (civil rights, gay rights, women's rights, men's rights) activist (for you). And you never, ever had the say in deciding what needs to be hidden or not. If a government decides they want to destroy your life by invading your privacy, then the more tools that they have the easier it'll be.
We need to put a stop to this. Our governments looked at East Germany and have collectively decided, without our consent, that the Stasi had a good idea going, they just didn't go far enough.
Don't blame Apple or Google here. This is a failure of our respective democracies.
um ... this doc is 5 years old! i think maybe that is just too out of date to matter now.
whatever the NSA is doing/trying to do has no doubt become a lot more sophisticated since then. and iOS security has also advanced greatly. none of use really has any idea what is happening now.
Well everybody know what is happening now - APPLE JOIN PIRSM PROJECT. end of story.
We shouldn't be surprised that they are targeting one of the most popular phones. They've clearly demonstrated their willingness to lie, to exaggerate, and to violate our privacy. The NSA isn't doing this because "terrorists" use iPhones. They're doing this because senators, congressmen, and judges use iPhones. They're doing this so when it's time to prosecute them for violating the peoples' rights, they can blackmail and extort. That's what drives me nuts when plebes say "Oh I don't care, I have nothing to hide".
I actually don't believe it really matters why they are doing it at the end of the day. If living in a prison is seen as the only option then we've lost it. At that stage we've leapfrogged the shark and The Fonz, together. People need to wake up. It's time American people and systems had checks and balances in place. Everybody needs to be held accountable for their actions: the common man and government. You only have to look at what's happening to people who try to expose this stuff. From what has been reported by The Guardian Snowden tried every avenue and eventually chose the journalistic one when he was systematically ignored through the 'correct' channels. And he redacted every name. But still he was treated as a terrorist and repeatedly labelled with scary questions by the American media.
There's a whole lot of moss on this slippery slope, folks.
If you have nothing to hide, who cares.
That's an irrelevant argument. You don't get to decide what's worth hiding, the government does. You can be 100% completely innocent (unlikely, as the US has something like over 18,000 statutes and the average person violates around 3 a day) and then the government decides that something you are doing, even in private, is against the law, and tada. Or, more likely, is that they'll go after congress people, senators, judges, or business leaders. Apple might decide to crack down on some security hole, and before you know it the CEO is being blackmailed by the NSA to prevent that. Or, the NSA could be using inside information to manipulate financial markets. Elections. Etc. It really doesn't matter what you think, if you're innocent or too unimportant to be affected by this. It's such a terrible, stupid, and irrelevant argument to make. And yet here we are, people like you still make it because you haven't thought of the consequences beyond yourself.
One more short anecdote. Recently several people in a small town in the US were pulled over. One did a "california roll" (rolling stop) through a parking lot stop sign. The police decided that this was enough cause for them to search the vehicle, and the driver. So they searched him, thoroughly. And when they didn't find anything, they took him to a hospital to have his insides checked. Several times. The first hospital, btw, refused to do it. The officer's reason for this? The driver appeared to have clenched buttocks. 12 hours of cavity searches. And this guy was completely innocent, with nothing to hide.
Or another episode, recently discussed on NPR. Journalist's family was returning from Canada where they attended a wedding. They are American citizens. They were detained by the DHS, and not told why. 6 hours they were kept in a deliberately cold room, without water, food, or access to medical supplies, or a lawyer. Eventually the father was arrested, and the wife was told that agents were going to take him away. Hours and hours later, the state police showed up. The father had had an unpaid ticket for a license plate that wasn't attached straight. DHS has refused to give any information as to why the family was treated this way. Turns out, this sort of treatment happened to other people who attended the same wedding.
Is that the sort of society you really want to have?
And there are still complete idiots who are able to defend NSA's abhorrent actions, which are not only against basic constitutional principles but also defy every relevant tenet of international law - they should all be sent to the firing squad together with all those who came up this agency in the first place.
"but the document suggests physical contact with a target phone is required to implant the surreptitious software"
So for this software to work they must have my phone or perhaps bump my iPhone to upload the software or perhaps the software just load itself automatically without me doing a single like the guy who claimed iOS7 installed itself in his home.
?The way I look at it it is much ado about nothing unless one is a iHater.
Lol, I am not working there but I see what was there before & what was missing after. You have to talk to somebody from inside to confirm it.