and he was already leaving so Blackberry wouldn't have to pay him anything to leave...
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
By Apple.
I think in similar cases, the ex-employee would walk away from existing options, 401K, etc.. whatever for breaching the contract, and the new company would essentially pay the new employee extra for what they had to walk away from.
In this case, I think BB is just doing it to spite not only the employee, but Apple. BB must feel like it's having salt rubbed into its wound by Apple, the one company that BB hilariously criticized back in 2007 as a nobody when the iPhone came out and almost single-handedly contributed to the BB's borderline demise.
It makes zero point to forcefully retain an employee that wants to leave. It's all about ego. Pay whatever to settle the contract-breach and move on.
At least BB's famous boondoggles will always live on...
These people are a valuable asset and as so are protected by contract. He should have informed Apple of this and acted accordingly. As he has breached the contract BB should seek to protect there interests. In reality though they would not want to keep him, if he wants to leave he should negotiate some recompense for BB. And seek to be reimbursed from Apple.
This isn't fair to Apple. They hired him fair and square, and should not have to put up with some dying Canadian has-been playing stupid games. Times change and Blackberry might as well just give up. They laughed at the iPhone but who is laughing now. <span style="font-size:16px;line-height:1.4em;">They are just jealous of Apple and that is why they want to mess with this guy and not let him have a better job at Apple.</span>
This from the guy who previously opined with regards to Apple engineers on normal contracts being poached.
.. you never work in consumer electronics ever again, there will be no problems. If you want to work in consumer electronics, you need to stay with Apple. Simple.
I personally am dubious about this hire. Here's a quote.
HTML5, for example. It lets you build rich, dynamic applications and user interfaces that can run on multiple types of devices without significant re-engineering. It also has the support of a large developer community and frees you from vendor lock-in.
Cook isn't a software guy. The reason the iPhone is the best is software lockin. And the use of objective C and C. Marineu Mes might be a lone voice for now but moving away from apples Next inherited strengths would be disastrous.
These people are a valuable asset and as so are protected by contract. He should have informed Apple of this and acted accordingly. As he has breached the contract BB should seek to protect there interests. In reality though they would not want to keep him, if he wants to leave he should negotiate some recompense for BB. And seek to be reimbursed from Apple.
This is more to do with delaying his move to Apple than anything else as there can be no other advantage to BB; they'll probably lock him in a room with no internet, no computer, no telephones and no colleagues and have him sit there for six months doing nothing just so that Apple can't use his talents. Six months is a long time in IT.
Most companies though put people on "Gardening Leave" which means they stay at home but still can't work for the new employer - and anything they invent or work on in this time becomes the property of BB, not him, not Apple. So, no just doing the work for Apple from home as you can be sure BB would have the court check this out and see the dates on the data and documents...
Alternatively, he doesn't turn up to work and has to pay them back all the salary he has earned since September. Whatever BB do, they are limited by the "Unfair Restraint of Trade" provisions in Canadian Employment Law.
Six full calendar months beginning from the end of December would run until 30th June, even the best case scenario would run until only one week before that, the 23rd June. I assume he will take a lot of sick leave and annual leave and accumulated flexitime up until then.
Why BB took this action I can't imagine; did he see something confidential from September to December that is time critical and they want to protect it as long as possible? From a PR point of view, BB loses from this action though. It just looks silly.
Maybe my math is off, but the article states that he was contractually obligated to give six months notice, and he handed in his letter in December. Doesn't that mean a wait until May...around two months from now? Where is this four months referenced in the last sentence coming from?
December 23 was when he notified them, so I'd expect that "six months" would be round about June 23. That's three months from now - "now" being March 26 - rather than four.
Execs get all kinds of deals that regular folks do not, such as retention deals and protection against arbitrary dismissal. In return they have longer notification requirements and no-competitor restrictions. It does seem tacky for him to have signed his deal in September - when others were not getting deals - and then bailing three months later. Not a class act.
It is unclear if Apple will wait the four months for Marineau-Mes and what the executive will do at BlackBerry in the meantime.
However long it takes, Federighi will want a guy with Marineau-Mes's experience and ability on his team. This is probably just a temporary setback. Apple has its sails set for a steady course. BlackBerry is trying frantically to keep its dinghy from foundering.
In a way, it's a strange agreement to have made, because it's uninforcable. If the employee wants to leave, then what can be done about it? Is there a penalty? It doesn't say. That's the only thing that they can do.
You can't make an employee stay. If one wants to leave, for whatever reason, you don’t WANT them to stay. I never would have wanted an employee of mine to be forced to continue working for me. What good would that do?
Six months notice? Typically, I find a new job first before quitting my existing position. I would imagine it would be awkward to tell an interviewer that you can start your job six months after giving notice.
I also hate non-compete clauses. My contract says that if I leave my current employer I pretty much leave the industry for two-years. Although my HR claims they do not enforce it, but then why require a signature at all?
In a way, it's a strange agreement to have made, because it's uninforcable. If the employee wants to leave, then what can be done about it? Is there a penalty? It doesn't say. That's the only thing that they can do.
Such clauses are illegal in California, I believe, but BlackBerry is based in Canada so I am unfamiliar with Canadian law. My guess is that BlackBerry could sue to block employment elsewhere and for damages.
He signed the contract. Should have played better politics in the office if he wanted to reneg so soon after signing.
Should have stuck to the terms and given 6 months notice. What many people seem to not realize is that 6 months for an executive lock-in isn't that long. In some countries almost all workers (both white and blue collar) must give 3 months notice. It is really weird to hear someone is leaving (gave notice) and then you still see them for almost 1/4 of a year. It isn't strange to them, it is just how it is.
Does anyone know how much notice is normal under a Canadian employment contract?
I personally am dubious about this hire. Here's a quote.
HTML5, for example. It lets you build rich, dynamic applications and user interfaces that can run on multiple types of devices without significant re-engineering. It also has the support of a large developer community and frees you from vendor lock-in.
Cook isn't a software guy. The reason the iPhone is the best is software lockin. And the use of objective C and C. Marineu Mes might be a lone voice for now but moving away from apples Next inherited strengths would be disastrous.
Not exactly sure what you're trying to say here?
I honestly don't see how that quote has anything to do with iOS or Objective C. It does however directly relate to Apple's iCloud effort, especially iWork. Yes, maybe the "vendor lock-in" statement might fly in the face of iOS, but Apple has always been a strong advocate of HTML5.
I honestly don't see how that quote has anything to do with iOS or Objective C. It does however directly relate to Apple's iCloud effort, especially iWork. Yes, maybe the "vendor lock-in" statement might fly in the face of iOS, but Apple has always been a strong advocate of HTML5.
Not at all. If he is talking about HTML 5 in the same breath as opposing "vendor buyin" he is taking about apps. HTML apps. No walled garden. In fact that is clear from the rest of the paragraph too.
Comments
By Apple.
A buy-out by who?
Marineau-Mes pays BlackBerry to leave? Nah'
and he was already leaving so Blackberry wouldn't have to pay him anything to leave...
By Apple.
I think in similar cases, the ex-employee would walk away from existing options, 401K, etc.. whatever for breaching the contract, and the new company would essentially pay the new employee extra for what they had to walk away from.
In this case, I think BB is just doing it to spite not only the employee, but Apple. BB must feel like it's having salt rubbed into its wound by Apple, the one company that BB hilariously criticized back in 2007 as a nobody when the iPhone came out and almost single-handedly contributed to the BB's borderline demise.
It makes zero point to forcefully retain an employee that wants to leave. It's all about ego. Pay whatever to settle the contract-breach and move on.
At least BB's famous boondoggles will always live on...
http://www.phonearena.com/news/They-said-what-Great-quotes-from-Jim-Balsillie-and-Mike-Lazaridis_id31751
This from the guy who previously opined with regards to Apple engineers on normal contracts being poached.
.. you never work in consumer electronics ever again, there will be no problems. If you want to work in consumer electronics, you need to stay with Apple. Simple.
HTML5, for example. It lets you build rich, dynamic applications and user interfaces that can run on multiple types of devices without significant re-engineering. It also has the support of a large developer community and frees you from vendor lock-in.
Cook isn't a software guy. The reason the iPhone is the best is software lockin. And the use of objective C and C. Marineu Mes might be a lone voice for now but moving away from apples Next inherited strengths would be disastrous.
"No employee is irreplaceable."
Most companies though put people on "Gardening Leave" which means they stay at home but still can't work for the new employer - and anything they invent or work on in this time becomes the property of BB, not him, not Apple. So, no just doing the work for Apple from home as you can be sure BB would have the court check this out and see the dates on the data and documents...
Alternatively, he doesn't turn up to work and has to pay them back all the salary he has earned since September. Whatever BB do, they are limited by the "Unfair Restraint of Trade" provisions in Canadian Employment Law.
Six full calendar months beginning from the end of December would run until 30th June, even the best case scenario would run until only one week before that, the 23rd June. I assume he will take a lot of sick leave and annual leave and accumulated flexitime up until then.
Why BB took this action I can't imagine; did he see something confidential from September to December that is time critical and they want to protect it as long as possible? From a PR point of view, BB loses from this action though. It just looks silly.
He signed the contract. Should have played better politics in the office if he wanted to reneg so soon after signing.
I wonder what his contract says about slacking off and not showing to work!
Maybe my math is off, but the article states that he was contractually obligated to give six months notice, and he handed in his letter in December. Doesn't that mean a wait until May...around two months from now? Where is this four months referenced in the last sentence coming from?
December 23 was when he notified them, so I'd expect that "six months" would be round about June 23. That's three months from now - "now" being March 26 - rather than four.
Execs get all kinds of deals that regular folks do not, such as retention deals and protection against arbitrary dismissal. In return they have longer notification requirements and no-competitor restrictions. It does seem tacky for him to have signed his deal in September - when others were not getting deals - and then bailing three months later. Not a class act.
Same as in Blazing Saddles I'd imagine. Docked a days pay for napping on the job. Lol
However long it takes, Federighi will want a guy with Marineau-Mes's experience and ability on his team. This is probably just a temporary setback. Apple has its sails set for a steady course. BlackBerry is trying frantically to keep its dinghy from foundering.
You can't make an employee stay. If one wants to leave, for whatever reason, you don’t WANT them to stay. I never would have wanted an employee of mine to be forced to continue working for me. What good would that do?
Six months notice? Typically, I find a new job first before quitting my existing position. I would imagine it would be awkward to tell an interviewer that you can start your job six months after giving notice.
I also hate non-compete clauses. My contract says that if I leave my current employer I pretty much leave the industry for two-years. Although my HR claims they do not enforce it, but then why require a signature at all?
In a way, it's a strange agreement to have made, because it's uninforcable. If the employee wants to leave, then what can be done about it? Is there a penalty? It doesn't say. That's the only thing that they can do.
Such clauses are illegal in California, I believe, but BlackBerry is based in Canada so I am unfamiliar with Canadian law. My guess is that BlackBerry could sue to block employment elsewhere and for damages.
He signed the contract. Should have played better politics in the office if he wanted to reneg so soon after signing.
Should have stuck to the terms and given 6 months notice. What many people seem to not realize is that 6 months for an executive lock-in isn't that long. In some countries almost all workers (both white and blue collar) must give 3 months notice. It is really weird to hear someone is leaving (gave notice) and then you still see them for almost 1/4 of a year. It isn't strange to them, it is just how it is.
Does anyone know how much notice is normal under a Canadian employment contract?
I personally am dubious about this hire. Here's a quote.
HTML5, for example. It lets you build rich, dynamic applications and user interfaces that can run on multiple types of devices without significant re-engineering. It also has the support of a large developer community and frees you from vendor lock-in.
Cook isn't a software guy. The reason the iPhone is the best is software lockin. And the use of objective C and C. Marineu Mes might be a lone voice for now but moving away from apples Next inherited strengths would be disastrous.
Not exactly sure what you're trying to say here?
I honestly don't see how that quote has anything to do with iOS or Objective C. It does however directly relate to Apple's iCloud effort, especially iWork. Yes, maybe the "vendor lock-in" statement might fly in the face of iOS, but Apple has always been a strong advocate of HTML5.
Not at all. If he is talking about HTML 5 in the same breath as opposing "vendor buyin" he is taking about apps. HTML apps. No walled garden. In fact that is clear from the rest of the paragraph too.