Cheaper $400 Xbox One coming sans Kinect as consoles face pressure from low-cost streamers

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Comments

  • Reply 41 of 96
    nasseraenasserae Posts: 3,158member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

     

     

    Uh… yeah, it does. Inherently. Because they all corroborate what I’m saying.


     

    The thing is no one denying that PC offer better performance than consoles. The problem with your argument is that those who buy consoles don't  care much about performance (still using 720/1080 tv with low refresh rate). It is about gaming and convenience. 

  • Reply 42 of 96
    jfanningjfanning Posts: 3,393member
    Not really, since there’s no ‘still’ and I’m not wrong. :???:

    Ok, please list all PS4 games that run at a maximum of 720p30, after all if you are not wrong, then you have proof to back yourself up?
  • Reply 43 of 96
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    Originally Posted by j1h15233 View Post

    He's never wrong. Super pundit is never wrong.

     

    If you had any other argument than calling me a “pundit”, you would have posted it by now.

     

    Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

    those who buy consoles dont  care much about performance… …It is about gaming and convenience. 


     

    Gee, that’s news to me. Everything I’ve read from Microsoft and Sony fans is how such and such console is better (hardware) than the other and how since Nintendo’s hardware is marginally worse that the ludicrous number of sales of the Wii magically don’t matter.

     

    Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

    Ok, please list all PS4 games that run at a maximum of 720p30, after all if you are not wrong, then you have proof to back yourself up?

     

    Sure, I’ll expound. Not sure why you can’t just do this yourself, but whatever.

     

    Xbox One

    Battlefield 4

    Titanfall (below 720p)

    Ryse: Son of Rome (900p)

    Watch_Dogs (792p)

    Metal Gear Solid V

    Call of Duty: Ghosts

     

    PS4

    Battlefield 4 (900p)

    The Order: 1866 (1920x800 because AA didn’t work at 1080)

    Watch_Dogs (900p)

     

    Not sure why you think I’d say something without knowing it.

  • Reply 44 of 96
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,230moderator
    Marketing. The idiots didn’t set it apart from the Wii enough.

    That was a big part of the problem but you'd expect that sales would improve over time and this hasn't happened. Of course failing at the start leads to a downward spiral of low developer support due to low sales and low sales due to lack of games.

    They've announced a new direction recently:

    http://www.pocketgamer.biz/asia/comment-and-opinion/59032/nintendo-can-steer-its-ship-back-on-course-without-mobile/
    http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2014/05/13/will-nintendo-collectable-toys-save-the-wii-u/
    http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2014/05/nintendos_plan_for_redefining_the_definition_of_video_game_platforms_around_two_years_away
    http://wiiudaily.com/2014/01/iwata-announces-new-business-strategy/
    http://www.vg247.com/2014/03/03/nintendo-quality-of-life-unit-to-be-separate-from-console-business/

    It seems to be a collection of strategies.

    - a quality of life business separate from consoles focusing on health
    - NFC enabled toys using their characters
    - a link with smart devices but not games

    The toys looks to get some of the following market:

    http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2014/02/17/video-game-skylanders-makes-record-profits/

    The quality of life business aims for a new health market:

    "We wish to achieve an integrated hardware-software platform business that, instead of providing mobile or wearable features, will be characterized by a new area of what we like to call “non-wearable” technology When we use ‘health’ as the keyword, some may inevitably think about ‘Wii Fit.’ However, we are considering themes that we have not incorporated to games for our existing platforms. Including the hardware that will enable such an idea, we will aim to establish a blue ocean."

    The link with smart devices:

    "an application that specifically shows how Nintendo can utilise smart devices within this year," Iwata announced the provisionally titled Mario Kart TV. It leverages smartphones as a shop-window for the console game, with the ability to upload game footage from the Wii U and watch it on smartphones and PCs.

    "[It] enables users to watch videos in a screen layout suitable for systems such as smart devices and computers, around the same time as the release of Mario Kart 8" he says.

    So, in short, there will be no core-IP on smart devices yet, and previous assertions that Nintendo will continue to shun mobile as long as Iwata is at the helm are looking increasingly credible."

    Then they want to make cheaper models of the hardware they have for emerging markets:

    http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming/nintendos-plan-to-save-itself/

    They seem like pretty conservative strategies and not tackling the core of their problems but it might work out financially.

    Microsoft really had to drop their price. They're not doing too badly but Sony was clearly getting faster uptake and a lot of people will make the decision for one console or the other and stick with it so they couldn't afford to wait. They might have data that suggests people aren't using the Kinect as much as they'd hoped anyway. People who want it will buy it.
  • Reply 45 of 96
    j1h15233j1h15233 Posts: 274member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

     

     

    If you had any other argument than calling me a “pundit”, you would have posted it by now.

     

     

    Gee, that’s news to me. Everything I’ve read from Microsoft and Sony fans is how such and such console is better (hardware) than the other and how since Nintendo’s hardware is marginally worse that the ludicrous number of sales of the Wii magically don’t matter.

     

     

    Sure, I’ll expound. Not sure why you can’t just do this yourself, but whatever.

     

    Xbox One

    Battlefield 4

    Titanfall (below 720p)

    Ryse: Son of Rome (900p)

    Watch_Dogs (792p)

    Metal Gear Solid V

    Call of Duty: Ghosts

     

    PS4

    Battlefield 4 (900p)

    The Order: 1866 (1920x800 because AA didn’t work at 1080)

    Watch_Dogs (900p)

     

    Not sure why you think I’d say something without knowing it.


    This is also very wrong. Both some of the numbers, and the general argument you were asked to make.

  • Reply 46 of 96

    The whole computer as game machine vs console argument is somewhat akin to Android vs iPhone.

    Do you want the flexibility and customization that a PC can provide or are you happier with a simpler interface and easier user experience that consoles often provide.

     

    Some will say that a iPhone 5s is easily as powerful if not more so than an Android but you can compare the preference for a iPhone 5 or even 4s.  They may be less powerful but a lot of consumers prefer them because they meet their needs and are far easier to use.

     

    Really at the end of the day isn't that what any consumer product should do?  For myself I ended up purchasing first the WiiU from Japan.  Not because it's a better gaming machine per say but it has built in karaoke capabilities with access to 100,000 songs online is something the family wants.  Most gamers wouldn't care but it the easy interface, ability to choose songs while others are singing (asymmetric at its best) and up-to-date catalog were key factors in the decision process.  

  • Reply 47 of 96
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    Originally Posted by j1h15233 View Post

    This is also very wrong. Both some of the numbers, and the general argument you were asked to make.

     

    Okay, well, they’re all linked there and I responded to exactly what was said. So if you have any reason to doubt the sources I used, feel free.

     

    I just don’t get it.

  • Reply 48 of 96
    nasseraenasserae Posts: 3,158member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

     

    Gee, that’s news to me. Everything I’ve read from Microsoft and Sony fans is how such and such console is better (hardware) than the other and how since Nintendo’s hardware is marginally worse that the ludicrous number of sales of the Wii magically don’t matter.


     

    That doesn't mean people should not buy gaming consoles because PC offer better performance. It is like saying people should not buy Macs because PCs cost less for the same performance. Or Mac sales are pathetic because they are only 10% of global market.

     

    Quote:


    Sure, I’ll expound. Not sure why you can’t just do this yourself, but whatever.

     

    Xbox One

    Battlefield 4

    Titanfall (below 720p)

    Ryse: Son of Rome (900p)

    Watch_Dogs (792p)

    Metal Gear Solid V

    Call of Duty: Ghosts

     

    PS4

    Battlefield 4 (900p)

    The Order: 1866 (1920x800 because AA didn’t work at 1080)

    Watch_Dogs (900p)

     

    Not sure why you think I’d say something without knowing it.



     

    In your post you said PS4 is limited to 720p 30fps.. Looks like the minimum in that list is 900p.

  • Reply 49 of 96
    quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,745member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

     

     

    Oh certainly; that’s not in question.

     

     

    Then how does a PC do it better? 


     

     

    Because it can run EVE Online.

     

    :D

  • Reply 50 of 96
    fallenjtfallenjt Posts: 3,980member

    I wonder how many xBox One and PlayStation4 systems will be sold once the next Apple TV with expandable storage (thru micro USB or new Thunderbolt) has full iOS for games. With over 500 millions user accounts, I guess Apple cannot ignore Apple TV potential as a game console anymore. True gamers will still stick with PlayStation and xBox or PC, but light/casual gamers will probably give Apple TV/game console a shot. I know I would.

  • Reply 51 of 96
    suddenly newtonsuddenly newton Posts: 13,765member
    Ha! Same here. Almost feels embarrassing jumping into multiplayer sometimes. “Shouldn’t I be doing better than this?” :lol:

    Practice practice practice. And chug energy drinks.
  • Reply 52 of 96
    suddenly newtonsuddenly newton Posts: 13,765member
    jfanning wrote: »
    In NZ the 7870 can retail for around $400, 66% of the price of the PS4, remember you need to purchase the rest of the PC as well, plus Windows

    Everything sounded good until you said "plus Windows." Ugh. Pain and suffering.
  • Reply 53 of 96
    jfanningjfanning Posts: 3,393member
    jfanning wrote: »
    Ok, please list all PS4 games that run at a maximum of 720p30, after all if you are not wrong, then you have proof to back yourself up?

    PS4
    Battlefield 4 (900p)
    The Order: 1866 (1920x800 because AA didn’t work at 1080)
    Watch_Dogs (900p)

    Not sure why you think I’d say something without knowing it.

    Well how you you do it correctly this time.

    I asked you to list all the PS4 games that run at a maximum of 720p30. Also, Watch Dogs hasn't been released yet.
  • Reply 54 of 96
    jfanningjfanning Posts: 3,393member
    Everything sounded good until you said "plus Windows." Ugh. Pain and suffering.

    There are three choices for PC gaming.

    Linux - Limited game choice, not a consumer OS
    OS X - Limited game choice, Poor performance for gaming compared to Windows (Compare the requirements for a Steam game in Windows versus OS X)
    Windows - All the games

    You are free to make your own choice
  • Reply 55 of 96
    jexusjexus Posts: 373member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by nht View Post

     

     

    Not really.  For example COD Ghosts had issues with wireless gamepads on some PCs.  Also Aim-assist is locked on.  Some older console ports didn't support gamepads out of the box well at all.  It's hit or miss.




    When Comparing Console/PC issues, at least use a GOOD game as an example.

     

    Ghosts was a bad game even by COD standards(and let me tell you MW3 was already awful) coming off of Black Ops 2. You're talking about a game that asked for a laughable 6GB of RAM minimum for the first few days or week/2 after launch and a game in which TotalBiscuit could not keep a stable 60 frames per second on with a i7 and 2 GTX Titans.

  • Reply 56 of 96
    nhtnht Posts: 4,496member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jexus View Post

     

    When Comparing Console/PC issues, at least use a GOOD game as an example.

     

    Ghosts was a bad game even by COD standards(and let me tell you MW3 was already awful) coming off of Black Ops 2. You're talking about a game that asked for a laughable 6GB of RAM minimum for the first few days or week/2 after launch and a game in which TotalBiscuit could not keep a stable 60 frames per second on with a i7 and 2 GTX Titans.


     

    And yet runs on a console with more meager hw resource.  /shrug  Good, bad, whatever is in the eye of the beholder.  If I want to play game X then to me game X is a good game.  If I don't want to play game Y then it's not a good game for me even if it's the uber game of the year.

     

    The point is that PCs are often hit or miss with console type titles.  Even ignoring performance issues there are usually UX oddities.  Take Dynasty Warrior 8.  Even when using a gamepad it shows keyboard prompts. 

     

    If PCs were as painless and inexpensive to use as consoles then most of us would still be PC gamers.  It's not.

  • Reply 57 of 96
    jexusjexus Posts: 373member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by nht View Post

     

     

    And yet runs on a console with more meager hw resource.  /shrug  Good, bad, whatever is in the eye of the beholder. 

     




    Which is irrelevant. Far Cry 3 and Battlefield 3 both run on the same old hardware. Neither had the catastrophic requirements or frame rate drops that Ghosts incurred, and both looked better.

     

    Eye of the beholder from a quality standpoints perhaps. But from a technical standpoint, Ghosts is garbage.

     

    Quote:


     The point is that PCs are often hit or miss with console type titles.  Even ignoring performance issues there are usually UX oddities.  Take Dynasty Warrior 8.  Even when using a gamepad it shows keyboard prompts.


    There is a reason that Japanese companies often outsource localizations or PC ports....that is because most Japanese developers have seldom developed a PC game(PC's were never popular in Japan after the Famicon release). See the awful port that was Dark Souls Prepare to die edition.

  • Reply 58 of 96
    slurpyslurpy Posts: 5,187member

    What a fucking fail. Microsoft has said time and time again that the Xbox One and Kinect are one and the same, inseperable, that the Kinect is the future of interaction, and they've guaranteed developers that every single Xbox One owner iwll have the kinect, so that they can really focus on integrating that fucntionality into their games. Apparently Microsoft didn't believe a fucking word of that, since they're now willing to separate the two and basically kill off that vision. Pathetic. Why not just lower the price $100, while keeping the Kinect, if they truly believed it was the future? As far as games go, its not a differentiating factor anymore. 

     

    And for those bashing the Wii U- yes, its not going great sales wise, but it's still the best value out of all these console, and has a good number of excellent games- the best games lineup of this generation so far, I'd say. Nintendo absolutely sucks at marketing and positioning, yet the Wii U is an excellent product at a good price, contains novel ideas, and it has some brilliantly high quality games that are actually original. 

  • Reply 59 of 96
    dunksdunks Posts: 1,248member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by j1h15233 View Post

     

    Seriously? If anything, Nintendo made less of a leap from Wii to Wii U than Microsoft or Sony did.


     

    Exactly. I have very fond memories of nintendo consoles and games but the resistive, single-point-of-contact touchscreen display was the nail in the coffin for me. They needed to make the online store more like the App Store. Thousands of 99c games instead of a handful of mediocre releases on a weekly schedule. If they had pared back all the crazy, gimmicky peripherals, made it HD and cheap (basically an Amazon Fire TV backed up with their NES/SNES library and Nintendo quality peripherals) it would have been amazing.

  • Reply 60 of 96
    MacProMacPro Posts: 18,414member
    jfanning wrote: »

    Well how you you do it correctly this time.

    I asked you to list all the PS4 games that run at a maximum of 720p30. Also, Watch Dogs hasn't been released yet.

    Just out of curiosity, are you the same jfanning that wrote in 2008; "Yet I see hundreds of people wearing Nokia earbuds in Ireland (and some using AD2P headphones...) yet have only seen one person with an iPhone here" and "So that explains why apple has fallen on their faces when it comes to iPhone sales outside of the US, the phone has no value to the consumer at the extreme price they have set for it?" ... and I could go on.

    If not I apologize for the insult and will read what you post.
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