The Mini is popular where you need a Mac but it's not your primary machine. It's perfect for iOS development/cross-development (eg with monogame/xamarin) and is reasonably powerful enough and portable enough to be used as a HTPC or taken to convention settings when there is power available.
The Mini is a lot better than you are implying. With a modern Intel chip it would be very competitive given the excellent OpenCL performance of the Iris GPUs.
That said, the lack of OS X on more capable desktop/laptop hardware is often a deciding factor in what Mac or PC someone buys. I'm not terribly fond of the Apple Laptop designs, as I feel they are overly compromised (eg the macmini 2012 is more capable than all the 2014 13" Retina Macbook Pro and Macbook Air's), versus the desktops which undoubtly beat the mini. The Iris Pro graphics doesn't make up for the weaker dual-core designs.
The Mini is excellent for what it is, what Apple needs is a Midrange desktop that sits between the Mini and the Mac Pro performance and price wise. In fact I've been saying this for some time. I can see putting the Mini to use in a number of ways that don't involve being a primary machine. The Mini isnt a problem it is rather the missing midrange machine that makes Apple line up look pathetic.
I have a desktop Windows machine that I'd drop in a heartbeat if I could get the same specs in a Macmini. It won't happen. The mini gets relegated to be development/backup system while the windows machine gets to be the primary development/steam-games system.
It is very easy to build a no name machine that will run circles around a Mini. That isn't relevant as it is Small Form Factor machine and as such should be judged against other small form factor machines.
OS X, is a wonderful OS, but it's only available on weak systems, systems that because of Intel Graphics have not been terribly capable.
The IMac isn't bad performance wise if you an stomach an all in one. However SFF machines have never been noted for GPU performance so I don't know why you even bring the Mini up in that context.
This problem extends to the new Mac Pro in that the graphics can never be upgraded.
You assume it can't be upgraded but the video cards in a Mac Pro are socketed. Beyond that it really doesn't make sense to upgrade a machine like the Mac Pro any more. Especially considering that the video cards can often be the largest part of a Mac Pro investment.
And for those that just don't underatand, there will never be a "mid range" tower in between the mini and the Mac pro. Price wise, it would undercut the iMac and Apple would much much much rather sell you one of those.
The Mini is popular where you need a Mac but it's not your primary machine. It's perfect for iOS development/cross-development (eg with monogame/xamarin) and is reasonably powerful enough and portable enough to be used as a HTPC or taken to convention settings when there is power available.
That said, the lack of OS X on more capable desktop/laptop hardware is often a deciding factor in what Mac or PC someone buys. I'm not terribly fond of the Apple Laptop designs, as I feel they are overly compromised (eg the macmini 2012 is more capable than all the 2014 13" Retina Macbook Pro and Macbook Air's), versus the desktops which undoubtly beat the mini. The Iris Pro graphics doesn't make up for the weaker dual-core designs.
I have a desktop Windows machine that I'd drop in a heartbeat if I could get the same specs in a Macmini. It won't happen. The mini gets relegated to be development/backup system while the windows machine gets to be the primary development/steam-games system.
OS X, is a wonderful OS, but it's only available on weak systems, systems that because of Intel Graphics have not been terribly capable. This problem extends to the new Mac Pro in that the graphics can never be upgraded.
I use a Mac mini as my primary Mac. So does my dad. They're more capable than most think.
Nobody ever said the graphics card in the MacPro could never be upgraded.
OS X, is a wonderful OS, but it's only available on weak systems, systems that because of Intel Graphics have not been terribly capable. This problem extends to the new Mac Pro in that the graphics can never be upgraded.
Haswell Iris Pro performs like the Nvidia 650m, which is not bad at all. Its would be fine for something like the mini. I am sure Apple could target the $499 price tag if it wanted to.
The GPU's in the mac pro runs circle around any gamers GPU in CAD/ video editing. Since those GPU can handle 4k I dont see the need for pro's to upgrade the GPU's for the expected lifespan of the machine. The mac pro GPU'S still perform like a GTX 780 even for gaming, but for that used this mac is very expensive compare to what a windows gamer PC would cost.
Huh? That is very Apple. You could just call it the year Mac for the ones that only had one update that year but every now and then they do have more than one release in a year so they use that for all of them. Plus it helps isolate how long it's been available more than just saying, say, 2013, when late-2013 would be less than a year and early-2013 would mean it's well over a year old.
I must admit I have never fathomed the US versions of when summer, late summer, fall, winter etc. occur ... my wife and I often have words about this (she is a native born Yank). To me it's simple, the year is in four quarters, divided by the summer and winter solstices and the spring and autumn equinoxes, nothing to do with labor day, wearing white not wearing white or memorial day or whatever else US marketing has cooked up
The Mini is popular where you need a Mac but it's not your primary machine. It's perfect for iOS development/cross-development (eg with monogame/xamarin) and is reasonably powerful enough and portable enough to be used as a HTPC or taken to convention settings when there is power available.
That said, the lack of OS X on more capable desktop/laptop hardware is often a deciding factor in what Mac or PC someone buys. I'm not terribly fond of the Apple Laptop designs, as I feel they are overly compromised (eg the macmini 2012 is more capable than all the 2014 13" Retina Macbook Pro and Macbook Air's), versus the desktops which undoubtly beat the mini. The Iris Pro graphics doesn't make up for the weaker dual-core designs.
I have a desktop Windows machine that I'd drop in a heartbeat if I could get the same specs in a Macmini. It won't happen. The mini gets relegated to be development/backup system while the windows machine gets to be the primary development/steam-games system.
OS X, is a wonderful OS, but it's only available on weak systems, systems that because of Intel Graphics have not been terribly capable. This problem extends to the new Mac Pro in that the graphics can never be upgraded.
The nMac Pro may seem like it is un-upgradeable (if that's a word) and that's partially true at the moment but it comes apart in seconds and everything can be swapped out easily. The question is when will affordable parts be available? Hopefully next year. I for one am waiting for a 1 TB PCIe SSD which currently isn't available even from Apple. But a weak system? Tell my nMac pro that as it chews through 4K video with multiple effects in real time as if it were 640 x 480 NTSC :smokey: Try that on your typical top of the line PC.
The Mini is popular where you need a Mac but it's not your primary machine. It's perfect for iOS development/cross-development (eg with monogame/xamarin) and is reasonably powerful enough and portable enough to be used as a HTPC or taken to convention settings when there is power available.
That said, the lack of OS X on more capable desktop/laptop hardware is often a deciding factor in what Mac or PC someone buys. I'm not terribly fond of the Apple Laptop designs, as I feel they are overly compromised (eg the macmini 2012 is more capable than all the 2014 13" Retina Macbook Pro and Macbook Air's), versus the desktops which undoubtly beat the mini. The Iris Pro graphics doesn't make up for the weaker dual-core designs.
I have a desktop Windows machine that I'd drop in a heartbeat if I could get the same specs in a Macmini. It won't happen. The mini gets relegated to be development/backup system while the windows machine gets to be the primary development/steam-games system.
OS X, is a wonderful OS, but it's only available on weak systems, systems that because of Intel Graphics have not been terribly capable. This problem extends to the new Mac Pro in that the graphics can never be upgraded.
I must admit I have never fathomed the US versions of when summer, late summer, fall, winter etc. occur ... my wife and I often have words about this (she is a native born Yank). To me it's simple, the year is in four quarters, divided by the summer and winter solstices and the spring and autumn equinoxes, nothing to do with labor day, wearing white not wearing white or memorial day or whatever else US marketing has cooked up
But us Americans, we not so good at science and reality. Equinox ... solstice... ain't that some pagan thing? Money is our God.
The nMac Pro may seem like it is un-upgradeable (if that's a word) and that's partially true at the moment but it comes apart in seconds and everything can be swapped out easily. The question is when will affordable parts be available? Hopefully next year. I for one am waiting for a 1 TB PCIe SSD which currently isn't available even from Apple. But a weak system? Tell my nMac pro that as it chews through 4K video with multiple effects in real time as if it were 640 x 480 NTSC Try that on your typical top of the line PC.
But us Americans, we not so good at science and reality. Equinox ... solstice... ain't that some pagan thing?
The easiest way to tell time is to just leave an egg on your windowsill all year. If you wake up and it’s magically standing on end, you know it’s the...
...wait, do people pretend that happens on solstices or equinoxes? CURSE YOU, WINDOWSILL EGG!
The Mini is popular where you need a Mac but it's not your primary machine. It's perfect for iOS development/cross-development (eg with monogame/xamarin) and is reasonably powerful enough and portable enough to be used as a HTPC or taken to convention settings when there is power available.
That said, the lack of OS X on more capable desktop/laptop hardware is often a deciding factor in what Mac or PC someone buys. I'm not terribly fond of the Apple Laptop designs, as I feel they are overly compromised (eg the macmini 2012 is more capable than all the 2014 13" Retina Macbook Pro and Macbook Air's), versus the desktops which undoubtly beat the mini. The Iris Pro graphics doesn't make up for the weaker dual-core designs.
I have a desktop Windows machine that I'd drop in a heartbeat if I could get the same specs in a Macmini. It won't happen. The mini gets relegated to be development/backup system while the windows machine gets to be the primary development/steam-games system.
OS X, is a wonderful OS, but it's only available on weak systems, systems that because of Intel Graphics have not been terribly capable. This problem extends to the new Mac Pro in that the graphics can never be upgraded.
In this house two Minis have been our main computer, starting at the G4 and now at the C2D 2.0 model.
We aren't SW developers, nor do we play action games.
Our Macs do our general computing, Office docs Web browsing, Email, photos and the occasional movie.
An iMac or MacBook aren't in our current plans, we have tablets and new upgraded Mini is being waited for.
The Mini is currently small enough for us, just sits beside the display.
So Apple lets have the upgraded Mini, it's long overdue !
It's nice that they are continuing to support Windows 7 64-bit so people don't have to deal with Windows 8.
The two unannounced models are Mac Mini and 27" iMac both noted as mid 2014. I doubt it's a typo given that both those models were changed. The MBP box still hasn't been updated in the live one but that's probably because Tim Cook just gave whoever was responsible for the mistake a prolonged energy bar munching silent dressing down from which they have to recover.
If products are updated in October, that counts as late 2014 so the Mac Mini and 27" iMac will have to be updated in the next 8 weeks. They've done Mac updates at the iOS event in September so if there's to be a Retina iMac, they might show it off there and the Mini will get a silent drag along update to the Haswell refresh chips.
And for those that just don't underatand, there will never be a "mid range" tower in between the mini and the Mac pro. Price wise, it would undercut the iMac and Apple would much much much rather sell you one of those.
I'd beg to differ.
Apple's vision of the desktop computer is translated in the Mac Pro: the computer as a central brain. The “everything crammed into one computer” model is going away according to Apple.
In return you get a computer that is easy to iFixit and much better to recycle. You don't have to throw away a good functioning screen when your computer is dead. I actually see no future for the iMac. It is neither sustainable* nor practical**.
Here's hoping the new mac mini will be thermos flask shaped. In silver grey. And yes, a maxed out mac mini could be the equivalent of a mid range tower.
(*) I am still using my ten year old 20" Cinema Display, hooked up with a 2011 mac mini at home.
(**) The mac mini is super portable. I take it with me to my coworking office and hook it up to a big screen. It makes me super productive.
Comments
You assume it can't be upgraded but the video cards in a Mac Pro are socketed. Beyond that it really doesn't make sense to upgrade a machine like the Mac Pro any more. Especially considering that the video cards can often be the largest part of a Mac Pro investment.
[...] just put Haswell in it and thunderbolt 2.
And Iris.
And PCIe flash storage.
The Mini is popular where you need a Mac but it's not your primary machine. It's perfect for iOS development/cross-development (eg with monogame/xamarin) and is reasonably powerful enough and portable enough to be used as a HTPC or taken to convention settings when there is power available.
That said, the lack of OS X on more capable desktop/laptop hardware is often a deciding factor in what Mac or PC someone buys. I'm not terribly fond of the Apple Laptop designs, as I feel they are overly compromised (eg the macmini 2012 is more capable than all the 2014 13" Retina Macbook Pro and Macbook Air's), versus the desktops which undoubtly beat the mini. The Iris Pro graphics doesn't make up for the weaker dual-core designs.
I have a desktop Windows machine that I'd drop in a heartbeat if I could get the same specs in a Macmini. It won't happen. The mini gets relegated to be development/backup system while the windows machine gets to be the primary development/steam-games system.
OS X, is a wonderful OS, but it's only available on weak systems, systems that because of Intel Graphics have not been terribly capable. This problem extends to the new Mac Pro in that the graphics can never be upgraded.
I use a Mac mini as my primary Mac. So does my dad. They're more capable than most think.
Nobody ever said the graphics card in the MacPro could never be upgraded.
OS X, is a wonderful OS, but it's only available on weak systems, systems that because of Intel Graphics have not been terribly capable. This problem extends to the new Mac Pro in that the graphics can never be upgraded.
Haswell Iris Pro performs like the Nvidia 650m, which is not bad at all. Its would be fine for something like the mini. I am sure Apple could target the $499 price tag if it wanted to.
The GPU's in the mac pro runs circle around any gamers GPU in CAD/ video editing. Since those GPU can handle 4k I dont see the need for pro's to upgrade the GPU's for the expected lifespan of the machine. The mac pro GPU'S still perform like a GTX 780 even for gaming, but for that used this mac is very expensive compare to what a windows gamer PC would cost.
I must admit I have never fathomed the US versions of when summer, late summer, fall, winter etc. occur ... my wife and I often have words about this (she is a native born Yank). To me it's simple, the year is in four quarters, divided by the summer and winter solstices and the spring and autumn equinoxes, nothing to do with labor day, wearing white not wearing white or memorial day or whatever else US marketing has cooked up
The nMac Pro may seem like it is un-upgradeable (if that's a word) and that's partially true at the moment but it comes apart in seconds and everything can be swapped out easily. The question is when will affordable parts be available? Hopefully next year. I for one am waiting for a 1 TB PCIe SSD which currently isn't available even from Apple. But a weak system? Tell my nMac pro that as it chews through 4K video with multiple effects in real time as if it were 640 x 480 NTSC :smokey: Try that on your typical top of the line PC.
Oh please let it be true, only so I can stop hearing all the complaining.
They'll just find something else to complain about.;)
I must admit I have never fathomed the US versions of when summer, late summer, fall, winter etc. occur ... my wife and I often have words about this (she is a native born Yank). To me it's simple, the year is in four quarters, divided by the summer and winter solstices and the spring and autumn equinoxes, nothing to do with labor day, wearing white not wearing white or memorial day or whatever else US marketing has cooked up
But us Americans, we not so good at science and reality. Equinox ... solstice... ain't that some pagan thing? Money is our God.
The nMac Pro may seem like it is un-upgradeable (if that's a word) and that's partially true at the moment but it comes apart in seconds and everything can be swapped out easily. The question is when will affordable parts be available? Hopefully next year. I for one am waiting for a 1 TB PCIe SSD which currently isn't available even from Apple. But a weak system? Tell my nMac pro that as it chews through 4K video with multiple effects in real time as if it were 640 x 480 NTSC
And it does that almost silently.
The easiest way to tell time is to just leave an egg on your windowsill all year. If you wake up and it’s magically standing on end, you know it’s the...
...wait, do people pretend that happens on solstices or equinoxes? CURSE YOU, WINDOWSILL EGG!
Try that on your typical top of the line PC.
We run Avid Nitris on HP hardware. No problem with horsepower or speed at all.
I threatened to quit if they tried switching Pro Tools to Windows, but not because the HP workstations are inadequate. They're not.
Oh please let it be true, only so I can stop hearing all the complaining.
Even if it were true and happened, there would still be plenty of complaining.
The Mini is popular where you need a Mac but it's not your primary machine. It's perfect for iOS development/cross-development (eg with monogame/xamarin) and is reasonably powerful enough and portable enough to be used as a HTPC or taken to convention settings when there is power available.
That said, the lack of OS X on more capable desktop/laptop hardware is often a deciding factor in what Mac or PC someone buys. I'm not terribly fond of the Apple Laptop designs, as I feel they are overly compromised (eg the macmini 2012 is more capable than all the 2014 13" Retina Macbook Pro and Macbook Air's), versus the desktops which undoubtly beat the mini. The Iris Pro graphics doesn't make up for the weaker dual-core designs.
I have a desktop Windows machine that I'd drop in a heartbeat if I could get the same specs in a Macmini. It won't happen. The mini gets relegated to be development/backup system while the windows machine gets to be the primary development/steam-games system.
OS X, is a wonderful OS, but it's only available on weak systems, systems that because of Intel Graphics have not been terribly capable. This problem extends to the new Mac Pro in that the graphics can never be upgraded.
In this house two Minis have been our main computer, starting at the G4 and now at the C2D 2.0 model.
We aren't SW developers, nor do we play action games.
Our Macs do our general computing, Office docs Web browsing, Email, photos and the occasional movie.
An iMac or MacBook aren't in our current plans, we have tablets and new upgraded Mini is being waited for.
The Mini is currently small enough for us, just sits beside the display.
So Apple lets have the upgraded Mini, it's long overdue !
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT5634
and the cached version is here:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://support.apple.com/kb/HT5634
It's nice that they are continuing to support Windows 7 64-bit so people don't have to deal with Windows 8.
The two unannounced models are Mac Mini and 27" iMac both noted as mid 2014. I doubt it's a typo given that both those models were changed. The MBP box still hasn't been updated in the live one but that's probably because Tim Cook just gave whoever was responsible for the mistake a prolonged energy bar munching silent dressing down from which they have to recover.
If products are updated in October, that counts as late 2014 so the Mac Mini and 27" iMac will have to be updated in the next 8 weeks. They've done Mac updates at the iOS event in September so if there's to be a Retina iMac, they might show it off there and the Mini will get a silent drag along update to the Haswell refresh chips.
And for those that just don't underatand, there will never be a "mid range" tower in between the mini and the Mac pro. Price wise, it would undercut the iMac and Apple would much much much rather sell you one of those.
I'd beg to differ.
Apple's vision of the desktop computer is translated in the Mac Pro: the computer as a central brain. The “everything crammed into one computer” model is going away according to Apple.
and much better to recycle. You don't have to throw away a good functioning screen when your computer is dead. I actually see no future for the iMac. It is neither sustainable* nor practical**.
In return you get a computer that is easy to iFixit
Here's hoping the new mac mini will be thermos flask shaped. In silver grey. And yes, a maxed out mac mini could be the equivalent of a mid range tower.
(*) I am still using my ten year old 20" Cinema Display, hooked up with a 2011 mac mini at home.
(**) The mac mini is super portable. I take it with me to my coworking office and hook it up to a big screen. It makes me super productive.