I am honestly tired of talking with economic illiterates on this site. Monopolies can be government run or form in market conditions. MS had an operating system monopoly.
No they didn't. They had a dominant position. That is not at all the same as a monopoly.
Do you believe the government is made of angels with your best interests in mind because they offer you free candy? You and those cartoonists fail to understand some elementary things about human behavior, self-interest and the dangers of giving politicians the keys to the Porsche. There is a trade-off for everything. There are no freebies.
Do you believe the government is made of angels with your best interests in mind because they offer you free candy? You and those cartoonists fail to understand some elementary things about human behavior, self-interest and the dangers of giving politicians the keys to the Porsche.
I think a list of past times categorical reclassification led to de facto or de jure government control over whatever it was would be helpful.
The technology it depends upon is largely government or university originated ( ARPANET, tcp/ip, HTML Etc). Not that it matters - the Internet runs on the same infrastructure in most cases to the phone system. Fibre and copper. And that's a public utility.
Do you really want your provider to throttle Apple, Spotify or Netflix for their own Streaming solutions just because you don't like a politician?
The fiber and copper is not a public utility. It does, in many cases use public land but companies pay leases for the land, access, perform the work themselves (or private contracts), provide all that copper, fiber, equipment, pay for power, and provide end to end support . Companies enter franchise agreements with municipalities that are lucrative for the municipalities who require the carrier to meet service levels. If people don't like the access they have they should talk to their local PUCs.
This piece does a decent job of explaining the W's of peering.
Politicians, no matter what the color (and I mean RED or BLUE) that talk about choking down bandwidth are just pandering to a constituency. It's funny to hear a government that runs agencies who give preference to those who pay more, ban the practice in the private sector. And to those saying Charter is choking down Netflix....
I think a list of past times categorical reclassification led to de facto or de jure government control over whatever it was would be helpful.
Next thing you know, Apple will be federalized and iPhones will become the de facto replacement for all phones, but first Apple will be forced to hand over the keys to all encryption... y'know... because we need to be "protected".
Next thing you know, Apple will be federalized and iPhones will become the de facto replacement for all phones, but first Apple will be forced to hand over the keys to all encryption... y'know... because we need to be "protected".
I’m not sure I believe the government when they say they’re unable to break that encryption. I don’t see the DoD, for example, not having working quantum computers already.
Bravo Ted Cruz. Never trust a government bureaucracy to make things better for consumers.
I not sure you could make it worse. Not even the Republicans could do that. So apparently your Internet access is so incredibly good, meaning you are getting like 1 gig up and down and it is only costing you $29 a month. How dare Obama come in and mess with that. Well in reality you are not getting that and you argue for the people who want to make sure it never gets better. Unless you want to pay more. I always love it when people argue against their own best interests.
Can’t imagine why; the definition of “net neutrality” means itself and its opposite these days. When psychopaths want to pretend words don’t mean what they mean, you’re not going to get much agreement.
I can’t see anyone favoring the ability to throttle a site based on use, nor the ability to block a site entirely unless you pay for a “higher tier” of access, but ‘net neutrality’ has been pushed before under exactly that premise.
I take it to mean the providers - ISPs and carriers - can't throttle site A to promote site B. Which could be their site or some company that pays them off. Now imagine Obama and the democrats were bought off by Verizon et al. And were opposing net neutrality. What would you support then?
As a non American I think Osama is fairly hopeless. However this is a good move.
The fiber and copper is not a public utility. It does, in many cases use public land but companies pay leases for the land, access, perform the work themselves (or private contracts), provide all that copper, fiber, equipment, pay for power, and provide end to end support . Companies enter franchise agreements with municipalities that are lucrative for the municipalities who require the carrier to meet service levels. If people don't like the access they have they should talk to their local PUCs.
This piece does a decent job of explaining the W's of peering.
Politicians, no matter what the color (and I mean RED or BLUE) that talk about choking down bandwidth are just pandering to a constituency. It's funny to hear a government that runs agencies who give preference to those who pay more, ban the practice in the private sector. And to those saying Charter is choking down Netflix....
As defined in law a "public utility" can be privately held but subject to restrictions to stop local monopolistic practices. That's exactly what is under debate here.
As defined in law a "public utility" can be privately held but subject to restrictions to stop local monopolistic practices. That's exactly what is under debate here.
I'm offended by your joke. Ten thousand Americans dead, over a million Iraqis, Because of US "intelligence failure," otherwise known as lies.
You still haven't answered my question. What "intelligence" from Europe were you referring to?
1. It's a joke. I guess I didn't run it by the PC police too. 2. Where did you get your numbers? 3. Let's not rehash it. Intelligence was there. It was wrong. British had their own Intel. The CIA dir said it was a slam dunk.
Powell and Rice are black. So was opposition against them during Bush's term racist? I suppose racism is a one way street.
There's a difference between a white man telling black people what to do, and a black man telling white people what to do.
There has been no time in modern history that one party has denied a president so much. And his policies are far from the liberal utopia that people make them out to be.
We will look back at Obama's Presidency in 40 years and be ashamed of how we let him be treated. I guarantee that.
Indeed.
He will be seen to have been treated far too leniently.
That has no bearing on the economic concept. You can check it out in any Econ 101 textbook.
Apologies for the poor-quality article.
As I stated before, monopolies exist when business colludes with government. That is supported by all of the information I've provided and by simply observing political reality.
That won’t do anything. If it’s classed as a public utility there will be ZERO reason to improve speeds (not like it happens anyway), ZERO reason for the ISPs not to collude (more than they do now), and ZERO reason for unlimited and unthrottled plans to keep existing.
If you check all the first world countries in the world you will find in fact our free enterprise system failed us on this one. Cartel like activities in the US have us at the bottom end of speed and price.
Hey, Joe! Latest internet rumblings are kinda slamming me after the election. Our plan to control the press (e.g. the Chavez plan) hasn't worked yet. I have a pretty good idea about how we can fix this. And the dumbasses who voted for me will eat it up!
Step #1 - Grant the government heavy regulatory control over the internet. How do we sell it to the gullible public? Just tell them that we are going to make it fast and fair for everyone (it worked for ObamaCare; it'll work again).
Step #2 - Classify the internet as a Public Utility - we sell this as a way to guarantee that everybody gets their share! Then we can offer ObamaComputers to everyone that is unemployed (we need to do this, as this includes most of our democrat base)
Step #3 - Wait until those Republicans refuse to pass a bill to me on this, then I pull out the ObamaHammer - Executive Action, baby! Who needs congress.
Step #4 - Now we add regulatory fees to every aspect of anything to do with the internet. Hell, we could save the postal service with this; we could give them regulatory control over email, and charge First Class delivery rates for every email. Do instant messages use the internet? I'll bet we could make a killing off those. I have already put together a team of advisers that tell me we could raise enough cash to buy the 2016 election, just like last time.
Step #5 - This is the beauty of the whole plan... We create a central network that acts as the nexus for the entire internet! Not just the U.S. Internet, but ALL of it. Why? So we can guarantee that services like YouTube and Netflix aren't getting special treatment. Really why? We see everything! I'm thinking we spin off a section of the NSA, call it OOA - (Obama Octopus Agency). We get to see every single packet of data in the world if it gets routed anywhere through the U.S.A. (any any other country that we have a tentacle into).
Step #6 - Bask for a while at Camp David in the knowledge that while Al Gore may have invented the Internet, Barack Obama now owns it.
Step #7 - Now this is the second beautiful part of the plan. Once Congress gets their head out of their asses and figures out what is going on, they will raise hell. They will likely try to impeach me... in fact, I'm counting on it. This is where we throw Congress under the bus (Sorry, Harry!), and the open-mouthed public will swallow anything I feed them. I'm going to, get this... I'm going to dissolve Congress. Who would believe that I spent the last 6 years making Congressional Republicans AND Democrats look like inept morons just so I could lead up to this point. Now, with Republicans in power, the citizens and illegals (both will be voting) will believe me when I declare that Congress has no meaningful reason to exist.
Step #8 - Ownership of the Internet means ownership of all information... I will use the Federal Internet to show increasing support for me as perpetual, omnipotent ruler of this country. Don't worry, I wouldn't leave you out. I'm going to make Duke of Washington. You will be steward for the country when I'm out golfing.
Step #9 - Hell with ObamaCare - At this point, I can't plant any seed I want and it will instantly be full-grown. Russia screwed up socialism, bad. It's not about communism. I'm going straight socialism. Hell with Putin. They never had the economy to make it work. We do. I was reading that book Chavez gave to me (I miss that guy) and I realized that all we have to do is make everything state-owned. Better cash out your Apple stocks! Ha! Doesn't matter. I think I'll make Mr. Cook Tsar over the the Federal Apple Agency that I'm planning. Can you imagine? No more ObamaPhones... Now, we will have ObamaiPhones!
Step #10 - Ok, look... I'm not going to grow a short mustache or anything (never did grow much facial hair anyway), but once we take the internet, I think we could pretty easily take the world.
What do you think? I'll give you France if you want it! Weren't you the one that liked cheese?
If you check all the first world countries in the world you will find in fact our free enterprise system failed us on this one. Cartel like activities in the US have us at the bottom end of speed and price.
Comments
I am honestly tired of talking with economic illiterates on this site. Monopolies can be government run or form in market conditions. MS had an operating system monopoly.
No they didn't. They had a dominant position. That is not at all the same as a monopoly.
Maybe this will help, it has pictures for the folks that only read picture books too. http://theoatmeal.com/blog/net_neutrality
Do you believe the government is made of angels with your best interests in mind because they offer you free candy? You and those cartoonists fail to understand some elementary things about human behavior, self-interest and the dangers of giving politicians the keys to the Porsche. There is a trade-off for everything. There are no freebies.
I think a list of past times categorical reclassification led to de facto or de jure government control over whatever it was would be helpful.
The fiber and copper is not a public utility. It does, in many cases use public land but companies pay leases for the land, access, perform the work themselves (or private contracts), provide all that copper, fiber, equipment, pay for power, and provide end to end support . Companies enter franchise agreements with municipalities that are lucrative for the municipalities who require the carrier to meet service levels. If people don't like the access they have they should talk to their local PUCs.
This piece does a decent job of explaining the W's of peering.
http://www.internap.com/2014/03/07/despite-comcast-netflix-deal-settlement-free-peering-alive-well/
Politicians, no matter what the color (and I mean RED or BLUE) that talk about choking down bandwidth are just pandering to a constituency. It's funny to hear a government that runs agencies who give preference to those who pay more, ban the practice in the private sector. And to those saying Charter is choking down Netflix....
http://ispspeedindex.netflix.com/usa
Those are Netflix's numbers.
I think a list of past times categorical reclassification led to de facto or de jure government control over whatever it was would be helpful.
Next thing you know, Apple will be federalized and iPhones will become the de facto replacement for all phones, but first Apple will be forced to hand over the keys to all encryption... y'know... because we need to be "protected".
I’m not sure I believe the government when they say they’re unable to break that encryption. I don’t see the DoD, for example, not having working quantum computers already.
Bravo Ted Cruz. Never trust a government bureaucracy to make things better for consumers.
I not sure you could make it worse. Not even the Republicans could do that. So apparently your Internet access is so incredibly good, meaning you are getting like 1 gig up and down and it is only costing you $29 a month. How dare Obama come in and mess with that. Well in reality you are not getting that and you argue for the people who want to make sure it never gets better. Unless you want to pay more. I always love it when people argue against their own best interests.
You've got your own personal dictionary there and I won't be arguing with it.
I take it to mean the providers - ISPs and carriers - can't throttle site A to promote site B. Which could be their site or some company that pays them off. Now imagine Obama and the democrats were bought off by Verizon et al. And were opposing net neutrality. What would you support then?
As a non American I think Osama is fairly hopeless. However this is a good move.
As defined in law a "public utility" can be privately held but subject to restrictions to stop local monopolistic practices. That's exactly what is under debate here.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_utility
Way to move the goal posts.
1. It's a joke. I guess I didn't run it by the PC police too. 2. Where did you get your numbers? 3. Let's not rehash it. Intelligence was there. It was wrong. British had their own Intel. The CIA dir said it was a slam dunk.
The very first example in that link is false.
That has no bearing on the economic concept. You can check it out in any Econ 101 textbook.
Apologies for the poor-quality article.
Indeed.
He will be seen to have been treated far too leniently.
As I stated before, monopolies exist when business colludes with government. That is supported by all of the information I've provided and by simply observing political reality.
QFT
If you check all the first world countries in the world you will find in fact our free enterprise system failed us on this one. Cartel like activities in the US have us at the bottom end of speed and price.
As a non American I think Osama is fairly hopeless. However this is a good move.
Who is Osama? I thought he was dead?
Memo, from Desk of Barack Hussein Obama:
Hey, Joe! Latest internet rumblings are kinda slamming me after the election. Our plan to control the press (e.g. the Chavez plan) hasn't worked yet. I have a pretty good idea about how we can fix this. And the dumbasses who voted for me will eat it up!
Step #1 - Grant the government heavy regulatory control over the internet. How do we sell it to the gullible public? Just tell them that we are going to make it fast and fair for everyone (it worked for ObamaCare; it'll work again).
Step #2 - Classify the internet as a Public Utility - we sell this as a way to guarantee that everybody gets their share! Then we can offer ObamaComputers to everyone that is unemployed (we need to do this, as this includes most of our democrat base)
Step #3 - Wait until those Republicans refuse to pass a bill to me on this, then I pull out the ObamaHammer - Executive Action, baby! Who needs congress.
Step #4 - Now we add regulatory fees to every aspect of anything to do with the internet. Hell, we could save the postal service with this; we could give them regulatory control over email, and charge First Class delivery rates for every email. Do instant messages use the internet? I'll bet we could make a killing off those. I have already put together a team of advisers that tell me we could raise enough cash to buy the 2016 election, just like last time.
Step #5 - This is the beauty of the whole plan... We create a central network that acts as the nexus for the entire internet! Not just the U.S. Internet, but ALL of it. Why? So we can guarantee that services like YouTube and Netflix aren't getting special treatment. Really why? We see everything! I'm thinking we spin off a section of the NSA, call it OOA - (Obama Octopus Agency). We get to see every single packet of data in the world if it gets routed anywhere through the U.S.A. (any any other country that we have a tentacle into).
Step #6 - Bask for a while at Camp David in the knowledge that while Al Gore may have invented the Internet, Barack Obama now owns it.
Step #7 - Now this is the second beautiful part of the plan. Once Congress gets their head out of their asses and figures out what is going on, they will raise hell. They will likely try to impeach me... in fact, I'm counting on it. This is where we throw Congress under the bus (Sorry, Harry!), and the open-mouthed public will swallow anything I feed them. I'm going to, get this... I'm going to dissolve Congress. Who would believe that I spent the last 6 years making Congressional Republicans AND Democrats look like inept morons just so I could lead up to this point. Now, with Republicans in power, the citizens and illegals (both will be voting) will believe me when I declare that Congress has no meaningful reason to exist.
Step #8 - Ownership of the Internet means ownership of all information... I will use the Federal Internet to show increasing support for me as perpetual, omnipotent ruler of this country. Don't worry, I wouldn't leave you out. I'm going to make Duke of Washington. You will be steward for the country when I'm out golfing.
Step #9 - Hell with ObamaCare - At this point, I can't plant any seed I want and it will instantly be full-grown. Russia screwed up socialism, bad. It's not about communism. I'm going straight socialism. Hell with Putin. They never had the economy to make it work. We do. I was reading that book Chavez gave to me (I miss that guy) and I realized that all we have to do is make everything state-owned. Better cash out your Apple stocks! Ha! Doesn't matter. I think I'll make Mr. Cook Tsar over the the Federal Apple Agency that I'm planning. Can you imagine? No more ObamaPhones... Now, we will have ObamaiPhones!
Step #10 - Ok, look... I'm not going to grow a short mustache or anything (never did grow much facial hair anyway), but once we take the internet, I think we could pretty easily take the world.
What do you think? I'll give you France if you want it! Weren't you the one that liked cheese?
B.O.
If you check all the first world countries in the world you will find in fact our free enterprise system failed us on this one. Cartel like activities in the US have us at the bottom end of speed and price.
Yes, and we fall further behind every month.