For ApplePay to work you must have WiFi, does JetBlue provide free WiFi?
Not true. I believe Apple Pay doesn't need any network connection to work. The token code is created for transactions from the built-in chip and sent to POS through NFC. The only time network connection is needed is when you need to receive the transaction summary/receipt.
So how does the technology work that Jet Blue can support ?Pay but not other forms of contactless payments? If that's possible could other retailers choose to be ?Pay only? That's huge iPhone lock-in if Apple gets exclusivity.
What seems really odd though is why Apple didn't include NFC antennas on the newest iPads so those could be used as POS terminals for ?Pay. Seems like a no brainer.
Other NFC devices need network or cell connection to authorize the transactions and many times, their devices are not able to connect to the network. iOS device works as stand-alone device.
I thought once you set your pin to never expire you didn't need an internet connection?
Nope. Your financial information is stored on Google server, so you will need network connection every time you use Google Wallet for the immediate authorization.
My point is that Apple Pay eventually needs an internet connection. Apple Pay consists of more than just the communication between the mobile device and the POS device.
It doesn't have to be an internet connection at all. Remember when it was more common and less expensive for PoS systems to dial-up an authorization service which would then verify if the transaction could be completed? No internet connection there, and that authorization service would do the same thing to verify a transaction. Nowadays they could be using a VPN over the internet, but they also might not. Regardless, the internet is not a requirement in this scenario, but rather just a convenient and inexpensive option that many merchants employ.
Then why are you questioning the fact that they need to connect to the internet to complete the transaction if you're already aware that they have a data connection on board? Are you having a hard time accepting that it just works?
>>>Originally Posted by dasanman69
My point is that Apple Pay eventually needs an internet connection. Apple Pay consists of more than just the communication between the mobile device and the POS device.
Over whatever network the POS has in place to approve transactions. Just like any credit card would use.
I don't believe so. I believe Apple Pay generates one-time use code and that's pre-authorized by the bank. POS only needs to verify it. This is the reason why Google Wallet doesn't work even though it's NFC based. If it's simple as what you think, any NFC payment should work, not only Apple Pay.
Then why are you questioning the fact that they need to connect to the internet to complete the transaction if you're already aware that they have a data connection on board? Are you having a hard time accepting that it just works?
>>>Originally Posted by dasanman69
The only time Apple Pay needs internet connection is for in-App purchase and to receive the transaction information/receipt.
Then why are you questioning the fact that they need to connect to the internet to complete the transaction if you're already aware that they have a data connection on board? Are you having a hard time accepting that it just works?
Again, it doesn't need an Internet connection. This data can go to through multiple intranet and private networks without ever touching the internet.
Nope. Your financial information is stored on Google server, so you will need network connection every time you use Google Wallet for the immediate authorization.
Hmm...this is the the Google Wallet FAQ on their site:
You will need to be connected to the internet in order to unlock the app with your 4-digit security PIN and tap and pay in stores. However, if you set your PIN expiration to “Never” in the app settings, you can pay in stores without having an internet connection
Hmm...this is the the Google Wallet FAQ on their site:
You will need to be connected to the internet in order to unlock the app with your 4-digit security PIN and tap and pay in stores. However, if you set your PIN expiration to “Never” in the app settings, you can pay in stores without having an internet connection
Again, The PoS will give the iPhone 6 series (and soon to be ?Watch) the transaction info over NFC, not over the Internet, of free WiFi, or any other connection. Now the merchant may ask the customer if they want a printed receipt or one sent to their email. If the customer chooses the latter, it will be sent over the internet from the companies transaction server (either directly or through an intermediary) to the customer's mail server which will be sent to the customer's device(s).
I don't believe so. I believe Apple Pay generates one-time use code and that's pre-authorized by the bank. POS only needs to verify it. This is the reason why Google Wallet doesn't work even though it's NFC based. If it's simple as what you think, any NFC payment should work, not only Apple Pay.
Actually that portion only happens once: When you load the credit card on to your phone, you need Internet Access for that. Once that is complete (presumably long before you actually USE Apple Pay). You do not need an Internet connection to complete a transaction. That is one of the touted features of Apple Pay. No internet required to complete a transaction.
Next time you are in Panera Bread (or anywhere else) and going to use Apple Pay. Place your phone in Airplane mode first, and watch it work. Google wallet requires you to log in to the app first (requiring Internet of course), to authenticate. Apple Pay does not. Authentication is local on the device through TouchID.
Now, if a merchant wants to query a card vendor for AUTHORIZATION of your iPhone AUTHENTICATED account, they can do that. But it is not required. But that is step 2, and up to the merchant to do that (using their own network). The merchant may choose to batch in collected transactions later (maybe they don't have network, like JetBlue). This capability may very well rule out Internet connected solutions like Google Wallet.
Absolutely correct. I did not mean to imply it was identical to the card swipe, it's not. Basically though, it replaces that part of the work flow. Neither one require the iPhone nor the card, to have it's own internet connection. Authenticating the transaction is handled locally by the Phone. "Authorization" is separate from that, and may or may not be handled in real time. Many times small value transactions are stored and later batched in to the payment processor. If the card (or the account represented by the iPhone) is no good. The merchant is out the funds. I would bet the risk of that happening on an aircraft in flight, is very small.
Batch processing of payments is the old CC number way of doing it. With ?Pay it has to be done in real time because the vendor does not have the information used in batching. That is the main point of ?Pay. The tokens get sent directly to the bank, the vendor can't store up the tokens for later use. There is really no point in not just letting the internet do it's thing, even when in flight. They are probably using an ?Pay app.
Great news, I think. I love Apple Pay, have a 6plus and fly JetBlue all the time. Their app is amazing, love having my boarding pass in passbook and now to be able to use Apple Pay during a flight..perfect. I always thought that when they first started JetBlue wanted to be the Apple of airlines and now they are a step closer!
Again, The PoS will give the iPhone 6 series (and soon to be ?Watch) the transaction info over NFC, not over the Internet, of free WiFi, or any other connection. Now the merchant may ask the customer if they want a printed receipt or one sent to their email. If the customer chooses the latter, it will be sent over the internet from the companies transaction server (either directly or through an intermediary) to the customer's mail server which will be sent to the customer's device(s).
The vendor does need to approve the transaction with the bank to verify there's enough funds to cover the purchase.
Comments
For ApplePay to work you must have WiFi, does JetBlue provide free WiFi?
Not true. I believe Apple Pay doesn't need any network connection to work. The token code is created for transactions from the built-in chip and sent to POS through NFC. The only time network connection is needed is when you need to receive the transaction summary/receipt.
Sure they have, it's called the Internet.
So how does the technology work that Jet Blue can support ?Pay but not other forms of contactless payments? If that's possible could other retailers choose to be ?Pay only? That's huge iPhone lock-in if Apple gets exclusivity.
What seems really odd though is why Apple didn't include NFC antennas on the newest iPads so those could be used as POS terminals for ?Pay. Seems like a no brainer.
Other NFC devices need network or cell connection to authorize the transactions and many times, their devices are not able to connect to the network. iOS device works as stand-alone device.
I thought once you set your pin to never expire you didn't need an internet connection?
Nope. Your financial information is stored on Google server, so you will need network connection every time you use Google Wallet for the immediate authorization.
It doesn't have to be an internet connection at all. Remember when it was more common and less expensive for PoS systems to dial-up an authorization service which would then verify if the transaction could be completed? No internet connection there, and that authorization service would do the same thing to verify a transaction. Nowadays they could be using a VPN over the internet, but they also might not. Regardless, the internet is not a requirement in this scenario, but rather just a convenient and inexpensive option that many merchants employ.
So how does the transaction get approval?
How do you use your token to connect to your company VPN? Token Code is what needed to be sent from your phone to the POS and to be verified by POS.
I imagine JetBlue has that all figured out.
Quote:
Sure they have, it's called the Internet.
Then why are you questioning the fact that they need to connect to the internet to complete the transaction if you're already aware that they have a data connection on board? Are you having a hard time accepting that it just works?
>>>Originally Posted by dasanman69
Over whatever network the POS has in place to approve transactions. Just like any credit card would use.
I don't believe so. I believe Apple Pay generates one-time use code and that's pre-authorized by the bank. POS only needs to verify it. This is the reason why Google Wallet doesn't work even though it's NFC based. If it's simple as what you think, any NFC payment should work, not only Apple Pay.
Then why are you questioning the fact that they need to connect to the internet to complete the transaction if you're already aware that they have a data connection on board? Are you having a hard time accepting that it just works?
>>>Originally Posted by dasanman69
The only time Apple Pay needs internet connection is for in-App purchase and to receive the transaction information/receipt.
Again, it doesn't need an Internet connection. This data can go to through multiple intranet and private networks without ever touching the internet.
Which is 100% of the time.
Communications between intranets is technically the internet.
Note my use of a capital 'I' in that specific comment.
Hmm...this is the the Google Wallet FAQ on their site:
I hope no one does that.
Again, The PoS will give the iPhone 6 series (and soon to be ?Watch) the transaction info over NFC, not over the Internet, of free WiFi, or any other connection. Now the merchant may ask the customer if they want a printed receipt or one sent to their email. If the customer chooses the latter, it will be sent over the internet from the companies transaction server (either directly or through an intermediary) to the customer's mail server which will be sent to the customer's device(s).
I don't believe so. I believe Apple Pay generates one-time use code and that's pre-authorized by the bank. POS only needs to verify it. This is the reason why Google Wallet doesn't work even though it's NFC based. If it's simple as what you think, any NFC payment should work, not only Apple Pay.
Actually that portion only happens once: When you load the credit card on to your phone, you need Internet Access for that. Once that is complete (presumably long before you actually USE Apple Pay). You do not need an Internet connection to complete a transaction. That is one of the touted features of Apple Pay. No internet required to complete a transaction.
Next time you are in Panera Bread (or anywhere else) and going to use Apple Pay. Place your phone in Airplane mode first, and watch it work. Google wallet requires you to log in to the app first (requiring Internet of course), to authenticate. Apple Pay does not. Authentication is local on the device through TouchID.
Now, if a merchant wants to query a card vendor for AUTHORIZATION of your iPhone AUTHENTICATED account, they can do that. But it is not required. But that is step 2, and up to the merchant to do that (using their own network). The merchant may choose to batch in collected transactions later (maybe they don't have network, like JetBlue). This capability may very well rule out Internet connected solutions like Google Wallet.
Absolutely correct. I did not mean to imply it was identical to the card swipe, it's not. Basically though, it replaces that part of the work flow. Neither one require the iPhone nor the card, to have it's own internet connection. Authenticating the transaction is handled locally by the Phone. "Authorization" is separate from that, and may or may not be handled in real time. Many times small value transactions are stored and later batched in to the payment processor. If the card (or the account represented by the iPhone) is no good. The merchant is out the funds. I would bet the risk of that happening on an aircraft in flight, is very small.
Batch processing of payments is the old CC number way of doing it. With ?Pay it has to be done in real time because the vendor does not have the information used in batching. That is the main point of ?Pay. The tokens get sent directly to the bank, the vendor can't store up the tokens for later use. There is really no point in not just letting the internet do it's thing, even when in flight. They are probably using an ?Pay app.
Great news, I think. I love Apple Pay, have a 6plus and fly JetBlue all the time. Their app is amazing, love having my boarding pass in passbook and now to be able to use Apple Pay during a flight..perfect. I always thought that when they first started JetBlue wanted to be the Apple of airlines and now they are a step closer!
The vendor does need to approve the transaction with the bank to verify there's enough funds to cover the purchase.