If loop-pay has the tokenizing infrastructure in place, this may be why Samesung bought them
The magstripe emulation is laughable of course, but they may hope to use the existing secure/token set up to build their own payment system.
You know, to promote for one product release, then never talk about it except on a bullet point list, then quietly decommission it a year later when no one uses it.
What is Samesung's copy of Continuity called again? Was it ever released or did they just mock up a couple of youtube vids and quietly shut it down when they realized not one person cared.
Samsung is in trouble if this is the best they can do. The technology looks neat in theory, but there are two obvious big problems, and why this is clearly not a competitor to Apple Pay as of now.
1. WAY TOO BIG. Look at the size of the key fob and/or iPhone case you can get right now. (The key fob is as big as the person's palm holding it). Way too big to be integrated into a reasonably sized smartphone. If they could shrink the tech easily the fob would already be way smaller. Look a the case -- still huge. NFC is now small enough that it can be integrated with other chips and be very small.
As a proof of concept, this is cool. Real world smallness that can be put into a phone without reducing battery size or other parts of the phone looks a long way off.
2. NO TOKENIZATION POSSIBLE WITHOUT NEW READERS. To the extent this system is good because it relies on existing magnetic readers, it is bad because it then has to pass traditional credit card account information (including name and card number). I would not be worried much about nearby skimmers getting the info, though that could be done if they are replaced nearby, but the retailer is getting all your info (that can then be hacked, misused by the retailer, etc.) just like current credit cards and unlike Apple Pay.
If you have to wait for new readers for tokenization, then there is no support for the 'better than Apple Pay argument because you can use it with existing swipe tech'
Sure Samsung would also have problems coming up with good integrated software for the phone, etc. but #1 is the real deal breaker.
One thing most are forgetting is that with the EMV rollout mandated by fall 2015 for non EMV POS devices, any fraud committed the retailer will be liable , not the Credit card company. This is a really big deal its going to essentially force all the POS devices to upgrade to EMV which also INCLUDES NFC. So by the end of the year almost every device will potentially work with Apple Pay (the only exception is outdoor gas pumps)
One thing most are forgetting is that with the EMV rollout mandated by fall 2015 for non EMV POS devices, any fraud committed the retailer will be liable , not the Credit card company. This is a really big deal its going to essentially force all the POS devices to upgrade to EMV which also INCLUDES NFC. So by the end of the year almost every device will potentially work with Apple Pay (the only exception is outdoor gas pumps)
I do not believe that the "EMV which also INCLUDES NFC" claim is correct. Merchants all have to update to EMV readers (i.e. chip-capable) and most (95% or better, I've heard) are including NFC in that upgrade. But I don't believe that the EMV compliance REQUIRES NFC to be present. I think it's encouraged, but not required.
One thought, though, about Google Wallet (GW) and tokenization. If you use GW then your actual card number (Primary Account Number PAN) is on file with Google. What the merchant gets from your Android phone is a Google "card number". I assume that can be hacked in the same way as happened at Target/Home Depot/etc, there might be better protections. It could be the case, for example, that the phone would create one-time card numbers in the same way that Visa/MasterCard do for certain of their transactions. I don't know. What is clear however is that your PAN is not provided to the merchant and so is not at risk. This is not "tokenization" as EMV describes it but the protection to the end-user is similar.
Comments
If loop-pay has the tokenizing infrastructure in place, this may be why Samesung bought them
The magstripe emulation is laughable of course, but they may hope to use the existing secure/token set up to build their own payment system.
You know, to promote for one product release, then never talk about it except on a bullet point list, then quietly decommission it a year later when no one uses it.
What is Samesung's copy of Continuity called again? Was it ever released or did they just mock up a couple of youtube vids and quietly shut it down when they realized not one person cared.
Samsung is in trouble if this is the best they can do. The technology looks neat in theory, but there are two obvious big problems, and why this is clearly not a competitor to Apple Pay as of now.
1. WAY TOO BIG. Look at the size of the key fob and/or iPhone case you can get right now. (The key fob is as big as the person's palm holding it). Way too big to be integrated into a reasonably sized smartphone. If they could shrink the tech easily the fob would already be way smaller. Look a the case -- still huge. NFC is now small enough that it can be integrated with other chips and be very small.
As a proof of concept, this is cool. Real world smallness that can be put into a phone without reducing battery size or other parts of the phone looks a long way off.
2. NO TOKENIZATION POSSIBLE WITHOUT NEW READERS. To the extent this system is good because it relies on existing magnetic readers, it is bad because it then has to pass traditional credit card account information (including name and card number). I would not be worried much about nearby skimmers getting the info, though that could be done if they are replaced nearby, but the retailer is getting all your info (that can then be hacked, misused by the retailer, etc.) just like current credit cards and unlike Apple Pay.
If you have to wait for new readers for tokenization, then there is no support for the 'better than Apple Pay argument because you can use it with existing swipe tech'
Sure Samsung would also have problems coming up with good integrated software for the phone, etc. but #1 is the real deal breaker.
One thing most are forgetting is that with the EMV rollout mandated by fall 2015 for non EMV POS devices, any fraud committed the retailer will be liable , not the Credit card company. This is a really big deal its going to essentially force all the POS devices to upgrade to EMV which also INCLUDES NFC. So by the end of the year almost every device will potentially work with Apple Pay (the only exception is outdoor gas pumps)
I do not believe that the "EMV which also INCLUDES NFC" claim is correct. Merchants all have to update to EMV readers (i.e. chip-capable) and most (95% or better, I've heard) are including NFC in that upgrade. But I don't believe that the EMV compliance REQUIRES NFC to be present. I think it's encouraged, but not required.
One thought, though, about Google Wallet (GW) and tokenization. If you use GW then your actual card number (Primary Account Number PAN) is on file with Google. What the merchant gets from your Android phone is a Google "card number". I assume that can be hacked in the same way as happened at Target/Home Depot/etc, there might be better protections. It could be the case, for example, that the phone would create one-time card numbers in the same way that Visa/MasterCard do for certain of their transactions. I don't know. What is clear however is that your PAN is not provided to the merchant and so is not at risk. This is not "tokenization" as EMV describes it but the protection to the end-user is similar.