Somebody pull out a chair for captain obvious, he must be exhausted.
The watch industry has its own customer base of mostly watch collectors. They make watches knowing exactly how many they will sell...the same amount they sold of the last one. Aside from being called a watch, none of that could have any less in common with ? Watch.
Really, you think most of the watch money spent out there is done by collectors? Huh! Not probable at all, because most watches are not collectable. At sub $1100, which is were Apple is mostly hitting, and were a big amount of revenues are made by watch makers, I really doubt people are collecting those things...
DO NOT SKIP!!! - This is a great presentation! All I can say is, "WOW!" and this is a must see preso for anyone interested in tech, retail and economics.
Maybe, this vid will explain what real watchmaking is about and why the Edition is not in the same league as a watch with real complications https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtkcLjiNy_0
Maybe, this vid will explain what real watchmaking is about and why the Edition is not in the same league as a watch with real complications
That video basically, was about working in the business of servicing/supporting expensive mechanical watches. As Ive said in his interview, not all of the watches in his nor Newson's collections are currently serviceable. Sorry, to use an outdated and inaccurate expression but one that everyone understands, 'dinosaurs'...
(What Apple is saying is that the wrist is or will be too valuable a space to waste it on lesser capabilities than offered by an Apple (luxury) product. The most valuable real-estate on Earth!)
It looks like Jony Ive is wearing the stainless steel with the leather buckle:
I wonder if any of the Apple staff wear the gold one.
Surprised you say that. It's very clear in the video he's wearing the gold one. When not in the light it looks a little more silvery, but watch close, it's definitely gold here. Whether that's true day to day I don't know, but I'd venture to guess he does. He's at a luxury conference here, merely on PR alone, he'd be showing off the gold. He also talks rather emotionally about how much he loves their gold, he's rather proud of it.
Phil wears the Stainless Steel Space Black Link version.
The funny moments in this video were definitely anytime Marc spoke, Jony looks like he wants to murder him.
Surprised you say that. It's very clear in the video he's wearing the gold one. When not in the light it looks a little more silvery, but watch close, it's definitely gold here. Whether that's true day to day I don't know, but I'd venture to guess he does. He's at a luxury conference here, merely on PR alone, he'd be showing off the gold. He also talks rather emotionally about how much he loves their gold, he's rather proud of it.
Phil wears the Stainless Steel Space Black Link version.
The funny moments in this video were definitely anytime Marc spoke, Jony looks like he wants to murder him.
Can't watch the video yet, what does Marc say that "irks" Ive?
I was excited about the watch it had the most coolest looking desktop, or home screen, I was looking forward to playing with the OS. But when I saw the thickness of the watch in store, and held one in my hands, and I played with the bubble type interface, I wasn't impressed. But there wasn't anything really wrong with it besides being a little thick, the problem is that it acted just like my phone, it wasn't really that different of an experience, just an extension of the phone, with a few watch specific features which I would rarely use. Another revelation was the screen was too small, I felt weird because I just bought the giant screen iPhone 6 months ago because of my bad eyes and hatred for wearing eyeglasses, and now I was considering a tiny little screen that would run my iPhone? Maybe the earphones are good enough for me to do Siri. I was gonna get the sports grey with black plastic band, needless to say I'm gonna wait a while until it evolves. I hope they offer a round faced one eventually. As a stockholder I'm grateful for early adopters, and blown away by the pre-sales numbers.
Evolve to what? A smaller screen! (round) You do know, the average normal watch is thicker than this watch don't you? They may shave 2mm eventually, but not before battery improve a lot. Do you wear a modern watch currently?
As for acting like your phone. I totally disagree and I'm not sure were you got that idea by playing with it.
Surprised you say that. It's very clear in the video he's wearing the gold one. When not in the light it looks a little more silvery, but watch close, it's definitely gold here. Whether that's true day to day I don't know, but I'd venture to guess he does. He's at a luxury conference here, merely on PR alone, he'd be showing off the gold. He also talks rather emotionally about how much he loves their gold, he's rather proud of it.
Phil wears the Stainless Steel Space Black Link version.
The funny moments in this video were definitely anytime Marc spoke, Jony looks like he wants to murder him.
I didn't get that vibe. I thought it was more along the lines of being wary not to say the wrong thing. This was not a particularly friendly crowd for Apple and the hostess was clearly more interested in Apple's threat to the industry than to the quality of their product.
I didn't get that vibe. I thought it was more along the lines of being wary not to say the wrong thing. This was not a particularly friendly crowd for Apple and the hostess was clearly more interested in Apple's threat to the industry than to the quality of their product.
True. That's how I felt too. She was more in the lines of, are we in trouble like blackberry.?
I found it funny that she's apparently qualified to even talk about fashion when she looks ridiculous with a giant bald patch from sweeping her hair into that There's Something About Mary slick while wearing the most outdated clothes:
Maybe you are right …
but probably not.
While I too found those things ridiculous, I know I'm a fashion moron. I'm reminded of the scene in "The Devil Wears Prada" when Anne Hathaway's character giggles at a fashion choice and Meryl Streep's character exposes her ignorance of fashion history and design language. Long story short, these fashion folks look eccentric, but everything they wear is a statement and has a meaning. You and I don't speak that language.
Someone in this thread mentioned that celebrities wouldn't be caught dead wearing the same dress twice. Wrong again. The celebs don't own the dresses. They are dressed by fashion design folks in dresses loaned by fashion design folks. Few celebs know anything about fashion. It's a rarified atmosphere, like any academic field, and few can function competently there. Notice Jony and Marc made no attempts to make any serious fashion statement with their clothes etc. They know enough to know they don't know enough to do it. Just a fact.
They are little more than personal tastes like with everyone else. She has a habit of holding onto old clothes from decades ago and even had shoulder pads. The story her clothes tell is by association with the events she attended while wearing them, again like everyone else.
She has had the hairstyle for at least 20 years:
and the reason she gave for it was that her husband didn't like her hair up and she didn't want her hair falling in her face while she worked. There was no statement being made, it was a personal style choice. The following shows her hair down:
The following style makes her look like a homeless person:
Karl Lagerfeld and Anna Wintour are similar in that they've developed into a style and stuck with it for about 20 years:
That doesn't happen with their models. Fashion goes in cycles but it doesn't stay static like that. It seems unusual that people so involved with the flow of fashion would essentially remove themselves from it. On the other hand, sticking to a style enforces an icon such as Steve Jobs' style. It looks unusual if they wear things not in the same style:
It helps if they pick a style that stands the test of time. Fashion is entirely subjective. There are statements that are made with color and shape that are universally understood but people wouldn't wear clothes they hated to make a statement in the same way a chef wouldn't eat food they didn't like just because they knew how to cook. People can wear whatever makes them feel good but if the clothes stood out in any particular era then they'll look dated in another.
She mentioned that she doesn't like minimalist design. This is a strong element of Jony Ive's design style. The good thing with minimalism though is that it holds up over time.
They are little more than personal tastes like with everyone else. She has a habit of holding onto old clothes from decades ago and even had shoulder pads. The story her clothes tell is by association with the events she attended while wearing them, again like everyone else.
She mentioned that she doesn't like minimalist design. This is a strong element of Jony Ive's design style. The good thing with minimalism though is that it holds up over time.
Yet Apple is catering to these types. She may just be relying on personal tastes, but unlike everybody else, hers are responsible for billions of dollars in annual revenue. Minimal is great, but it doesn't guarantee sales, nor does it guarantee timelessness. This watch is plenty minimal, but it's hardly timeless (no pun intended):
To me the ?Watch already looks dated (or should I say I see the potential). And If the way Apple is sucking up to the fashion luminaries and celebrities is any indication, Apple will be working hard to ensure their watch doesn't end up looking like last seasons smart watch for the rest of its product life cycle -- this means in part catering to the whims of people like her.
I happened to see the Devil Wears Prada the other night and the scene where Merrill Streep explains how the new assistant came to be wearing a cerulean-colored sweater explains it all in a nutshell. I'm reminded of the Bondi blue iMac that permeated the computer industry for a decade beyond the few years it was in vogue. Yes Apple changes the game for most businesses into which it enters, but unless Jony Ive starts designing handbags, shoes and jackets, and sigle handedly reforms it, I seriously doubt the fashion industry is going to change their pretentious elitism for him, nor the millions who follow their fashion gurus. When they say the ?Watch is passé, it will be. And just like Apple knew when to stop making Bondi blue products, they will likewise adapt the watch to remain the relevant choice in haute couture for smart watches.
Yet Apple is catering to these types. She may just be relying on personal tastes, but unlike everybody else, hers are responsible for billions of dollars in annual revenue.
For their own style they rely on personal tastes, I expect their editorial choices to be different. Anna Wintour and Suzy Menkes are fashion critics for Vogue, they aren't fashion designers. They are like the Siskel and Ebert movie critics. The artists and designers present their work and these self-appointed critics share their feelings about them. They clearly don't apply this to themselves because how they style themselves are not styles that appear elsewhere.
Their editorial does seem to be influential, they have a few million subscribers:
It's mainly a women's fashion magazine so I expect it will have limited influence on the overall watch market. Vogue is owned by Condé Nast who Apple has dealt with in the past:
I happened to see the Devil Wears Prada the other night and the scene where Merrill Streep explains how the new assistant came to be wearing a cerulean-colored sweater explains it all in a nutshell. I'm reminded of the Bondi blue iMac that permeated the computer industry for a decade beyond the few years it was in vogue. Yes Apple changes the game for most businesses into which it enters, but unless Jony Ive starts designing handbags, shoes and jackets, and sigle handedly reforms it, I seriously doubt the fashion industry is going to change their pretentious elitism for him, nor the millions who follow their fashion gurus. When they say the ?Watch is passé, it will be. And just like Apple knew when to stop making Bondi blue products, they will likewise adapt the watch to remain the relevant choice in haute couture for smart watches.
That scene is here:
[VIDEO]
The writer of the book the movie is based on was Anna Wintour's assistant and has said that it was influenced by her experience at Vogue. This scene applies to Apple too. When people buy a Mac thinking that they've chosen the best quality product, it's really the designers and engineers at Apple who made all the hard decisions to make the buyer's decision easy.
The Watch might have a tougher time with fashion because Apple alone determines its style. With the phone, fashion publishers can talk about cases:
Perhaps they can talk about 3rd party straps eventually. For a fashion publication to suggest the ?Watch is passé, they'd have to choose something better. Apple is in a good position vs their technology competitors as they can easily manufacturer a better quality watch than them. It's possible that a Swiss manufacturer might design a watch that appeals more to the fashion crowd but then it won't be as fully featured as a smartwatch.
Keeping the design fresh is a problem for the iPhone too. The ?Watch follows the iPhone 6 design language:
which makes sense as it's an iPhone accessory. If Apple continues with the biennial iPhone design changes then I imagine the same will be true of the watch. Where do they take the iPhone 7, 8, 9, 10? Financially, the watch will be a small fraction of the income of the iPhone (likely <1/10th) so the iPhone design direction is more important.
which makes sense as it's an iPhone accessory. If Apple continues with the biennial iPhone design changes then I imagine the same will be true of the watch.
Which means the ?Car should look like this:
I don't necessarily disagree with your take on it, however, the more the iPhone stays in the pocket and the more autonomous the watch becomes, allowing it to be paired with an iPad, iPod Touch, or MacBook, the more I would expect the watch to exist as more of a fashion item independent of the anything it may currently be tethered too. That's why there must be a round watch, as well as a thinner watch, a smaller watch, and a larger watch, among the many other fashion choices designers make.
And frankly, I don't know why we haven't seen any third party fashion house strap designers discussing it in the media. Either Apple is holding back licensing this, or the fashion designers are more leery of the watch than their heavily promoted acceptance of the often custom lavish gifts Apple is pandering to them with.
Comments
Somebody pull out a chair for captain obvious, he must be exhausted.
The watch industry has its own customer base of mostly watch collectors. They make watches knowing exactly how many they will sell...the same amount they sold of the last one. Aside from being called a watch, none of that could have any less in common with ? Watch.
Really, you think most of the watch money spent out there is done by collectors? Huh! Not probable at all, because most watches are not collectable. At sub $1100, which is were Apple is mostly hitting, and were a big amount of revenues are made by watch makers, I really doubt people are collecting those things...
DO NOT SKIP!!! - This is a great presentation! All I can say is, "WOW!" and this is a must see preso for anyone interested in tech, retail and economics.
I agree, though 'WOW' hardly covers my reaction.
Maybe, this vid will explain what real watchmaking is about and why the Edition is not in the same league as a watch with real complications
When did Apple ever say it was?
Maybe, this vid will explain what real watchmaking is about and why the Edition is not in the same league as a watch with real complications
That video basically, was about working in the business of servicing/supporting expensive mechanical watches. As Ive said in his interview, not all of the watches in his nor Newson's collections are currently serviceable. Sorry, to use an outdated and inaccurate expression but one that everyone understands, 'dinosaurs'...
(What Apple is saying is that the wrist is or will be too valuable a space to waste it on lesser capabilities than offered by an Apple (luxury) product. The most valuable real-estate on Earth!)
It looks like Jony Ive is wearing the stainless steel with the leather buckle:
I wonder if any of the Apple staff wear the gold one.
Surprised you say that. It's very clear in the video he's wearing the gold one. When not in the light it looks a little more silvery, but watch close, it's definitely gold here. Whether that's true day to day I don't know, but I'd venture to guess he does. He's at a luxury conference here, merely on PR alone, he'd be showing off the gold. He also talks rather emotionally about how much he loves their gold, he's rather proud of it.
Phil wears the Stainless Steel Space Black Link version.
The funny moments in this video were definitely anytime Marc spoke, Jony looks like he wants to murder him.
Can't watch the video yet, what does Marc say that "irks" Ive?
Can't watch the video yet, what does Marc say that "irks" Ive?
Nothing, really. It's just all in the facial expression and body language, didn't look like he was up for him piping up at all.
Thanks for the link. LMAO - direct unapologetic statements that are so true!
There have been plenty remarks in that sense made by the Apple die hards
Right so never by Cook or any other Apple exec.
I was excited about the watch it had the most coolest looking desktop, or home screen, I was looking forward to playing with the OS. But when I saw the thickness of the watch in store, and held one in my hands, and I played with the bubble type interface, I wasn't impressed. But there wasn't anything really wrong with it besides being a little thick, the problem is that it acted just like my phone, it wasn't really that different of an experience, just an extension of the phone, with a few watch specific features which I would rarely use. Another revelation was the screen was too small, I felt weird because I just bought the giant screen iPhone 6 months ago because of my bad eyes and hatred for wearing eyeglasses, and now I was considering a tiny little screen that would run my iPhone? Maybe the earphones are good enough for me to do Siri. I was gonna get the sports grey with black plastic band, needless to say I'm gonna wait a while until it evolves. I hope they offer a round faced one eventually. As a stockholder I'm grateful for early adopters, and blown away by the pre-sales numbers.
Evolve to what? A smaller screen! (round) You do know, the average normal watch is thicker than this watch don't you? They may shave 2mm eventually, but not before battery improve a lot. Do you wear a modern watch currently?
As for acting like your phone. I totally disagree and I'm not sure were you got that idea by playing with it.
Surprised you say that. It's very clear in the video he's wearing the gold one. When not in the light it looks a little more silvery, but watch close, it's definitely gold here. Whether that's true day to day I don't know, but I'd venture to guess he does. He's at a luxury conference here, merely on PR alone, he'd be showing off the gold. He also talks rather emotionally about how much he loves their gold, he's rather proud of it.
Phil wears the Stainless Steel Space Black Link version.
The funny moments in this video were definitely anytime Marc spoke, Jony looks like he wants to murder him.
I didn't get that vibe. I thought it was more along the lines of being wary not to say the wrong thing. This was not a particularly friendly crowd for Apple and the hostess was clearly more interested in Apple's threat to the industry than to the quality of their product.
True. That's how I felt too. She was more in the lines of, are we in trouble like blackberry.?
Maybe you are right …
but probably not.
While I too found those things ridiculous, I know I'm a fashion moron. I'm reminded of the scene in "The Devil Wears Prada" when Anne Hathaway's character giggles at a fashion choice and Meryl Streep's character exposes her ignorance of fashion history and design language. Long story short, these fashion folks look eccentric, but everything they wear is a statement and has a meaning. You and I don't speak that language.
Someone in this thread mentioned that celebrities wouldn't be caught dead wearing the same dress twice. Wrong again. The celebs don't own the dresses. They are dressed by fashion design folks in dresses loaned by fashion design folks. Few celebs know anything about fashion. It's a rarified atmosphere, like any academic field, and few can function competently there. Notice Jony and Marc made no attempts to make any serious fashion statement with their clothes etc. They know enough to know they don't know enough to do it. Just a fact.
Suzy Menkes talks about her style choices here:
http://www.harpersbazaar.com/fashion/trends/g2757/suzy-menkes-fashion-profile-0613/?slide=1
They are little more than personal tastes like with everyone else. She has a habit of holding onto old clothes from decades ago and even had shoulder pads. The story her clothes tell is by association with the events she attended while wearing them, again like everyone else.
She has had the hairstyle for at least 20 years:
and the reason she gave for it was that her husband didn't like her hair up and she didn't want her hair falling in her face while she worked. There was no statement being made, it was a personal style choice. The following shows her hair down:
The following style makes her look like a homeless person:
Karl Lagerfeld and Anna Wintour are similar in that they've developed into a style and stuck with it for about 20 years:
That doesn't happen with their models. Fashion goes in cycles but it doesn't stay static like that. It seems unusual that people so involved with the flow of fashion would essentially remove themselves from it. On the other hand, sticking to a style enforces an icon such as Steve Jobs' style. It looks unusual if they wear things not in the same style:
It helps if they pick a style that stands the test of time. Fashion is entirely subjective. There are statements that are made with color and shape that are universally understood but people wouldn't wear clothes they hated to make a statement in the same way a chef wouldn't eat food they didn't like just because they knew how to cook. People can wear whatever makes them feel good but if the clothes stood out in any particular era then they'll look dated in another.
She mentioned that she doesn't like minimalist design. This is a strong element of Jony Ive's design style. The good thing with minimalism though is that it holds up over time.
Yet Apple is catering to these types. She may just be relying on personal tastes, but unlike everybody else, hers are responsible for billions of dollars in annual revenue. Minimal is great, but it doesn't guarantee sales, nor does it guarantee timelessness. This watch is plenty minimal, but it's hardly timeless (no pun intended):
To me the ?Watch already looks dated (or should I say I see the potential). And If the way Apple is sucking up to the fashion luminaries and celebrities is any indication, Apple will be working hard to ensure their watch doesn't end up looking like last seasons smart watch for the rest of its product life cycle -- this means in part catering to the whims of people like her.
I happened to see the Devil Wears Prada the other night and the scene where Merrill Streep explains how the new assistant came to be wearing a cerulean-colored sweater explains it all in a nutshell. I'm reminded of the Bondi blue iMac that permeated the computer industry for a decade beyond the few years it was in vogue. Yes Apple changes the game for most businesses into which it enters, but unless Jony Ive starts designing handbags, shoes and jackets, and sigle handedly reforms it, I seriously doubt the fashion industry is going to change their pretentious elitism for him, nor the millions who follow their fashion gurus. When they say the ?Watch is passé, it will be. And just like Apple knew when to stop making Bondi blue products, they will likewise adapt the watch to remain the relevant choice in haute couture for smart watches.
For their own style they rely on personal tastes, I expect their editorial choices to be different. Anna Wintour and Suzy Menkes are fashion critics for Vogue, they aren't fashion designers. They are like the Siskel and Ebert movie critics. The artists and designers present their work and these self-appointed critics share their feelings about them. They clearly don't apply this to themselves because how they style themselves are not styles that appear elsewhere.
Their editorial does seem to be influential, they have a few million subscribers:
http://www.quora.com/How-influential-is-Vogue-in-the-fashion-industry
It's mainly a women's fashion magazine so I expect it will have limited influence on the overall watch market. Vogue is owned by Condé Nast who Apple has dealt with in the past:
http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748703730804576312962784365744
That scene is here:
[VIDEO]
The writer of the book the movie is based on was Anna Wintour's assistant and has said that it was influenced by her experience at Vogue. This scene applies to Apple too. When people buy a Mac thinking that they've chosen the best quality product, it's really the designers and engineers at Apple who made all the hard decisions to make the buyer's decision easy.
The Watch might have a tougher time with fashion because Apple alone determines its style. With the phone, fashion publishers can talk about cases:
http://www.vogue.com/6109959/best-iphone-cases-gifts/
They can make money off those:
http://www.condenaststore.com/-st/iPhone-6-Cases-Prints_c225166_.htm
Perhaps they can talk about 3rd party straps eventually. For a fashion publication to suggest the ?Watch is passé, they'd have to choose something better. Apple is in a good position vs their technology competitors as they can easily manufacturer a better quality watch than them. It's possible that a Swiss manufacturer might design a watch that appeals more to the fashion crowd but then it won't be as fully featured as a smartwatch.
Keeping the design fresh is a problem for the iPhone too. The ?Watch follows the iPhone 6 design language:
which makes sense as it's an iPhone accessory. If Apple continues with the biennial iPhone design changes then I imagine the same will be true of the watch. Where do they take the iPhone 7, 8, 9, 10? Financially, the watch will be a small fraction of the income of the iPhone (likely <1/10th) so the iPhone design direction is more important.
The ?Watch follows the iPhone 6 design language:
which makes sense as it's an iPhone accessory. If Apple continues with the biennial iPhone design changes then I imagine the same will be true of the watch.
Which means the ?Car should look like this:
I don't necessarily disagree with your take on it, however, the more the iPhone stays in the pocket and the more autonomous the watch becomes, allowing it to be paired with an iPad, iPod Touch, or MacBook, the more I would expect the watch to exist as more of a fashion item independent of the anything it may currently be tethered too. That's why there must be a round watch, as well as a thinner watch, a smaller watch, and a larger watch, among the many other fashion choices designers make.
And frankly, I don't know why we haven't seen any third party fashion house strap designers discussing it in the media. Either Apple is holding back licensing this, or the fashion designers are more leery of the watch than their heavily promoted acceptance of the often custom lavish gifts Apple is pandering to them with.