Solving the mysterious failure of Apple's iPad

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  • Reply 81 of 153
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member

    It's easy to sit back and criticize. It's hard to actually do things. 
    Apple literally has billions in cash, if they can't get an iPad update out the door there is something very very wrong at the company. That is criticizm it is an evaluation of the status of the company. Something is wrong at Apple and it seems to be getting worst over time. The lack of an iPad update is a clear indication that they have their priorities screwed up.
    You can look at a company like Apple, which is making virtually all the available profits in every category they enter, and complain about how "they let some product category stagnate," but the reality is that Apple is making choices. And those choices are taking all the available profits in every category they enter. 
    Hey if Apple was running on air and didn't have the resources that would be one thing, you make the choice that likely have the best payoff. The problem is Apple isn't running on air anymore, they have the money to find a decent sized Mac engineering team.

    Sadly if rumors are true, they have siphoned off considerable talents from both the Mac and the I devices teams to support other projects. This truly sucks and doesn't leave one with a good feeling about the future of the Hardware lines. Remember these are teams that have product lines that are in fact showing sales growth overall.
    Now look at Microsoft. They too are making choices, allocating resources and talent. They are not taking most of the available profits in PCs anymore. What they're doing is not working. Zune, Kin, Windows Phone, Nokia, Surface - a string of whimpers and failures. And on top of this, Microsoft also just spent more than a year "letting" its Surface Pro 3 stagnate.
    Why does MS continue to fail? Simple a lack of vision to develop a great product.
    Except that neither company is "letting" something stagnate. They just weren't able to execute any faster. Now look at other companies: Blackberry, Amazon, Google, Samsung Mobile - they are all executing as quickly and as competently as they can. Sometimes their devices stagnate or get canceled. Sometimes they flop right out of the gate. Sometimes they release nice looking products that nobody buys.

    This is hard. But complaining is easy. 

    It isn't hard to allocate resources to make sure products remain viable! Further you don't improve a products sales potential by ignoring it. IPads are slipping sales wise, everyone knows this, but this is exactly the time to overhaul the product and keep it fresh and desirable.
  • Reply 82 of 153
    foggyhillfoggyhill Posts: 4,767member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by eightzero View Post

     

    Agreed. Each consumer will need to evaluate the value to them personally. I have a family member still running a white G5 iMac on 10.4. He gets pissed at Apple when web pages don't load, or "iChat doesn't work" or his ISP won't support SMTP. This, in his mind, is clearly Apple's problem, since it is because "Apple just did this to sell me a new computer" when all he wants is web browsing, chat, and email. "I hate touchscreen environments too." I get the point, but it is often difficult to explain why things just don't work forever. A car wears out, but consumers have different expectations of their electronics.


     

    Well, it's just not that the car wears out, it's the whole world around that changes. Right now, web pages are basically big really badly coded and inefficient programs!! That wasn't the case 15 years ago.

     

    That's like buying an average car in the 1930s and dropping it on the road right now where even the least powerful slugs accelerate much much much faster than these cars with a massive top speed with incredible handling. Traffic around also has increased 10 fold!

    That car would have difficulty even keeping up with traffic even in good driving confitions, even if it was a perfectly good 1930s cars.

  • Reply 83 of 153
    Don't report figures on iPads? That's the solution? Less transparency in corporate governance. I can see this will end well.
  • Reply 84 of 153
    kotatsu wrote: »
    "But Microsoft is now facing competition from iPad Pro, which offers a lower entry price with higher performance, tied to modern mobile app ecosystem."

    Typical fanboy BS from DED. Other reviews of the iPad Pro have criticised it precisely because it's stuck with dumbed down mobile apps. Why would a pro want mobile apps? The MS Surface can run full fat Photoshop, as well as other pro apps such as Zbrush, Maya, 3DS Max, and Substance Painter.

    Got anything else besides that tired meme?
    My dad used to scoff at PCs. He'd say "real computers" were mainframes. Real graphics pros use SGI workstations. And once upon a time, that was true. Then one day he woke up and commodity x86 PCs (in the form of rack mounted servers) were in data centers, and had replaced "professional" workstations like SGI. And clusters of them were now taking on supercomputer jobs.

    The story of iPad Pro and the 64-bit ARM is not over. It's just beginning. Mobile apps are growing and evolving rapidly. Apple is building the world as it will be. And you will witness it.
  • Reply 85 of 153
    ascii wrote: »
    dysamoria wrote: »
    Because people are irrational, the stock market is BS, and the status quo businesses are still suffering Apple's industry disruption, failing to undo or stop it, and therefore are lobbying (or whatever the term is for industry "pundits" who are historically aligned with Microsoft and Google) to blow all negative points out of all proportion, including those negatives that aren't actually negative.


    You might as well ask why people still believe in gods, magic, etc. Irrationality and entrenchment of existing power structures is not a thing that gets corrected quickly. Frankly, the stock market is a blight on humanity, so I say down with it entirely ("hiss hiss boo boo!" - I don't care).

    The stock market isn't fundamentally BS - at root, there's nothing wrong with the concept of a place where you can buy a share of companies you think will be successful. 

    Where it goes wrong is people who want to make profits in the short term instead of the long term, so they "buy the rumour, sell the fact" and try to manipulate things to cause short term fluctuations that they can profit from. Basically they are "hackers." But whereas in the computer industry we put up defenses against hackers, the finance industry seems to do nothing year after year. And likewise lobbyists are hackers of government, a place where decisions are supposed to be make by democracy.

    Couldn't agree more. There is no institution that has cumulatively created more wealth in the history of humankind. It had built many houses, funded many non-profits, sent a lot of kids to college, paid for a lot retirements, and sent a lot of taxes the government's way (every time a stock is sold for a profit or a dividend is paid).

    In my personal experience (I don't know the OP), the ones complaining about it (or have conspiracy theories) are almost always those who are either not in it (i.e., have envy for those who do) or those who lost money in it (i.e., self-doubt and regret are projected on to the market)
  • Reply 86 of 153
    kernapster wrote: »
    Don't report figures on iPads? That's the solution? Less transparency in corporate governance. I can see this will end well.

    Don't confuse voluntary disclosure with corporate governance.
  • Reply 87 of 153
    Terrific piece, as always. My summary is this: powerful mobile phones are shrinking the entire market for computer devices of all types, including PC's and tablets. And they are shrinking the market for non-Apple products more quickly. This is not only because Apple makes great products, but because Apple customers are more well off and can afford multiple devices.

    But it's really bad news for cheap tablets and cheap PC's.
  • Reply 88 of 153
    kotatsukotatsu Posts: 1,010member
    Got anything else besides that tired meme?
    My dad used to scoff at PCs. He'd say "real computers" were mainframes. Real graphics pros use SGI workstations. And once upon a time, that was true. Then one day he woke up and commodity x86 PCs (in the form of rack mounted servers) were in data centers, and had replaced "professional" workstations like SGI. And clusters of them were now taking on supercomputer jobs.

    The story of iPad Pro and the 64-bit ARM is not over. It's just beginning. Mobile apps are growing and evolving rapidly. Apple is building the world as it will be. And you will witness it.

    With tablet sales in seemingly perpetual decline and Mac sales up, the trends do not support your argument.

    Irrelevant for now anyway, there are no pro level apps for CG art (my personal field) right now, so from my point of view, comparing a "pro" iPad to a PC is idiotic and pointless.
  • Reply 89 of 153
    k2kwk2kw Posts: 2,075member
    wizard69 wrote: »


    As for iPad AIr sales, Apple didn't get a skate from me this year even though I was ready to upgrade. Expecting an upgrade and not getting it really pissed me off because I have no need for a larger iPad. I do however want to invest my money in hardware that isn't more than a year old now.
    It is just another tablet.

    .

    Totally agree. I want a new iPad Air this year and when they didn't come out with it I bought the Microsoft Surface 3 with LTE (not the Pro) and I am perfectly happy with it. If MS comes out with a LTE version Surface 4 or Surface Pro 3 next year. I will definitely upgrade. I'm surprised how much I like my kickstand - can't image getting a iPP without it. The apple keyboard looks pathetic (no backlight, no angle for typing).

    Still would have been happy with new Air with quad speakers. Maybe next year.

    iPP looks like good product for artists but I don't this it will lift sales much.
  • Reply 90 of 153
    maxitmaxit Posts: 222member

    excellent analysis .... that' why Apple isn't really worried about iPad's sales drop

  • Reply 91 of 153
    maxitmaxit Posts: 222member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Sacha View Post



    I think the reason is upgrades. Many people have iPads, they just haven't bought new ones. The iPad they have already does everything they need it to do. For example, the iPad 3 or 4 is still perfectly usable for most people. These reports only represent the people buying iPads, not the amount of people using them.

    iPad 4, perhaps, iPad 3 not at all .... it wasn't usable even at launch.

     

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by JDW View Post

     

    Yes, well, the only thing I care about is to know whether or not YouTube is still restricted to foolish 720p on the iPad Pro.  Is the "Pro" still considered a silly "mobile" device, or is it "pro"?  

     

    Honestly, it makes no sense to use iPads as a Mac replacement if they cannot be a true replacement, even for simple, stupid things like watching YouTube videos in a decent resolution such as 1080p.  YouTube has 4K videos now, for crying out loud.  And where's the FCPX Mobile edition?  Only 4K EDITING but no ability to record?  Still includes lame, outdated camera tech?  Where's the PRO?  Oh, you mean the PENCIL, which isn't included???

     

    Functionality of the iPad line means MUCH, MUCH more than silly talk about sales, either pro or con.  FUNCTIONALITY is what matters.  The only reason I am mulling a MacBook over an iPad Pro is that I remain unconvinced that the iPad (or iOS in general) has what it takes to do even simple "work" tasks.  Focusing on "what we really can do in iOS vs MacOS" would be the makings of a truly meaningful editorial!  

    It's time you, the Mac/Apple reporting media, start putting Apple to the fire on this.  They make so much money that they are getting lazy.  It's pretty much 2016 for goodness sake.  If Jobs was still alive, he'd surely be kicking their fanny hard, and not just to kick out the mythical Apple car either.  Awesome computing tech is still very much the heart of Apple, and they need to get with the program on that.  iOS today is still System 1.0 on a Macintosh 128k in comparison to OS X.  Apple needs to fix that, and fast.


     

    Are you sure YouTube limitation is imposed by Apple and not Google ?

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by CanukStorm View Post

     

    For those poster(s) that want or think that TC will released a converged OSX / iOS device, he just gave an interview today and this is what he said;

     

    http://www.independent.ie/business/technology/tim-cook-apple-wont-create-converged-macbook-and-ipad-34201986.html

     

    “We feel strongly that customers are not really looking for a converged Mac and iPad,” said Cook. “Because what that would wind up doing, or what we’re worried would happen, is that neither experience would be as good as the customer wants. So we want to make the best tablet in the world and the best Mac in the world. And putting those two together would not achieve either. You’d begin to compromise in different ways.”


    Great !

    I really don't like convergence.

    Leave the half baked solutions to M$.

  • Reply 92 of 153
    pmcdpmcd Posts: 396member
    kotatsu wrote: »
    With tablet sales in seemingly perpetual decline and Mac sales up, the trends do not support your argument.

    Irrelevant for now anyway, there are no pro level apps for CG art (my personal field) right now, so from my point of view, comparing a "pro" iPad to a PC is idiotic and pointless.

    Tablets are relatively new. Mac sales are up as desktop users moved to laptops. The iPad Pro is a new kind of device. It's not really a mobile one such as an iPhone but more like a desk iPad, whatever that is. It's too big for one handed use so I think you will see people using it will two hands and especially with the Pencil. I don't quite see the keyboard being all that interesting. Adds bulk and the stand is not really as good as the Surface products. Nevertheless, I think it will evolve greatly as a two handed, pencil desk iPad ( desk being used here to mean less mobile). The apps aren't there now but they will come. The whole pre-emptive window model of OSX and Windows isn't really needed for this type of device.

    I certainly agree that it is a bit odd to compare it to a PC. I wouldn't, but I sure wish I could afford one just to be part of the evolution of what is a very new thing.
  • Reply 93 of 153
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 9secondko View Post



    You cannot compare iPad sales to iPhone.



    It's more like Mac sales.

     

     

    The article isn't comparing them -- it's accounting for where the "missing" sales went. The article agrees with you -- there is little need to upgrade an iPad. Instead, people are buying a new iPhone with a larger screen. (Rather than, say, upgrading their iPad, while keeping their current phone longer or buying an older, smaller phone model if they do upgrade their phone.) Since since going for a larger phone increases both revenue and margin over iPads, that is a good thing for Apple.

  • Reply 94 of 153
    People don't upgrade their iPads every two years like their iPhones. The iPad 2 is still the most popular iPad and it's 4 years old.
  • Reply 95 of 153
    Great analysis. My own 2 cents is many, many more people want to buy an iPad but cannot afford one as they can afford the-tablets-that-spy-on-them. I personally know many people like my housekeeper, the waiters at my favorite restaurants, the local cops, etc. who have told me they want to buy iPads for themselves and their kids but cannot afford to. I helped one of them buy a used iPad but most of the want a new one but can't even afford the cheapest iPad mini. Just yesterday my housekeeper asked me about possible Black Friday deals for iPads and I promised to look into it for her.

    So Apple could have easily solved the "failure" by lowering prices, such as keeping iPad mini 1. People like my housekeeper are actually aware even the original mini still works great (because they got friends who could afford one).

    Given how average real income in the US have steadily declined in the past 7 or 8 years, it's high time Apple took a look at possibly serving the "masses". Not to mention the mess Europe is in. People just can't afford to buy new iPads, even though millions more want to.

    Fer Kerist's Sake, did you even browse the article. For one thing it states how Apple is not losing sales to Android, they are losing them to their own iPhone Pluses.
  • Reply 96 of 153
    eightzeroeightzero Posts: 3,069member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by foggyhill View Post

     

     

    Well, it's just not that the car wears out, it's the whole world around that changes. Right now, web pages are basically big really badly coded and inefficient programs!! That wasn't the case 15 years ago.

     

    That's like buying an average car in the 1930s and dropping it on the road right now where even the least powerful slugs accelerate much much much faster than these cars with a massive top speed with incredible handling. Traffic around also has increased 10 fold!

    That car would have difficulty even keeping up with traffic even in good driving confitions, even if it was a perfectly good 1930s cars.




    I get the analogy, but a 1930s car still gets you from A to B. Perhaps not as fast, or in the style you prefer, but there. If you own a 1930s car, and A to B is all you want, why would you buy a new car? You wouldn't...unless someone showed you the value of speed or style (or similar.)

     

    But if they quit making the fuel the 1930s car ran on, you might not be pissed at the 1930's car maker - you'd be pissed at the fuel company that stopped making the fuel. But, there will be those that blame the car manufacturer for not foreseeing the lack of fuel in the future.

     

    Life is like an analogy.

  • Reply 97 of 153
    auxioauxio Posts: 2,728member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Nevermark View Post



    But Apple's app store doesn't encourage and support deeply functional apps which are funded successfully on PCs via paid major upgrades.

     

    As someone who works in software and tried to pitch making fully functional iOS versions of desktop apps, I can say you are bang on here.  The vast majority of apps are designed to be one-hit wonders because there's very little money to be made after that initial sale (if you're a paid app).

     

    In-app purchase models are great for funding games, but don't work well for major desktop apps like word processors and other content creation tools.  People want to buy the full featured app and not have to buy add-ons.  However, once you've sold that full featured app to them, there's no way to fund upgrades year after year unless you create a whole new app each year.  Which doesn't sit well with people who already paid for the same app last year.  The only other business model is the paid subscription model (ala Adobe), which sucks because customers lose access to their apps if they don't pay their subscription.

  • Reply 98 of 153
    bluefire1bluefire1 Posts: 1,302member

    I buy a new iPhone every year. I buy a new iPad every 3-4 years. I buy a new MacBook every 3-5 years. I'll probably buy my next Apple Watch every 2-4 years. Different devices, different timetables.  Apple has a business strategy for each device and they're working out just fine. Tim Cook knows what he's doing, and Steve Jobs knew what he was doing when he made him CEO of Apple. 

  • Reply 99 of 153
    I have been involved in education for 40 years and have been using Apple products since 1983. Everyone except one other person on this thread is unaware of, or ignoring, the biggest change in the education technology market in years --- Chromebooks, Chromebooks, Chromebooks.

    Factors appealing to schools:

    [LIST]
    [*] Price - about $200 for a decent 11" Chromebook including a $28 licensing fee to Google per device.
    [*] Robust, high density wireless networks in school buildings with Gb bandwidth are becoming standard. (Federal Erate subsidies are now directly targeted at improving the network backbone in every school. Erate will pay 85% of the cost of installing a "next generation" network in a school.)
    [*] Google Classroom - not dependent on a Chromebook - but a great tool for teachers with a short learning curve to get started.
    [*]
    [*] No virus, malware, etc. and they automatically update.
    [*] Like an iPad, they have all day battery life.
    [*] Google Vault
    [/LIST]

    From Google's own data from about ten days ago, 30,000 Chromebooks per day are being activated. Since 2013, every school district in our area, except one, have become GAFE (Google Applications For Education) districts.

    The Chromebook is very easy to manage and the students' accounts are so much simpler to manage than AppleIDs in an education setting.

    Chromebooks are not just impacting iPad and tablet sales in the education market, they have greatly diminished PC and Mac sales too.
  • Reply 100 of 153
    I had an iPad 2 and upgraded to an iPad Air But I can't justify spending $1000 AUD more than every few years. Most people buy a PC for that amount and use it for 5+ years.
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