Chinese manufacturers not likely to follow Apple iPhone manufacturing migration to US

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 45
    MacProMacPro Posts: 18,142member
    Speaking of foreign policy, tech and tariffs, the Chinese pose another significant issue for Apple, given their unyielding attitude on Taiwan. TSMC and other important Taiwanese located suppliers will be caught in the crosshairs. This upheaval would have a dramatic effect on Apple. The threats are hardening and the timing could be sooner than expected.
    this to is disturbing!
    I agree.  Tim has long been known, famous in fact, for his strategic long term planning.   I have to think he has a worst case scenario strategy.  I just wonder what it is?  I wish I had one too!
    ration al
  • Reply 22 of 45
    flaneurflaneur Posts: 4,509member
    Assembling some Apple products in the US would be possible but difficult because of distance from the parts and the expertise.

    Manufacturing some parts in the US might be more likely, such as iPhone cover glass.

    But nearly the entire electronics and miniature-hardware production ecosystem, which includes the engineering and knowledge over the last 50 years, more than two generations, is in Asia. Entire industries established over entire regions and several countries do not transplant well.

    Boeing can't make 757s in Kazakstan. Apple can't make AirPods in the US. With great difficulty, some small percentage of assembly could happen here. But what Apple can only do in the US is the intellectual innovation, the engineering, of developing the products, including the software.

    Let them concentrate on that as they expand and refocus in their new headquarters.
    edited December 2016 ration al
  • Reply 23 of 45
    flaneurflaneur Posts: 4,509member
    I have an idea.  Let's force people living in New York City to drill their own oil wells and farm cattle.  Let's tell the folks in Alaska to grow their own cotton for the shirts they wear.  Somehow the common sense approach of producing where conditions are most favorable or most economically efficient eludes the emotional minds of those who demand we bring jobs here; jobs that have no advantages to being here.
    This is the correct view, stated better than I just tried to do.
    anantksundaramblastdoor
  • Reply 24 of 45
    tshapitshapi Posts: 291member
    blastdoor said:
    I think the scenario in which Apple might move manufacturing to the US is one in which they get substantial incentives to do so. 
    I don'tnecessarily agree. Time cook has already stated how answer to this question, I believe.  He said or at least it was commented on back in 12/2015 that Apple would continue to manufacture iPhone in china if the costs combined with the tarrifs proved cheaper than the alternative.

    That combined with rumors from last year where it was alleged that Apple tried to drive down component prices to maintain the same profit margin. Leads me to believe that Apple would go this route first.

     Now, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple somehow got trump to turn the tarrifs around and instead of imposing them on American companies not manufacturing in USA. Raises tarrifs on foreign competition forcing those companies to make THERE provide in USA  in order to better compete. Forcing them to invest money into America to keep costs the same. Like India for example. If you want to sell products in our country they need to be made in our country. 
  • Reply 25 of 45
    It will be interesting to see if anything comes of this...  

    First thought is Apple using CPU and memory produced in the US (Intel/Micron) and assembled in China.  There will be all kinds of loopholes that companies will exploit.

    For people entering college, they should look to automation technologies (like robotics).
  • Reply 26 of 45
    macxpress said:
    designr said:
    lkrupp said:
    Apple suppliers to moving to the U.S. would require them to figure out how to produce the same parts at the same price because Apple is certainly not going to pay more. That, of course, would require intensive automation which would limit the number of jobs created. And jobs is supposedly the object of this political game is it not? 
    It is ostensibly about job creation. But being able to say "made in America" or some other rather meaningless "mission accomplished" is the real reason.

    I surely hope Trump doesn't get anywhere near an import tariff. The effects will be terrible for Americans. If he was wise and knowledgeable about economics, trade and things like comparative advantage, he would would to unshackle international trade even more, not restrict it. Trade helps to generate wealth and prosperity. Trade restrictions do the opposite.
    Then I would like the option to freely move to any country where my skills are in demand and the cost of living, quality of life and wage ratio works in my favor
    You already have that option. Nobody is making you stay here or anywhere. 
    Sure, it IS possible to move to another country. But it's seldom easy and usually very hard. Why don't you make inquiries at the embassies of Britain, France, Germany and Japan and report back. Then you'll know.
  • Reply 27 of 45
    Nothing wrong at all with America benefitting. For too long we have sacrificed production to become largely a services economy only. 

    China doesn't want to acquiesce to our human rights laws which would benefit workers here. Nor do they want that gravy train to cease. 

    Would he be great to see all the dollars funneling OUT of the country make a return here. Then Americans can enjoy some of that gravy and much of the capital issues can be relieved (so long as foolish leaders don't wastefully spend on frivolous pet endeavors yet again). 

    Moving operations on here will foster innovation to keep the prices competitive throughout the chain. It will also provide a human rights cover legally. 

    There are many arenas to consider where cost is concerned and many to consider where human being bugs are concerned. And there are solutions. Simply "don't rock the boat" isn't one. 

    Apple let itself is an American company that has benefited since its inception from being such. 
  • Reply 28 of 45
    I have an idea.  Let's force people living in New York City to drill their own oil wells and farm cattle.  Let's tell the folks in Alaska to grow their own cotton for the shirts they wear.  Somehow the common sense approach of producing where conditions are most favorable or most economically efficient eludes the emotional minds of those who demand we bring jobs here; jobs that have no advantages to being here.
    You miss the point. The folks in New York can go elsewhere for their needs in the USA. As it's one country. Sorry to say, but You've missed the point entirely. Your analogy doesn't follow logic. 
  • Reply 29 of 45
    And by "labor cost" they really mean less profit for executives and shareholders.
  • Reply 30 of 45
    designr said:
    lkrupp said:
    Apple suppliers to moving to the U.S. would require them to figure out how to produce the same parts at the same price because Apple is certainly not going to pay more. That, of course, would require intensive automation which would limit the number of jobs created. And jobs is supposedly the object of this political game is it not? 
    It is ostensibly about job creation. But being able to say "made in America" or some other rather meaningless "mission accomplished" is the real reason.

    I surely hope Trump doesn't get anywhere near an import tariff. The effects will be terrible for Americans. If he was wise and knowledgeable about economics, trade and things like comparative advantage, he would would to unshackle international trade even more, not restrict it. Trade helps to generate wealth and prosperity. Trade restrictions do the opposite.
    Re Designr:
    "If he was wise and knowledgeable about economics, trade". 
    That seems impossible. He even make his stuff, tie, shirt, etc, oversea. All he sell is lies and lies. No wall, no deportation, keep Obamacare and no lock her up. 
    singularity
  • Reply 31 of 45
    flaneurflaneur Posts: 4,509member
    I have an idea.  Let's force people living in New York City to drill their own oil wells and farm cattle.  Let's tell the folks in Alaska to grow their own cotton for the shirts they wear.  Somehow the common sense approach of producing where conditions are most favorable or most economically efficient eludes the emotional minds of those who demand we bring jobs here; jobs that have no advantages to being here.
    You miss the point. The folks in New York can go elsewhere for their needs in the USA. As it's one country. Sorry to say, but You've missed the point entirely. Your analogy doesn't follow logic. 
    And you REALLY missed the point. It's not about nations, it's about nearness to the production sources. America dropped out of electronics manufacturing, except for chips, in the 1970s. Every little-bitty part is made on the other side of the world. Get it?
    singularity
  • Reply 32 of 45
    dewmedewme Posts: 1,992member
    Are techo widgets assembled by industrial robots in the USA better for the macro US economy and worldwide customers than techno widgets assembled by industrial robots in China or Vietnam? Either way, it's a boon for industrial robot and automation suppliers. May want to look into where the leading industrial robot manufacturers are located to get a sense of which countries are intelligently profiting from globalization in spite of the movement of certain manufacturing functions to low labor cost locations. If the US turns its focus inward and towards recreating Leave it to Beaver nostalgia, the outsourcing of manually intensive manufacturing processes to China and SE Asia will be the least of its job creation concerns. At some level, strong arming US companies into bringing job functions that were outsourced for labor cost reasons to low cost countries back into the US is admitting that the US cannot compete in the global marketplace by being smarter and more innovative. 



    apple jockey
  • Reply 33 of 45
    dewmedewme Posts: 1,992member
    tshapi said:
    blastdoor said:
    I think the scenario in which Apple might move manufacturing to the US is one in which they get substantial incentives to do so. 
    Now, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple somehow got trump to turn the tarrifs around and instead of imposing them on American companies not manufacturing in USA. Raises tarrifs on foreign competition forcing those companies to make THERE provide in USA  in order to better compete. Forcing them to invest money into America to keep costs the same. Like India for example. If you want to sell products in our country they need to be made in our country. 
    Tariffs and protectionism are totally unnecessary. Many non US manufacturers, e.g., Honda, BMW, Phillips, Hyundai, Toyota, etc., have been manufacturing in the US, some for several decades, because it's economically advantageous for these companies to build their products inside the US, both for sale in the US and for export from the US to other countries. Heck, the most "American Made" car in the US, including supplied components, parts, labor, and assembly is the Toyota Camry. Globalization can work for all parties.

    By the way, the top 5 American Made cars in the US are non US brands.

    1. Toyota Camry

    2.  Honda Accord

    3. Toyota Sienna

    4. Honda Odyssey

    5. Honda Pilot

    6. Chevrolet Traverse

    7. GMC Acadia

    8. Buick Enclave

    edited December 2016 apple jockeyhungover
  • Reply 34 of 45
    Of course they aren't moving. And any manufacturing that *is* moved to the US will be just a token (and thereby insignificant) gesture. 

    The reasons for this should be obvious by now. 
    singularity
  • Reply 35 of 45
    lkrupp said:
    Apple suppliers to moving to the U.S. would require them to figure out how to produce the same parts at the same price because Apple is certainly not going to pay more. That, of course, would require intensive automation which would limit the number of jobs created. And jobs is supposedly the object of this political game is it not? 
    Maybe Apple will pass along the reduction in corporate taxes to keep the price down.

  • Reply 36 of 45
    k2kwk2kw Posts: 1,699member
    tshapi said:
    blastdoor said:
    I think the scenario in which Apple might move manufacturing to the US is one in which they get substantial incentives to do so. 
    I don'tnecessarily agree. Time cook has already stated how answer to this question, I believe.  He said or at least it was commented on back in 12/2015 that Apple would continue to manufacture iPhone in china if the costs combined with the tarrifs proved cheaper than the alternative.

    That combined with rumors from last year where it was alleged that Apple tried to drive down component prices to maintain the same profit margin. Leads me to believe that Apple would go this route first.

     Now, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple somehow got trump to turn the tarrifs around and instead of imposing them on American companies not manufacturing in USA. Raises tarrifs on foreign competition forcing those companies to make THERE provide in USA  in order to better compete. Forcing them to invest money into America to keep costs the same. Like India for example. If you want to sell products in our country they need to be made in our country. 
    First Trump needs to build the wall on the southern Border.    It's a much more tangible symbol of his policies .    This will probably help employment for low skilled American workers.    Trump may not need to make any substantial changes in Trade policies then.
  • Reply 37 of 45
    flaneur said:
    I have an idea.  Let's force people living in New York City to drill their own oil wells and farm cattle.  Let's tell the folks in Alaska to grow their own cotton for the shirts they wear.  Somehow the common sense approach of producing where conditions are most favorable or most economically efficient eludes the emotional minds of those who demand we bring jobs here; jobs that have no advantages to being here.
    You miss the point. The folks in New York can go elsewhere for their needs in the USA. As it's one country. Sorry to say, but You've missed the point entirely. Your analogy doesn't follow logic. 
    And you REALLY missed the point. It's not about nations, it's about nearness to the production sources. America dropped out of electronics manufacturing, except for chips, in the 1970s. Every little-bitty part is made on the other side of the world. Get it?
    Actually, it's even more about comparative advantage.
  • Reply 38 of 45
    viclauyyc said:
    designr said:
    lkrupp said:
    Apple suppliers to moving to the U.S. would require them to figure out how to produce the same parts at the same price because Apple is certainly not going to pay more. That, of course, would require intensive automation which would limit the number of jobs created. And jobs is supposedly the object of this political game is it not? 
    It is ostensibly about job creation. But being able to say "made in America" or some other rather meaningless "mission accomplished" is the real reason.

    I surely hope Trump doesn't get anywhere near an import tariff. The effects will be terrible for Americans. If he was wise and knowledgeable about economics, trade and things like comparative advantage, he would would to unshackle international trade even more, not restrict it. Trade helps to generate wealth and prosperity. Trade restrictions do the opposite.
    Re Designr:
    "If he was wise and knowledgeable about economics, trade". 
    That seems impossible. He even make his stuff, tie, shirt, etc, oversea. All he sell is lies and lies. No wall, no deportation, keep Obamacare and no lock her up. 
    Not sure I follow your comment. I agree that Trump (like most politicians including both his predecessor and his previous opponent) are either generally ignore of good economic theory or simply don't care and will say whatever. The rest of your statement seems to be a rambling salad of disconnected and, at best, semi-relevant statements.
  • Reply 39 of 45
    Of course they aren't moving. And any manufacturing that *is* moved to the US will be just a token (and thereby insignificant) gesture. 

    The reasons for this should be obvious by now. 
    The Mac Pro should be clear enough evidence of that. And now, I've read, their even not 100% happy with that.
  • Reply 40 of 45
    k2kw said:
    tshapi said:
    blastdoor said:
    I think the scenario in which Apple might move manufacturing to the US is one in which they get substantial incentives to do so. 
    I don'tnecessarily agree. Time cook has already stated how answer to this question, I believe.  He said or at least it was commented on back in 12/2015 that Apple would continue to manufacture iPhone in china if the costs combined with the tarrifs proved cheaper than the alternative.

    That combined with rumors from last year where it was alleged that Apple tried to drive down component prices to maintain the same profit margin. Leads me to believe that Apple would go this route first.

     Now, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple somehow got trump to turn the tarrifs around and instead of imposing them on American companies not manufacturing in USA. Raises tarrifs on foreign competition forcing those companies to make THERE provide in USA  in order to better compete. Forcing them to invest money into America to keep costs the same. Like India for example. If you want to sell products in our country they need to be made in our country. 
    First Trump needs to build the wall on the southern Border.    It's a much more tangible symbol of his policies .    This will probably help employment for low skilled American workers.    Trump may not need to make any substantial changes in Trade policies then.
    Actually, that would be a substantial trade policy.
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