Apple's confidence, acquisitions strategy stand in the way of large takeovers

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Apple has been unable to pull off large acquisitions because it often feels it doesn't need to, but also because of its hesitant approach to the process, a report suggested on Wednesday.




The company tries to avoid risk, and is reluctant to cooperate with third-party advisers like investment banks, according to Bloomberg sources said to have worked on past Apple deals. The company is also noted to have little experience in buying and merging large businesses. Its biggest takeover was the 2014 Beats deal, costing $3 billion -- even then, a small fraction of its global cash reserves.

Instead of investment bankers appointed by a seller, Apple often prefers to talk directly to a target company's management, the sources said. It's also claimed to dictate terms in a take-it-or-leave-it manner, working on the assumption that the promise of later development support and appearing in Apple products will be attractive enough to overcome concerns.

An example of this is said to be Apple's Metaio takeover in 2015, in which the latter's bankers --appointed to negotiate -- weren't actually allowed to get involved. Metaio also accepted what its executives considered a lowball offer because of Apple's vision for its augmented reality technology.

The difficulty with direct talks is that third parties can potentially smooth over conflicts, something that may be especially important when trying to buy a company that doesn't need Apple's money.

Apple is, "probably more than most," confident in the idea that it can build things itself rather than buy them, according to Eric Risley, a managing partner at Architect Partners who has previously negotiated deals with the iPhone maker. He added that Apple is used to being able to "muscle" its way into favorable deals.

The company's acquisitions team is said to include roughly a dozen people, led by former Goldman Sachs banker Adrian Perica. Notably acquisitions are often instigated by Apple engineers, and every month product managers meet with Perica's team to point out targets with useful technology or staff.

Analysts have sometimes suggested that Apple could go after many large companies, like Tesla, Netflix, or even Disney, which currently has a $175.5 billion market cap. At one point Apple was rumored to be interested in Time Warner prior to AT&T's $85 billion deal, but talks are thought to have stopped at the preliminary level.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 24
    red oakred oak Posts: 1,104member
    Good.  I think this is exactly the right approach 
    leavingthebiggrob53tmayrandominternetpersonanantksundarampalominebadmonk
  • Reply 2 of 24
    jbdragonjbdragon Posts: 2,312member
    3 billion for Beats I thought was way to much money!!! Maybe that'll pay off, but in general why pay a bunch of money for a company if you can do it on your own and build it up on your own? Some many big company's have Google or Microsoft acquired for a lot of money where they ended up losing a bunch of money on in the end. Why should Apple fork out a bunch of money to get Netflix? Apple already gets a cut from them and others every month when people sign up to the service though Apple. How many times now have Analysts been wrong? I've lost track. Sometimes you'll be right just because the odds are in your favor more then anything. Been wrong so many times, something at some time will be right. Why wold Apple want to buy Tesla? I don't thing and never have though Apple would ever want to get into making CARS. They want to be in the center of the car, and we have CarPlay for that. Maybe they want to get into some type of system for Self Driving Cars where they sell that tech to other company's to use in their own cars. Who knows! Just because Apple has money doesn't mean they need to buy over priced company's that may or may not at some point pay off.
    red oakMacsplosionwatto_cobra
  • Reply 3 of 24
    blastdoorblastdoor Posts: 3,527member
    So I guess these people are trying to be critical, but I see it as a compliment. 

    Let's look at a sample from the long list of disastrous big takeovers:

    Compaq buys Digital
    HP buys Compaq
    Microsoft buys Nokia
    Google buys Motorola
    AOL buys Time Warner

    I would not want Apple to join that list. 

    I would much rather have Apple spend $10 billion funding the construction of a 7nm fab than $10 billion buying Twitter (or whatever). 
    red oakradarthekatrob53tundraboyMacsplosionbrucemcquadra 610watto_cobraanantksundarambadmonk
  • Reply 4 of 24
    Given the history of large acquisitions it is probably more useful to show how and when they make sense. The evidence at Google, Microsoft, et al point to most acquisitions being fantasy guesses at the future (almost universally wrong), efforts to get into new markets and business (rarely work and pretty much result in expensive write-offs), vanity projects that bigger is better, or other again almost uniformly bad examples based on arguments of synergy and complementarity. 

    Most (really almost universally) of the acquisitions and mergers would have better benefited stockholders with buy backs and dividends. 

    There is a constant drum beat that Apple is not doing enough big acquisitions shows more of a paucity of imagination by analysts to merger buyout reality and utter disregard for history and experience. Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it and analysts seem most doomed.  

    Apple and a few other companies unprecedented cash reserves reflect more on business and tax law as well as inrernational environment constraints and uncertainties. Looking at the foundations of why large cash reserves are so valuable (recall pay very low earnings) and what constrains their application to economic and business development would be a lot more useful and meaningful.   
    brucemcrandominternetpersonwatto_cobrapalominebadmonk
  • Reply 5 of 24
    tundraboytundraboy Posts: 1,908member
    This is just a a gripe piece expressing investment bankers' disappointment that Apple doesn't do much business with them on the M&A front.

    Investment bankers with their outsized opinions of themselves think that they are major contributors to the economy.  No they are not.  If the tech industry were a professional sports league, then Apple, Google, Tesla etc. are the teams, the CEOs are the coaches and investment bankers are the water boys.  They provide a service that helps the teams play better but they know nothing about the game --can't play it, can't coach it, should be easily replaced.  They are not as important or critical as they think they are and good for Apple that they know this and are treating investment banks the way they should be treated.  Like water boys not players or coaches, not even as benchwarmers.

    In fact the headline should be amended to "Apple's common sense stand in the way of large takeovers".

    edited February 2017 StrangeDayswatto_cobrabadmonk
  • Reply 6 of 24
    rob53rob53 Posts: 3,289member
    Why don't all AI writers read DED's articles, like Monday's, before making an opposite statement? Apple tries not to waste money on stupid and careless acquisitions. Apple looks st the whole picture not a night on the town view. 
    charlesgresquadra 610watto_cobraanantksundarambadmonkjony0
  • Reply 7 of 24
    radarthekatradarthekat Posts: 3,898moderator
    jbdragon said:
    3 billion for Beats I thought was way to much money!!! Maybe that'll pay off, but in general why pay a bunch of money for a company if you can do it on your own and build it up on your own? Some many big company's have Google or Microsoft acquired for a lot of money where they ended up losing a bunch of money on in the end. Why should Apple fork out a bunch of money to get Netflix? Apple already gets a cut from them and others every month when people sign up to the service though Apple. How many times now have Analysts been wrong? I've lost track. Sometimes you'll be right just because the odds are in your favor more then anything. Been wrong so many times, something at some time will be right. Why wold Apple want to buy Tesla? I don't thing and never have though Apple would ever want to get into making CARS. They want to be in the center of the car, and we have CarPlay for that. Maybe they want to get into some type of system for Self Driving Cars where they sell that tech to other company's to use in their own cars. Who knows! Just because Apple has money doesn't mean they need to buy over priced company's that may or may not at some point pay off.

    The Beats deal has likely nearly paid for itself merely on Beats hardware sales.  That's a high margin product line that Apple was acting as a distributor for, with Beats having been sold in Apple stores.  Owning Beats gets Apple those margins on every sale, including the sales through Apple stores (bricks and online) and also through every other outlet where Beats are sold, which likely include a good number of Apple reseller partners.  It's not so much a matter of Apple bringing Beats global distribution, as Beats already had that, but rather Apple profiting off every Beats hardware sale where they hadn't previously.  

    Plus the music industry talent and connections, and that talent's experience in the streaming segment.

    Plus the value of having bought those products and talent off the market, so that they can no longer be scooped up by one of Apple's adversaries.

    Not difficult at all to have justified the Beats acquisition. 
    edited February 2017 Rayz2016Rayz2016tmayStrangeDayspatchythepirateMacsplosionbrucemccaliwatto_cobraanantksundaram
  • Reply 8 of 24
    So glad to know Apple is confident and has an acquisition strategy that stand in the way of large takeovers! Following the advice of analysts would have Apple's cash filling the pockets of analysts and investment bankers while Apple would then be left less money, the possibility of write downs and more ridicule from analysts.
    radarthekatrandominternetpersonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 9 of 24
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 6,957member
    The fact that Apple doesn't want to involve investment banks is not nervousness, it's simple common sense. 
    StrangeDaysradarthekatwatto_cobraanantksundaramjony0
  • Reply 10 of 24
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 5,914member
    jbdragon said:
    3 billion for Beats I thought was way to much money!!! Maybe that'll pay off, but in general why pay a bunch of money for a company if you can do it on your own and build it up on your own? Some many big company's have Google or Microsoft acquired for a lot of money where they ended up losing a bunch of money on in the end. Why should Apple fork out a bunch of money to get Netflix? Apple already gets a cut from them and others every month when people sign up to the service though Apple. How many times now have Analysts been wrong? I've lost track. Sometimes you'll be right just because the odds are in your favor more then anything. Been wrong so many times, something at some time will be right. Why wold Apple want to buy Tesla? I don't thing and never have though Apple would ever want to get into making CARS. They want to be in the center of the car, and we have CarPlay for that. Maybe they want to get into some type of system for Self Driving Cars where they sell that tech to other company's to use in their own cars. Who knows! Just because Apple has money doesn't mean they need to buy over priced company's that may or may not at some point pay off.
    The Beats purchase was paid for many many months ago...probably a couple of years ago. The headphone sales alone would have paid for this within the next couple or so quarters after the acquisition. On top of that, Apple now has Apple Music which is far an away paid for the $3 Billion Apple paid for Beats. I think its safe to say Apple is actually making money off this purchase. Whether you (or someone else) think Apple paid too much for Beats, its more than paid for itself by now. Its a purchase that has benefited Apple. 

    Imagine if Apple bought a large company and tried to do something with it and failed, even if it had plans. Apple would never hear the end of it. I think maybe they're afraid of that. Too many times we see Microsoft, Google, etc buying these companies and failing to do anything with them. Microsoft's purchase of Nokia is a prime example. HP's acquisition of Palm is another example. Too many people have plans for Apple's money. 
    edited February 2017 StrangeDayscaliradarthekatwatto_cobrabadmonkjony0
  • Reply 11 of 24
    tundraboytundraboy Posts: 1,908member
    Following the advice of analysts would have Apple's cash filling the pockets of analysts and investment bankers while Apple would then be left less money, the possibility of write downs and more ridicule from analysts.
    Time to be reminded of the existential conundrum of analysts: If analysts are so good, they should be keeping their analyses to themselves and making money hand over fist in the stock market rather than peddling them to the gullible segment of the investing public.
    Rayz2016caliradarthekatwatto_cobra
  • Reply 12 of 24
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 5,914member
    sog35 said:
    From a purely shareholder perspective large acquisitions are almost a no lose situation.

    Look at Google, Microsoft, ect and their horrible multi-billion dollar acquisitions. Did not hurt them one bit.

    Step 1: Buy a multi-billion dollar company

    Step 2: Hype it up

    Step 3: Acquisition is a success!

    But what if it isn't successful?

    Step 4: Sell company for pennies on the dollar. Recognize loss

    Step 5: Market will ignore the loss since its a one time thing


    So I think many Wall Street pundits want Apple to make acquisitions. Even if only 1 out of 10 workout it won't hurt the stock price.

    I mean Google lost $8 billion on Motorola and Microsoft lost $7 billion on Nokia, and their stock has gone nothing but up since they sold those companies at massive losses.
    I think Apple is held to a higher standard. If something Apple does fails, it will hurt them. Everyone is waiting for Apple to fail. 
    radarthekatwatto_cobrabigpics
  • Reply 13 of 24
    jbdragon said:
    3 billion for Beats I thought was way to much money!!! Maybe that'll pay off,
    It already has. 
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 14 of 24
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 6,957member
    macxpress said:
    sog35 said:
    From a purely shareholder perspective large acquisitions are almost a no lose situation.

    Look at Google, Microsoft, ect and their horrible multi-billion dollar acquisitions. Did not hurt them one bit.

    Step 1: Buy a multi-billion dollar company

    Step 2: Hype it up

    Step 3: Acquisition is a success!

    But what if it isn't successful?

    Step 4: Sell company for pennies on the dollar. Recognize loss

    Step 5: Market will ignore the loss since its a one time thing


    So I think many Wall Street pundits want Apple to make acquisitions. Even if only 1 out of 10 workout it won't hurt the stock price.

    I mean Google lost $8 billion on Motorola and Microsoft lost $7 billion on Nokia, and their stock has gone nothing but up since they sold those companies at massive losses.
    I think Apple is held to a higher standard. If something Apple does fails, it will hurt them. Everyone is waiting for Apple to fail. 
    Bear in mind that Sog can't see the big picture while he's licking his portfolio. 
    avon b7radarthekatwatto_cobra
  • Reply 15 of 24
    maestro64maestro64 Posts: 5,043member

    It sounds like Apple Knows how to negotiate deals, they keep all the middle men out of the conversation. The worse deals are those who are negotiated by folks who are not invested in the outcome. They always say the worse negotiated deals are real estate deals since you two disinterested parties who have far less to loose negotiating on behalf of the two interested parties.

    radarthekatwatto_cobrabadmonk
  • Reply 16 of 24
    steven n.steven n. Posts: 1,229member
    Let me get this straight. Investment bankers are mad because they don't get to rip off Apple share-holders by over-inflating the price paid for acquisitions? 

    Right....
    radarthekatwatto_cobraanantksundarambadmonk
  • Reply 17 of 24
    sog35 said:
    From a purely shareholder perspective large acquisitions are almost a no lose situation.

    Look at Google, Microsoft, ect and their horrible multi-billion dollar acquisitions. Did not hurt them one bit.

    Step 1: Buy a multi-billion dollar company

    Step 2: Hype it up

    Step 3: Acquisition is a success!

    But what if it isn't successful?

    Step 4: Sell company for pennies on the dollar. Recognize loss

    Step 5: Market will ignore the loss since its a one time thing


    So I think many Wall Street pundits want Apple to make acquisitions. Even if only 1 out of 10 workout it won't hurt the stock price.

    I mean Google lost $8 billion on Motorola and Microsoft lost $7 billion on Nokia, and their stock has gone nothing but up since they sold those companies at massive losses.
    It really does annoy me how Microsoft was able to lose $7B on Nokia and Wall Street totally ignored that loss.  All Microsoft got was a much higher P/E and Satya Nadella was seen as a savior for using the cloud business to offset all those losses.  Microsoft losing its grip in the mobile business seemed like a really serious thing considering how important smartphones are to everyone.  That Microsoft/Nokia deal really destroyed a lot of lives through job losses but no one cares about that.  Considering the big stink Wall Street made about Apple acquiring Beats for $3B considering Apple's cash flow, I really don't understand why Microsoft always gets a free pass.  These genius pundits really make me sick.  I don't doubt Apple could do different things with its money but the company doesn't seem to have recently made any large acquisition mistakes.  I guess Wall Street likes companies who take big gambles for bigger rewards and Apple is somewhat conservative.  I have often wondered why Apple didn't go into the cloud business as Wall Street thinks that area is so praiseworthy and has unlimited growth potential.  Apple had been building a number of data centers but are they even being used for anything worthwhile.

    So, Amazon, Alphabet and Microsoft will get all the praise for their acquisitions and make Apple look like a lost company.  Apple with a P/E of 16 is considered a high risk based on their dependency upon the iPhone.  I guess that's just how investors are.  I suppose I shouldn't complain and just hope Apple knows what it is doing even if everyone else outside of Apple don't have faith in Apple's abilities.
    caliwatto_cobra
  • Reply 18 of 24
    brucemcbrucemc Posts: 1,541member
    One of the reasons that I like Apple the company is that they truly appear to do the "right" things.  They don't do CEO ego driven purchases, they don't acquire a large company just to "be seen to be doing something".  They don't waste company money & give it back to their owners (shareholders).  They stand up for privacy and security, but will cooperate with law enforcement within the law.  They continually strive to reduce the environmental impact of their products.  When issues arise about contracted companies (which all of the industry uses) & workplace policies, they take action.

    Sorry to all of the haters, but Apple is one of the best run large companies in the world.  And they make great products too.  If Apple really bothers you, perhaps you should look in the mirror to see the problem...
    caliradarthekatwatto_cobra
  • Reply 19 of 24
    maestro64maestro64 Posts: 5,043member
    sog35 said:
    From a purely shareholder perspective large acquisitions are almost a no lose situation.

    Look at Google, Microsoft, ect and their horrible multi-billion dollar acquisitions. Did not hurt them one bit.

    Step 1: Buy a multi-billion dollar company

    Step 2: Hype it up

    Step 3: Acquisition is a success!

    But what if it isn't successful?

    Step 4: Sell company for pennies on the dollar. Recognize loss

    Step 5: Market will ignore the loss since its a one time thing


    So I think many Wall Street pundits want Apple to make acquisitions. Even if only 1 out of 10 workout it won't hurt the stock price.

    I mean Google lost $8 billion on Motorola and Microsoft lost $7 billion on Nokia, and their stock has gone nothing but up since they sold those companies at massive losses.


    Other than the fact lots of people lost their jobs and the companies no longer exist nor does their products. You are just looking at one side of the equation. Most companies loose money these deal and take years to recover. You are just focusing on MS with Nokia, MS bought lots of companies and never return customers any value on those acquisition. MS was stagnate for years and had lots of acquisition which went no where.

    The prevailing winds on why to acquire another company is to buy market share if remove a competitor from the market place. In a couple instance it to grow the business in another direction. If a company is buying to grow market share or take out a competitor yeah most time this does not hurt the acquiring company, but they do not grow their stock price equal to the two. The sum of the two is always less then the two standing alone. Most all companies fail to grow their company by making big buys.

    watto_cobra
  • Reply 20 of 24
    mattinozmattinoz Posts: 2,448member
    Rayz2016 said:
    The fact that Apple doesn't want to involve investment banks is not nervousness, it's simple common sense. 
    Who managers the cash hoard? Sorry cash like securities

    I'd bet it's a bunch of investment bankers. 
    I think that is what the article misses. Apple have lots of capital in lots of places they can move around to get the investments they want without paying the premium of having their brand on the deal. 

    The only reason for Apple to ink the deal themselves is to bring the team in house. Why use a middle man for what is effectively a job interview?
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