You guys who are complaining about Apple being against repairs should try reading *the entire article* next time. QUOTE "Apple told Brasch it would not oppose LB67 if phones were excepted from the legislation."
Why should phones be excluded from the legislation? Is it Ok to throw a phone to dustbin ONLY because the OEM would not make the necessary component to be available for repair OR the cost of repair is same as the cost of new phone? Again, don't restrict this discussion to Apple who is relatively much better. Think about the bigger picture of electronics industry.
So if I understand this , Nebraska wants to make companies legally obliged to supply manuals and parts to unauthorised repairers? Basically let anyone repair the phone, authorised or not.
That's what it sounds like, but I might have read it incorrectly.
How would you know they know what they're doing if they're not an authorised service?
So if I understand this , Nebraska wants to make companies legally obliged to supply manuals and parts to unauthorised repairers? Basically let anyone repair the phone, authorised or not.
That's what it sounds like, but I might have read it incorrectly.
How would you know they know what they're doing if they're not an authorised service?
Yup, let anyone repair the phone, authorized or not. Think about this - why would anyone take a phone which is under warranty to unauthorized person? No, they won't. When it comes to out of warranty repair, why wouldn't a customer go to a third party if they can get the same job done at a lesser price? There are cases of OEMs refusing to repair the devices out of warranty and customer has no option but to throw the device in dustbin and get a new device. Why should that be allowed to happen - apple or not?
Fake parts from China. Fake logic boards, fake circuits with espionage backdoors, giant botnets built with home-repaired phones and computers...
If the OEMs don't provide components at a reasonable price, this is what will happen. To avoid it, make the damn original components available to the end user who needs it when his/her device needs to be repaired.
You guys who are complaining about Apple being against repairs should try reading *the entire article* next time. QUOTE "Apple told Brasch it would not oppose LB67 if phones were excepted from the legislation."
"We will not oppose this if it excludes cars" - GM "We will not oppose this if it excludes pants" - Levi's "We will not oppose this if it excludes dynamite" - ACME
To all those complaining...everyone knows what they get when they buy an Apple device. You are not forced to own a Mac or iOS device. If this bothers you so much buy something that is user repairable and upgradeable.
Fake parts from China. Fake logic boards, fake circuits with espionage backdoors, giant botnets built with home-repaired phones and computers...
If the OEMs don't provide components at a reasonable price, this is what will happen. To avoid it, make the damn original components available to the end user who needs it when his/her device needs to be repaired.
Do OEM prices matter here? The whole rationale of that repair thing is to not pay the OEM prices. That is your starting point. Whatever the OEM price is, you won't be satisfied and will always ask for "cheaper". Welcome China...
To me it’s about Apple’s reputation. Imagine tons of shitty repaired iPhones out there, “repaired” by the cheapest bidder. I broke the screen on my original iPad 2 a few years ago. I did take it to a third party repair shop. The fit and finish of the repaired screen was barely good enough. It worked but it looked crappy. And NO, it won’t lower the cost of repairs. Even if this bill passes I would never entertain the idea of letting some third party putz in a van with a magnetic sign on the side that says “Apple Repairs” touch any of my Apple products. This bill would also raise the prices of Apple products too. If the bill requires Apple to keep parts in stock for a required number of years (like the auto industry) that will be a huge expense. Supporting third parties with manuals and repair methods won’t be cheap either.
You guys who are complaining about Apple being against repairs should try reading *the entire article* next time. QUOTE "Apple told Brasch it would not oppose LB67 if phones were excepted from the legislation."
Why should the most disposable product be excepted from legislation that might reduce e-waste??
Apple has a right to protect its brand -- which includes its reputation -- from incompetents.
When people screw up a machine and then claim it doesn't work, that screws up the reputation and downgrades the brand.
You're probably not old enough to know of decades worth of businesses that specialized in post-warranty repair work, which kept lots of equipment out of landfills. The change happened not because of corporations' images suffering via post-warranty repairs (which makes no sense). The change happened because corporations wanted to increase repeat sales by eliminating repair facilities. The economy has changed not by necessity of society but by gross negligence of resources and the environment and via manipulation for greed's sake.
Fake parts from China. Fake logic boards, fake circuits with espionage backdoors, giant botnets built with home-repaired phones and computers...
What you're describing is a RESULT of companies blockading the business of legit repair companies. There used to be tons of repair businesses decades ago.
I don't follow the posters here who are claiming it's Apple's duty to provide 3rd-parties with repair manuals for all their devices. If you want to take a chance with fixing your device then go to iFixit, but this isn't something Apple should be required to supply.
What would you achieve by going to iFixit, when you don't have the parts to repair your device?
Then buy the damn part(s) you need like everyone else, or are you are suggesting that Apple is now responsible for diagnosing what's wrong with your device, too?
Nope, I am not expecting Apple/Samsung/LG/HTC/Sony/X/Y/Z companies to diagnose what's wrong with the device, if it is out of warranty. Just make the damn parts available, so that I can go to any third party shops to try my luck instead of throwing the device to dustbin because repairing the device by Apple/Samsung/X/Y/Z company would cost the same as buying a new device. That's all.
The problem is that at what point you stop at overriding what a certain company wants to do with its business? Where is a demarkation line? Make Apple sell components. Great. Customers would love that. Make them diagnose for free! Why the hell not, since you are already making them do shit that was not part of their business model anyways. Just one step further. Make them provide blue prints and e-schematics. Well, since schematics are there, why not make them install backdoors, as well? All of that is only for the greater good, you know. As usual.
Fake parts from China. Fake logic boards, fake circuits with espionage backdoors, giant botnets built with home-repaired phones and computers...
What you're describing is a RESULT of companies blockading the business of legit repair companies. There used to be tons of repair businesses decades ago.
Apple does not blockade the business of legit repair companies. They have Authorized Service Centers everywhere in the world. The proposed legislation might make service centers mandatory for every city and town but apparently their concern is not repair availability. That could be achieved easily with a mandatory service network.
Fake parts from China. Fake logic boards, fake circuits with espionage backdoors, giant botnets built with home-repaired phones and computers...
What you're describing is a RESULT of companies blockading the business of legit repair companies. There used to be tons of repair businesses decades ago.
Apple does not blockade the business of legit repair companies. They have Authorized Service Centers everywhere in the world. The proposed legislation might make service centers mandatory for every city and town but apparently their concern is not repair availability. That could be achieved easily with a mandatory service network.
Other than by favouring their own repair centres inside Apple Stores, and delaying sending components to second party repair centres. AI has reported that they've been reducing service (and upping prices) at Apple Authorised Resellers too.
I think the right to repair legalisation is a good thing. Apple's green credentials for long term use of their products is complete crap, due to the non-repairability but no one (Greenpeace) seems to care about that. Using superglue for batteries for example is completely unnecessary. Glueing iMac screens on just to shave off another 5% thickness is unnecessary. This will force Apple to allow third party repairs, quite possibly leading to a reduction in first and second party repair costs.
Fake parts from China. Fake logic boards, fake circuits with espionage backdoors, giant botnets built with home-repaired phones and computers...
If the OEMs don't provide components at a reasonable price, this is what will happen. To avoid it, make the damn original components available to the end user who needs it when his/her device needs to be repaired.
Do OEM prices matter here? The whole rationale of that repair thing is to not pay the OEM prices. That is your starting point. Whatever the OEM price is, you won't be satisfied and will always ask for "cheaper". Welcome China...
See, the problem is about choice. Choice to repair with OEM components, choice to repair with counterfeit components - It should be left to the user. Right now, the other option is NOT even available to the end users most of the times, for devices out of warranty. I am not saying close authorized repair shops and keep ONLY unauthorized repair shops. Let both options be available to the end users. Let them choose what they want to do with their device which need repair.
Apple should lose this fight and lose it hard. Right now I am sitting at a desk with: 1. An MBA2012 that Apple said needed a new logic board—the logic board needed cleaning and connectors reseating, which I did. 2. A MacPro 2008 that needed a new power supply—scavenged by me from a dead machine and now running Sierra with hacks from dosdude. 3. A 2009 iMac that had a GPU board with solder cracks under the BGA—Apple wanted $550 to replace the GPU. Since that was more than twice the value of the iMac, I pulled the GPU board and had it reflowed for $60—still going strong after 2 years. 4. An Phone 4s on its third battery and second screen that I replaced. 5. An iPhone5 on its second battery that I replaced. 6. A Time Capsule that had a dead 2 TB disk that I replaced with a 4 TB drive.
All these older pieces of Apple kit have been kept out of landfill for a few extra years. Apple brags about it solar power data centers, new HQ, etc., saving the environment, but the single biggest contribution Apple could make is to give OWNERS of their older devices access to Apple parts and manuals at reasonable prices.
For you to become very happy with what you're saying is to look at a Dutch startup: Fairphone (www.fairphone.nl). A phone that anyone can easily service, and that is - as its name says - fair for environment the rest.
I don't follow the posters here who are claiming it's Apple's duty to provide 3rd-parties with repair manuals for all their devices. If you want to take a chance with fixing your device then go to iFixit, but this isn't something Apple should be required to supply.
What would you achieve by going to iFixit, when you don't have the parts to repair your device?
Then buy the damn part(s) you need like everyone else, or are you are suggesting that Apple is now responsible for diagnosing what's wrong with your device, too?
Nope, I am not expecting Apple/Samsung/LG/HTC/Sony/X/Y/Z companies to diagnose what's wrong with the device, if it is out of warranty. Just make the damn parts available, so that I can go to any third party shops to try my luck instead of throwing the device to dustbin because repairing the device by Apple/Samsung/X/Y/Z company would cost the same as buying a new device. That's all.
The problem is that at what point you stop at overriding what a certain company wants to do with its business? Where is a demarkation line? Make Apple sell components. Great. Customers would love that. Make them diagnose for free! Why the hell not, since you are already making them do shit that was not part of their business model anyways. Just one step further. Make them provide blue prints and e-schematics. Well, since schematics are there, why not make them install backdoors, as well? All of that is only for the greater good, you know. As usual.
At what point you stop at overriding what a certain company wants to do with its business? Whatever the law of the land stipulates them to follow!!! The law does not say companies should diagnose the problems for free, so no need to do that.Is it rocket-science, as you are making it out to be? No, not really.
I would like to repeat this again and again - It is not just about Apple alone. It is about ALL companies. Reducing e-waste and making sure customers have a choice to use their devices even if the device is out of warranty. Even if the manufacturers WANT the customers to buy a new device so that they can maximize their profits without caring about environment/customer, the LAW makers have to put the interests of Environment and Customers.
So if I understand this , Nebraska wants to make companies legally obliged to supply manuals and parts to unauthorised repairers? Basically let anyone repair the phone, authorised or not.
That's what it sounds like, but I might have read it incorrectly.
How would you know they know what they're doing if they're not an authorised service?
Yup, let anyone repair the phone, authorized or not. Think about this - why would anyone take a phone which is under warranty to unauthorized person? No, they won't. When it comes to out of warranty repair, why wouldn't a customer go to a third party if they can get the same job done at a lesser price? There are cases of OEMs refusing to repair the devices out of warranty and customer has no option but to throw the device in dustbin and get a new device. Why should that be allowed to happen - apple or not?
Think about this - why would anyone take a phone which is under warranty to unauthorized person? No, they won't.
Well they might if the phone damage wasn't covered by the warranty, such as dropping it and cracking the screen.
When it comes to out of warranty repair, why wouldn't a customer go to a third party if they can get the same job done at a lesser price?
I don't think Apple is saying no to third-party repairs; they are just saying they will not supply parts to unauthorised third parties. You don't have to get the phone repaired by Apple.
OEMs refusing to repair the devices out of warranty and customer has no option but to throw the device in dustbin and get a new device. Why should that be allowed to happen - apple or not?
Again, Apple doesn't have a problem with third party repairs. It seems to be that they're concerned about their reputation if a phone gets a million hits on the internet because it was badly repaired and melts while connected to a power outlet.
I assume that's the reason because relatively speaking they don't make that much money of repairs. In fact, they'd probably make a lot more by selling parts to unauthorised third parties. But then there's the reputation thing…
Comments
Why should phones be excluded from the legislation? Is it Ok to throw a phone to dustbin ONLY because the OEM would not make the necessary component to be available for repair OR the cost of repair is same as the cost of new phone? Again, don't restrict this discussion to Apple who is relatively much better. Think about the bigger picture of electronics industry.
When people screw up a machine and then claim it doesn't work, that screws up the reputation and downgrades the brand.
That's what it sounds like, but I might have read it incorrectly.
How would you know they know what they're doing if they're not an authorised service?
If the OEMs don't provide components at a reasonable price, this is what will happen. To avoid it, make the damn original components available to the end user who needs it when his/her device needs to be repaired.
"We will not oppose this if it excludes pants" - Levi's
"We will not oppose this if it excludes dynamite" - ACME
Make them provide blue prints and e-schematics. Well, since schematics are there, why not make them install backdoors, as well? All of that is only for the greater good, you know. As usual.
I think the right to repair legalisation is a good thing. Apple's green credentials for long term use of their products is complete crap, due to the non-repairability but no one (Greenpeace) seems to care about that. Using superglue for batteries for example is completely unnecessary. Glueing iMac screens on just to shave off another 5% thickness is unnecessary. This will force Apple to allow third party repairs, quite possibly leading to a reduction in first and second party repair costs.
See, the problem is about choice. Choice to repair with OEM components, choice to repair with counterfeit components - It should be left to the user. Right now, the other option is NOT even available to the end users most of the times, for devices out of warranty. I am not saying close authorized repair shops and keep ONLY unauthorized repair shops. Let both options be available to the end users. Let them choose what they want to do with their device which need repair.
At what point you stop at overriding what a certain company wants to do with its business? Whatever the law of the land stipulates them to follow!!! The law does not say companies should diagnose the problems for free, so no need to do that.Is it rocket-science, as you are making it out to be? No, not really.
I would like to repeat this again and again - It is not just about Apple alone. It is about ALL companies. Reducing e-waste and making sure customers have a choice to use their devices even if the device is out of warranty. Even if the manufacturers WANT the customers to buy a new device so that they can maximize their profits without caring about environment/customer, the LAW makers have to put the interests of Environment and Customers.
Think about this - why would anyone take a phone which is under warranty to unauthorized person? No, they won't.
Well they might if the phone damage wasn't covered by the warranty, such as dropping it and cracking the screen.
When it comes to out of warranty repair, why wouldn't a customer go to a third party if they can get the same job done at a lesser price?
I don't think Apple is saying no to third-party repairs; they are just saying they will not supply parts to unauthorised third parties. You don't have to get the phone repaired by Apple.
OEMs refusing to repair the devices out of warranty and customer has no option but to throw the device in dustbin and get a new device. Why should that be allowed to happen - apple or not?
Again, Apple doesn't have a problem with third party repairs. It seems to be that they're concerned about their reputation if a phone gets a million hits on the internet because it was badly repaired and melts while connected to a power outlet.
I assume that's the reason because relatively speaking they don't make that much money of repairs. In fact, they'd probably make a lot more by selling parts to unauthorised third parties. But then there's the reputation thing…