Amazon announces premium touchscreen $230 Echo Show, allowing Alexa to 'show you things'

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  • Reply 101 of 153
    pepe779pepe779 Posts: 84member
    gatorguy said:
    pepe779 said:
    Soli said:
    pepe779 said:
    Soli said:
    pepe779 said:
    pepe779 said:
    pepe779 said:
    So basically this is a niche device for the kitchen. As far as connecting with parents or kids can't you do that already with your phone or tablet using FaceTime, Skype etc.?
    I would like an Apple-version of this type of device for the kitchen counter.

    A counter fixture that has a Today View for the family's events, weather info, Siri, FaceTime, etc. My house would get a lot of use out of that. In some ways, more convenient than using someone's iPad, which is what happens today.

    IMO this product I have in mind from Apple is no way shape or form similar to the Echo or Home products' use case.
    You can get a used iPad for less than $200 and a new one for under #300 and nothing prevents you from fixing it to your kitchen counter. I don't know if it's just me but this Echo Show concept is just one epic and absurd rip off.
    I think they are really on the leading edge of creating the market for an in-home artificial intelligence companion/ assistant for millions of people.
    In what way exactly? People who use their smartphones/tablets on a daily basis have absolutely no need for such dedicated (and overpriced) device. People who avoid any technology beyond their flip phones are not going to use this in any shape or form either. Most of the people who actually bought the Echo speaker only did it because of the hype, but I don't know a single person still actually using it. You call it artificial intelligence companion for your home, I call it a feature that's been separated from your smartphone/tablet and is now being sold for the price of your whole smartphone/tablet. Truly wise move Amazon, I applaud you.
    There are about 76 million Baby Boomers, and their parents are additional to that. That audience, much of which is technology averse, is what this product is attempting to target.
    Okay now you made me laugh. So if this is the target audience, how will they even discover such product exists (unless their kids buy it for them as a present)? What % of these people will actually be using it? I know my parents wouldn't, flip phones are the most they will ever be willing to accept in their lives. So I'm pretty sure this is not the primary reason Bezos & co. are developing these gimmicks.
    1) You know most people procreate and that Mother's Day (US) is right around the corner, right? My older family menbers have had Macs, iPhones, iPads, Apple TVs, Netflix, Facebook, Words with Friends app. Nest thermostats, Echos, and countless other "technologies" because of what their kids, the younger enervation, or even some usage on TV on the radio as a review, ad, or general usage in a series has piqued their interest.

    2) But you're correct that Bezos' primary reason for anything isn't your parents. From your statement, even Amazon selling books online would be a stupid idea of your parents were the target market.
    To your second point - let's look at it from the highest possible level for a moment. World's population is roughly 7.5 billion people and it is estimated that in 2017 there are approximately 2.3 billion of them owning or using a smartphone. In other words, more than two thirds of the people on this planet don't need / can't afford / don't know what a smartphone is. Now go judge my parents again if you wish, all I'm saying is there are millions upon millions of people just like my parents and no, those people will simply never buy a smartphone, let alone an overpriced one trick pony called Echo.
    And Apple is the highest valued company in the world despite only being in the hands of such a small percentage of the people—a much smaller subset than the "people on this planet don't need / can't afford / don't know what a smartphone is" category. By your statement, Apple's iPhone is pointless since it doesn't address every person on the planet, or even the majority of its inhabitants? Do you not see how ridiculous your claim is?
    Sorry, no, I don't see how what I said about the Echo devices is related to what you're now saying about Apple's market value. All I'm saying is that I don't understand who the Echo device is for and what is its added value over all the existing tablets out there, nothing more, nothing less.
    Hey, we get that you have no interest in this product and don't understand how anyone could. I suspect millions of folks will disagree with you and buy one anyway. Not getting your order won't hurt Amazon too much. 
    Fair enough, I got carried away too much, I'll shut up now.
    metalcase
  • Reply 102 of 153
    pepe779pepe779 Posts: 84member
    Soli said:
    pepe779 said:
    Soli said:
    garfong said:

    Why can't existing iPhones and iPads sit in a stand like this and do the same darned things with siri? I can't see the need for a new device as much as new functionality for existing devices. Just add the functionality to Siri and I'll buy the stand and use it with one of my older, aging iPads.

    1) You don't see why Amazon should compete with Apple because Apple is already doing it? If that's the measure then why did Apple do it when there were already products on the market?

    2) This is different, and this works better than the HW Siri gets to access from your iPhone.
    1. How exactly is Amazon competing with Apple? What did Apple do that was already on the market?
    2. What's wrong with Apple's HW in your opinion and how is the Echo "better"?
    1) Pretty much everything Apple has ever done "has already existed in some shape or form."

    2) If you don't yet understand how the microphones and speakers can make a difference in a digital personal assistance designed for microphones and speakers as the primary UI, then I don't know what I can tell you to make you understand the multiple far-field microphones and a large speaker system in a large tower make for a better experience than what is found in an already tiny iPhone that dedicates very little space to each, and I'm sure you'll tell me that Siri's mics are just as good as picking up the wake word from across a room with music blaring. :rolleyes: 
    Okay I said I'll shut up, so I'll shut up, but just one final remark to your second point - not sure how much important those quality mics are going to be at the end of the day if they're clearly going to put a lot more focus on the added screen now. So you can talk from the opposite side of the room all you want, you will eventually still need to come close to the small display to see many of the results, otherwise I'm not sure why they're even including that screen.
  • Reply 103 of 153
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,187member
    brucemc said:
    A lot of frickin' naysayers here. No one's holding a gun to anyone's head to buy this. I applaud Amazon for doing this, and pushing the envelope. This is the type of CE device that Apple should have gotten in front of, ages ago. Maybe Apple will do something similar some day (let's hope so), but it seems like a lot of 'sour grapes' to bitch and moan about someone trying to do it now.

    I can see why lots of people will get a lot out of it. That said, I am not wildly enthusiastic about its aesthetics, so it's not for me.
    Like many CE devices, I am sure that it will appeal to millions of people (though perhaps not "multiple 10s of millions).  I have no issue against anyone that wants to purchase it.  Many will enjoy it.

    That doesn't make it above criticism.  Given that this is an Apple rumour forum site, it is fair to take criticism that Apple receives and consider this new product in that light.  Some of that pertains to design, functionality, market, etc.  Apple gets no free passes (far from it...), and Amazon is a big-boy company that should be able to take it.

    As to the contention that Apple should have done this "ages ago", I don't agree.  Apple has publicly stated they take the approach of saying "no" to many ideas, and only focusing on the select few.  Apple is already selling (and has for a few years), over 200 million iPhones and iPads per year, and each one can be used for some aspects of voice assistants, playing music (natively or to speakers), voice & video calls.  Amazon is different, not having much in this area, so they could see a reason for such a device, all of which blends into their objective to drive more engagement with their retail service.

    While Amazon may have sold 10-11M Echo units, Apple has sold close to 25M Apple Watches, at higher price and believed higher margin.  Similarly AirPods are looking like a hit.  The wearables space (seems at least) holds more promise of the larger market.  So I think Apple has made the right "bet" from their perspective.  

    Will Apple bring something like this to market - meaning a speaker with voice assistant - maybe.  IMO, it only makes sense in conjunction with Apple Music, or as part of HomeKit strategy.  It is much less important than wearables IMO.
    I don't think the comparison of Apple sales is fair. That's about mindshare, and Amazon is still very new to HW, but at least they are doing it, unless MS and Google who jumped into HW by simply attaching their names to another company's product.

    If we want to say that more units are better as the sole measure as to what makes a product good, then we have to say that Samsung makes the best high-end Android-based phone. But let's compare the Echo products to the rest of the industry in this field—I only see Google Home as the only other real competitor for Amazon right now, and even that's new. Amazon came out of nowhere and found a niche with an excellent product. From day one it was a brilliant release and nearly 2.5 years later I still use my original Echo every day. I don't think they've updated the HW in the original Echo, either, only the Echo Dot has jumped to version 2.
  • Reply 104 of 153
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,187member
    pepe779 said:
    Soli said:
    pepe779 said:
    Soli said:
    garfong said:

    Why can't existing iPhones and iPads sit in a stand like this and do the same darned things with siri? I can't see the need for a new device as much as new functionality for existing devices. Just add the functionality to Siri and I'll buy the stand and use it with one of my older, aging iPads.

    1) You don't see why Amazon should compete with Apple because Apple is already doing it? If that's the measure then why did Apple do it when there were already products on the market?

    2) This is different, and this works better than the HW Siri gets to access from your iPhone.
    1. How exactly is Amazon competing with Apple? What did Apple do that was already on the market?
    2. What's wrong with Apple's HW in your opinion and how is the Echo "better"?
    1) Pretty much everything Apple has ever done "has already existed in some shape or form."

    2) If you don't yet understand how the microphones and speakers can make a difference in a digital personal assistance designed for microphones and speakers as the primary UI, then I don't know what I can tell you to make you understand the multiple far-field microphones and a large speaker system in a large tower make for a better experience than what is found in an already tiny iPhone that dedicates very little space to each, and I'm sure you'll tell me that Siri's mics are just as good as picking up the wake word from across a room with music blaring. :rolleyes: 
    Okay I said I'll shut up, so I'll shut up, but just one final remark to your second point - not sure how much important those quality mics are going to be at the end of the day if they're clearly going to put a lot more focus on the added screen now. So you can talk from the opposite side of the room all you want, you will eventually still need to come close to the small display to see many of the results, otherwise I'm not sure why they're even including that screen.
    Don't ignore the years of Echo products that have NO display. Amazon figured that out a long time ago. The display, as their video shows, just allows an extra option for the UI, but it's supplementary.
    edited May 2017
  • Reply 105 of 153
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,709member
    Soli said:
    jungmark said:
    Anyone with parents or grandparents will immediately see the appeal of having multiples of these devices.
    I don't think so. Many people have smartphones and/computers. They can video chat with those items. 
    1) And they were able to do that with PCs, which is why the iPad was doomed to fail since it wasn't a "real" computer, yet it outsells the Mac by over 2 to 1.

    2) Many owning something means there aren't many others that want something more like an appliance that is easier to use or wants additional options? I use Siri and Alexa on iDevices and Echos, respectively, but according to your statement there's no option for my use case since I could've just use Siri despite Alexa being better suited for a great many tasks.
    1. Not the same comparison. For many, the iPad replaced the PC/Mac. I don't see how this will replace anything. 

    2. Your use-case was 76 MM baby boomers that abhor technology. Why would they want another device if they have an iPhone or Android even?
  • Reply 106 of 153
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,187member
    jungmark said:
    Soli said:
    jungmark said:
    Anyone with parents or grandparents will immediately see the appeal of having multiples of these devices.
    I don't think so. Many people have smartphones and/computers. They can video chat with those items. 
    1) And they were able to do that with PCs, which is why the iPad was doomed to fail since it wasn't a "real" computer, yet it outsells the Mac by over 2 to 1.

    2) Many owning something means there aren't many others that want something more like an appliance that is easier to use or wants additional options? I use Siri and Alexa on iDevices and Echos, respectively, but according to your statement there's no option for my use case since I could've just use Siri despite Alexa being better suited for a great many tasks.
    1. Not the same comparison. For many, the iPad replaced the PC/Mac. I don't see how this will replace anything. 

    2. Your use-case was 76 MM baby boomers that abhor technology. Why would they want another device if they have an iPhone or Android even?
    1) My use case? I don't recall mentioning baby boomers.

    2) "Yes, why would you want another device if you already have an iPhone or Android phone," he says wearing his Apple Watch and typing on his Mac.
  • Reply 107 of 153
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,187member
    1) I expect the people saying that Echo is a stupid idea when you already have an iPhone and iPad that can do Siri will be jumping to buy Apple's home-based Siri device.

    2) I can see a scenario where Apple tries to find a slightly different product to market their first Siri-based appliance for the home, like having a display as the previous rumours and statements from Schiller(?) indicated, and how Amazon knowing this would try to jump in with the Echo Show in order to keep Apple out of the market they created and currently dominate.

    edited May 2017
  • Reply 108 of 153
    pepe779pepe779 Posts: 84member
    I think we all can agree on one thing at least - this new Echo Show must be the ugliest piece of tech designed and produced in this century thus far. Whatever appeal the original Echo had, this thing completely destroys it (while costing significantly more).

    No Soli, I can assure I won't buy a standalone voice assistant regardless of what company it comes from, these assistants are simply not useful enough (even on my existing devices).
  • Reply 109 of 153
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,309member
    pepe779 said:
    Soli said:
    pepe779 said:
    pepe779 said:
    pepe779 said:
    So basically this is a niche device for the kitchen. As far as connecting with parents or kids can't you do that already with your phone or tablet using FaceTime, Skype etc.?
    I would like an Apple-version of this type of device for the kitchen counter.

    A counter fixture that has a Today View for the family's events, weather info, Siri, FaceTime, etc. My house would get a lot of use out of that. In some ways, more convenient than using someone's iPad, which is what happens today.

    IMO this product I have in mind from Apple is no way shape or form similar to the Echo or Home products' use case.
    You can get a used iPad for less than $200 and a new one for under #300 and nothing prevents you from fixing it to your kitchen counter. I don't know if it's just me but this Echo Show concept is just one epic and absurd rip off.
    I think they are really on the leading edge of creating the market for an in-home artificial intelligence companion/ assistant for millions of people.
    In what way exactly? People who use their smartphones/tablets on a daily basis have absolutely no need for such dedicated (and overpriced) device. People who avoid any technology beyond their flip phones are not going to use this in any shape or form either. Most of the people who actually bought the Echo speaker only did it because of the hype, but I don't know a single person still actually using it. You call it artificial intelligence companion for your home, I call it a feature that's been separated from your smartphone/tablet and is now being sold for the price of your whole smartphone/tablet. Truly wise move Amazon, I applaud you.
    There are about 76 million Baby Boomers, and their parents are additional to that. That audience, much of which is technology averse, is what this product is attempting to target.
    Okay now you made me laugh. So if this is the target audience, how will they even discover such product exists (unless their kids buy it for them as a present)? What % of these people will actually be using it? I know my parents wouldn't, flip phones are the most they will ever be willing to accept in their lives. So I'm pretty sure this is not the primary reason Bezos & co. are developing these gimmicks.
    1) You know most people procreate and that Mother's Day (US) is right around the corner, right? My older family menbers have had Macs, iPhones, iPads, Apple TVs, Netflix, Facebook, Words with Friends app. Nest thermostats, Echos, and countless other "technologies" because of what their kids, the younger enervation, or even some usage on TV on the radio as a review, ad, or general usage in a series has piqued their interest.

    2) But you're correct that Bezos' primary reason for anything isn't your parents. From your statement, even Amazon selling books online would be a stupid idea of your parents were the target market.
    To your second point - let's look at it from the highest possible level for a moment. World's population is roughly 7.5 billion people and it is estimated that in 2017 there are approximately 2.3 billion of them owning or using a smartphone. In other words, more than two thirds of the people on this planet don't need / can't afford / don't know what a smartphone is. Now go judge my parents again if you wish, all I'm saying is there are millions upon millions of people just like my parents and no, those people will simply never buy a smartphone, let alone an overpriced one trick pony called Echo.
    It would be foolish to assume the Echo Show product remains "expensive" for a very long time, since Bezos tends to rapidly iterate and slash prices (as was done with the original models of Echo) in order to gain marketshare quickly.
  • Reply 110 of 153
    pepe779pepe779 Posts: 84member
    Soli said:
    jungmark said:
    Soli said:
    jungmark said:
    Anyone with parents or grandparents will immediately see the appeal of having multiples of these devices.
    I don't think so. Many people have smartphones and/computers. They can video chat with those items. 
    1) And they were able to do that with PCs, which is why the iPad was doomed to fail since it wasn't a "real" computer, yet it outsells the Mac by over 2 to 1.

    2) Many owning something means there aren't many others that want something more like an appliance that is easier to use or wants additional options? I use Siri and Alexa on iDevices and Echos, respectively, but according to your statement there's no option for my use case since I could've just use Siri despite Alexa being better suited for a great many tasks.
    1. Not the same comparison. For many, the iPad replaced the PC/Mac. I don't see how this will replace anything. 

    2. Your use-case was 76 MM baby boomers that abhor technology. Why would they want another device if they have an iPhone or Android even?
    1) My use case? I don't recall mentioning baby boomers.

    2) "Yes, why would you want another device if you already have an iPhone or Android phone," he says wearing his Apple Watch and typing on his Mac.
    And just for the record - I have never purchased an Apple Watch and I also do not consider getting one. Having notifications on my wrist is nice, but simply not worth the steep price. And I don't need a fitness tracker to track all the sport activities I'm doing, not much added value in that. Apple Watch is nothing more than an accessory in my opinion, so no, I'm personally not buying everything that has Apple logo on it.
  • Reply 111 of 153
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,187member
    pepe779 said:
    I think we all can agree on one thing at least - this new Echo Show must be the ugliest piece of tech designed and produced in this century thus far. Whatever appeal the original Echo had, this thing completely destroys it (while costing significantly more).
    LOL Not even close. Granted, I find nothing stunning about its design, but it's more of a "meh" than any sort recoil from its aesthetic. Let's remember that the iPod first arrived in 2001 if you want to put a pin into how far back you need to start looking for ugly CE.

    For instance, there are innumerable Nokia phones I find ugly. When they should've been trying to make a great mobile OS for the future of the smartphone, they seemed to be focusing on make as many variations of a handset wit the same SW as possible.

    Case in point, the Nokia 7600.




    And that's one example from one company. At CES I see are countless cringeworthy products.
    edited May 2017
  • Reply 112 of 153
    pepe779pepe779 Posts: 84member
    Soli said:
    pepe779 said:
    I think we all can agree on one thing at least - this new Echo Show must be the ugliest piece of tech designed and produced in this century thus far. Whatever appeal the original Echo had, this thing completely destroys it (while costing significantly more).
    LOL Not even close. Granted, I find nothing stunning about its design, but it's more of a "meh" than any sort recoil from its aesthetic. Let's remember that the iPod first arrived in 2001 if you want to put a pin into how far back you need to start looking for ugly CE.

    For instance, there are innumerable Nokia phones I find ugly. When they should've been trying to make a great mobile OS for the future of the smartphone, they seemed to be focusing on make as many variations of a handset wit the same SW as possible.

    Case in point, the Nokia 7600.




    And that's one example from one company. At CES I see are countless cringeworthy products.
    Well we can argue about each other's taste forever, but this Nokia 7600 at least looks like an interesting concept / attempt and I think it fits just fine into the trends of 2003. This Echo Show, however, looks like it was designed in 1986 :)
  • Reply 113 of 153
    mac_128mac_128 Posts: 3,449member
    pepe779 said:
    Soli said:
    pepe779 said:
    Soli said:
    garfong said:

    Why can't existing iPhones and iPads sit in a stand like this and do the same darned things with siri? I can't see the need for a new device as much as new functionality for existing devices. Just add the functionality to Siri and I'll buy the stand and use it with one of my older, aging iPads.

    1) You don't see why Amazon should compete with Apple because Apple is already doing it? If that's the measure then why did Apple do it when there were already products on the market?

    2) This is different, and this works better than the HW Siri gets to access from your iPhone.
    1. How exactly is Amazon competing with Apple? What did Apple do that was already on the market?
    2. What's wrong with Apple's HW in your opinion and how is the Echo "better"?
    1) Pretty much everything Apple has ever done "has already existed in some shape or form."

    2) If you don't yet understand how the microphones and speakers can make a difference in a digital personal assistance designed for microphones and speakers as the primary UI, then I don't know what I can tell you to make you understand the multiple far-field microphones and a large speaker system in a large tower make for a better experience than what is found in an already tiny iPhone that dedicates very little space to each, and I'm sure you'll tell me that Siri's mics are just as good as picking up the wake word from across a room with music blaring. :rolleyes: 
    Okay I said I'll shut up, so I'll shut up, but just one final remark to your second point - not sure how much important those quality mics are going to be at the end of the day if they're clearly going to put a lot more focus on the added screen now. So you can talk from the opposite side of the room all you want, you will eventually still need to come close to the small display to see many of the results, otherwise I'm not sure why they're even including that screen.
    I agree. In an Apple household, a person invoking Siri from across the room is likely to have another Apple device with a screen located much closer to them. And not only that, the Apple device will likely be mobile, rather than fixed as this Echo is. I could see this in a kitchen where Apple devices aren't typically left lying around, unlike  most other areas of the house; but then it faces competition from smart refrigerators and the like. If Apple goes this route, I see it as more of a halo device that helps pull others into the Apple ecosystem, but even then it will likely need to do more than just be a smart interface to compete with other such devices on the market.
  • Reply 114 of 153
    jbdragonjbdragon Posts: 2,149member
    kent909 said:
    Does not speak to high confidence if you discount the product with a promo upon your release announcement.
    I think they are going to sell a lot of these.
    How's that? Do you know Amazon has sold 9 Million Echo's to date!!! That's 2 years time and people think they're doing great. There were 12 million Apple Watches sold last year alone. That doesn't count the year before. I can say Hey Siri and issue all kinds of commands and it shows up on my Watch screen. Ummm, Kind of like this Echo!!!! Except I'm not locked into the room like a Echo device. My Apple Watch works outside in the front year and back yard. Someplace you'd never see a Echo. it even works away from home. It supports Homekit and so I can turn lights on/off, control the temp and so on and so on. Set a Timer, a Reminder, a Appointment, a Text, a phone call, Tell me a joke, Tell me when the Giants platy next and on and on. Umm, Just like a Echo except it's on me where I go and I can do it all without a single touch on the watch. So many really don't realize what the Apple Watch is really capable of doing. I can go on and on. Does a Echo take your Heart Rate? No! Does it know how far you've walked? No! I can't play a Youtube video on my Apple Watch, but so what, never had a reason or would want to. That's not something you would do n a Watch, you'd pull out your Smartphone for that. Sales numbers I got off Amazon. Neither Apple or Amazon release official sales numbers. but the numbers are not going to be hugely off. While the Amazon Echo is doing great for Amazon, far better then their Phone. it's still small time, even to the Apple Watch which I think is a far comparison in this market. Siri works great.
  • Reply 115 of 153
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,709member
    Soli said:
    jungmark said:
    Soli said:
    jungmark said:
    Anyone with parents or grandparents will immediately see the appeal of having multiples of these devices.
    I don't think so. Many people have smartphones and/computers. They can video chat with those items. 
    1) And they were able to do that with PCs, which is why the iPad was doomed to fail since it wasn't a "real" computer, yet it outsells the Mac by over 2 to 1.

    2) Many owning something means there aren't many others that want something more like an appliance that is easier to use or wants additional options? I use Siri and Alexa on iDevices and Echos, respectively, but according to your statement there's no option for my use case since I could've just use Siri despite Alexa being better suited for a great many tasks.
    1. Not the same comparison. For many, the iPad replaced the PC/Mac. I don't see how this will replace anything. 

    2. Your use-case was 76 MM baby boomers that abhor technology. Why would they want another device if they have an iPhone or Android even?
    1) My use case? I don't recall mentioning baby boomers.

    2) "Yes, why would you want another device if you already have an iPhone or Android phone," he says wearing his Apple Watch and typing on his Mac.
    The watch is a fitness tracker and quick notification display. My iPhone can't track my fitness if I don't have it on me. I don't have one. 

    A Mac is a computer. I play steam games on it. Store my photos and music, etc. I also don't have an iPad. 
  • Reply 116 of 153
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,187member
    jungmark said:
    Soli said:
    jungmark said:
    Soli said:
    jungmark said:
    Anyone with parents or grandparents will immediately see the appeal of having multiples of these devices.
    I don't think so. Many people have smartphones and/computers. They can video chat with those items. 
    1) And they were able to do that with PCs, which is why the iPad was doomed to fail since it wasn't a "real" computer, yet it outsells the Mac by over 2 to 1.

    2) Many owning something means there aren't many others that want something more like an appliance that is easier to use or wants additional options? I use Siri and Alexa on iDevices and Echos, respectively, but according to your statement there's no option for my use case since I could've just use Siri despite Alexa being better suited for a great many tasks.
    1. Not the same comparison. For many, the iPad replaced the PC/Mac. I don't see how this will replace anything. 

    2. Your use-case was 76 MM baby boomers that abhor technology. Why would they want another device if they have an iPhone or Android even?
    1) My use case? I don't recall mentioning baby boomers.

    2) "Yes, why would you want another device if you already have an iPhone or Android phone," he says wearing his Apple Watch and typing on his Mac.
    The watch is a fitness tracker and quick notification display. My iPhone can't track my fitness if I don't have it on me. I don't have one. 

    A Mac is a computer. I play steam games on it. Store my photos and music, etc. I also don't have an iPad. 
    That's the point, there are unique aspects for different devices, but some people make excuses as to why they shouldn't exist because they don't have a use case or because another device is good enough for their needs. I'm sure you've seen plenty of comments aganist the iPad and Watch over the years.
  • Reply 117 of 153
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,228moderator
    tzeshan said:
    This is essentially a repackaged tablet.  Who will pay $230 on such a cheap tablet?
    Yeah, you can put an iPad on a stand and do the same thing and it looks better with a bigger display:



    The mini starts at $399 now but used to be $269, used ones on eBay are cheaper or people can repurpose older ones. That would do far more than the Amazon device and is easily moved with multiple stands. A special stand could have better speakers/mics in it.

    The other Echo products are much cheaper at $49 for the Dot and $129-149 for the larger one, which is how they get more unit sales like Fitbit etc. When you have to buy multiple Echo Show units for certain things, the costs get quite high for the benefit. You'd want one in each of the kid's room, bedroom, kitchen and lounge to save running around all the time so $920. People would get more value from tablets that they can take off the stand and share for different tasks.

    A fit-for-purpose device is going to take out some of the setup headache but when they show the video chat, song playlists, online purchases, these things still have to be setup before they work. If they were setup on an iPad, they'd work the same way and the contacts, purchases, playlists work across all iOS devices.

    Apple can replace the functionality of the cheaper Echo products at a competing price using the Apple TV. Maybe they'll eventually rebrand it as a more generic hub so it can work as a router, Homekit controller, voice assistant etc and work plugged in anywhere.

    As the prices of all these products come down, people will likely have multiples of all of them but fixed-function products don't offer as good value as multipurpose ones at the higher price points.

    If the cheaper Echo products are only selling about 7m per year and start at $49 (this is similar to Apple TV unit sales), I doubt they'll manage half that at $230. There's nothing wrong with that but there always seems to be this idea that Apple has to catch up somehow when these kind of products arrive. They will outsell these products more than tenfold already with their tablets and AppleTV. To match the use cases, they just need some accessories.
  • Reply 118 of 153
    omasouomasou Posts: 22member
    pepe779 said:
    pepe779 said:
    So basically this is a niche device for the kitchen. As far as connecting with parents or kids can't you do that already with your phone or tablet using FaceTime, Skype etc.?
    I would like an Apple-version of this type of device for the kitchen counter.

    A counter fixture that has a Today View for the family's events, weather info, Siri, FaceTime, etc. My house would get a lot of use out of that. In some ways, more convenient than using someone's iPad, which is what happens today.

    IMO this product I have in mind from Apple is no way shape or form similar to the Echo or Home products' use case.
    You can get a used iPad for less than $200 and a new one for under #300 and nothing prevents you from fixing it to your kitchen counter. I don't know if it's just me but this Echo Show concept is just one epic and absurd rip off.
    I think they are really on the leading edge of creating the market for an in-home artificial intelligence companion/ assistant for millions of people.
    In what way exactly? People who use their smartphones/tablets on a daily basis have absolutely no need for such dedicated (and overpriced) device. People who avoid any technology beyond their flip phones are not going to use this in any shape or form either. Most of the people who actually bought the Echo speaker only did it because of the hype, but I don't know a single person still actually using it. You call it artificial intelligence companion for your home, I call it a feature that's been separated from your smartphone/tablet and is now being sold for the price of your whole smartphone/tablet. Truly wise move Amazon, I applaud you.
    There are about 76 million Baby Boomers, and their parents are additional to that. That audience, much of which is technology averse, is what this product is attempting to target.
    and who will set it up for those luddites?
  • Reply 119 of 153
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,187member
    Marvin said:
    tzeshan said:
    This is essentially a repackaged tablet.  Who will pay $230 on such a cheap tablet?
    Yeah, you can put an iPad on a stand and do the same thing and it looks better with a bigger display:
    How is that the same? The UI isn't designed to display information without ever being touched, and then you have the core HW not being nearly as useful in an iPad for a digital personal assistant. Put your iPad next to an Echo and try making a request across a room, then tell me which one has better mics. Now play music. Which one has better speakers? The comparison isn't even close.
    edited May 2017 gatorguymetalcase
  • Reply 120 of 153
    AI_liasAI_lias Posts: 303member
    This is a specialized device, an appliance for very specific uses. Apple fans should understand this better than anyone, since Apple does this also. Sure, you have Siri on your phone, but this thing stands with its microphones ready to hear you. That's a big difference. The same difference between connecting your laptop To your TV via AirPlay mirroring, or buying an Apple TV. These small convenience factors add up and are the difference between using the technology or not. 
    Soli
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