Read the article again, and tell me what the similarities are between these products, and how they relate to this conversation:
Macintosh IIfx Original Powerbook 3500 (G3) Twentieth Anniversary Mac PowerMac Cube iMac Pro
The only reason the iMac Pro will sell is that it's coming out before the first release of what will hopefully be an actual Mac Pro since 2012, and people need to get work done. [...]
And the iMac Pro is another inherently compromised design. There is no sane reason to put a top of the line computer in a super-thin case behind a screen. It's not portable, a 27 inch computer is not intended to be portable, put the guts in a box, give the box plenty of expansion capability and cooling.
Wrong. Loaded 5k iMacs are popular with pros because they’re fast enough and take up very little space. For us pros who work in our homes an iMac is a great choice because it’s a very clean system that takes me up very little space. My loaded iMac uses a VESA mount and floats above my desk, with no box on or under. I love this.
Craig said most of their pros are running Xcode and a great number are iMacs. So thank god you aren’t making the decisions over there.
Until Craig puts some absolute numbers on the table his claims are very much open to speculation which could swing wildly in either direction.
More of your pointless BS about needing absolute numbers that nobody provides. Most pros means anything over 50%. There is no direction to swing.
I doubt many Pros give much importance to boxes vs AIO but given the choice I bet many would prefer to separate the screen and the rest of the machine. Especially, as to expand on the AIO, it has to be external anyway which involves 'clutter' (which again, most pros are happy with as the clutter of today is not the clutter of yesteryear).
Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?
To support my point, I wonder how many Pros (not just developers) would opt for something to this over an iMac? https://www.tomsguide.com/us/dell-xps-tower,review-4499.html I'm not talking about the innards, just the styling, overall size and upgrade options. If Apple had taken that ball and ran with it, many people, not just pros, would have jumped on it for way under $2,000. That will never happen with this Apple because it would likely chop the legs off the iMac line but that has little to do with satisfying users' preferences and everything to do with Apple wanting to keep revenues up. I think Apple should be trying to reach both goals in every segment.
Not one developer picked that Dell where I work and we can pick whatever machines we want up to a certain price. Zero. There are a handful of dell workstations running linux and a few Alienwares. The rest were split between Dell laptops and Macs (mostly MBPs with some iMacs). Yes, we mostly have Dell and Apple because the corporate discount allows the budget to go further when spec'ing your machine. The video and media folks are running with iMacs or Mac Pros.
Amusingly, not one developer over 30 was running Windows...they all were running Linux or OS X. IT did a survey and published the results.
That is also a really ugly machine in my opinion.
You miss the point again.
I hope you realise I was countering someone else's point who used Craig's words to 'support' numbers (or in his words, 'great number') that nobody has. Not 'most of'.
Yes. I know that. You know that. Everybody on the outside knows that. That makes his words open to interpretation. Very open. But that's by the by, the point was a different one.
As for your Dell comments. I made no reference to Mac users, or any other users for that matter, choosing Dell over Macs. I was saying that if a machine similarto the Dell were made byApple then I'm sure that many would opt for it instead of an AIO.
What happens where you work has no bearing whatsoever on what I am saying.
"Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?"
Unlike for Craig's comments, absolute numbers do not exist because the hypothetical machine I am talking about does not exist and that, ironically, was part of what I was getting at.
I've been buying Macs and iPhones since the first ones the first ones were released. They have always been more pricey than their windows or android counterparts. US$1200 however is considerablably more everywhere else in the world. Where I live for example a $1200 iPhone would be a $2000 iPhone. That is priced completely out of my range for a phone... no matter how amazing it is. Let's be honest here, the new screen and wireless charging are not exactly new and innovative. I think they need to be extremely careful not to price themselves so premium that no one but the 1% can buy their phones outside of the U.S. The rest of the world is Apple's biggest market.
You act as if the 7s wouldn’t still be priced the same.
Read the article again, and tell me what the similarities are between these products, and how they relate to this conversation:
Macintosh IIfx Original Powerbook 3500 (G3) Twentieth Anniversary Mac PowerMac Cube iMac Pro
The only reason the iMac Pro will sell is that it's coming out before the first release of what will hopefully be an actual Mac Pro since 2012, and people need to get work done. [...]
And the iMac Pro is another inherently compromised design. There is no sane reason to put a top of the line computer in a super-thin case behind a screen. It's not portable, a 27 inch computer is not intended to be portable, put the guts in a box, give the box plenty of expansion capability and cooling.
Wrong. Loaded 5k iMacs are popular with pros because they’re fast enough and take up very little space. For us pros who work in our homes an iMac is a great choice because it’s a very clean system that takes me up very little space. My loaded iMac uses a VESA mount and floats above my desk, with no box on or under. I love this.
Craig said most of their pros are running Xcode and a great number are iMacs. So thank god you aren’t making the decisions over there.
Until Craig puts some absolute numbers on the table his claims are very much open to speculation which could swing wildly in either direction.
More of your pointless BS about needing absolute numbers that nobody provides. Most pros means anything over 50%. There is no direction to swing.
I doubt many Pros give much importance to boxes vs AIO but given the choice I bet many would prefer to separate the screen and the rest of the machine. Especially, as to expand on the AIO, it has to be external anyway which involves 'clutter' (which again, most pros are happy with as the clutter of today is not the clutter of yesteryear).
Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?
To support my point, I wonder how many Pros (not just developers) would opt for something to this over an iMac? https://www.tomsguide.com/us/dell-xps-tower,review-4499.html I'm not talking about the innards, just the styling, overall size and upgrade options. If Apple had taken that ball and ran with it, many people, not just pros, would have jumped on it for way under $2,000. That will never happen with this Apple because it would likely chop the legs off the iMac line but that has little to do with satisfying users' preferences and everything to do with Apple wanting to keep revenues up. I think Apple should be trying to reach both goals in every segment.
Not one developer picked that Dell where I work and we can pick whatever machines we want up to a certain price. Zero. There are a handful of dell workstations running linux and a few Alienwares. The rest were split between Dell laptops and Macs (mostly MBPs with some iMacs). Yes, we mostly have Dell and Apple because the corporate discount allows the budget to go further when spec'ing your machine. The video and media folks are running with iMacs or Mac Pros.
Amusingly, not one developer over 30 was running Windows...they all were running Linux or OS X. IT did a survey and published the results.
That is also a really ugly machine in my opinion.
You miss the point again.
I hope you realise I was countering someone else's point who used Craig's words to 'support' numbers (or in his words, 'great number') that nobody has. Not 'most of'.
Yes. I know that. You know that. Everybody on the outside knows that. That makes his words open to interpretation. Very open. But that's by the by, the point was a different one.
As for your Dell comments. I made no reference to Mac users, or any other users for that matter, choosing Dell over Macs. I was saying that if a machine similarto the Dell were made byApple then I'm sure that many would opt for it instead of an AIO.
What happens where you work has no bearing whatsoever on what I am saying.
"Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?"
Unlike for Craig's comments, absolute numbers do not exist because the hypothetical machine I am talking about does not exist and that, ironically, was part of what I was getting at.
Pure nonsense on your part. Apple isn’t going to disclose their numbers but the mere fact that highly public execs said it during a special media event means it’s true. They can’t lie about this, theyre a public company. So stop playing word games and trying to dance around a fact that doesn’t fit your narrative.
There’s absolutely no doubting or dancing – most of Apple pro customers run Xcode. Most of them run it on MBPs and iMacs, not MPs, which is why they’re building the iMac Pro. I have no idea why this makes life difficult for you.
And don't forget RED's phone will be $1300 and $1600, so it's not like Apple is the first to go to these kind of price points.
How much do you want to bet that Apple mentions RED and their phone's price at the iPhone announcement keynote before saying the iPhone 7S costs what it has always cost?
Pricing for the '8' phone is irrelevant as long as there are improved 7 series phones introduced along with it. If they will only be available initially in lower quantities, a high price won't hurt Apple.
Will it hurt users? Create resentment that the star new features are sitting up on a perch they can't reach? The users will decide on that.
I jumped ship when iPhones became unaffordable for me and the competition gave me more than I really needed for 250€ with some features that the iPhone still doesn't have.
My next phone will be a little more expensive and in the so called 'affordable premium' range. It won't be an iPhone.
I also think the upcoming 'star' phone won't be called iPhone 8. My wife wants one but it all depends on the price. Anything over 800€ is a no go.
And don't forget RED's phone will be $1300 and $1600, so it's not like Apple is the first to go to these kind of price points.
How much do you want to bet that Apple mentions RED and their phone's price at the iPhone announcement keynote before saying the iPhone 7S costs what it has always cost?
1) Is there any previous example of Apple ever comparing itself to a non-player in a market with no shipping product during an event?
2) Why do people call a single, one-off event a keynote when it comes to Apple? This makes sense when it's the first event at WWDC or the old MacWorld conference.
Read the article again, and tell me what the similarities are between these products, and how they relate to this conversation:
Macintosh IIfx Original Powerbook 3500 (G3) Twentieth Anniversary Mac PowerMac Cube iMac Pro
The only reason the iMac Pro will sell is that it's coming out before the first release of what will hopefully be an actual Mac Pro since 2012, and people need to get work done. [...]
And the iMac Pro is another inherently compromised design. There is no sane reason to put a top of the line computer in a super-thin case behind a screen. It's not portable, a 27 inch computer is not intended to be portable, put the guts in a box, give the box plenty of expansion capability and cooling.
Wrong. Loaded 5k iMacs are popular with pros because they’re fast enough and take up very little space. For us pros who work in our homes an iMac is a great choice because it’s a very clean system that takes me up very little space. My loaded iMac uses a VESA mount and floats above my desk, with no box on or under. I love this.
Craig said most of their pros are running Xcode and a great number are iMacs. So thank god you aren’t making the decisions over there.
Until Craig puts some absolute numbers on the table his claims are very much open to speculation which could swing wildly in either direction.
More of your pointless BS about needing absolute numbers that nobody provides. Most pros means anything over 50%. There is no direction to swing.
I doubt many Pros give much importance to boxes vs AIO but given the choice I bet many would prefer to separate the screen and the rest of the machine. Especially, as to expand on the AIO, it has to be external anyway which involves 'clutter' (which again, most pros are happy with as the clutter of today is not the clutter of yesteryear).
Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?
To support my point, I wonder how many Pros (not just developers) would opt for something to this over an iMac? https://www.tomsguide.com/us/dell-xps-tower,review-4499.html I'm not talking about the innards, just the styling, overall size and upgrade options. If Apple had taken that ball and ran with it, many people, not just pros, would have jumped on it for way under $2,000. That will never happen with this Apple because it would likely chop the legs off the iMac line but that has little to do with satisfying users' preferences and everything to do with Apple wanting to keep revenues up. I think Apple should be trying to reach both goals in every segment.
Not one developer picked that Dell where I work and we can pick whatever machines we want up to a certain price. Zero. There are a handful of dell workstations running linux and a few Alienwares. The rest were split between Dell laptops and Macs (mostly MBPs with some iMacs). Yes, we mostly have Dell and Apple because the corporate discount allows the budget to go further when spec'ing your machine. The video and media folks are running with iMacs or Mac Pros.
Amusingly, not one developer over 30 was running Windows...they all were running Linux or OS X. IT did a survey and published the results.
That is also a really ugly machine in my opinion.
You miss the point again.
I hope you realise I was countering someone else's point who used Craig's words to 'support' numbers (or in his words, 'great number') that nobody has. Not 'most of'.
Yes. I know that. You know that. Everybody on the outside knows that. That makes his words open to interpretation. Very open. But that's by the by, the point was a different one.
As for your Dell comments. I made no reference to Mac users, or any other users for that matter, choosing Dell over Macs. I was saying that if a machine similarto the Dell were made byApple then I'm sure that many would opt for it instead of an AIO.
What happens where you work has no bearing whatsoever on what I am saying.
"Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?"
Unlike for Craig's comments, absolute numbers do not exist because the hypothetical machine I am talking about does not exist and that, ironically, was part of what I was getting at.
Pure nonsense on your part. Apple isn’t going to disclose their numbers but the mere fact that highly public execs said it during a special media event means it’s true. They can’t lie about this, theyre a public company. So stop playing word games and trying to dance around a fact that doesn’t fit your narrative.
There’s absolutely no doubting or dancing – most of Apple pro customers run Xcode. Most of them run it on MBPs and iMacs, not MPs, which is why they’re building the iMac Pro. I have no idea why this makes life difficult for you.
Read the article again, and tell me what the similarities are between these products, and how they relate to this conversation:
Macintosh IIfx Original Powerbook 3500 (G3) Twentieth Anniversary Mac PowerMac Cube iMac Pro
The only reason the iMac Pro will sell is that it's coming out before the first release of what will hopefully be an actual Mac Pro since 2012, and people need to get work done. [...]
And the iMac Pro is another inherently compromised design. There is no sane reason to put a top of the line computer in a super-thin case behind a screen. It's not portable, a 27 inch computer is not intended to be portable, put the guts in a box, give the box plenty of expansion capability and cooling.
Wrong. Loaded 5k iMacs are popular with pros because they’re fast enough and take up very little space. For us pros who work in our homes an iMac is a great choice because it’s a very clean system that takes me up very little space. My loaded iMac uses a VESA mount and floats above my desk, with no box on or under. I love this.
Craig said most of their pros are running Xcode and a great number are iMacs. So thank god you aren’t making the decisions over there.
Until Craig puts some absolute numbers on the table his claims are very much open to speculation which could swing wildly in either direction.
More of your pointless BS about needing absolute numbers that nobody provides. Most pros means anything over 50%. There is no direction to swing.
I doubt many Pros give much importance to boxes vs AIO but given the choice I bet many would prefer to separate the screen and the rest of the machine. Especially, as to expand on the AIO, it has to be external anyway which involves 'clutter' (which again, most pros are happy with as the clutter of today is not the clutter of yesteryear).
Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?
To support my point, I wonder how many Pros (not just developers) would opt for something to this over an iMac? https://www.tomsguide.com/us/dell-xps-tower,review-4499.html I'm not talking about the innards, just the styling, overall size and upgrade options. If Apple had taken that ball and ran with it, many people, not just pros, would have jumped on it for way under $2,000. That will never happen with this Apple because it would likely chop the legs off the iMac line but that has little to do with satisfying users' preferences and everything to do with Apple wanting to keep revenues up. I think Apple should be trying to reach both goals in every segment.
Not one developer picked that Dell where I work and we can pick whatever machines we want up to a certain price. Zero. There are a handful of dell workstations running linux and a few Alienwares. The rest were split between Dell laptops and Macs (mostly MBPs with some iMacs). Yes, we mostly have Dell and Apple because the corporate discount allows the budget to go further when spec'ing your machine. The video and media folks are running with iMacs or Mac Pros.
Amusingly, not one developer over 30 was running Windows...they all were running Linux or OS X. IT did a survey and published the results.
That is also a really ugly machine in my opinion.
You miss the point again.
I hope you realise I was countering someone else's point who used Craig's words to 'support' numbers (or in his words, 'great number') that nobody has. Not 'most of'.
Yes. I know that. You know that. Everybody on the outside knows that. That makes his words open to interpretation. Very open. But that's by the by, the point was a different one.
As for your Dell comments. I made no reference to Mac users, or any other users for that matter, choosing Dell over Macs. I was saying that if a machine similarto the Dell were made byApple then I'm sure that many would opt for it instead of an AIO.
What happens where you work has no bearing whatsoever on what I am saying.
"Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?"
Unlike for Craig's comments, absolute numbers do not exist because the hypothetical machine I am talking about does not exist and that, ironically, was part of what I was getting at.
Pure nonsense on your part. Apple isn’t going to disclose their numbers but the mere fact that highly public execs said it during a special media event means it’s true. They can’t lie about this, theyre a public company. So stop playing word games and trying to dance around a fact that doesn’t fit your narrative.
There’s absolutely no doubting or dancing – most of Apple pro customers run Xcode. Most of them run it on MBPs and iMacs, not MPs, which is why they’re building the iMac Pro. I have no idea why this makes life difficult for you.
Nonsense? No. The absolute opposite in fact.
'Lies' don't even come into it. Nor does Apple having to release absolute numbers.
I don't even know why you bring that up.
Answer this question honestly. Given the option of an equivalent, Apple designed box in the same vein as the Dell I mentioned, with great ugradeability and without the Apple screen bolted onto it, do you really think most Pro users would skip over that option and opt for the fully loaded iMac?
My point was that I don't think they would. My point was that I think it would be a huge seller. My point was that Apple is fully aware of this and that is why such a machine does not exist.
'Lies', truth etc are irrelevant. When Apple gives media presentations you get facts and marketing, politics and passion all rolled into the same enchilada and, more often than not, unless some cold, hard numbers are put on the table, the viewer has to interpret the rest. Of course this includes taking words like 'magical' very lightly indeed.
Pricing for the '8' phone is irrelevant as long as there are improved 7 series phones introduced along with it. If they will only be available initially in lower quantities, a high price won't hurt Apple.
Will it hurt users? Create resentment that the star new features are sitting up on a perch they can't reach? The users will decide on that.
I jumped ship when iPhones became unaffordable for me and the competition gave me more than I really needed for 250€ with some features that the iPhone still doesn't have.
My next phone will be a little more expensive and in the so called 'affordable premium' range. It won't be an iPhone.
I also think the upcoming 'star' phone won't be called iPhone 8. My wife wants one but it all depends on the price. Anything over 800€ is a no go.
If my wife would want one she would get one.
. LOL. I wish I could give her two but that exceeds my limit these days.
Those prices are just crazy. Apple will be pricing themselves right out of the market if this rumor is true. If Apple is going to release a so called iPhone 7s and 7s Plus and a iPhone 8, well then the iPhone 7s and 7s Plus are already outdated!!! The 8 is over priced, and I'd stick with my iPhone 6 for a 4th year.
I don't think anyone really thinks it will be called "iPhone 8" that would position it as a successor to the 7s.
The new premium tier will likely be called iPhone Pro or iPhone Edition.
It will be priced out of the market. Apple might sell one of these for every 6 lower tier iPhones. And the point is that this is all they will be able to manufacture.
It will cost $1200 - $1500 and after 9 months there will still be a 4-6 week shipping delay for new orders.
This is a prescient post!
IMO, the Pro/Edition iPhone will have better hardware, 3D camera, motion sensors. RAM, SSD, maybe new A11 APU/GPU capabilities – to exploit the software capabilities added in iOS 11.
Apple may not even call it an iPhone – nobody makes phone calls anymore!
Read the article again, and tell me what the similarities are between these products, and how they relate to this conversation:
Macintosh IIfx Original Powerbook 3500 (G3) Twentieth Anniversary Mac PowerMac Cube iMac Pro
The only reason the iMac Pro will sell is that it's coming out before the first release of what will hopefully be an actual Mac Pro since 2012, and people need to get work done. [...]
And the iMac Pro is another inherently compromised design. There is no sane reason to put a top of the line computer in a super-thin case behind a screen. It's not portable, a 27 inch computer is not intended to be portable, put the guts in a box, give the box plenty of expansion capability and cooling.
Wrong. Loaded 5k iMacs are popular with pros because they’re fast enough and take up very little space. For us pros who work in our homes an iMac is a great choice because it’s a very clean system that takes me up very little space. My loaded iMac uses a VESA mount and floats above my desk, with no box on or under. I love this.
Craig said most of their pros are running Xcode and a great number are iMacs. So thank god you aren’t making the decisions over there.
Until Craig puts some absolute numbers on the table his claims are very much open to speculation which could swing wildly in either direction.
More of your pointless BS about needing absolute numbers that nobody provides. Most pros means anything over 50%. There is no direction to swing.
I doubt many Pros give much importance to boxes vs AIO but given the choice I bet many would prefer to separate the screen and the rest of the machine. Especially, as to expand on the AIO, it has to be external anyway which involves 'clutter' (which again, most pros are happy with as the clutter of today is not the clutter of yesteryear).
Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?
To support my point, I wonder how many Pros (not just developers) would opt for something to this over an iMac? https://www.tomsguide.com/us/dell-xps-tower,review-4499.html I'm not talking about the innards, just the styling, overall size and upgrade options. If Apple had taken that ball and ran with it, many people, not just pros, would have jumped on it for way under $2,000. That will never happen with this Apple because it would likely chop the legs off the iMac line but that has little to do with satisfying users' preferences and everything to do with Apple wanting to keep revenues up. I think Apple should be trying to reach both goals in every segment.
Not one developer picked that Dell where I work and we can pick whatever machines we want up to a certain price. Zero. There are a handful of dell workstations running linux and a few Alienwares. The rest were split between Dell laptops and Macs (mostly MBPs with some iMacs). Yes, we mostly have Dell and Apple because the corporate discount allows the budget to go further when spec'ing your machine. The video and media folks are running with iMacs or Mac Pros.
Amusingly, not one developer over 30 was running Windows...they all were running Linux or OS X. IT did a survey and published the results.
That is also a really ugly machine in my opinion.
You miss the point again.
I hope you realise I was countering someone else's point who used Craig's words to 'support' numbers (or in his words, 'great number') that nobody has. Not 'most of'.
Yes. I know that. You know that. Everybody on the outside knows that. That makes his words open to interpretation. Very open. But that's by the by, the point was a different one.
As for your Dell comments. I made no reference to Mac users, or any other users for that matter, choosing Dell over Macs. I was saying that if a machine similarto the Dell were made byApple then I'm sure that many would opt for it instead of an AIO.
What happens where you work has no bearing whatsoever on what I am saying.
"Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?"
Unlike for Craig's comments, absolute numbers do not exist because the hypothetical machine I am talking about does not exist and that, ironically, was part of what I was getting at.
Pure nonsense on your part. Apple isn’t going to disclose their numbers but the mere fact that highly public execs said it during a special media event means it’s true. They can’t lie about this, theyre a public company. So stop playing word games and trying to dance around a fact that doesn’t fit your narrative.
There’s absolutely no doubting or dancing – most of Apple pro customers run Xcode. Most of them run it on MBPs and iMacs, not MPs, which is why they’re building the iMac Pro. I have no idea why this makes life difficult for you.
Read the article again, and tell me what the similarities are between these products, and how they relate to this conversation:
Macintosh IIfx Original Powerbook 3500 (G3) Twentieth Anniversary Mac PowerMac Cube iMac Pro
The only reason the iMac Pro will sell is that it's coming out before the first release of what will hopefully be an actual Mac Pro since 2012, and people need to get work done. [...]
And the iMac Pro is another inherently compromised design. There is no sane reason to put a top of the line computer in a super-thin case behind a screen. It's not portable, a 27 inch computer is not intended to be portable, put the guts in a box, give the box plenty of expansion capability and cooling.
Wrong. Loaded 5k iMacs are popular with pros because they’re fast enough and take up very little space. For us pros who work in our homes an iMac is a great choice because it’s a very clean system that takes me up very little space. My loaded iMac uses a VESA mount and floats above my desk, with no box on or under. I love this.
Craig said most of their pros are running Xcode and a great number are iMacs. So thank god you aren’t making the decisions over there.
Until Craig puts some absolute numbers on the table his claims are very much open to speculation which could swing wildly in either direction.
More of your pointless BS about needing absolute numbers that nobody provides. Most pros means anything over 50%. There is no direction to swing.
I doubt many Pros give much importance to boxes vs AIO but given the choice I bet many would prefer to separate the screen and the rest of the machine. Especially, as to expand on the AIO, it has to be external anyway which involves 'clutter' (which again, most pros are happy with as the clutter of today is not the clutter of yesteryear).
Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?
To support my point, I wonder how many Pros (not just developers) would opt for something to this over an iMac? https://www.tomsguide.com/us/dell-xps-tower,review-4499.html I'm not talking about the innards, just the styling, overall size and upgrade options. If Apple had taken that ball and ran with it, many people, not just pros, would have jumped on it for way under $2,000. That will never happen with this Apple because it would likely chop the legs off the iMac line but that has little to do with satisfying users' preferences and everything to do with Apple wanting to keep revenues up. I think Apple should be trying to reach both goals in every segment.
Not one developer picked that Dell where I work and we can pick whatever machines we want up to a certain price. Zero. There are a handful of dell workstations running linux and a few Alienwares. The rest were split between Dell laptops and Macs (mostly MBPs with some iMacs). Yes, we mostly have Dell and Apple because the corporate discount allows the budget to go further when spec'ing your machine. The video and media folks are running with iMacs or Mac Pros.
Amusingly, not one developer over 30 was running Windows...they all were running Linux or OS X. IT did a survey and published the results.
That is also a really ugly machine in my opinion.
You miss the point again.
I hope you realise I was countering someone else's point who used Craig's words to 'support' numbers (or in his words, 'great number') that nobody has. Not 'most of'.
Yes. I know that. You know that. Everybody on the outside knows that. That makes his words open to interpretation. Very open. But that's by the by, the point was a different one.
As for your Dell comments. I made no reference to Mac users, or any other users for that matter, choosing Dell over Macs. I was saying that if a machine similarto the Dell were made byApple then I'm sure that many would opt for it instead of an AIO.
What happens where you work has no bearing whatsoever on what I am saying.
"Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?"
Unlike for Craig's comments, absolute numbers do not exist because the hypothetical machine I am talking about does not exist and that, ironically, was part of what I was getting at.
Pure nonsense on your part. Apple isn’t going to disclose their numbers but the mere fact that highly public execs said it during a special media event means it’s true. They can’t lie about this, theyre a public company. So stop playing word games and trying to dance around a fact that doesn’t fit your narrative.
There’s absolutely no doubting or dancing – most of Apple pro customers run Xcode. Most of them run it on MBPs and iMacs, not MPs, which is why they’re building the iMac Pro. I have no idea why this makes life difficult for you.
Nonsense? No. The absolute opposite in fact.
'Lies' don't even come into it. Nor does Apple having to release absolute numbers.
I don't even know why you bring that up.
Because you wrote this: "Until Craig puts some absolute numbers on the table his claims are very much open to speculation which could swing wildly in either direction."
That's why he brings it up. Phil states that only 15% of mac users use Pro apps regularly and 30% less than once a week and the majority (80%) do so on MBPs. So no, MOST pros wouldn't buy your mythical xMac based on that ugly Dell. They can spin and market when they talk but when they state numbers like 20% increase YoY or 80/20 split between notebooks and desktops those numbers have to be true.
"Obviously, as you know, we just did a very major update to the MacBook Pro line. That’s going very well. Customers absolutely love it, we’ve had a lot of customers buying them. Big numbers, as I said, 20 percent growth year over year."
whoa- what about those of us who bought the iPhone 7 via the Annual Upgrade program? I paid extra/ month for the assurance I get the next model at the same price...
whoa- what about those of us who bought the iPhone 7 via the Annual Upgrade program? I paid extra/ month for the assurance I get the next model at the same price…
You paid extra, huh? You might want to reevaluate your belief.
whoa- what about those of us who bought the iPhone 7 via the Annual Upgrade program? I paid extra/ month for the assurance I get the next model at the same price…
You paid extra, huh? You might want to reevaluate your belief.
yep, with the understanding last year that this year would be a major upgrade. Apple & Wired Mag also thought is was a good idea:
whoa- what about those of us who bought the iPhone 7 via the Annual Upgrade program? I paid extra/ month for the assurance I get the next model at the same price…
You paid extra, huh? You might want to reevaluate your belief.
yep, with the understanding last year that this year would be a major upgrade. Apple & Wired Mag also thought is was a good idea:
Let me restate that. YOU DON'T PAYING ANYTHING EXTRA. THE PLAN IS THE COST OF THE DEVICE PLUS APPLECARE+, JUST LIKE ANY OTHER DEVICE SALE EXCEPT YOU GET THE CONVENIENCE OF PAYING IT OFF MONTHLY AND THE OPTION TO TRADE IT IN FOR A NEW ONE AFTER AT LEAST 6 MONTHS FROM THE SALE DATE AND 12 PAYMENTS COMPLETED.
Let me restate yet another way. THERE IS NO GUARANTEE OR REQUIREMENT THAT A NEW DEVICE HAS TO BE THE SAME PRICE. IN FACT, YOU CAN GET A LESS EXPENSIVE OR MORE EXPENSIVE MODEL YEAR-OVER-YEAR ON THE PROGRAM SINCE YOUR MONTHLY RATE VARIOUS EACH TIME YOU RE-UP BECAUSE IT'S BASED ON THE AFOREMENTIONED RETAIL PRICE OF THE ITEM PLUS APPLECARE+ DIVIDED BY 24 MONTHS. WHY DO YOU THINK THEY CHECK YOUR CREDIT EVERY TIME AND START A NEW CONTRACT?
1) Is there any previous example of Apple ever comparing itself to a non-player in a market with no shipping product during an event?
Oh, do you mean because RED isn't an established company in the telecom industry? I don't think so; good point. Then again, Steve's dead.
2) Why do people call a single, one-off event a keynote when it comes to Apple?
Likely Steve. Then again, he's dead. Also, Keynote is the name of the software so it has sort of become the "generic" term for the act of giving a presentation in some Mac circles. I've never known people to say "PowerPoint presentation," likely because it's too alliterative. But if you're giving a keynote presentation, why, that implies the piece of iWork software, so the quality will be higher!
Android phones are improving, and flagships with minimal bezels and other features that we hope/assume the next iPhone will ship with are already significantly cheaper. I am all in on Apple, but when the Honor 9 and OnePlus 5 are very well reviewed and less than half the price of current iPhones, it pains me to think Apple might increase prices further. I won't be able to afford to upgrade and may have to stick with my iPhone 6 for yet another year. The price differential between my beloved Apple products and the competition seems to be widening, especially here in the UK
Apple or any company knows what can sell at what price at how long and where is breaking point. So, wait and see in September who is right! Apple might put $150 wireless airpods into box with iphone 8 and free wireless charging accessory. Afterall, iphone 8 is flagship premium phone.
I think, were I 'Apple', that I would very actively, aggressively (if covertly), encourage the speculation that the price will be very high.
It might be the only way to eliminate initial shock and create widespread acceptance, and would also create "wiggle-room", so that, if Apple then comes in a little below speculation, they could fairly effectively defuse a lot of the pushback and negative press at release.
(As in "Apple's new iPhone priced below analysts' guesses" makes a much friendlier headline, than "Apple's new iPhone priced far above competitors, discourages many buyers...)
This seems reasonable, we can't both simultaneously expect significant advancement and significant price decline...
It's like letting the user choose if they want the slow lane or the fast lane to the future of personal computing.
While it is entirely possible for Apple to deliver advanced functionality at a lower cost I think most would be satisfied with more value (same price for better features/capabilities ).
Your slow lane / fast lane analogy is laughable. What is Apple's #1 go-to critique of Android? How fragmented they are, right? You think Apple should purposely cultivate a fragmented user base? That's insane.
You don’t understand what fragmented means. Apple has referred to android phone OS fragmentation, since different devices run differ versions of Android with different support options and functionality. iOS doesn’t have that problem...
I do understand fragmentation and how Apple uses it, as you wrote, to shine a light on the many flavors of android floating around but especially to point out how few devices are running the latest rendition of the OS which makes Android look weak. Certainly +1 for Apple - but fragmentation can happen exclusive of the OS. A platform can handle a certain amount of feature disparity ( Pencil support for iPads, portrait camera setup on iPhone Plus) but I took the slow lane / fast lane analogy to mean the OP thinks more devices with more unique features (which, possibly contrary to your opinion, would create a more capability fragmented platform) is desirable. Eh - there is no right answer here...it all depends on your personal perspective. While a more uniform device base allows developers to reach the largest audience while having confidence in the device capabilities, there will be niche developers that would love the opportunity to serve a small focused market. And there will be users that fall on both sides, too.
I look at Apple selling these at 10-15% of the mainstream rate and wonder if the extra profit will be worth the extra effort in logistics/marketing/etc.
whoa- what about those of us who bought the iPhone 7 via the Annual Upgrade program? I paid extra/ month for the assurance I get the next model at the same price…
You paid extra, huh? You might want to reevaluate your belief.
yep, with the understanding last year that this year would be a major upgrade. Apple & Wired Mag also thought is was a good idea:
Let me restate that. YOU DON'T PAYING ANYTHING EXTRA. THE PLAN IS THE COST OF THE DEVICE PLUS APPLECARE+, JUST LIKE ANY OTHER DEVICE SALE EXCEPT YOU GET THE CONVENIENCE OF PAYING IT OFF MONTHLY AND THE OPTION TO TRADE IT IN FOR A NEW ONE AFTER AT LEAST 6 MONTHS FROM THE SALE DATE AND 12 PAYMENTS COMPLETED.
Let me restate yet another way. THERE IS NO GUARANTEE OR REQUIREMENT THAT A NEW DEVICE HAS TO BE THE SAME PRICE. IN FACT, YOU CAN GET A LESS EXPENSIVE OR MORE EXPENSIVE MODEL YEAR-OVER-YEAR ON THE PROGRAM SINCE YOUR MONTHLY RATE VARIOUS EACH TIME YOU RE-UP BECAUSE IT'S BASED ON THE AFOREMENTIONED RETAIL PRICE OF THE ITEM PLUS APPLECARE+ DIVIDED BY 24 MONTHS. WHY THE FUCK DO YOU THINK THEY CHECK YOUR CREDIT EVERY FUCKING TIME AND START A NEW FUCKING CONTRACT?
Geeze, there is absolutely no reason to use the F word (nor CAPS) just because you can't get this straight . For exactly the same phone, it cost an additional $5/month to enter the Apple Upgrade Program. Yes Apple Care is included but useless as it already has a year coverage. The issue at hand, and not mentioned in the Apple literature, is to which new phone one is entitled. That is not clear.
Comments
I hope you realise I was countering someone else's point who used Craig's words to 'support' numbers (or in his words, 'great number') that nobody has. Not 'most of'.
Yes. I know that. You know that. Everybody on the outside knows that. That makes his words open to interpretation. Very open. But that's by the by, the point was a different one.
As for your Dell comments. I made no reference to Mac users, or any other users for that matter, choosing Dell over Macs. I was saying that if a machine similar to the Dell were made by Apple then I'm sure that many would opt for it instead of an AIO.
What happens where you work has no bearing whatsoever on what I am saying.
"Why don't you provide some absolute numbers to back up your claims?"
Unlike for Craig's comments, absolute numbers do not exist because the hypothetical machine I am talking about does not exist and that, ironically, was part of what I was getting at.
There’s absolutely no doubting or dancing – most of Apple pro customers run Xcode. Most of them run it on MBPs and iMacs, not MPs, which is why they’re building the iMac Pro. I have no idea why this makes life difficult for you.
2) Why do people call a single, one-off event a keynote when it comes to Apple? This makes sense when it's the first event at WWDC or the old MacWorld conference.
'Lies' don't even come into it. Nor does Apple having to release absolute numbers.
I don't even know why you bring that up.
Answer this question honestly. Given the option of an equivalent, Apple designed box in the same vein as the Dell I mentioned, with great ugradeability and without the Apple screen bolted onto it, do you really think most Pro users would skip over that option and opt for the fully loaded iMac?
My point was that I don't think they would. My point was that I think it would be a huge seller. My point was that Apple is fully aware of this and that is why such a machine does not exist.
'Lies', truth etc are irrelevant. When Apple gives media presentations you get facts and marketing, politics and passion all rolled into the same enchilada and, more often than not, unless some cold, hard numbers are put on the table, the viewer has to interpret the rest. Of course this includes taking words like 'magical' very lightly indeed.
IMO, the Pro/Edition iPhone will have better hardware, 3D camera, motion sensors. RAM, SSD, maybe new A11 APU/GPU capabilities – to exploit the software capabilities added in iOS 11.
Apple may not even call it an iPhone – nobody makes phone calls anymore!
That's why he brings it up. Phil states that only 15% of mac users use Pro apps regularly and 30% less than once a week and the majority (80%) do so on MBPs. So no, MOST pros wouldn't buy your mythical xMac based on that ugly Dell.
They can spin and market when they talk but when they state numbers like 20% increase YoY or 80/20 split between notebooks and desktops those numbers have to be true.
"Obviously, as you know, we just did a very major update to the MacBook Pro line. That’s going very well. Customers absolutely love it, we’ve had a lot of customers buying them. Big numbers, as I said, 20 percent growth year over year."
https://www.wired.com/2016/09/apples-iphone-upgrade-plan-right/
Let me restate yet another way. THERE IS NO GUARANTEE OR REQUIREMENT THAT A NEW DEVICE HAS TO BE THE SAME PRICE. IN FACT, YOU CAN GET A LESS EXPENSIVE OR MORE EXPENSIVE MODEL YEAR-OVER-YEAR ON THE PROGRAM SINCE YOUR MONTHLY RATE VARIOUS EACH TIME YOU RE-UP BECAUSE IT'S BASED ON THE AFOREMENTIONED RETAIL PRICE OF THE ITEM PLUS APPLECARE+ DIVIDED BY 24 MONTHS. WHY DO YOU THINK THEY CHECK YOUR CREDIT EVERY TIME AND START A NEW CONTRACT?
Likely Steve. Then again, he's dead. Also, Keynote is the name of the software so it has sort of become the "generic" term for the act of giving a presentation in some Mac circles. I've never known people to say "PowerPoint presentation," likely because it's too alliterative. But if you're giving a keynote presentation, why, that implies the piece of iWork software, so the quality will be higher!
encourage the speculation that the price will be very high.
It might be the only way to eliminate initial shock and create widespread acceptance,
and would also create "wiggle-room", so that, if Apple then comes in a little below speculation,
they could fairly effectively defuse a lot of the pushback and negative press at release.
(As in "Apple's new iPhone priced below analysts' guesses" makes a much friendlier headline,
than "Apple's new iPhone priced far above competitors, discourages many buyers...)
I look at Apple selling these at 10-15% of the mainstream rate and wonder if the extra profit will be worth the extra effort in logistics/marketing/etc.