Inside iPhone 8: Apple's A11 Bionic introduces 5 new custom silicon engines

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 119
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 6,154member
    Blunt said:
    avon b7 said: 
    The idea that some have that Android is just some kind of ad platform, apart from being somewhat insulting to Android users, is just plain stupid and ignores the many good reasons people buy Android.


    Your reaction to the speed of the A11 this week was plain stupid and somewhat insulting and ignores the many good reasons people buy iPhones. When you buy an new iPhone it will last a long time and you will recieve updates for years. The iPhone 8 will be up speed for years and Android phones will not be as fast for maybe three years.
    There is also the fact that the A11 opens the door for exciting things to come. By the way we all know the main reason people buy Android: they are cheap just like Windows computers. If you want't the best quality Android is not an option.
    My reaction was in no way insulting to anybody. The opinion on speed was fine or has anything changed on that front in the last three years? Did it do anything big for Apple? Did it improve sales? Did it improve the user experience for the vast majority of users?

    As I have said before and detailed before, the industry hit a wall on features a couple of years ago and what we have seen is a fleshing out of those features not anything truly revolutionary. Processors are fast enough, cameras are good enough, screens are good enough etc, etc.

    The future is AI and possibly AR/VR. We might see some jump in battery tech. We might see some foldable screen tech etc but, today, smartphones largely do what most people currently ask of them and extremely well (and that includes those mid tier Androids).

    If your plan is to upgrade every year or two, how does having a phone that 'lasts' longer help?
  • Reply 22 of 119
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    palegolas said:
    Today I've been recording in the new High Efficiency mode on my iPad Pro 10.5", and then played back the files on the Mac (Mac OS 10.12.6). First of all, QuickTime Player plays the files fine. It looks good. But QuickTime Player says it's h.264. Is this just wrong, or is Apple's "High Efficiency" something else than HEVC (which i was under the impression was h.265). Has HEVC moved into the h.264 standard?
    Also, these High Efficiency recordings do not play back very well on my iPhone 6 plus. They play, but very choppy. Even the 1080 ones. Either iOS 11 optimisations for older phones is needed, or it's just the nature of the new algorithms.. Too heavy for iPhone 6.
    The newer IOS devices have built in hardware for h.265.    Hardware decode is almost mandatory for the majority of high quality video CODECs.    It was mentioned someplace which devices support h.265, but I believe it was A10 on.
    palegolas
  • Reply 23 of 119
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member

    foggyhill said:
    rob53 said:
    My Geekbench 4 scores on a iPhone 8 Plus show the following:

    CPU
    ARM @ 2.05 GHz, 1 processor, 6 Cores
    single-core 4229
    multi-core 10381
    Compute 15295

    These look a little better than the ones in the chart. My results also show CPU speed.

    To put this in context, my late 2015 iMac Retina 5K, 3.3 GHz quad core i5 has scores that aren't that much butter than my phone, until you get to the crazy compute score.

    single-core 4954
    multi-core 14458
    compute  Radeon R9 M395 2048MB 77845

    In other words, the Bionic A11 is a very fast and powerful device. It would be interesting if Apple could take this design and change it to run in a desktop environment. Their GPU needs a lot of work but maybe it would take that much effort to pack 4-6 GPUs into a desktop system. I know it's not that simple but the single-core CPU results show the A11 is in the ballpark of a really good desktop computer already.
    Who knows what "score" the other coprocessors on the SOC have though... Nobody're really measuring them.

    Things like geekbench will have less and less meaning as those things multiply.
    True to the extent that Geebench doesn't adapt to the new technologies.  For somethings, like AI processing, it will likely be sometime before the industry settles on how to benchmark such accelerators.  Right now it doesn't look like their is a direct way for developers to hook into some of the new tech, they need to use libraries and system services so it may be some time before a worthwhile benchmark can even be written for the new chips.   I'm still hoping for a leak that details exactly what is in these SoC's and how the various units are coordinated. 


  • Reply 24 of 119
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    avon b7 said:
    Blunt said:
    avon b7 said: 
    The idea that some have that Android is just some kind of ad platform, apart from being somewhat insulting to Android users, is just plain stupid and ignores the many good reasons people buy Android.


    Your reaction to the speed of the A11 this week was plain stupid and somewhat insulting and ignores the many good reasons people buy iPhones. When you buy an new iPhone it will last a long time and you will recieve updates for years. The iPhone 8 will be up speed for years and Android phones will not be as fast for maybe three years.
    There is also the fact that the A11 opens the door for exciting things to come. By the way we all know the main reason people buy Android: they are cheap just like Windows computers. If you want't the best quality Android is not an option.
    My reaction was in no way insulting to anybody. The opinion on speed was fine or has anything changed on that front in the last three years? Did it do anything big for Apple? Did it improve sales? Did it improve the user experience for the vast majority of users?

    As I have said before and detailed before, the industry hit a wall on features a couple of years ago and what we have seen is a fleshing out of those features not anything truly revolutionary. Processors are fast enough, cameras are good enough, screens are good enough etc, etc.

    The future is AI and possibly AR/VR. We might see some jump in battery tech. We might see some foldable screen tech etc but, today, smartphones largely do what most people currently ask of them and extremely well (and that includes those mid tier Androids).

    If your plan is to upgrade every year or two, how does having a phone that 'lasts' longer help?
    Well I'm interjecting here but I don't upgrade every two years.   That is a behavior that the gullible and pound foolish have engaged in for some time.   It bothers me to see comments about 2 year upgrades as it leads people to believe they have to do an upgrade.

    As for ipHone performance I don't think we will ever see an end to performance increases.    At some point cell phones will completely replace PC's for most user needs.    They will simply plug the phone into a monitor at homeland at work to get all the PC functionality they need.    Unplug the device and the phone reverts to cell phone mode.   Even if we don't get there anytime soon performance is still very important for user satisfaction.

    In any even your negativity is ether willful trolling or the result fo a complete misunderstanding what Apple has managed ot build into the A11 chip.   It is a major milestone.    Besides if you believe the the future is AI and AR/VR (I generally agree but have a hard time calling todays AI systems AI) then you apparently already realize that such features take a tremendous amount of processing power to implement. Frankly I see A11 as just broaching the idea of AI hardware in a computer for the common user.   To really get this tech to work we will need a massive amount of extra compute power just ot make it look half good.   I used the term milestone because that really is what we have in A11, it is the birth of a new generation of technologies and the only way to go from here is up.

    You can dismiss the new iPhones all you want, you are still free to do so.   The problem is that opinion doesn't seem to correlate with an objective look at what Apple debuted.  
    tmaypscooter63chiamagman1979cali
  • Reply 25 of 119
    I am curious if Apple has removed hardware support for 32-bit instructions from the A11 chip, now that iOS11 doesn't support 32 bit apps.  It would be a way to save chip space.  If so, perhaps the same will happen to x86 CPUs in Macs in a few years (if Intel or AMD agree). 
    mizhou
  • Reply 26 of 119
    staticx57 said:
    Still waiting for for an iPad or iPhone to be even close to as versatile as my MacBook Pro in anything other than Geekbench. I’ll reserve judgement until the iPhone runs macOS.
    Still waiting for for my MacBook Pro to be even close to as versatile as an iPad or iPhone in anything other than Geekscale ™. I’ll reserve judgement until the MacBook Pro weighs 1 pound.

    : )
    edited September 2017 netmageronnradarthekatcaliflaneur
  • Reply 27 of 119
    It looks like in all over media, Apple and it's fans are not doing enough to tout(create awareness) the leap in tech inside iPhone 8 which currently over shadowed by iPhone X. Curious if Apple started using it's own home grown GPU in iPhone 8 instead of Imagination ?
  • Reply 28 of 119
    iqatedoiqatedo Posts: 1,740member
    Does anyone here know on what systems Apple designs their hardware, at chip level and final device level?
  • Reply 29 of 119
    Avieshek said:
    wizard69 said:

    tmay said:
    It will be interesting to the what ChipWorks comes up with when they dismantle the A11, although mostly I'm interested in the size of the die itself.
    I'm interested in just about everything.   I'd like to know how they lowered power while increasing performance in the GPU for one.   The GPU alone would benefit form a serious reveal on Apples part.    Then there is the rest of the chip, fascinating stuff.

    As for people rising the iPhone 8 as a modest upgrade, I see A11 completely blowing that position out of the water, this is a huge update.
    From TSMC's higher Fabrication Processes.

    The switch to 10nm, while reducing power consumption, doesn’t give anywhere near those gains. The main reason is Apple developed an improved custom GPU.
    netmagemizhouronn
  • Reply 30 of 119
    tmaytmay Posts: 5,713member
    wood1208 said:
    It looks like in all over media, Apple and it's fans are not doing enough to tout(create awareness) the leap in tech inside iPhone 8 which currently over shadowed by iPhone X. Curious if Apple started using it's own home grown GPU in iPhone 8 instead of Imagination ?
    Yes, it is Apple's own GPGPU design.


    netmagemizhouflaneur
  • Reply 31 of 119
    ksecksec Posts: 1,568member
    wizard69 said:
    longfang said:
    Daniel is getting mellow in his old age. I didn’t figure him for the author until half way through the article.
    Frankly it is his best article to date.   Generally I can't read through his articles, the style just runs my stomach.    This article is very good though and nicely corrals the known information.

    Now I kinda look at this as a start, I really want to see more details on the GPU and other new units in the chip.    A11 is a powerhouse of a chip and ushers in a lot of new technology that I want to see more detail on.  
    This isn't any better, Just much more toned down. As soon as AI touches anything that is "technical". It fall short.  Nvidia, AMD, ARM even Qualcomm all uses some form of Tiled based Rendering, and deferred Rendering isn't unique to IMG either. But of course IMG being the pioneer of this tech has the best implementation, and the patents around it.

    H265 Hardware Encoder is nothing new. What is surprising ( at least to those who dont follow Apple ) is the quality of encoding. Normally, most hardware encoder tends to produces very poor quality results, compared to software based encoder. You can trying doing Hardware encoding from Intel iGPU and Nvidia. 

    And then it got to iPod? And you dont paid patents and IP for the chip even if it includes WMV decode or encoding. You only have to paid if they are activated. That is why there is a different between shipping 300 million of X capable chips and devices that can play a certain codec.

    You can argue A10 was still not quite up to Intel's Core performance /watt, but A11 surely is. And it is done with a slightly inferior node, TSMC 10nm. At the moment we are paying roughly $150 - $300+ ( Retail Prices with Apple Margin ) extra for the same performance but x86 compatibility on Mac. Not sure if the maths will ever work on in flavor of Apple switching to its own CPU.   

    derekmorr
  • Reply 32 of 119
    "Android buyers are an audience for advertisers, not customers demanding UI polish, app performance or sophisticated features like multiprocessing support. Android apps are optimized to deliver ads."
    And this is when I first realized that DED was the author! 😉
    netmageasdasdcali
  • Reply 33 of 119
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 6,154member
    wizard69 said:
    avon b7 said:
    Blunt said:
    avon b7 said: 
    The idea that some have that Android is just some kind of ad platform, apart from being somewhat insulting to Android users, is just plain stupid and ignores the many good reasons people buy Android.


    Your reaction to the speed of the A11 this week was plain stupid and somewhat insulting and ignores the many good reasons people buy iPhones. When you buy an new iPhone it will last a long time and you will recieve updates for years. The iPhone 8 will be up speed for years and Android phones will not be as fast for maybe three years.
    There is also the fact that the A11 opens the door for exciting things to come. By the way we all know the main reason people buy Android: they are cheap just like Windows computers. If you want't the best quality Android is not an option.
    My reaction was in no way insulting to anybody. The opinion on speed was fine or has anything changed on that front in the last three years? Did it do anything big for Apple? Did it improve sales? Did it improve the user experience for the vast majority of users?

    As I have said before and detailed before, the industry hit a wall on features a couple of years ago and what we have seen is a fleshing out of those features not anything truly revolutionary. Processors are fast enough, cameras are good enough, screens are good enough etc, etc.

    The future is AI and possibly AR/VR. We might see some jump in battery tech. We might see some foldable screen tech etc but, today, smartphones largely do what most people currently ask of them and extremely well (and that includes those mid tier Androids).

    If your plan is to upgrade every year or two, how does having a phone that 'lasts' longer help?
    Well I'm interjecting here but I don't upgrade every two years.   That is a behavior that the gullible and pound foolish have engaged in for some time.   It bothers me to see comments about 2 year upgrades as it leads people to believe they have to do an upgrade.

    As for ipHone performance I don't think we will ever see an end to performance increases.    At some point cell phones will completely replace PC's for most user needs.    They will simply plug the phone into a monitor at homeland at work to get all the PC functionality they need.    Unplug the device and the phone reverts to cell phone mode.   Even if we don't get there anytime soon performance is still very important for user satisfaction.

    In any even your negativity is ether willful trolling or the result fo a complete misunderstanding what Apple has managed ot build into the A11 chip.   It is a major milestone.    Besides if you believe the the future is AI and AR/VR (I generally agree but have a hard time calling todays AI systems AI) then you apparently already realize that such features take a tremendous amount of processing power to implement. Frankly I see A11 as just broaching the idea of AI hardware in a computer for the common user.   To really get this tech to work we will need a massive amount of extra compute power just ot make it look half good.   I used the term milestone because that really is what we have in A11, it is the birth of a new generation of technologies and the only way to go from here is up.

    You can dismiss the new iPhones all you want, you are still free to do so.   The problem is that opinion doesn't seem to correlate with an objective look at what Apple debuted.  
    No one is obliged to upgrade at any given rate. The point is more a consideration at the time of the initial outlay. My wife has an iPhone 6 in the knowledge that the purchase was for three years. I have a 249€ Android in the knowledge that it would be for 18 months or more.

    AI is taking its first steps on mobile hardware. First with machine learning for a few things (handset optimisation, anticipation, camera etc) For me this was the first step so I know what you mean when you say you have a hard time calling it AI. But now we have dedicated NPUs finding space on the SoC. The results may seem a little lacking in substance at first because they need software to be written for them but the possibilities are vast going forward.

    Nearly a year ago the Honor Magic was released and it gave us a peek at what could be done on a 'simple' level (no NPU) just by incorporating subtle changes. For example, the idea that the phone could 'know' whose hand it was in and if the user was looking at the screen and react according. In the user's hand, the screen would use sensors in the frame and face recognition to wake the screen and reveal the text in notifications. The same gesture in anybody else's hand would not show the text in notifications. If the user stopped looking at the screen for 10 seconds it would switch to power saving mode. This was using its infrared and eye tracking tech. It would do different things depending on if the phone face was face up or down, in a dark room or not etc. Providing quick access to boarding passes at airports or package info when picking up packets.

    Much of this AI was 'invisible' to the user but is the kind of thing you somehow miss when you pick up a different phone that doesn't have it. And this was nearly a year ago. Expect major refinements very soon.

    I compare the sensation to the classic Mac OS Finder. It was a technological neanderthal but always seemed to be one step ahead of what the user was going to do next. In its own special way it was 'intelligent' even if it was just the result of nice design.

    Now, all this (iPhone 8, X and the Mate 10, next Honor Magic) is going 'local' to improve context, latency and privacy. The first areas of main development have been on image recognition and voice recognition but when you tie in information from on-board sensors, user habits, cloud support services etc, you begin to see the potential. I've always argued for onboard AI in some circumstances and now we will see the best of both worlds come into play. Imagine how text input and spelling could be improved (especially in multi language cases)

    Or imagine this: 

    You are diabetic type 1. Imagine having your continuous monitoring glucose sensor (hopefully non-invasive  at some point) tied in with your phone and being able to scan all the food at home (barcodes on packets and camera for food recognition) and for the phone to guide you through glucose changes (alerts) and give advice on which kind of insulin and how much to use, based both on the food you propose, the food you have eaten earlier, your history, and the exercise you have done, the sleep you have has AND learn from past events (hipoglucemia/hiperglucemia) to improve its suggestions. Now imagine if emergency services could upload pattern information (for FaceID for example) and users could store the information (relating to local personnel) locally on their phones and have only authorised medical personnel gain access - to the relevant information and that previously chosen a by the user - on their phones, and only in case of emergency. Information that would include up to the minute real health information.

    Some of this is available now but lacking the ability to learn from the situation and adapt to it (the intelligence). Imagine if it could know you have neuropatholigies, accomodate that information on your diabetes and keep all this info private (locally onboard the phone) until a time that it needs to be revealed (to a member of the emergency services for example and only in case of need).

    AR could take off universally or end up as a niche feature or fall somewhere in between but AI will truly change our lives even if we aren't quite aware of its presence.

    At some point sensor tech will become commonplace in glasses and then we will have even more options available to AI.

    There will be issues with privacy, legality and other problems but AI will have to be adapted to one way or another but, like I said, these are just the first steps.

    derekmorrFolio
  • Reply 34 of 119
    haarhaar Posts: 563member
    iqatedo said:
    Does anyone here know on what systems Apple designs their hardware, at chip level and final device level?
    While you are at it... ask what software does INTEL use to design its CPU’s... or AMD uses... or NVIDIA uses, or qualcomm...

    My guess... some custom million dollar program that is specfic to the fab process.

    IMO in otherwards, there is no need to know... but i guess if you had to know start using the google web browser to see what software is compatible with ASML (the makers of fab machines) ... etc...
  • Reply 35 of 119
    From speed tests using current apps, it seems like not even Apple is not set up to deal with all that power yet. It's future-proofing the phones. And it sounds to me there is a MAJOR MAJOR update to iOS to deal with all that raw power. So expect a brand-spanking new iOS in the near future.
  • Reply 36 of 119
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,232member
    It will be interesting to see whether Apple decides to support Google’s codecs. It’s up to Apple to do that. Since it’s free to support, I can’t see why they wouldn’t, unless it just corporate rivalry on their part.

    remember that Apple never supported FLAC for music either, but now they do. So that’s a change.
  • Reply 37 of 119
    melgross said:
    It will be interesting to see whether Apple decides to support Google’s codecs. It’s up to Apple to do that. Since it’s free to support, I can’t see why they wouldn’t, unless it just corporate rivalry on their part.

    remember that Apple never supported FLAC for music either, but now they do. So that’s a change.


    More like when will Google stop pushing their own inferior standards down everyone's throat and use the industry accepted HEVC (h.265) instead?
    tmayrob53pscooter63chiaStrangeDaysalandailcaliwilliamlondon
  • Reply 38 of 119
    FolioFolio Posts: 698member

    Funny how the depth and breadth of 10th anniversary rollout— phenomenal to most of us partisans— so far eludes general appreciation. But that’s just a momentary hiccup, so I hope.

    Appreciate the insight on the processors. Look forward to a series: AI on AI. Perhaps also consider initiating a quarterly comparison: Sets of questions and answers to Siri, Alexa, Google Asst, Cortana, Bixby.

    I recently did 2400 mile road trip in California and Arizona. My travel buddy used Galaxy/Verizon/Google and I had iPhone5s/12.9iPadPro on T-Mobile. Verizon coverage noticeably superior outside of cities. Siri did fine, except for glaring misdirection to Sequoia National Park, taking us up by Edison Lake instead, so we missed seeing the gargantuan trees this trip, but at least hiked great lake with mountain air.

    Another time I asked Siri driving distance from Tucson to Phoenix. Instead of a simple quick answer, it demanded I turn on location services. Grrrr. In my dream, Siri would have traits like a concierge in a world class hotel and not talk back, let alone be impertinent. Note: I’ve not yet used new Siri.

    A recent brokerage report (BAML 31AUG2017 on Google Traffic Acquisition Costs) estimates Google pays Apple $4billion plus each year in TAC fees. That’s US$4,000,000,000 plus to tap each of us in Apple’s ecosystem. Google’s iOS recent assistant app, while it may help Apple retain any users who would otherwise defect to Android for the assistant, likely is a foot in the door to reduce annual TAC payments from Google to Apple.

    If Apple makes more Siri experiences superior or near frictionless, with consent tailored to its individual users, then it can not only protect TAC fees but gain more lucrative share in e-commerce from Google, Amazon, etc. Recent internal moves, though late in coming, are encouraging, and HomePod visibility means Siri development can’t languish anymore. Game on.

    Bionic chip processing power for AR/VR could be a differentiator for Apple mobile for next few years in buying fitted clothes, shower curtains, sofas, views from/of hotel rooms, maybe even head room in cars or leg room on airline seats. Question is how fast sellers ramp up.

  • Reply 39 of 119
    melgross said:
    It will be interesting to see whether Apple decides to support Google’s codecs. It’s up to Apple to do that. Since it’s free to support, I can’t see why they wouldn’t, unless it just corporate rivalry on their part.

    remember that Apple never supported FLAC for music either, but now they do. So that’s a change.
    Why would Apple support Google codecs? Does Apple support Flash? No, but we can still use Flash thanks to the Flash plug-in on macOS. We use Microsoft's Silverlight plug-in to watch Netflix. Google must just provide its own plug-in for its codec. If it provides its own codec for tvOS and Apple refuses that then we may question that. But since Google doesn't provide a plug-in for macOS, it is most probably that it doesn't provide a codec for tvOS either. They might well implement it in their YouTube tvOS app. So the truth is not Apple does not support Google's codecs, the truth is Google's YouTube app does not support Google's own 4K codec on tvOS. If I'm wrong and it supports then correct me.
    edited September 2017 mizhou
  • Reply 40 of 119
    tmaytmay Posts: 5,713member
    avon b7 said:
    wizard69 said:
    avon b7 said:
    Blunt said:
    avon b7 said: 
    The idea that some have that Android is just some kind of ad platform, apart from being somewhat insulting to Android users, is just plain stupid and ignores the many good reasons people buy Android.


    Your reaction to the speed of the A11 this week was plain stupid and somewhat insulting and ignores the many good reasons people buy iPhones. When you buy an new iPhone it will last a long time and you will recieve updates for years. The iPhone 8 will be up speed for years and Android phones will not be as fast for maybe three years.
    There is also the fact that the A11 opens the door for exciting things to come. By the way we all know the main reason people buy Android: they are cheap just like Windows computers. If you want't the best quality Android is not an option.
    My reaction was in no way insulting to anybody. The opinion on speed was fine or has anything changed on that front in the last three years? Did it do anything big for Apple? Did it improve sales? Did it improve the user experience for the vast majority of users?

    As I have said before and detailed before, the industry hit a wall on features a couple of years ago and what we have seen is a fleshing out of those features not anything truly revolutionary. Processors are fast enough, cameras are good enough, screens are good enough etc, etc.

    The future is AI and possibly AR/VR. We might see some jump in battery tech. We might see some foldable screen tech etc but, today, smartphones largely do what most people currently ask of them and extremely well (and that includes those mid tier Androids).

    If your plan is to upgrade every year or two, how does having a phone that 'lasts' longer help?
    Well I'm interjecting here but I don't upgrade every two years.   That is a behavior that the gullible and pound foolish have engaged in for some time.   It bothers me to see comments about 2 year upgrades as it leads people to believe they have to do an upgrade.

    As for ipHone performance I don't think we will ever see an end to performance increases.    At some point cell phones will completely replace PC's for most user needs.    They will simply plug the phone into a monitor at homeland at work to get all the PC functionality they need.    Unplug the device and the phone reverts to cell phone mode.   Even if we don't get there anytime soon performance is still very important for user satisfaction.

    In any even your negativity is ether willful trolling or the result fo a complete misunderstanding what Apple has managed ot build into the A11 chip.   It is a major milestone.    Besides if you believe the the future is AI and AR/VR (I generally agree but have a hard time calling todays AI systems AI) then you apparently already realize that such features take a tremendous amount of processing power to implement. Frankly I see A11 as just broaching the idea of AI hardware in a computer for the common user.   To really get this tech to work we will need a massive amount of extra compute power just ot make it look half good.   I used the term milestone because that really is what we have in A11, it is the birth of a new generation of technologies and the only way to go from here is up.

    You can dismiss the new iPhones all you want, you are still free to do so.   The problem is that opinion doesn't seem to correlate with an objective look at what Apple debuted.  
    No one is obliged to upgrade at any given rate. The point is more a consideration at the time of the initial outlay. My wife has an iPhone 6 in the knowledge that the purchase was for three years. I have a 249€ Android in the knowledge that it would be for 18 months or more.

    AI is taking its first steps on mobile hardware. First with machine learning for a few things (handset optimisation, anticipation, camera etc) For me this was the first step so I know what you mean when you say you have a hard time calling it AI. But now we have dedicated NPUs finding space on the SoC. The results may seem a little lacking in substance at first because they need software to be written for them but the possibilities are vast going forward.

    Nearly a year ago the Honor Magic was released and it gave us a peek at what could be done on a 'simple' level (no NPU) just by incorporating subtle changes. For example, the idea that the phone could 'know' whose hand it was in and if the user was looking at the screen and react according. In the user's hand, the screen would use sensors in the frame and face recognition to wake the screen and reveal the text in notifications. The same gesture in anybody else's hand would not show the text in notifications. If the user stopped looking at the screen for 10 seconds it would switch to power saving mode. This was using its infrared and eye tracking tech. It would do different things depending on if the phone face was face up or down, in a dark room or not etc. Providing quick access to boarding passes at airports or package info when picking up packets.

    Much of this AI was 'invisible' to the user but is the kind of thing you somehow miss when you pick up a different phone that doesn't have it. And this was nearly a year ago. Expect major refinements very soon.

    I compare the sensation to the classic Mac OS Finder. It was a technological neanderthal but always seemed to be one step ahead of what the user was going to do next. In its own special way it was 'intelligent' even if it was just the result of nice design.

    Now, all this (iPhone 8, X and the Mate 10, next Honor Magic) is going 'local' to improve context, latency and privacy. The first areas of main development have been on image recognition and voice recognition but when you tie in information from on-board sensors, user habits, cloud support services etc, you begin to see the potential. I've always argued for onboard AI in some circumstances and now we will see the best of both worlds come into play. Imagine how text input and spelling could be improved (especially in multi language cases)

    Or imagine this: 

    You are diabetic type 1. Imagine having your continuous monitoring glucose sensor (hopefully non-invasive  at some point) tied in with your phone and being able to scan all the food at home (barcodes on packets and camera for food recognition) and for the phone to guide you through glucose changes (alerts) and give advice on which kind of insulin and how much to use, based both on the food you propose, the food you have eaten earlier, your history, and the exercise you have done, the sleep you have has AND learn from past events (hipoglucemia/hiperglucemia) to improve its suggestions. Now imagine if emergency services could upload pattern information (for FaceID for example) and users could store the information (relating to local personnel) locally on their phones and have only authorised medical personnel gain access - to the relevant information and that previously chosen a by the user - on their phones, and only in case of emergency. Information that would include up to the minute real health information.

    Some of this is available now but lacking the ability to learn from the situation and adapt to it (the intelligence). Imagine if it could know you have neuropatholigies, accomodate that information on your diabetes and keep all this info private (locally onboard the phone) until a time that it needs to be revealed (to a member of the emergency services for example and only in case of need).

    AR could take off universally or end up as a niche feature or fall somewhere in between but AI will truly change our lives even if we aren't quite aware of its presence.

    At some point sensor tech will become commonplace in glasses and then we will have even more options available to AI.

    There will be issues with privacy, legality and other problems but AI will have to be adapted to one way or another but, like I said, these are just the first steps.


    You could have shortened alt that to "just imagine what Apple could do with AI, health, wearables and specifically the Apple Watch.", but of course, you're afraid that you would explode in a ball of flame if you said anything nice about Apple.

    Who, other than Apple, controls all the pieces needed to put together what you are asking for? Sure, Google s attempting to be more like Apple as we speak, good luck with that. Otherwise, it will be the OEM's on their own, providing little bits and pieces, but no full solution, the achilles heel of Android OS.

    See how Apple rolled out ARKit, for example, and how Apple had the foresight to provide enough performance in their iPhones, even a few generations ago, to make this happen. So today's performance, that you ignore, is tomorrow's new capability, and we will see, again, Android OS fall behind.


    pscooter63propodradarthekatwilliamlondonargonaut
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