EU says Apple's cash repatriation plans won't alleviate Irish $15.9B back tax payments

Posted:
in General Discussion edited January 2018
Though Apple is planning to pay the U.S. some $38 billion in taxes on repatriated foreign cash, that won't impact how much it owes in Ireland, a spokesman for the European Commission said on Thursday.




"The Commission's 2016 state aid decision found that, over many years, tax rulings issued by Ireland had allowed Apple to pay less tax on profits recorded in Ireland than other companies subject to same national taxation laws. This gave Apple an illegal advantage in breach of E.U. state aid rules, which must now be recovered by Ireland -- nothing has changed in that regard," the representative explained to Reuters.

The European Commission had previously said that the amount Apple owes Ireland could be lowered if another country found sales should've been recorded there instead of Ireland, or if Apple's European subsididies were to pay more in taxes to their U.S. parent.

Since the company is merely repatriating foreign cash, it doesn't meet the necessary criteria.

Apple could still theoretically use its Irish payments to offset what it pays in the U.S., but the Irish government has yet to collect any money -- prompting the Commission to go to court -- and both Ireland and Apple are appealing the Commission's 2016 ruling.

Should they fail, Apple will owe some 13 billion euros in back taxes, currently worth about $15.9 billion U.S.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 34
    FU, EU.
    kaiphermacseekeranton zuykovmonstrositytallest skilwatto_cobra
  • Reply 2 of 34
    steven n.steven n. Posts: 1,108member
    The EU. Let's just make rules/laws out of thin air if we can make lots of €€€€€€.
    SpamSandwichkaiphermacseekeranton zuykovmonstrosityJWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 3 of 34
    And disincentivise future business by showing how greedy a socialist government system can be.
    macseekeranton zuykovSpamSandwichmonstrosityJWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 4 of 34
    JanNLJanNL Posts: 258member
    jsmythe00 said:
    At least they have access to quality and affordable healthcare AND a retirement age not getting pushed up or having your retirement funds spent to fund the gapig hole left by not collectingnthr proper amount of corporate tax
    Just exactly these bad things happen in EU. Don't believe all these standard media-talk.
    Healthcare isn't affordable (anymore). Retirement age is getting higher and higher. Contribution to your own (obligated) retirement is getting higher and higher and the payment when your are retired is getting lower (even retroactively!). 
  • Reply 5 of 34
    fallenjtfallenjt Posts: 3,976member
    No wonder, all EU companies are crushed against US companies. Let me see...is there any hi profile EU corporate anymore beside the Swiss bank? Nokia is pretty dead and trying to survive on Patent loyalty payments...any other?
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 6 of 34
    JanNLJanNL Posts: 258member
    fallenjt said:
    No wonder, all EU companies are crushed against US companies. Let me see...is there any hi profile EU corporate anymore beside the Swiss bank? Nokia is pretty dead and trying to survive on Patent loyalty payments...any other?
    Come on, not all. As a Dutch born I will name just a few: ASML / Shell / Unilever  and the beers  :) like Heineken.
  • Reply 7 of 34
    jsmythe00 said:
    kaipher said:
    And disincentivise future business by showing how greedy a socialist government system can be.
    Like a capitalistic gov is better. At least they have access to quality and affordable healthcare AND a retirement age
    Actually, they don't...because just like in a capitalist society, the only thing that pays for all that is, you guessed it, TAXPAYERS. So, when you scare the business away, you scare the source of money away, and when you have a lot of obligations to pay (for "affordable" programs) along with overblown bureaucracy, and not a lot of money is in the budget, that is when you are f**ked.
    Don't ask me, ask California, how their "affordable" health care (100% covered on pensions starting at 50) and pensions are working out right now. EU is the same thing.
    Russia, for example has both "affordable healthcare" and "pension" system. The only thing I can tell you, after experiencing that as well as US healthcare (which is not in the best state), is that I would rather chose the capitalist "in-affordable" one, because any socialist "affordable" system is only affordable on paper. Why? Try "affordable" u-sound scanning done to you, for which you need to be in queue for 3-5 months to receive it. It is free, though...so it is affordable...if you don't die prior to it, that is.
    Stop with that "affordable" mantra, ok? You will pay for everything, no matter what. Except in a socialist system, that cost is overblown and hidden...but it is still there.

    Example2: Cost of public schooling for 1 pupil is 12700 dollars a year per student in the US. Cost of the same in private schools is 8-10k. Mind you, private schools have MUCH higher standards, but they cost less. This makes little sense, but yet here you are touting about the same "affordable" BS...
    randominternetpersonSpamSandwich
  • Reply 8 of 34
    croprcropr Posts: 914member
    kaipher said:
    And disincentivise future business by showing how greedy a socialist government system can be.
    Since when is the European commission a socialist government? The fact that the EU commission is going after illegal state aid, is not at all socialist.  On the contrary, the EU commission wants a fair playing field where companies can compete on equal terms.  There is no fair playing field If a country like Ireland allows one company to have a tax level of <1%, while other companies must pay 12.5% on their Irish profits.

    And why do you think the EU commission s greedy?  Apple has to pay the tax to Ireland, not to the EU.

    Read the the quote of Reuters in first paragraph again and try to understand.  Because the quote is 100% spot on. Once you understand it, you'll know that your current post is just nonsense.



    edited January 2018 [Deleted User]muthuk_vanalingamsingularity
  • Reply 9 of 34
    So what? Either way, nothing's gonna save the sinking ship of the European Union! The water's already over its gunwales! Worst case: Apple drags its heels, and the ship sinks before any payoff.
    edited January 2018
  • Reply 10 of 34
    JanNLJanNL Posts: 258member
    jsmythe00 said:
    JanNL said:
    jsmythe00 said:
    At least they have access to quality and affordable healthcare AND a retirement age not getting pushed up or having your retirement funds spent to fund the gapig hole left by not collectingnthr proper amount of corporate tax
    Just exactly these bad things happen in EU. Don't believe all these standard media-talk.
    Healthcare isn't affordable (anymore). Retirement age is getting higher and higher. Contribution to your own (obligated) retirement is getting higher and higher and the payment when your are retired is getting lower (even retroactively!). 
    If so then at least corporations aren't getting away with legalized robbery. 

    Man, I remember the days when the government gave me a tax holiday of 5 percent on 20 years of income. 

    Wait...they never did. It's odd how the narrative is billion dollar compaines need more but working class needs less. 
    Wouldn't call it this way, but the same in the EU. You know "The double Irish with a Dutch sandwich" construction?

    Sympathy for your last remarks though.
  • Reply 11 of 34
    Hahaha serves Apple right

    Wish it was 4-5x that much. Such an unethical tax scam company.
  • Reply 12 of 34
    fallenjt said:
    No wonder, all EU companies are crushed against US companies. Let me see...is there any hi profile EU corporate anymore beside the Swiss bank? Nokia is pretty dead and trying to survive on Patent loyalty payments...any other?
    Basically, none, except for a couple of chemical, pharma, and machine tool companies.

    Other than Spotify, I can't think of a major tech company in the EU. Absolutely nothing remotely close in the league of FAANG. Heck, even China has Alibaba and Tencent, and India has Flipkart!
  • Reply 13 of 34

    kkqd1337 said:
    Hahaha serves Apple right

    Wish it was 4-5x that much. Such an unethical tax scam company.
    What "serves Apple right"? What are you blathering about? Did something happen here that we missed?
    StrangeDays
  • Reply 14 of 34
    fallenjt said:
    No wonder, all EU companies are crushed against US companies. Let me see...is there any hi profile EU corporate anymore beside the Swiss bank? Nokia is pretty dead and trying to survive on Patent loyalty payments...any other?
    Basically, none, except for a couple of chemical, pharma, and machine tool companies.

    Other than Spotify, I can't think of a major tech company in the EU. Absolutely nothing remotely close in the league of FAANG. Heck, even China has Alibaba and Tencent, and India has Flipkart!
    SAP is German.
  • Reply 15 of 34
    entropysentropys Posts: 1,619member

    Russia, for example has both "affordable healthcare" and "pension" system. The only thing I can tell you, after experiencing that as well as US healthcare (which is not in the best state), is that I would rather chose the capitalist "in-affordable" one, because any socialist "affordable" system is only affordable on paper. Why? Try "affordable" u-sound scanning done to you, for which you need to be in queue for 3-5 months to receive it. It is free, though...so it is affordable...if you don't die prior to it, that is.

    Private healthcare, services are rationed by price. Public healthcare, services are rationed by queues.

    Personally, waiting for months for a serious problem sucks, and I was amazed to discover how accepting Pommies are to wait to just see an NHS GP. But hey, pick your poison.  

    A mix is probably the best compromise, but you then have to live in a constant war with those who think everything should be free and those that get sick of paying for other peoples’ free stuff.


    But back on the EU and taxes. That Euroweenie sounds like a calf realising weaning day approaches.

    SpamSandwich
  • Reply 16 of 34
    jfanningjfanning Posts: 3,385member
    fallenjt said:
    No wonder, all EU companies are crushed against US companies. Let me see...is there any hi profile EU corporate anymore beside the Swiss bank? Nokia is pretty dead and trying to survive on Patent loyalty payments...any other?

    Um Nokia dead?  You do know they are the second largest network company in the world, and have sales of over 20 billion euro a year?  Now, can you tell me what US company is crushing Nokia?
    [Deleted User]
  • Reply 17 of 34
    fallenjt said:
    No wonder, all EU companies are crushed against US companies. Let me see...is there any hi profile EU corporate anymore beside the Swiss bank? Nokia is pretty dead and trying to survive on Patent loyalty payments...any other?

    Seems like you might have your head in the sand. There are absolutely huge companies in the EU and many do business in the US as well. 

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_European_companies_by_revenue
  • Reply 18 of 34
    fallenjt said:
    No wonder, all EU companies are crushed against US companies. Let me see...is there any hi profile EU corporate anymore beside the Swiss bank? Nokia is pretty dead and trying to survive on Patent loyalty payments...any other?
    Basically, none, except for a couple of chemical, pharma, and machine tool companies.

    Other than Spotify, I can't think of a major tech company in the EU. Absolutely nothing remotely close in the league of FAANG. Heck, even China has Alibaba and Tencent, and India has Flipkart!
    SAP is German.
    Yes, but their best days in terms of future growth opportunities are likely way behind them. It is not clear to me how cutting-edge SAP is in today's computing/IT environment.

    While SAP's market cap ($130B) is above that of Netflix ($95B), it is dwarfed by companies such as Apple ($920B), Amazon ($625B), Google ($785B), Facebook ($520B), and Microsoft ($695B). 
    anton zuykov
  • Reply 19 of 34
    Way to go Europe!! EU is the second worldwide market for Apple (behind America, but before China, and the rest of the world), I bet they're gonna pay what they owe in local taxes there and damn sure they're happy to! They wouldn't want to worry the slightest their second worldwide market regulators.
  • Reply 20 of 34
    entropysentropys Posts: 1,619member
    the price SAP charges compared with its competitors suggests its best days are behind it.
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