Channel checks, sales data on HomePod likely as wrong as it was about Apple Watch in 2015

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 52
    maestro64maestro64 Posts: 4,227member
    So Slice track a specific set of users' purchasing interest and history to determine if a product is grow or shrinking in popularity. This is great for consumable products you may buy all the time, like an Apple at the grocery store. However does this have any barring on a one and done purchase. This company only has a finite user base and if that user base is not looking or interested in a specific product there is no way for them to know what the rest of the world is doing. There is no way to estimate or extrapolate their single time purchase data to the broader markets.

    In the case of the Watch, they had a group of consumer who were interested in the Watch, they either bought one or not and their interest is now gone and they now see no purchase or interest in the watch, so this company declared Watch sales were tanking. But their finite group of consumers have move on other product and have no need to buy another watch for years. This is bad enough that this company was making prediction like this. What is worse is the news media lack any critical thinking to realize what Slice was doing.

    Folks, this is pretty black and white no gray area, Apple is either selling product or not, in some case they share the numbers and others they do not. At the end of the day, the $ in bank tells the real store. The fact Media jump of information like this is the reason we have the Fake New era, you can not trust most media outlets they spend no time on the least bit of critical analysis to see what they are about to report makes any sense. If they are doing this on simple things imagine what they do on the more complex issues.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 22 of 52
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 3,218administrator
    It would be nice if there was a chart containing the companies that routinely issue these predictions and their accuracy rate to could be up-to-date and posted with every silly rumor. It could be limited to only the recurring predictors (to keep it manageable) and it could have simple score columns: accurate or inaccurate (to keep it simple). More than 75% inaccurate, the market manipulator box is checked by companies name. In any case, I don't know any better than anyone else if HomePod is a hit or miss with the population in general. I do know that we have one and it is terrific! Music sounds fantastic, very easy to make it the output for our iPhones, iPads or AppleTV, the later of which we don't currently use as the lack of stereo sound is weird when watching TV. AirPlay2 and another HomePod purchase will fix this and then we can likely toss our Sonos system.
    We keep track of everybody behind the scenes.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 23 of 52
    jcs2305jcs2305 Posts: 462member
    zroger73 said:
    I'm on my second HomePod since launch. The first one had a problem where Siri became hard of hearing after hours/days of use. Apple refunded my money and I bought another one at a retail store. Unfortunately, it does exactly the same thing. When Siri starts going deaf, all I have to do is unplug the HomePod and plug it back in and the operation returns to "perfection"...for hours or days. Apple couldn't solve my problem with the first one, so they refunded my money. They haven't been able to figure out why the second one does the same thing, either. All I get is escalations to another department who calls back a few days later and I go through the same "infinite loop". I had hopes the 11.3 update would resolve this issue, but it didn't. I also don't like how Siri answers me too loudly at times and too softly at others independent of the volume setting. The sound quality is impressive, but the voice control makes the product too frustrating for me. My "workaround"? I plugged the HP into a digital timer that turns off the power for one minute each day.

    When it works, it's well worth the $349 I paid for it. However, having to cycle the power to get it to work is unacceptable. I find myself using my Amazon Echo devices more often. Even though the sound quality is much lower, Alexa doesn't have a hearing problem.
    So you only bought this speaker for the Siri functionality ? It works perfect with iPhone or iPad. I have never had a problem with Siri going of hearing, although I barely use Siri ... I haven’t unplugged my HomePod since I picked it up on launch day. 
    StrangeDaysmagman1979watto_cobra
  • Reply 24 of 52
    chasmchasm Posts: 756member
    It will come as a great surprise to the HomePod that it can’t stream “lesser” services. It most certainly can, via AirPlay. No, it’s not quite the same as the native Apple Music, but “pushing” a service to a Bluetooth speaker is the norm, so it’s nothing foreign or unusual.
    StrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 25 of 52
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 5,343member
    larrya said:
    I’m not sure analysts were so wrong about Apple Watch sales in 2015. Something convinced Apple to move from boutique shops in April, to Wal-marts by August. The HomePod is fatally flawed (only 1 streaming service, no stereo, Siri), just like the original watch (too slow, poor battery life, no gps).  It will improve over time, just like the watch did, but right now I have no interest in it and I don’t think I’m alone. 
    You're not alone. First gen products usually have flaws and issues that are ironed out with second gen. I have several Apple devices, but homepod doesn't interest me. If I am going to spend that much for a speaker, I might as well throw another couple hundred at it and go for a quality sound bar. $700 for stereo speakers? What year is this? 
    Oh, you mean like this quality sound bar by Bose? It’s....$700. No smart features. Oops. What year is it?

    https://www.bestbuy.com/site/bose-soundtouch-300-soundbar-black/5594801.p?skuId=5594801

    ...meanwhile, the sort of beam formed computational channel separation seen in HP only exists in 5-figure speakers. 
    edited April 12 roundaboutnowroundaboutnowMisterKitequality72521watto_cobra
  • Reply 26 of 52
    sirlance99sirlance99 Posts: 1,094member
    I got a HomePod but ONLY because I was able to get it for half off with the employee discount. Girlfriend who works there said they had more sales by the employees than actual sales to customers on launch day. 

    I looked around at other stores online and you could step right in a buy the HomePod no problem at any store around me. Not the usual, “sell out, have to wait a week or more”, to get it. 

    It it sits in my bathroom and gets used for only as long as a shower takes. Then it’s right back to my home theater system that has AirPlay as well and sounds much better. Especially with my sub. Could probably fit about 30 HomePods in my sub. And true multichannel sound is amazing. 

    HomePod sounds great for it size but is it really worth over $100 or more to sound just a little bit better? Plus you won’t be seeing these HomePods at the beach, park, poolside or anywhere else that people bring portable systems with them. So other companies still will sell a ton. 
  • Reply 27 of 52
    jdgazjdgaz Posts: 290member
    The total addressable market for HomePod is limited to the 40Million Apple Music Subscribers. I would not expect all of them to want or need one or more HomePods. That being said, we love ours and it does what it does very well. But to make this a 2 or 3 million a quarter seller Apple will need to either dramatically improve Siri and or provide support for any and all music streaming services.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 28 of 52
    SilmaSilma Posts: 1member
    You are a little harsh with Bloomberg and show bad faith too
    Google Chrome, a product I personnally despise, has certainly been a huge success in education, especially in the US.
    That's why Apple had an event recently, and new offerings, to try to get back marketshares.
    You mention the new offering and the new pricing, as if it were already successful and proved Apple's strategy was right. At the very least, it is premature. More realistically, the new launch won't suddenly allow Apple to grab significant market shares.The iPad is simply too expensive for education, even with a 10 % discount.

    You present Apple Watch like a success.
    It is, and it isn't.
    It's a 5 billion plus business, which is impressive. But remember that for most, and most probably for Apple Insider too, it was the product that was supposed to be the next big thing, the next iPhone.
    It certainly hasn't, and certainly won't. In this sense, the Apple Watch, like all the other so-called intelligent watches, is a joke.

    What about the HomePod ?
    The commercial potential is big, since Apple has lots of customers, and its customers love to pile on its products and services.

    Still, it is not objectively a good product in its present version.
    It leaks.
    People that are really interested in sound will purchase real HiFi loudspeakers.
    People that are more attracted to the smart, will be disappointed.
    The HomePod shows how Siri is limited and years behind Alexa, Google Assistant or Cortana.
    So the main market presently is the Apple customer. Which is not to be underestimated, but very small in potential volume.
    Why does volume matter this time, more than profit margin ? The success of such offering resides in the capabilities it brings you, such as ordering a pizza for you.
    Third parties won't develop 'skills' for a smart speaker unless the potential market for their service or product justify it.

  • Reply 29 of 52
    zroger73zroger73 Posts: 673member
    zroger73 said:
    I'm on my second HomePod since launch. The first one had a problem where Siri became hard of hearing after hours/days of use. Apple refunded my money and I bought another one at a retail store. Unfortunately, it does exactly the same thing. When Siri starts going deaf, all I have to do is unplug the HomePod and plug it back in and the operation returns to "perfection"...for hours or days. Apple couldn't solve my problem with the first one, so they refunded my money. They haven't been able to figure out why the second one does the same thing, either. All I get is escalations to another department who calls back a few days later and I go through the same "infinite loop". I had hopes the 11.3 update would resolve this issue, but it didn't. I also don't like how Siri answers me too loudly at times and too softly at others independent of the volume setting. The sound quality is impressive, but the voice control makes the product too frustrating for me. My "workaround"? I plugged the HP into a digital timer that turns off the power for one minute each day.

    When it works, it's well worth the $349 I paid for it. However, having to cycle the power to get it to work is unacceptable. I find myself using my Amazon Echo devices more often. Even though the sound quality is much lower, Alexa doesn't have a hearing problem.
    I can confirm that I have had exactly zero of the problems you are describing, maybe check your power/wiring situation occasionally electronics can act funny if the power to them fluctuates.
    Good suggestion, but my supply voltage is stable at 124 volts and clean according to my Rigol DS1054Z scope. The HomePod sits on a table about 20 feet form the nearest electronic device. If there was a line noise/RFI issue, I'd expect to have issues with other electronic devices - including my four Amazon Echo devices, which seem to operate flawlessly. I've about determined that my home was built on top of an ancient Indian burial ground. :(
    kruegdude
  • Reply 30 of 52

    Avon said this about a month back and it makes sense even today. It is TOO EARLY  to talk about Success/Failure of HomePod as a product. We should wait at least until end of this year to comment about HomePod's success as a product.

  • Reply 31 of 52
    zroger73 said:
    zroger73 said:
    I'm on my second HomePod since launch. The first one had a problem where Siri became hard of hearing after hours/days of use. Apple refunded my money and I bought another one at a retail store. Unfortunately, it does exactly the same thing. When Siri starts going deaf, all I have to do is unplug the HomePod and plug it back in and the operation returns to "perfection"...for hours or days. Apple couldn't solve my problem with the first one, so they refunded my money. They haven't been able to figure out why the second one does the same thing, either. All I get is escalations to another department who calls back a few days later and I go through the same "infinite loop". I had hopes the 11.3 update would resolve this issue, but it didn't. I also don't like how Siri answers me too loudly at times and too softly at others independent of the volume setting. The sound quality is impressive, but the voice control makes the product too frustrating for me. My "workaround"? I plugged the HP into a digital timer that turns off the power for one minute each day.

    When it works, it's well worth the $349 I paid for it. However, having to cycle the power to get it to work is unacceptable. I find myself using my Amazon Echo devices more often. Even though the sound quality is much lower, Alexa doesn't have a hearing problem.
    I can confirm that I have had exactly zero of the problems you are describing, maybe check your power/wiring situation occasionally electronics can act funny if the power to them fluctuates.
    Good suggestion, but my supply voltage is stable at 124 volts and clean according to my Rigol DS1054Z scope. The HomePod sits on a table about 20 feet form the nearest electronic device. If there was a line noise/RFI issue, I'd expect to have issues with other electronic devices - including my four Amazon Echo devices, which seem to operate flawlessly. I've about determined that my home was built on top of an ancient Indian burial ground. :(
    Didn't mean to sound snarky there. Based on the information you provided, power does not seem to be the case. Perhaps, it is some issue with the computational beam forming algorithms. I wonder if you put it in a different room if the issues would persist ... obviously not an acceptable solution just may be useful to narrow down the issue to the source.
    zroger73
  • Reply 32 of 52
    maestro64maestro64 Posts: 4,227member
    Silma said:
    You are a little harsh with Bloomberg and show bad faith too
    Google Chrome, a product I personnally despise, has certainly been a huge success in education, especially in the US.
    That's why Apple had an event recently, and new offerings, to try to get back marketshares.
    You mention the new offering and the new pricing, as if it were already successful and proved Apple's strategy was right. At the very least, it is premature. More realistically, the new launch won't suddenly allow Apple to grab significant market shares.The iPad is simply too expensive for education, even with a 10 % discount.

    You present Apple Watch like a success.
    It is, and it isn't.
    It's a 5 billion plus business, which is impressive. But remember that for most, and most probably for Apple Insider too, it was the product that was supposed to be the next big thing, the next iPhone.
    It certainly hasn't, and certainly won't. In this sense, the Apple Watch, like all the other so-called intelligent watches, is a joke.

    What about the HomePod ?
    The commercial potential is big, since Apple has lots of customers, and its customers love to pile on its products and services.

    Still, it is not objectively a good product in its present version.
    It leaks.
    People that are really interested in sound will purchase real HiFi loudspeakers.
    People that are more attracted to the smart, will be disappointed.
    The HomePod shows how Siri is limited and years behind Alexa, Google Assistant or Cortana.
    So the main market presently is the Apple customer. Which is not to be underestimated, but very small in potential volume.
    Why does volume matter this time, more than profit margin ? The success of such offering resides in the capabilities it brings you, such as ordering a pizza for you.
    Third parties won't develop 'skills' for a smart speaker unless the potential market for their service or product justify it.


    So you joined to share your option, thanks, but we not talking personal opinions, where are your facts.

    Google Chrome for schools has not replace the installed based PC and Apple product, they just made a small dent in the over all market.

    The Watch is big, it is outselling all it competitors from a $ stand point, as it was state it even out sold the entire watch industry. No one ever said it was going to replace the phone from an over revenue standpoint, please sight someone from Apple making that specific statement.

    All the audiophile have weighted in on the Homepod and they all said it has near perfect sound reproduction and better than products which are 10X the cost. Yeah most people can not tell the difference in what good sound and okay sound, I hope they know what bad sound quality sounds like. This is even back up with actual audio sound measurements not someone opinion. As we know Apple never said it assistant first product, but the horsepower is there for it to evolve over time.
    magman1979StrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 33 of 52
    jcs2305jcs2305 Posts: 462member
    chasm said:
    It will come as a great surprise to the HomePod that it can’t stream “lesser” services. It most certainly can, via AirPlay. No, it’s not quite the same as the native Apple Music, but “pushing” a service to a Bluetooth speaker is the norm, so it’s nothing foreign or unusual.
    I have stated this same thing regarding airplay multiple times. I also agree Bluetooth works the same way yet folks are so upset that the homepod doesn't have everything and every service baked in with Siri control. There is so much misinformation and general shade being tossed around regarding this product. It's a shame actually because it is a SOLID little speaker.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 34 of 52
    jcs2305jcs2305 Posts: 462member
    I got a HomePod but ONLY because I was able to get it for half off with the employee discount. Girlfriend who works there said they had more sales by the employees than actual sales to customers on launch day. 

    I looked around at other stores online and you could step right in a buy the HomePod no problem at any store around me. Not the usual, “sell out, have to wait a week or more”, to get it. 

    It it sits in my bathroom and gets used for only as long as a shower takes. Then it’s right back to my home theater system that has AirPlay as well and sounds much better. Especially with my sub. Could probably fit about 30 HomePods in my sub. And true multichannel sound is amazing. 

    HomePod sounds great for it size but is it really worth over $100 or more to sound just a little bit better? Plus you won’t be seeing these HomePods at the beach, park, poolside or anywhere else that people bring portable systems with them. So other companies still will sell a ton. 
    $100.00 or more than what product? Sonos Play 3, Play 5 or Home Max?  What the heck are you even talking about?  You've come with that I use it in the bathroom xcomment before and then proceed to talk about your airplay capable HT system?  Why? It's not the same product or meant to replace a HT set up.. so that comparison makes zero sense.  When I watch a movie I still default to my HT setup as well with powered sub as well. . Homepod isn't meant to replace the impact or enveloping sound of a receiver driven HT receiver with a large sub. In a small area it can give you nice impact and clearer dialogue but I personally wouldn't replace my set up with even two homepods.

    To listen to music in the main area of my house by myself or with people over, or playing audiobooks or youtube while I work at home it does a great job.
    StrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 35 of 52
    macplusplusmacplusplus Posts: 1,297member
    zroger73 said:
    zroger73 said:
    I'm on my second HomePod since launch. The first one had a problem where Siri became hard of hearing after hours/days of use. Apple refunded my money and I bought another one at a retail store. Unfortunately, it does exactly the same thing. When Siri starts going deaf, all I have to do is unplug the HomePod and plug it back in and the operation returns to "perfection"...for hours or days. Apple couldn't solve my problem with the first one, so they refunded my money. They haven't been able to figure out why the second one does the same thing, either. All I get is escalations to another department who calls back a few days later and I go through the same "infinite loop". I had hopes the 11.3 update would resolve this issue, but it didn't. I also don't like how Siri answers me too loudly at times and too softly at others independent of the volume setting. The sound quality is impressive, but the voice control makes the product too frustrating for me. My "workaround"? I plugged the HP into a digital timer that turns off the power for one minute each day.

    When it works, it's well worth the $349 I paid for it. However, having to cycle the power to get it to work is unacceptable. I find myself using my Amazon Echo devices more often. Even though the sound quality is much lower, Alexa doesn't have a hearing problem.
    I can confirm that I have had exactly zero of the problems you are describing, maybe check your power/wiring situation occasionally electronics can act funny if the power to them fluctuates.
    Good suggestion, but my supply voltage is stable at 124 volts and clean according to my Rigol DS1054Z scope. The HomePod sits on a table about 20 feet form the nearest electronic device. If there was a line noise/RFI issue, I'd expect to have issues with other electronic devices - including my four Amazon Echo devices, which seem to operate flawlessly. I've about determined that my home was built on top of an ancient Indian burial ground. :(
    Or maybe has a weirdly acting wi-fi installation? Your router's "connect on demand" feature maybe?
  • Reply 36 of 52
    DAalsethDAalseth Posts: 254member
    maestro64 said:
    All the audiophile have weighted in on the Homepod and they all said it has near perfect sound reproduction and better than products which are 10X the cost. Yeah most people can not tell the difference in what good sound and okay sound, I hope they know what bad sound quality sounds like. This is even back up with actual audio sound measurements not someone opinion. As we know Apple never said it assistant first product, but the horsepower is there for it to evolve over time.
    Yes the sound quality is phenomenal. The issue most people don't care. Look at all the people listening to broadcast radio on their stock car speakers, listening to cheap earbuds, listening to the speakers built into their iPad or iPhone. Most people want to hear sound, radio broadcast, an old playlist, something,  while they do something else. The old favorite tune they ripped from a scratchy LP is good enough. So the HomePod may have fantastic sound, but the trouble that few people care about that enough to plunk down three and a half bills for one.
    edited April 12 watto_cobranunzy
  • Reply 37 of 52
    zroger73zroger73 Posts: 673member
    zroger73 said:
    zroger73 said:
    I'm on my second HomePod since launch. The first one had a problem where Siri became hard of hearing after hours/days of use. Apple refunded my money and I bought another one at a retail store. Unfortunately, it does exactly the same thing. When Siri starts going deaf, all I have to do is unplug the HomePod and plug it back in and the operation returns to "perfection"...for hours or days. Apple couldn't solve my problem with the first one, so they refunded my money. They haven't been able to figure out why the second one does the same thing, either. All I get is escalations to another department who calls back a few days later and I go through the same "infinite loop". I had hopes the 11.3 update would resolve this issue, but it didn't. I also don't like how Siri answers me too loudly at times and too softly at others independent of the volume setting. The sound quality is impressive, but the voice control makes the product too frustrating for me. My "workaround"? I plugged the HP into a digital timer that turns off the power for one minute each day.

    When it works, it's well worth the $349 I paid for it. However, having to cycle the power to get it to work is unacceptable. I find myself using my Amazon Echo devices more often. Even though the sound quality is much lower, Alexa doesn't have a hearing problem.
    I can confirm that I have had exactly zero of the problems you are describing, maybe check your power/wiring situation occasionally electronics can act funny if the power to them fluctuates.
    Good suggestion, but my supply voltage is stable at 124 volts and clean according to my Rigol DS1054Z scope. The HomePod sits on a table about 20 feet form the nearest electronic device. If there was a line noise/RFI issue, I'd expect to have issues with other electronic devices - including my four Amazon Echo devices, which seem to operate flawlessly. I've about determined that my home was built on top of an ancient Indian burial ground. :(
    Or maybe has a weirdly acting wi-fi installation? Your router's "connect on demand" feature maybe?
    I'd think/hope the HomePod would be fully tested and compatible with Apple's own AirPort Extreme router, which is the latest version running the latest firmware. :)

    Siri doesn't stop working completely after hours/days, she just simply becomes so hard of hearing that I have to walk up to the HomePod and almost scream in order for her to start listening and process my request. As long as she hears me, she does what I ask (within the capability of the unit). This issue only occurs when the HomePod is playing something - even at a low volume level.

    Regarding the suggestion of trying a different location, the HomePod normally sits near the dining room, but I've moved it into the kitchen. Of course, it worked great right after moving it because the power was cycles, but hours late it started doing the same thing again. It's so strange because it's AMAZING how well Siri hears me right after a power cycle - she can hear me even while playing music at 100% volume even when I can't hear myself! But, after some time passes the joy turns into frustration. A power cycle will temporarily resolve the issue every...single...time. I've enabled/disabled Siri and various other settings on my iPhone and Watch, unpaired/re-paired, full reset - all per Apple without resolve.

    A few others have reported the same or similar issue, so I'm not alone although this appears to be very isolated.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/HomePod/comments/7wu97o/siri_suddenly_lost_its_ability_to_hear_me/
    https://www.reddit.com/r/apple/comments/829hzn/sometimes_the_homepod_cant_hear_me_and_i_have_to/

  • Reply 38 of 52
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 5,343member
    Silma said:

    You present Apple Watch like a success.
    It is, and it isn't.
    It's a 5 billion plus business, which is impressive. But remember that for most, and most probably for Apple Insider too, it was the product that was supposed to be the next big thing, the next iPhone.
    It certainly hasn't, and certainly won't. In this sense, the Apple Watch, like all the other so-called intelligent watches, is a joke.

    What a load of bollocks. Please quote which Apple exec said the AW would be as big as iPhone? Despite it being, you know, only an accessory to an iPhone...And a quite limited one at that (iPhone: pocket computing platform to do a million things. AW: wrist, almost no screen, no keyboard, very limited processor capacity, etc etc..)

    Those of us grounded in reality understand that the iPhone, as the single most profitable & successful consumer product in history, is unique. There may never be another hit like it in our lifetimes. So to compare the AW sales to this singularity and claim "AW is failure!" is simply stupid. 

    AW is a success. Why? Because it makes a shit-ton of money, that's why. EOS. Save the phony narrative.
    edited April 12 GG1equality72521watto_cobra
  • Reply 39 of 52
    sfolaxsfolax Posts: 22member
    And two articles later we have this - https://appleinsider.com/articles/18/04/12/homepod-suppliers-allegedly-facing-order-volume-cut-after-poor-sales-performance

    There definitely isn't a "united front" when it comes to articles out of AI. DED seems to go against everyone.
  • Reply 40 of 52
    foggyhillfoggyhill Posts: 4,733member
    The one thing that shows how bs that is ... THE HOMEPOD HAS ONLY BEEN SOLD IN 30% of Apple's overall markets.

    So, unless orders are way way way lower than expected, a cut when not even sold in most of the world makes no fracking sense at all.

    So, I'm calling bullshit on that claim cause it makes no sense from a manufacturing, marketing and distribution point of view
    rochfordwatto_cobra
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