Our biggest gripes with Apple's 2018 iPad

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Comments

  • Reply 61 of 74
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 2,341member
    Soli said:
    Soli said:
    Soli said:
    I don't understand why anyone is upset by an article that details why this education-focused iPad is able to be considerably less expensive than their other models. I appreciate the research into how this seemingly identical looking iPad is able to undercut their other models so drastically despite including a digitizer. For those that are butt hurt by this article you really should try to look things objectively. Prior to this article I thought that the 2018 model would be a great replacement for many people that I know with iPads, but now I see that there are limitations that will likely lead me to suggest Apple's more expensive options to get that improved user experience.

    But one must wonder.... is Apple disappointed in itself for not being able to keep their hardware fully leading-edge with each release? Or are they just after the dollars after all?
    1) That's like saying Apple is disappointed with MacBook and Mac mini updates because they're not using all the same leading-edge technology as the MacBook Pro and Mac Pro.

    2) Of course they're after a profit.
    Many have explained why VERY clearly.
    My own explanation was:
    Denigrating a Toyota Camry because it doesn't have the same features as a Lexus ES is, frankly, ridiculous.  If he had posed the title and the tone of the video as to why one might prefer a Lexus to a Toyota, it would have been fine.  But instead he chose to trash a very fine product.

    Further, in today's world, things get twisted to serve a purpose.  I won't be surprised if I see an article or video coming out "Apple Insider trashes new iPad -- thinks its junk".

    If I wasn't more knowledgeable of Apple products and I read this review from a supposed Apple loyalist, I would think was junk too.  But, having bought one (for my grandson) and used it, I know that this video is very misleading. 
    I didn't get any of that from the article, and I'm not sure I'd compare the an inexpensive Toyota to an expensive Lexus when there's no direct comparison since those automobiles are very not mistakable to the buyer. Hell, even with VW and Audi the similarities seem to end with the chassis, which the buyer can't see.

    You mean being an "Apple loyalist." Well now you have a single article that will note why your iPad isn't the same as a nearly identical looking educational iPad if you ever need to assert why your purchase asserts your loyalty.
    "I didn't get any of that from the article"
    From the comments here, you stand pretty much alone in that assertion.  And, if you don't have time to actually watch the video, perhaps just read the title: 

    Our biggest gripes with Apple's 2018 iPad

    further, my analogy of trashing the Toyota Camry because it doesn't measure up to the high standards of the Lexus ES is entirely appropriate because, both this video and that analogy are comparing a "consumer grade" product to a high end luxury product costing twice made by the same manufacturer -- and then using that comparison to trash the consumer grade product.   That's just stupid.

    I would respond to your last paragraph -- but it makes no sense.
    I think you're really missing the point. Pretty much anyone can look at a $20k car and a $80k car and know which one is better than the other, even without knowing anything specific about either model. It's easily discernible in how they look, especially in your general and luxury brands from the same manufacturer example.

    That's simply not the case with two 10" iPads, and if you look the 11" iPad Pro you're going to get people who think that you're paying an excessive amount more for less larger diagonal display. This article makes it very clear why this is a low-cost iPad for the education market. That shouldn't be a problem for anyone.

    Why so much animosity in making these basic comparisons? Is your self-professed "loyalist" attitude toward Apple so wrapped up in your identity that you really don't want anyone else to have their products unless they're wiling to pay a premium price for it? If you hate this iPad then you'd really hate my vision for getting less-expensive Macs into consumers' hands.

    I really don't understand why anyone could be against an educational iPad. I think this was a sorely needed area and I'm glad Apple found a way to get this made… and with a digitizer, no less. I just hope it's popular enough to keep up the momentum for a long time to come.
    "Why so much animosity in making these basic comparisons?"
    Why?  Because, as I and many others have pointed out:  It was not a "comparison".  He was unfairly trashing the 2018 iPad.   Again, in case you missed it the first time -- and the second time:

    Our biggest gripes with Apple's 2018 iPad

    As for your concern that people will confuse the iPad with the iPad Pro.   Should he also trash the MacBook because it isn't a MacBook Pro?   Or the iMac because it isn't an iMac Pro?   (heavy sigh...)
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 62 of 74
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 2,341member
    avon b7 said:
    Soli said:
    kbeat said:
    Really odd editorial on AppleInsider. Just below a header for a review proclaiming the new iPad an absolute steal, there is this article suggesting it's not worth the tradeoffs in 2018. It can't really be both. 
    Sure it can. It all depends on what features are important to the buyer.
    ...
    The title of this piece says 'our gripes'. Some users might consider them gripes and others might not. ...
    ... And some might think an orange is orange and others might not...
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 63 of 74
    DuhSesameDuhSesame Posts: 237member
    avon b7 said:
    Soli said:
    kbeat said:
    Really odd editorial on AppleInsider. Just below a header for a review proclaiming the new iPad an absolute steal, there is this article suggesting it's not worth the tradeoffs in 2018. It can't really be both. 
    Sure it can. It all depends on what features are important to the buyer.
    ...
    The title of this piece says 'our gripes'. Some users might consider them gripes and others might not. ...
    ... And some might think an orange is orange and others might not...
    How about
    “Our biggest gripes about the low-cost 2018 iPad”
  • Reply 64 of 74
    SoliSoli Posts: 7,656member
    Soli said:
    Soli said:
    Soli said:
    I don't understand why anyone is upset by an article that details why this education-focused iPad is able to be considerably less expensive than their other models. I appreciate the research into how this seemingly identical looking iPad is able to undercut their other models so drastically despite including a digitizer. For those that are butt hurt by this article you really should try to look things objectively. Prior to this article I thought that the 2018 model would be a great replacement for many people that I know with iPads, but now I see that there are limitations that will likely lead me to suggest Apple's more expensive options to get that improved user experience.

    But one must wonder.... is Apple disappointed in itself for not being able to keep their hardware fully leading-edge with each release? Or are they just after the dollars after all?
    1) That's like saying Apple is disappointed with MacBook and Mac mini updates because they're not using all the same leading-edge technology as the MacBook Pro and Mac Pro.

    2) Of course they're after a profit.
    Many have explained why VERY clearly.
    My own explanation was:
    Denigrating a Toyota Camry because it doesn't have the same features as a Lexus ES is, frankly, ridiculous.  If he had posed the title and the tone of the video as to why one might prefer a Lexus to a Toyota, it would have been fine.  But instead he chose to trash a very fine product.

    Further, in today's world, things get twisted to serve a purpose.  I won't be surprised if I see an article or video coming out "Apple Insider trashes new iPad -- thinks its junk".

    If I wasn't more knowledgeable of Apple products and I read this review from a supposed Apple loyalist, I would think was junk too.  But, having bought one (for my grandson) and used it, I know that this video is very misleading. 
    I didn't get any of that from the article, and I'm not sure I'd compare the an inexpensive Toyota to an expensive Lexus when there's no direct comparison since those automobiles are very not mistakable to the buyer. Hell, even with VW and Audi the similarities seem to end with the chassis, which the buyer can't see.

    You mean being an "Apple loyalist." Well now you have a single article that will note why your iPad isn't the same as a nearly identical looking educational iPad if you ever need to assert why your purchase asserts your loyalty.
    "I didn't get any of that from the article"
    From the comments here, you stand pretty much alone in that assertion.  And, if you don't have time to actually watch the video, perhaps just read the title: 

    Our biggest gripes with Apple's 2018 iPad

    further, my analogy of trashing the Toyota Camry because it doesn't measure up to the high standards of the Lexus ES is entirely appropriate because, both this video and that analogy are comparing a "consumer grade" product to a high end luxury product costing twice made by the same manufacturer -- and then using that comparison to trash the consumer grade product.   That's just stupid.

    I would respond to your last paragraph -- but it makes no sense.
    I think you're really missing the point. Pretty much anyone can look at a $20k car and a $80k car and know which one is better than the other, even without knowing anything specific about either model. It's easily discernible in how they look, especially in your general and luxury brands from the same manufacturer example.

    That's simply not the case with two 10" iPads, and if you look the 11" iPad Pro you're going to get people who think that you're paying an excessive amount more for less larger diagonal display. This article makes it very clear why this is a low-cost iPad for the education market. That shouldn't be a problem for anyone.

    Why so much animosity in making these basic comparisons? Is your self-professed "loyalist" attitude toward Apple so wrapped up in your identity that you really don't want anyone else to have their products unless they're wiling to pay a premium price for it? If you hate this iPad then you'd really hate my vision for getting less-expensive Macs into consumers' hands.

    I really don't understand why anyone could be against an educational iPad. I think this was a sorely needed area and I'm glad Apple found a way to get this made… and with a digitizer, no less. I just hope it's popular enough to keep up the momentum for a long time to come.
    "Why so much animosity in making these basic comparisons?"
    Why?  Because, as I and many others have pointed out:  It was not a "comparison".  He was unfairly trashing the 2018 iPad.   Again, in case you missed it the first time -- and the second time:

    Our biggest gripes with Apple's 2018 iPad

    As for your concern that people will confuse the iPad with the iPad Pro.   Should he also trash the MacBook because it isn't a MacBook Pro?   Or the iMac because it isn't an iMac Pro?   (heavy sigh...)
    They literally compare every point they make. Why do you feel that a comparison can't "express a complaint or grumble about something, especially something trivial." Based on your comments and repeated use of their article title as a defense you keep reinforcing their article. It sure sounds like you're saying their comparisons are trivial.

    Q: Do you have more knowledge about this 2018 iPad than before you read the article?
    edited April 13
  • Reply 65 of 74
    You get what you pay for!  Apple not going give you something that cost 2X as much and put it into a budget iPad that is for educational use.  Even I can do the math on this!
  • Reply 66 of 74
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 2,341member
    Soli said:
    Soli said:
    Soli said:
    Soli said:
    I don't understand why anyone is upset by an article that details why this education-focused iPad is able to be considerably less expensive than their other models. I appreciate the research into how this seemingly identical looking iPad is able to undercut their other models so drastically despite including a digitizer. For those that are butt hurt by this article you really should try to look things objectively. Prior to this article I thought that the 2018 model would be a great replacement for many people that I know with iPads, but now I see that there are limitations that will likely lead me to suggest Apple's more expensive options to get that improved user experience.

    But one must wonder.... is Apple disappointed in itself for not being able to keep their hardware fully leading-edge with each release? Or are they just after the dollars after all?
    1) That's like saying Apple is disappointed with MacBook and Mac mini updates because they're not using all the same leading-edge technology as the MacBook Pro and Mac Pro.

    2) Of course they're after a profit.
    Many have explained why VERY clearly.
    My own explanation was:
    Denigrating a Toyota Camry because it doesn't have the same features as a Lexus ES is, frankly, ridiculous.  If he had posed the title and the tone of the video as to why one might prefer a Lexus to a Toyota, it would have been fine.  But instead he chose to trash a very fine product.

    Further, in today's world, things get twisted to serve a purpose.  I won't be surprised if I see an article or video coming out "Apple Insider trashes new iPad -- thinks its junk".

    If I wasn't more knowledgeable of Apple products and I read this review from a supposed Apple loyalist, I would think was junk too.  But, having bought one (for my grandson) and used it, I know that this video is very misleading. 
    I didn't get any of that from the article, and I'm not sure I'd compare the an inexpensive Toyota to an expensive Lexus when there's no direct comparison since those automobiles are very not mistakable to the buyer. Hell, even with VW and Audi the similarities seem to end with the chassis, which the buyer can't see.

    You mean being an "Apple loyalist." Well now you have a single article that will note why your iPad isn't the same as a nearly identical looking educational iPad if you ever need to assert why your purchase asserts your loyalty.
    "I didn't get any of that from the article"
    From the comments here, you stand pretty much alone in that assertion.  And, if you don't have time to actually watch the video, perhaps just read the title: 

    Our biggest gripes with Apple's 2018 iPad

    further, my analogy of trashing the Toyota Camry because it doesn't measure up to the high standards of the Lexus ES is entirely appropriate because, both this video and that analogy are comparing a "consumer grade" product to a high end luxury product costing twice made by the same manufacturer -- and then using that comparison to trash the consumer grade product.   That's just stupid.

    I would respond to your last paragraph -- but it makes no sense.
    I think you're really missing the point. Pretty much anyone can look at a $20k car and a $80k car and know which one is better than the other, even without knowing anything specific about either model. It's easily discernible in how they look, especially in your general and luxury brands from the same manufacturer example.

    That's simply not the case with two 10" iPads, and if you look the 11" iPad Pro you're going to get people who think that you're paying an excessive amount more for less larger diagonal display. This article makes it very clear why this is a low-cost iPad for the education market. That shouldn't be a problem for anyone.

    Why so much animosity in making these basic comparisons? Is your self-professed "loyalist" attitude toward Apple so wrapped up in your identity that you really don't want anyone else to have their products unless they're wiling to pay a premium price for it? If you hate this iPad then you'd really hate my vision for getting less-expensive Macs into consumers' hands.

    I really don't understand why anyone could be against an educational iPad. I think this was a sorely needed area and I'm glad Apple found a way to get this made… and with a digitizer, no less. I just hope it's popular enough to keep up the momentum for a long time to come.
    "Why so much animosity in making these basic comparisons?"
    Why?  Because, as I and many others have pointed out:  It was not a "comparison".  He was unfairly trashing the 2018 iPad.   Again, in case you missed it the first time -- and the second time:

    Our biggest gripes with Apple's 2018 iPad

    As for your concern that people will confuse the iPad with the iPad Pro.   Should he also trash the MacBook because it isn't a MacBook Pro?   Or the iMac because it isn't an iMac Pro?   (heavy sigh...)
    They literally compare every point they make. Why do you feel that a comparison can't "express a complaint or grumble about something, especially something trivial." Based on your comments and repeated use of their article title as a defense you keep reinforcing their article. It sure sounds like you're saying their comparisons are trivial.

    Q: Do you have more knowledge about this 2018 iPad than before you read the article?
    As I and others have said repeatedly, comparing a consumer level product to a high end product and then denigrating the consumer product simply because it doesn't have the features of the high end product is simply a way of trashing the consumer product.  My analogy of calling a Toyota Camry junk because it doesn't measure up to a Lexus EX stands:  the Camry is a quality product, solid and fully functional for most normal uses -- and so is the 2018 iPad.

    But you keep insisting that this is an impartial comparison -- which, for the third time, not even the author agrees with you because his title is not about comparison it is:

    Our biggest gripes with Apple's 2018 iPad

    You can try to redefine the meaning of the word "gripe" (which you have already tried), but a gripe is a complaint.  period.  And the body of the article bears that out.  It's griping about the supposed deficiencies of the 2018 iPad.  For instance: griping about It's "obsolete retina display"...

    And, to answer your question, no, I learned nothing about either iPad from this article that I didn't already know.   Zero.

    The danger of this article, is somebody who doesn't know as much about the two will take this article and believe the author that 2018 iPad is junk because of his "gripes" about it. 

  • Reply 67 of 74
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 2,317member
    avon b7 said:
    Soli said:
    kbeat said:
    Really odd editorial on AppleInsider. Just below a header for a review proclaiming the new iPad an absolute steal, there is this article suggesting it's not worth the tradeoffs in 2018. It can't really be both. 
    Sure it can. It all depends on what features are important to the buyer.
    ...
    The title of this piece says 'our gripes'. Some users might consider them gripes and others might not. ...
    ... And some might think an orange is orange and others might not...
    Yes but would that be enough to criticise those some when they made it clear it was their opinion and went so far to support it?

    The 'gripes' are valid and so is the opinion that this is a budget iPad and as such will come with 'limitations'.

    The main point is that these 'gripes/limitations' have been laid bare and the user can make decisions taking them into account.

    To take it a step further, one could argue that some very old tech has been used on this machine when it wasn't entirely necessary. That could be seen as a case of extreme penny pinching.

    Whatever the case, I'd much rather have this information before purchase than after.
  • Reply 68 of 74
    Among lots of good reviews, this one is pretty pointless. Basically you are criticising the iPad lacks all the features from the iPad Pro. If it HAD all those features, it would be called "pro", and costs as much as the pro?
    GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 69 of 74
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 2,317member
    SiSander said:
    Among lots of good reviews, this one is pretty pointless. Basically you are criticising the iPad lacks all the features from the iPad Pro. If it HAD all those features, it would be called "pro", and costs as much as the pro?
    It wasn't a review. It focuses on the gripes. There are other articles here that look at this iPad from a different perspective.
  • Reply 70 of 74
    wizard69 said:
    Apparently Apple Insider doesn't grasp the concept of low cost.

    Yes, there is a reason that Apple positioned the new iPad as targeting the education market... because it's good enough for that market while still making plenty of money until next year's model comes out.

    But one must wonder.... is Apple disappointed in itself for not being able to keep their hardware fully leading-edge with each release? Or are they just after the dollars after all?
    Apple sells a fully-leading edge iPad—it’s called the iPad Pro. It costs $649. Should they just stop there, and not even bother bringing a $329 iPad to market? Maybe nobody should be able to buy a $329 iPad? Is only the $649 iPad Pro suitable?

    Is Apple “disappointed in itself” that they are able to produce an excellent product at $649 while also offering an excellent $329 product?

    Is Apple “disappointed in itself” that the $1,799 entry level 27” 5K iMac isn’t the fully leading-edge $4,999 iMac Pro?

    Is Apple “disappointed in itself” that the $349 iPhone SE isn’t the fully leading-edge $999 iPhone X? Should they be disappointed in the $699 iPhone 8? It’s certainly not as leading edge as the iPhone X. 

    Apple sells products with various price/performance/features that range from entry level to top of the line. Older, less expensive, less leading-edge components are typically  used to reduce costs in the entry level models. One must wonder why you think Apple should be “disappointed in itself” for doing so. 
    muthuk_vanalingamGeorgeBMac
  • Reply 71 of 74
    charlitunacharlituna Posts: 7,174member
    CobraGuy said:
    Well, I guess there is a reason why it costs half as much?
    Right. How did they think Apple was going to cut the price? It’s a business so cutting all profit wasn’t going to happen
  • Reply 72 of 74
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 2,341member
    avon b7 said:
    avon b7 said:
    Soli said:
    kbeat said:
    Really odd editorial on AppleInsider. Just below a header for a review proclaiming the new iPad an absolute steal, there is this article suggesting it's not worth the tradeoffs in 2018. It can't really be both. 
    Sure it can. It all depends on what features are important to the buyer.
    ...
    The title of this piece says 'our gripes'. Some users might consider them gripes and others might not. ...
    ... And some might think an orange is orange and others might not...
    Yes but would that be enough to criticise those some when they made it clear it was their opinion and went so far to support it?

    The 'gripes' are valid and so is the opinion that this is a budget iPad and as such will come with 'limitations'.

    The main point is that these 'gripes/limitations' have been laid bare and the user can make decisions taking them into account.

    To take it a step further, one could argue that some very old tech has been used on this machine when it wasn't entirely necessary. That could be seen as a case of extreme penny pinching.

    Whatever the case, I'd much rather have this information before purchase than after.
    LOL...
    So you think those who decide their opinion trumps reality should be above criticism?   S A D !

    What is even more sad, is how you then go on to try to justify those opinions with distorted so called "facts":
    "Very Old Tech"....   ROFL...   Yep!  That retina display sure is obsolete...  I can't imagine why Apple continues to push those dinosaurs on us!   /s
  • Reply 73 of 74
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 2,341member
    avon b7 said:
    SiSander said:
    Among lots of good reviews, this one is pretty pointless. Basically you are criticising the iPad lacks all the features from the iPad Pro. If it HAD all those features, it would be called "pro", and costs as much as the pro?
    It wasn't a review. It focuses on the gripes. There are other articles here that look at this iPad from a different perspective.
    Ahhh!  Yeh!  Now I get it!
    We should all be griping because the iPad is not the iPad Pro at half the cost!
    Damn Apple!  You screwed us again!   /s
  • Reply 74 of 74
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 2,317member
    avon b7 said:
    SiSander said:
    Among lots of good reviews, this one is pretty pointless. Basically you are criticising the iPad lacks all the features from the iPad Pro. If it HAD all those features, it would be called "pro", and costs as much as the pro?
    It wasn't a review. It focuses on the gripes. There are other articles here that look at this iPad from a different perspective.
    Ahhh!  Yeh!  Now I get it!
    We should all be griping because the iPad is not the iPad Pro at half the cost!
    Damn Apple!  You screwed us again!   /s
    This one of your earlier contributions to this thread:

    "This article sounds like it was written by a Droid fan -- picking a great product apart just to pick it apart.
    I could have tolerated this if it were titled and treated as a comparison between the iPad and iPad Pro.  But "Our Biggest Gripes with..."  makes it a negative review of the 2018 iPad.  It would even have been ok if he had titled it and structured it as: "Why I like the iPad Pro more than the 2018 iPad".

    This isn't "picking a great product apart just to pick it apart".

    It's not a 'negative review' either. It's a roundup of the not so great aspects that potential buyers should be aware of. Some (such as the non-laminated display) were mentioned as heads up to those who may be using older iPads with laminated displays but still considering this new one. Others were pointers to other aspects that could affect everyday use. IMO it is unforgivable and a deal breaker that the TouchID setup was so old when better, faster options are readily available on Apple's virtually oldest, still shipping phones.

    When you purchase any Apple product, you weigh up the pros and contras. You can get the 'pros' literally everywhere (starting at Apple and including AI). Getting the 'contras' is a little harder. Having them rounded up and laid out clearly - and under a clear title - is in the interest of most people who want to weigh things up.

    It doesn't matter who wrote it (Droid or Apple fan - or both!) as long as the information is correct.



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