Ralph Nader once again assails Apple's stock buybacks

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Comments

  • Reply 41 of 90
    Nader’s still alive?!
    dewmeJWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 42 of 90
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    markbyrn said:
    Must hurt Tim to see an iconic legend of left-wing ideology blasting him.  Does Mr. Nadar have a podcast that Apple can shut down?
    False Equivalency.   Very false.
    dysamoriawatto_cobra
  • Reply 43 of 90
    jcs2305jcs2305 Posts: 1,309member
    rezwits said:
     Apple is so there, and MAN WOW, am I seeing a GRIZNIP of Watches. 
    So far, I've yet to see even one Apple Watch outside of an Apple Store. Yeah Man, right on, they are taking over the world... MEH

    I see a number of things that could be really great but get released in a half hearted, half completed state or as in the new MacPro, delayed and delayed.
    They are just not delivering on their promises. 

    To put it bluntly, some asses need kicking inside Apple.
    Do you walk around with your eyes closed? Do you not realize what an actual apple watch looks like on someone's wrists?  You must live in a tiny town where you know all 25 people and they happen to not have an Apple Watch.. or you're completely full of sh**. I am not sure which it is.  So no Apple watches and you are really concerned about the Mac Pro... Yea you're full of sh**.
    JWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 44 of 90
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    Nader, brings up some good points.   There are a lot of questions and issues around Apple's stock buy backs -- and pointing to the comparison of Apple under Steve (who abhorred such things) to Apple under Tim is a fair one.  

    However, in his criticism of Tim he conveniently omitted a critical factor:   Such buybacks and high dividends were not initiated by Tim but forced by activist shareholders trying to extract cash from the company.

    While I am agnostic about whether Apple should have spent the money on environmental issues and employee pensions, etc., I do find it disturbing that they could not have found a better way to invest the money.  It's like they don't believe in their own company.  And, that was Steve's objection to such things:   His passion for the organization would have not allowed him to enrich himself and others at the organization's expense.  I think it is clear that Steve would have put the money back into the company and its products.
    dysamoria
  • Reply 45 of 90
    ascii said:
    Speaking of Apple's cash pile, Elon Musk recently claimed to have secured funding to take Tesla private. I wonder if it could be Apple?
    Hell no. 
  • Reply 46 of 90
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 10,326member
    Apple reaching the trillion dollar market cap may turn out to be a problem rather than a benefit. Apple now has a HUGE target on its back and the Marxists (communists, socialists, liberals, etc.) are crawling out of the woodwork to make Apple the poster boy of their anti-capitalist rantings. It’s only just begun. I’m betting you will see Apple being portrayed in a negative light in political ads this Fall from the likes of Sanders and Ocasio-Cortez and their Socialist minions. Mike Daisey style monologues will be revived in documentaries and stage shows, all to point out the evils of Capitalism.

    Bottom line, the division between economic and social ideologies is as clear in the general population as it is right here in this comment thread. 
    rwx9901watto_cobra
  • Reply 47 of 90
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,523member
    DAalseth said:
    It's sad to see a person who once was a great consumer rights advocate reduced to a whining luddite. His high point was Unsafe at any Speed, and it's been downhill from there. The only thing he didn't say is "get off my lawn". Why does anyone pay attention to someone so badly out of touch? If he want's to rail about something there are FAR more pressing things he could use his voice for. 
    So true but he knows that criticizing Apple gets him in the news faster than anything else he could say.
    edited August 2018 DAalsethJWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 48 of 90
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,523member
    ascii said:
    Speaking of Apple's cash pile, Elon Musk recently claimed to have secured funding to take Tesla private. I wonder if it could be Apple?
    I joked about that very thing and got ripped a new one by the experts here as they 'know' it is the Saudis.  Honestly I have no idea either way.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 49 of 90
    GG1GG1 Posts: 483member
    darelrex said:
    The positive accomplishments of Nader's Corvair exposé might be just a happy coincidence. Consider Upton Sinclair, who is heralded today for exposing the horrors of the meat-packing industry in his book, "The Jungle," which resulted in the pure-food-and-drug laws. But if you read that book, you find that he was really a hard-left socialist who was trying to convince his readers that meat-industry abuses are just one example of the inevitable evils of free-market economics, and the cure is a government-run economy. Maybe Nader, like Sinclair, wasn't really trying to get Chevy to make safer cars -- he was trying to convince people to replace market economics with state socialism.
    Sinclair wasn't being subtle about pushing socialism in "The Jungle." Nader? I don't know, but that's an interesting thought. Nader attacked the whole US car industry (actually cars sold in the US, as the VW Beetle was cited in his book), so taken at face value, I'd say no, but in hindsight, maybe you're right.

    And the Corvair was a great car; just a bit different. ;)
  • Reply 50 of 90
    Back when the environment really was a disaster, and the bulk of the third world was living in abject poverty.“

    The planet's on fire and most of the “third world” still live in abject poverty!

    Glad to see Nader still active, challenging corporate power, and making cogent critiques.  The status quo still supports capitalist inequalities and greed over responsibility and community.



    GeorgeBMacdysamoriaelectrosoft
  • Reply 51 of 90
    "It could have been used — two percent of it to double the income of the serf laborers, 1.3 million Chinese laborers in the contractor that builds the iPhones." Nader doesn't realize that Apple is a customer of its foreign suppliers. It's like admonishing customers of McDonald's for not increasing the wages of McDonald's employees.
    williamh
  • Reply 52 of 90
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    lkrupp said:
    Apple reaching the trillion dollar market cap may turn out to be a problem rather than a benefit. Apple now has a HUGE target on its back and the Marxists (communists, socialists, liberals, etc.) are crawling out of the woodwork to make Apple the poster boy of their anti-capitalist rantings. It’s only just begun. I’m betting you will see Apple being portrayed in a negative light in political ads this Fall from the likes of Sanders and Ocasio-Cortez and their Socialist minions. Mike Daisey style monologues will be revived in documentaries and stage shows, all to point out the evils of Capitalism.

    Bottom line, the division between economic and social ideologies is as clear in the general population as it is right here in this comment thread. 
    So where do you get your information now that Apple banned Alex?
    dysamoria
  • Reply 53 of 90
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 6,957member
    rezwits said:
     Apple is so there, and MAN WOW, am I seeing a GRIZNIP of Watches. 
    So far, I've yet to see even one Apple Watch outside of an Apple Store. 
    Then you must be in prison. 
    anantksundarampscooter63GeorgeBMacJWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 54 of 90
    jbdragonjbdragon Posts: 2,246member
    davgreg said:

    Mr Nader is mostly correct as Stock buybacks are a very inefficient way to build shareholder value or return excess earnings to shareholders. A special dividend to shareholders, to name one example, would have been a more efficient option.


    Under Mr Cook, anything not iOS has been relegated to third class citizen status or left to twist in the wind. Ask yourself when have you seen a broad coordinated advertising campaign for the Macintosh in either the consumer or enterprise space? Look at the abysmal dumpster fire that is iTunes, or the lagging of Roku in the streaming HW space. Why cannot a company as big as Apple keep the wireless router line up to date and world class? Why are they still selling the trash can Mac or the outdated HW in the 2014 Mac mini?


    Why does an Apple that claims to be green seem determined to eliminate user removable batteries from every mobile device they sell? Why are all Macs currently sold sealed shut to make user upgrades or repairs improbable if not practically impossible?


    Finally, Apple does have a lot of new employees, but exactly what are they doing that is productive?

    Removable battery's take more space. You have to have a case for the battery. Some type of Door to remove the battery. I always laughed at the drop tests because I'd watch at a low drop the cover come off and the battery fly away.

    I've replaced battery's in a few phones. It's not that hard. It's just not designed to swap out. Apple has their robots that can rip apart a iPhone into different parts in a matter of seconds. I replaced a screen on a iPhone 6 a few weeks ago for someone at work. I've done that a number of times.

    Stock Buyback has been a good idea. It's been working for them. Less stock out there and more in Apple's control is a good thing.

    Now sure why Apple needs to be in the Router market? There are a lot of company's in that market already. What NEW can Apple bring?

    Lagging of ROKU? Apple has Apple TV which I think is a much better device than the ROKU and I have a few ROKU's. Apple just doesn't make cheap garbage. Which is why there's no $50 Apple TV or a $50 HomePod.

    iTUNES? About the only thing I use iTunes these days for is backing up my iPhone and iPad to my Windows PC as it's faster to restore that using iCloud. It would be better if they separate some of the things out of it. Apple has thrown more and more crap into it over the years and really has turned it into a mess.

    Nader is a idiot on so many things. Seems completely clueless about Apple, even though Apple has been doing pretty much everything he's complaining about. What he wants is his hands into Apple's big pile of money.
    edited August 2018 watto_cobra
  • Reply 55 of 90
    DAalsethDAalseth Posts: 2,571member
    rezwits said:
     Apple is so there, and MAN WOW, am I seeing a GRIZNIP of Watches. 
    So far, I've yet to see even one Apple Watch outside of an Apple Store. Yeah Man, right on, they are taking over the world... MEH

    Me too. I live in Nanaimo BC, a tech savvy city a short ride from Vancouver and Victoria, and a day trip from Seattle. I deal with businesspeople, engineers, and a lot of doctors and nurses. So far I've seen one (1) AppleWatch. It was on my Opthamologists wrist. I've tried to keep an eye out for them and so far I'm seeing almost nothing. I suspect it has to do with the lack of a nearby AppleStore. There's nowhere someone can go and play with them, to see what they can do and if they are worth the price. It would be interesting to do an analyses comparing AppleWatch penetration and proximity to an AppleStore.
  • Reply 56 of 90
    spice-boyspice-boy Posts: 1,450member
    lkrupp said:
    Apple reaching the trillion dollar market cap may turn out to be a problem rather than a benefit. Apple now has a HUGE target on its back and the Marxists (communists, socialists, liberals, etc.) are crawling out of the woodwork to make Apple the poster boy of their anti-capitalist rantings. It’s only just begun. I’m betting you will see Apple being portrayed in a negative light in political ads this Fall from the likes of Sanders and Ocasio-Cortez and their Socialist minions. Mike Daisey style monologues will be revived in documentaries and stage shows, all to point out the evils of Capitalism.

    Bottom line, the division between economic and social ideologies is as clear in the general population as it is right here in this comment thread. 
    OMG where do I begin. Apple is one of he most socially progressive companies in the world. The company prides itself on inclusion of all people and supports progressive ideals. Apple is about as Liberal as a corporation can be. Why do you through out words like Marxists, communists, and liberals as if they have anything in common? Stop and think for once before you post. You have never been to a socialist progressive country obviously, here's a hint the population has a much safer, healthier fair society than this great one. I'm an American which has visited Scandinavia for decades and if my fellow Americans had any clue to how little we get for our tax dollars they would stop electing snake oil salesmen (and women) which continually remove their rights, benefits and social safety nets. You have every right to been uniformed but do yourself a favor and visit Denmark or Sweden and see what you could have if you just opened your mind. 
    dysamoriaGeorgeBMac
  • Reply 57 of 90
    sflocal said:
    If Nader were smart with his own money instead of telling people like me how to spend it, he would have invested in Apple way back when he was still relevant (?) and too the crazy profits and do as he saw fit.

    Screw people like him.  I do believe that the government should take care of their citizens, but what he is proposing is just wrong on every level.
    TL;DR You have no idea who Ralph Nader is. Read a book.
    dysamoriaelectrosoftspice-boy
  • Reply 58 of 90
    It's good that Ralph Nader is using, LOL, a typewriter! This idiot should be as unproductive as possible. It has another advantage - Luddites have approximately zero credibility when talking about technology or technology companies.
    JWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 59 of 90
    j238j238 Posts: 10member
    The economy is increasingly favoring owners over workers. That's not about to change. No one wants to invest in a company that isn't focused on investment return. Stock ownership should be more available to people with small amounts of assets and people with low-wage jobs should have an option to save some of their wages in equities. Capitalism marches onwards, but we need ways to make it work for everyone.
  • Reply 60 of 90
    horvatichorvatic Posts: 144member
    Apple spends a lot on recycling and all forms of clean energy. More than any other company in the world for that matter. They could do more for employees though.
    watto_cobra
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