Anyone who lives in the northeast would you want a car drive you around which was trained on California roads? I'll give you a hint, would you get in any car with a person who never seen snow and let them drive you during the storm we just had.
The van Idea make sense since it give more room for batteries and allows the sensor to have higher vantage point.
When I tough my kids to drive one things I taught them was not to always watch the car in front of them but the cars 10 in front as well as the cars behind. I have avoided more accidents because I saw brake lights way ahead and began slowing long before the car in front of me even tapped their brakes, this also allowed the cars behind me to begin slowing so we all did not have to panic stop. This is call offensive driving which most drivers do not do and think about the people programing theses system, what view of driving do they follow.
I believe it's called defensive driving but I could be wrong.
With regards to where the cars are being trained - they start out somewhere nice and dry and flat and straight then launch there, as we've seen with Waymo. Once they are confident that they are ready to test in more difficult conditions, they'll do that. There's no chance they will just launch in the NE having trained only in Cali or Arizona.
You would hope that is the case, but my many years of driving and dealing with all kinds of vehicle in all kinds of bad driving condition, i have found even with all my experience i run into situation I have not encountered, snow is the one thing that teaches you if your think you know how to drive in snow you have not driven enough in snow.
Before, i would have self driving car, I want to see it win a NASCAR or F1 car race. This is all about driving strategy and doing things which are counter intuitive most time. Also I want to know the cars prime directive who dies, me or the other guy, My person prime directive it to save my life at all cost, if someone else if doing something to put their life in danger does not mean I need to die to save them.
Defensive means you waiting for something to happen and defending against it, offensive mean you are take necessary action before something happens. I am always reading the situation and taking action to ensure I am not in bad situation and have not recourse, like I said , seeing red lights ahead I am already slowing before anyone else around me.
Anyone who lives in the northeast would you want a car drive you around which was trained on California roads? I'll give you a hint, would you get in any car with a person who never seen snow and let them drive you during the storm we just had.
The van Idea make sense since it give more room for batteries and allows the sensor to have higher vantage point.
When I tough my kids to drive one things I taught them was not to always watch the car in front of them but the cars 10 in front as well as the cars behind. I have avoided more accidents because I saw brake lights way ahead and began slowing long before the car in front of me even tapped their brakes, this also allowed the cars behind me to begin slowing so we all did not have to panic stop. This is call offensive driving which most drivers do not do and think about the people programing theses system, what view of driving do they follow.
Self driving cars and snow is one thing I've always wondered about. How are self driving vehicles going to handle snow? If you start sliding and a self driving car hits the brakes hard, it's just going to make things worse. It sounds like you drive the same way as me. When I'm driving in the snow, I let off the gas way ahead of time at a light or when cars are stopped. I try avoiding using the brakes as much as possible.
Why would a self driving car do anything different that what you (excellent driver, presumably) would do? It's not going to "learn" that slamming on the brakes is a good reaction when trying to slow on icy roads.
There's going to be a mental shift (and maybe it's already happened). A shift from people thinking that their reaction times and ability to analyze their surroundings is far better than computers and sensors to one where the populace can't believe how ignorant people were to think that using advanced electronics wouldn't result in saving lives, reducing injury, limiting property damage, increasing power efficiency, and increasing flow of traffic despite most of these people having been around when these automated advancements (which include ABS, automatic transmissions, adaptive cruise control, blindspot detection, lane guidance, etc.) were already in place.
Here is the problem, humans are predictably unpredictable, as long as humans are in the driving equation, self driving cars will have issue, yes they will not cause the accident but can the avoid the human who will get them into an accident. Will the self driving car recognize the telltale signed on someone not paying attention who will put you at risk of an accident.
Do you know ABS is rain and snow is mostly good, ABS on ice you will die, traction control on wet road is good, traction control on snow and ice will get you stuck at best or get you killed. I turn off traction control in snow and use the try and true method of keeping a car moving on snow. I trend to be very careful with the brakes on icy roads since the ABS kicks in and you are off in a slide at that point sometime I which you can turn that off. I hate cars with the warning system, I have almost gotten in accidents because of them, warning are going off, the seat is vibrating and I am looking around trying to figure where the threat is coming from in the mean time I already knew since i was paying attention. Also the side view mirrors with blind spot indicators are distracting in your peripheral vision, those flashing light cause you to take your eyes of the road in front of you.
The VW ID Buzz will be in full production and for sale before Apple gets out of the garage. Already approved for production in Germany and the US plant in Chattanooga.
The VW ID Buzz will be in full production and for sale before Apple gets out of the garage. Already approved for production in Germany and the US plant in Chattanooga.
Just like with the Apple TV and streaming service, Apple has let others get out ahead.
The ID Buzz is a consumer vehicle.
What makes you think that Apple isn't building a commercial vehicle which will be used for long term ride sharing service and delivery designed around easy maintenance and repair?
Well, it’s waaaaaaaaaay out of their wheelhouse for starters. It’s a huge leap from computers and gadgets to cars, vans, delivery vehicles or whatever the rumor du jour says. After the “car”, maybe they’ll start building washing machines and refrigerators too?
Easy maintenance and repair, where? At the nearest Apple store? In the Apple Garage? And do you really believe that the company who makes upgrades nearly impossible, the company that glues and solders everything together and consistently scores at the bottom in terms of ability to repair, will build an “easy maintenance and repair” vehicle?
Anyone who lives in the northeast would you want a car drive you around which was trained on California roads? I'll give you a hint, would you get in any car with a person who never seen snow and let them drive you during the storm we just had.
The van Idea make sense since it give more room for batteries and allows the sensor to have higher vantage point.
When I tough my kids to drive one things I taught them was not to always watch the car in front of them but the cars 10 in front as well as the cars behind. I have avoided more accidents because I saw brake lights way ahead and began slowing long before the car in front of me even tapped their brakes, this also allowed the cars behind me to begin slowing so we all did not have to panic stop. This is call offensive driving which most drivers do not do and think about the people programing theses system, what view of driving do they follow.
I believe it's called defensive driving but I could be wrong.
With regards to where the cars are being trained - they start out somewhere nice and dry and flat and straight then launch there, as we've seen with Waymo. Once they are confident that they are ready to test in more difficult conditions, they'll do that. There's no chance they will just launch in the NE having trained only in Cali or Arizona.
You know Michigan is mostly flat, driving in bad weather on mostly flat and straight roads it pretty easy, bring those cars to PA or even NJ and see how well they do. NJ with their various cup handle turns and the various roundabout (sorry traffic circles) which do not conform to any standard. These roads become a nightmare in bad weather.
Anyone who lives in the northeast would you want a car drive you around which was trained on California roads? I'll give you a hint, would you get in any car with a person who never seen snow and let them drive you during the storm we just had.
The van Idea make sense since it give more room for batteries and allows the sensor to have higher vantage point.
When I tough my kids to drive one things I taught them was not to always watch the car in front of them but the cars 10 in front as well as the cars behind. I have avoided more accidents because I saw brake lights way ahead and began slowing long before the car in front of me even tapped their brakes, this also allowed the cars behind me to begin slowing so we all did not have to panic stop. This is call offensive driving which most drivers do not do and think about the people programing theses system, what view of driving do they follow.
I believe it's called defensive driving but I could be wrong.
With regards to where the cars are being trained - they start out somewhere nice and dry and flat and straight then launch there, as we've seen with Waymo. Once they are confident that they are ready to test in more difficult conditions, they'll do that. There's no chance they will just launch in the NE having trained only in Cali or Arizona.
You know Michigan is mostly flat, driving in bad weather on mostly flat and straight roads it pretty easy, bring those cars to PA or even NJ and see how well they do. NJ with their various cup handle turns and the various roundabout (sorry traffic circles) which do not conform to any standard. These roads become a nightmare in bad weather.
Try living in the mountains! We just got through a week long storm cycle that dumped 10+ feet. The road disappears completely for days. My neighborhood streets are all single lane with 5 foot snow berms. It will be a while before a self driving vehicle can handle such conditions.
The VW ID Buzz will be in full production and for sale before Apple gets out of the garage. Already approved for production in Germany and the US plant in Chattanooga.
Anyone who lives in the northeast would you want a car drive you around which was trained on California roads? I'll give you a hint, would you get in any car with a person who never seen snow and let them drive you during the storm we just had.
The van Idea make sense since it give more room for batteries and allows the sensor to have higher vantage point.
When I tough my kids to drive one things I taught them was not to always watch the car in front of them but the cars 10 in front as well as the cars behind. I have avoided more accidents because I saw brake lights way ahead and began slowing long before the car in front of me even tapped their brakes, this also allowed the cars behind me to begin slowing so we all did not have to panic stop. This is call offensive driving which most drivers do not do and think about the people programing theses system, what view of driving do they follow.
I believe it's called defensive driving but I could be wrong.
With regards to where the cars are being trained - they start out somewhere nice and dry and flat and straight then launch there, as we've seen with Waymo. Once they are confident that they are ready to test in more difficult conditions, they'll do that. There's no chance they will just launch in the NE having trained only in Cali or Arizona.
You would hope that is the case, but my many years of driving and dealing with all kinds of vehicle in all kinds of bad driving condition, i have found even with all my experience i run into situation I have not encountered, snow is the one thing that teaches you if your think you know how to drive in snow you have not driven enough in snow.
Before, i would have self driving car, I want to see it win a NASCAR or F1 car race. This is all about driving strategy and doing things which are counter intuitive most time. Also I want to know the cars prime directive who dies, me or the other guy, My person prime directive it to save my life at all cost, if someone else if doing something to put their life in danger does not mean I need to die to save them.
Defensive means you waiting for something to happen and defending against it, offensive mean you are take necessary action before something happens. I am always reading the situation and taking action to ensure I am not in bad situation and have not recourse, like I said , seeing red lights ahead I am already slowing before anyone else around me.
Can you transfer all of your constantly evolving driving expertise to a huge number of other drivers across the country/world, on a weekly basis? Can you receive the collected training and growing experience of hundreds, and soon thousands and shortly hundreds of thousands and eventually millions of drivers across the world and integrate that into your own knowledge and experience, in a weekly, or eventually perhaps a daily or even real-time basis?
Because that’s the potential of autonomous driving systems. What each experiences all may learn from. The entire fleet acts as a constantly evolving and learning hive mind. No human will be able to match the performance, efficiency, and optimized results, no human will be able to integrate the non-intuitive actions that will be learned and cannot even be predicted as the data from a huge fleet of autonomous vehicles adds millions of miles of driving daily to its collective ‘experience.’
Vehicle accident, injury and death rates should plunge. But these great advances will come with great challenges; the systems must be designed to prevent hacking, must have overriding directives and be multiply redundant in critical controls. It’s a huge engineering and social challenge, but the rewards are economically and socially as profound as perhaps any major advance in the Industrial Age.
Anyone who lives in the northeast would you want a car drive you around which was trained on California roads? I'll give you a hint, would you get in any car with a person who never seen snow and let them drive you during the storm we just had.
The van Idea make sense since it give more room for batteries and allows the sensor to have higher vantage point.
When I tough my kids to drive one things I taught them was not to always watch the car in front of them but the cars 10 in front as well as the cars behind. I have avoided more accidents because I saw brake lights way ahead and began slowing long before the car in front of me even tapped their brakes, this also allowed the cars behind me to begin slowing so we all did not have to panic stop. This is call offensive driving which most drivers do not do and think about the people programing theses system, what view of driving do they follow.
I believe it's called defensive driving but I could be wrong.
With regards to where the cars are being trained - they start out somewhere nice and dry and flat and straight then launch there, as we've seen with Waymo. Once they are confident that they are ready to test in more difficult conditions, they'll do that. There's no chance they will just launch in the NE having trained only in Cali or Arizona.
You know Michigan is mostly flat, driving in bad weather on mostly flat and straight roads it pretty easy, bring those cars to PA or even NJ and see how well they do. NJ with their various cup handle turns and the various roundabout (sorry traffic circles) which do not conform to any standard. These roads become a nightmare in bad weather.
Try living in the mountains! We just got through a week long storm cycle that dumped 10+ feet. The road disappears completely for days. My neighborhood streets are all single lane with 5 foot snow berms. It will be a while before a self driving vehicle can handle such conditions.
Yes, but autonomous vehicles will be much more about ride sharing in densely populated urban areas than about replacing the vehicle in your driveway with one you don’t have to pilot. The economics will imply fleets of vehicles initially deployed in well mapped geographies where conditions are favorable to their capabilities.
But after a few generations (maybe ten years), the hive mind nature of shared experience across these huge fleets will yield AIs and sensors equal to top rally drivers. And so eventually any conditions an individual human could handle will be fair play for autonomous vehicles.
And there’s an additional factor. Already analysis of big data yields non-intuitive hidden correlations, which no individual human is capable of leaping to, other than by blind luck or the powers of the mind of a savant, which most of us do not possess. So autonomous vehicles will have at their disposal reactions and strategies unavailable to most humans.
For example, consider a situation where an autonomous vehicle is able to perceive, through analysis of a series of 10,000 samples against its sensor data, all collected over a period of a couple seconds, a potentially adverse situation developing, to which its AI may deduce a simple and subtle corrective action that heads off that adverse situation without compromising its directives or goals. And without introducing some other adverse downstream situation. Even if a human is made aware of this type of situation, perhaps by watching a future TED Talk where some engineer cites it as an an example, telling us how the AI combines data from side scanning Lidar with data transmitted from nearby vehicles combined with humidity and ambient temperature data to come to some incredibly cool and non-intuitive conclusion that has a statistically high probability of some incredible hard-to-believe adverse outcome, and the light goes on in our heads as to how all those various and disparate inputs might actually imply that outcome, our brains don’t include side scanning Lidar or transceivers to interact with other nearby vehicles. And even if all the data being used by the autonomous vehicle were collected and presented to a human driver via a heads-up display on the windshield, we simply cannot process 10,000 samples collected over the course of a couple seconds. So there’s no way a human will be able to ever detect and react to such a situation. The appropriate reaction, itself, might include not only subtle manipulation of the vehicle’s speed, steering, braking, etc, but also transmission of appropriate data to multiple other vehicles, whose AIs might perform their own quick analysis of their own recently collected data and/or incoming data to verify that the warning they received is appropriate and then decide their own appropriate corrective actions. Then in this case it’s not only a single autonomous vehicle acting to direct actions but a hive mind of networked vehicles in close proximity to affect a desired outcome, or avoid an undesired one.
The VW ID Buzz will be in full production and for sale before Apple gets out of the garage. Already approved for production in Germany and the US plant in Chattanooga.
Anyone who lives in the northeast would you want a car drive you around which was trained on California roads? I'll give you a hint, would you get in any car with a person who never seen snow and let them drive you during the storm we just had.
The van Idea make sense since it give more room for batteries and allows the sensor to have higher vantage point.
When I tough my kids to drive one things I taught them was not to always watch the car in front of them but the cars 10 in front as well as the cars behind. I have avoided more accidents because I saw brake lights way ahead and began slowing long before the car in front of me even tapped their brakes, this also allowed the cars behind me to begin slowing so we all did not have to panic stop. This is call offensive driving which most drivers do not do and think about the people programing theses system, what view of driving do they follow.
I believe it's called defensive driving but I could be wrong.
With regards to where the cars are being trained - they start out somewhere nice and dry and flat and straight then launch there, as we've seen with Waymo. Once they are confident that they are ready to test in more difficult conditions, they'll do that. There's no chance they will just launch in the NE having trained only in Cali or Arizona.
You know Michigan is mostly flat, driving in bad weather on mostly flat and straight roads it pretty easy, bring those cars to PA or even NJ and see how well they do. NJ with their various cup handle turns and the various roundabout (sorry traffic circles) which do not conform to any standard. These roads become a nightmare in bad weather.
So no kudos from you for moving beyond sunny Cali and AZ in order to better challenge their self-driving tech in Detroit (NOT just "mostly flat and straight roads")? Well OK then. There's also companies testing in Pennsylvania too, the company Aurora for example
Has New Jersey approved fully-autonomous testing on public highways yet? I know there's been discussion. That's one of the biggest limitations, as states are still formulating their approaches to testing. Here in very rainy Florida they've been quite proactive with rules allowing us to become another test-bed destination. Other states not so much.
Waymo's laser focus on safety, reliability and predictability, no members of the public have ever been harmed by an autonomous Waymo vehicle, actually puts them in danger of being TOO cautious in their self-driving roll-out IMO. They may be beaten to market by companies who are more "aggressive" in their plans. https://waymo.com/ontheroad/
What makes you think that Apple isn't building a commercial vehicle which will be used for long term ride sharing service and delivery designed around easy maintenance and repair?
Actually, the ID Buzz will be built in 2 versions- a passenger van built in the US and a commercial version to be built in Hanover Germany. Do not forget that VW owns Porsche and Audi- it has considerable engineering resources and is pouring lots of money into electrics now that Diesel will be going away in much of the world.
I wasn't aware of the commercial version, but I was aware that VW owns Porsche, and Audi, as well as other makes.
Taxis, minibusses, all excellent markets for AI. School buses could be a good market for AI too, far safer. I've rarely followed one not going well over the speed limit!
We moved a couple years prior to this happening, but had lived only a block off the road this happened on, and I drove down that road every week day to work. Had my child been elementary school age at the time (and in public school) could have even been on the bus. As a designer I've always thought school busses were in dire need of redesign and that incident made me feel even more strongly that way. Would be pretty cool if Apple developed a platform that could be utilized by schools/school bus companies.
I'm a vehicle aficionado despite driving a rusty Silverado. After reading an Ive profile a few years ago in which he quietly disparaged the state of car design, I would very much like to see his ideal vehicle, or at least the first-generation of what might eventually become his ideal.
Personally, I’m not a Jony Ive design worshiper. Just like the tastefulness and restraint which was part of the original Apple Stores, the minimal Apple aesthetic was all about Steve Jobs. He made the final decisions.
The VW ID Buzz will be in full production and for sale before Apple gets out of the garage. Already approved for production in Germany and the US plant in Chattanooga.
Just like with the Apple TV and streaming service, Apple has let others get out ahead.
Apple doesn’t need to be first. They need to perfect it as much as possible.
Yeah I blocked that guy long as he doesn’t get Apple whatsoever. A race to first? Please.
How do you block I know how to on 9to5 but not here?
Thanks
Or you could learn to deal with people whose opinions differ from your own. It’s not like that person posted anything inflammatory or derogatory.
All I ask for was how to block someone, I didn't say I was going to block anyone you are making assumptions that I wanted to block that person...
To block someone, click on their name. This will take you to their personal info page and there you’ll see the option to “Ignore” them. Click on the “Ignore” tab and you’re set.
Comments
Before, i would have self driving car, I want to see it win a NASCAR or F1 car race. This is all about driving strategy and doing things which are counter intuitive most time. Also I want to know the cars prime directive who dies, me or the other guy, My person prime directive it to save my life at all cost, if someone else if doing something to put their life in danger does not mean I need to die to save them.
Defensive means you waiting for something to happen and defending against it, offensive mean you are take necessary action before something happens. I am always reading the situation and taking action to ensure I am not in bad situation and have not recourse, like I said , seeing red lights ahead I am already slowing before anyone else around me.
Do you know ABS is rain and snow is mostly good, ABS on ice you will die, traction control on wet road is good, traction control on snow and ice will get you stuck at best or get you killed. I turn off traction control in snow and use the try and true method of keeping a car moving on snow. I trend to be very careful with the brakes on icy roads since the ABS kicks in and you are off in a slide at that point sometime I which you can turn that off. I hate cars with the warning system, I have almost gotten in accidents because of them, warning are going off, the seat is vibrating and I am looking around trying to figure where the threat is coming from in the mean time I already knew since i was paying attention. Also the side view mirrors with blind spot indicators are distracting in your peripheral vision, those flashing light cause you to take your eyes of the road in front of you.
Easy maintenance and repair, where? At the nearest Apple store? In the Apple Garage? And do you really believe that the company who makes upgrades nearly impossible, the company that glues and solders everything together and consistently scores at the bottom in terms of ability to repair, will build an “easy maintenance and repair” vehicle?
Just like with smartwatches...
Just like with tablets... (okay, the competition put forth netbooks as their offering, but... same result).
Just like with styluses on touch screens...
Apple will be fine.
Because that’s the potential of autonomous driving systems. What each experiences all may learn from. The entire fleet acts as a constantly evolving and learning hive mind. No human will be able to match the performance, efficiency, and optimized results, no human will be able to integrate the non-intuitive actions that will be learned and cannot even be predicted as the data from a huge fleet of autonomous vehicles adds millions of miles of driving daily to its collective ‘experience.’
Vehicle accident, injury and death rates should plunge. But these great advances will come with great challenges; the systems must be designed to prevent hacking, must have overriding directives and be multiply redundant in critical controls. It’s a huge engineering and social challenge, but the rewards are economically and socially as profound as perhaps any major advance in the Industrial Age.
But after a few generations (maybe ten years), the hive mind nature of shared experience across these huge fleets will yield AIs and sensors equal to top rally drivers. And so eventually any conditions an individual human could handle will be fair play for autonomous vehicles.
And there’s an additional factor. Already analysis of big data yields non-intuitive hidden correlations, which no individual human is capable of leaping to, other than by blind luck or the powers of the mind of a savant, which most of us do not possess. So autonomous vehicles will have at their disposal reactions and strategies unavailable to most humans.
For example, consider a situation where an autonomous vehicle is able to perceive, through analysis of a series of 10,000 samples against its sensor data, all collected over a period of a couple seconds, a potentially adverse situation developing, to which its AI may deduce a simple and subtle corrective action that heads off that adverse situation without compromising its directives or goals. And without introducing some other adverse downstream situation. Even if a human is made aware of this type of situation, perhaps by watching a future TED Talk where some engineer cites it as an an example, telling us how the AI combines data from side scanning Lidar with data transmitted from nearby vehicles combined with humidity and ambient temperature data to come to some incredibly cool and non-intuitive conclusion that has a statistically high probability of some incredible hard-to-believe adverse outcome, and the light goes on in our heads as to how all those various and disparate inputs might actually imply that outcome, our brains don’t include side scanning Lidar or transceivers to interact with other nearby vehicles. And even if all the data being used by the autonomous vehicle were collected and presented to a human driver via a heads-up display on the windshield, we simply cannot process 10,000 samples collected over the course of a couple seconds. So there’s no way a human will be able to ever detect and react to such a situation. The appropriate reaction, itself, might include not only subtle manipulation of the vehicle’s speed, steering, braking, etc, but also transmission of appropriate data to multiple other vehicles, whose AIs might perform their own quick analysis of their own recently collected data and/or incoming data to verify that the warning they received is appropriate and then decide their own appropriate corrective actions. Then in this case it’s not only a single autonomous vehicle acting to direct actions but a hive mind of networked vehicles in close proximity to affect a desired outcome, or avoid an undesired one.
Has New Jersey approved fully-autonomous testing on public highways yet? I know there's been discussion. That's one of the biggest limitations, as states are still formulating their approaches to testing. Here in very rainy Florida they've been quite proactive with rules allowing us to become another test-bed destination. Other states not so much.
Waymo's laser focus on safety, reliability and predictability, no members of the public have ever been harmed by an autonomous Waymo vehicle, actually puts them in danger of being TOO cautious in their self-driving roll-out IMO. They may be beaten to market by companies who are more "aggressive" in their plans.
https://waymo.com/ontheroad/
We moved a couple years prior to this happening, but had lived only a block off the road this happened on, and I drove down that road every week day to work. Had my child been elementary school age at the time (and in public school) could have even been on the bus. As a designer I've always thought school busses were in dire need of redesign and that incident made me feel even more strongly that way. Would be pretty cool if Apple developed a platform that could be utilized by schools/school bus companies.