The worst designed Apple products that I've owned were in the G4 lineup. I had the "wind tunnel" G4 desktop with the mirrored drive bays (an odd detail and design choice at best) which ran too hot for Apple's recycling of the G3 size enclosure and was always too loud as a result. I also had a G4 laptop which, to date, is the only Apple product I've owned that has ever suddenly stopped working.
I’ve never understood the angst about the Magic Mouse 2 charging port. The critique above explains clearly why the port doesn’t need to be on the edge or top of the mouse. Less than a minute’s charge yields hours of use.
As as noted in another post above, a charging cable isn’t structurally designed to handle the motions and bending involved with being a mouse cord. Yet, you can rest assured that lots of people would just leave it plugged in all the time, damaging the cable and the charging port on the mouse as well. Then there would be lots of complaints and inevitable class-action lawsuits over the poorly designed charging cables and charging ports. And for what? Because users can’t wait a minute or two to charge up the mouse for a day’s use.
Your argument implies there’s only two possible designs for mice with rechargeable batteries. On bottom, or fragile on front.
There are plenty of options. One might design a robust charging cable. How about that? Go on, tell me that’s not possible. Another is to give the device wireless charging. Both add cost, but Apple is not shy in that department, so that’s not an issue. There’s plenty of better designs than this mess.
Sure, there are plenty of ‘third options’ that might’ve been dreamed up. Of course, each would have its downside, and most that I can think of would actually introduce more expense and design problems than they would solve. Remember the “problem” of the current design is about flipping the mouse over and plugging it in for less time than it takes to get a cup of coffee.
For instance, a more robust cable would have to have a distinct, proprietary connector, because people would otherwise end up using and destroying other cables instead, with the same complaints listed previously. And of course, that’s a lot of investment to enable the user to entirely miss the point that it’s a wireless mouse.
Maybe wireless charging isn’t a bad idea, but that adds a lot of expense when the current design allows a two-minute charge to cover a whole workday, and leaving it plugged in overnight will solve the charging problem for a month.
No, I think their current design for charging the mouse is both reasonable and very intentional, and that some users’ visceral negative reaction to it is more about them not getting it than it is about any actual problem or inconvenience.
No, I think their current design for charging the mouse is both reasonable and very intentional, and that some users’ visceral negative reaction to it is more about them not getting it than it is about any actual problem or inconvenience.
It’s not just about not getting it, but rightfully rejecting it so my opinion is always correct, like the mouse, the keyboard, one USB-C, so on, so forth. Criticism is good when they makes sense, which so far I haven’t seen but ridiculous opinions like transparent plastic is a sin.
I don't see the 3rd gen iPod Shuffle is a bad design, if anything is the manifestation of pure minimalism by Apple, a metal slab with just 1 interaction point. I really regret not getting the polished stainless steel edition of this iPod, I was a broke student at the time. Anyways, those were the most fun years at Apple, when you were just waiting every year to see what new form factors and colours the iPod would have.
Wheres the 1st gen Apple Pencil on the article?! I think we can all agree that's the biggest miss for Sir Ive in the last couple years...
One more time ... as near as anyone can figure out, something less than five percent (and possibly much lower) of the butterfly keyboards have repair-worthy, non-user-caused issues. This may well be much higher than other keyboards, and I'm not saying Apple shouldn't take steps to address this, but ... this is very far from Ive's worst design.
Dubious reliability is only part of the problem. What makes these Butterfly keyboards so horrible is their lack of key travel - typing on them is like pounding your fingers on concrete.
I may be the lone entity in the universe who loved his hockey-puck mouse. I found it far more comfortable than its predecessors and never had an issue with orientation.
Since I was raised on one-buttoners, the first thing I do when configuring a Mac is switching the alternate-click to the left side of the mouse; my standard use case is having index finger on right side of mouse. Maybe this oddball style accounts (or at least helps) for my puck-loving ways.
Add AppleTV Remote to the mix if it already hasn’t been. Designed to frustrate. If Ive designed it I guarantee he doesn’t use it. If he did, he would have thrown it against the wall by now.
Apple TV remotes and Mighty Mouse leave a lot to be desired while Jony Ives is a top designer and has made substantial contributions at Apple perhaps the time is right to move on. Hopefully Apple has a new designer ready to put them back in the hardware game. Selling services for your iPhone is a great option but the most important thing is the iPhone itself which has always been Apples bread and butter
I don't see the 3rd gen iPod Shuffle is a bad design, if anything is the manifestation of pure minimalism by Apple, a metal slab with just 1 interaction point. I really regret not getting the polished stainless steel edition of this iPod, I was a broke student at the time. Anyways, those were the most fun years at Apple, when you were just waiting every year to see what new form factors and colours the iPod would have.
Wheres the 1st gen Apple Pencil on the article?! I think we can all agree that's the biggest miss for Sir Ive in the last couple years...
Agree on third gen shuffle. Pure minimalism. It was a bold move and the dollars spoke. I love mine though. I forgot they had a polished stainless model. Pretty sweet.
However on the Pencil, while I agree that the dongle-style charging is not the best, the product overall is stellar. Guess they could have waited a year or however long it took to get the wireless charging crammed in to release, but I've certainly gotten a lot of use out of mine & just can't consider it eligible for a "worst design" list
chasm said: One more time ... as near as anyone can figure out, something less than five percent (and possibly much lower) of the butterfly keyboards have repair-worthy, non-user-caused issues. This may well be much higher than other keyboards, and I'm not saying Apple shouldn't take steps to address this, but ... this is very far from Ive's worst design.
But, failure rate aside (and I suspect it's much higher numbers including people who have or have had issues, and just didn't take them in for repair... I only know a couple people who haven't had issues!), there is also the issue of how well the average user likes to type on it. I know a few who like it, but again, the majority would opt for the older style if they had the choice.
And, again, since it has a major impact and there isn't a work-around (ie: just buy a different mouse), I think I stand by it being the worst or one of the worst.
Re: the original iMac ... I must disagree. Remembering that nearly all computers at the time used far uglier CRTs,...
No doubt! We're not comparing it to a modern iMac, but the computers at the time!
kimberly said: I'm with you on this one and describe my experiences with Apple mice as "spoon in a bowl of soup". No-one else in the family has an issue with them though . I use an MX Master 25. Sometimes it is pure function that embodies beauty and not form.
I'm sure it varies for everyone... but I've owned/used most of the Apple mice over the years. I even bought a Magic Mouse outright (as expensive as they are), but just couldn't continue to use it after a year or two. The shape has something to do with it, but the more problematic thing was how the scrolling worked via the touch surface. It often messed up (even constrained to 1 or 2 gestures like right-click and scroll), and made me keep my fingers in odd positions (like holding the right-click finger slightly off the mouse surface, to make it work properly. IMO, it just didn't work well and was quite uncomfortable for long periods of work.
I've also spent hours at stores trying mice, and the MX Master is about the only one I can tolerate for long, now (I use a Magic Trackpad 2 most of the time, despite it not being as good for graphics/CAD most of the time). In doing so, I've always been a bit shocked at how bad most mice really are. The MX Master could use a slightly different shape for me, but for basic functions (right-click, scroll) it works quite well. The scroll wheel is especially good on it, and especially horrible on most other mice!
That said, I'm now on my 3rd one in like maybe 5ish years. The left-click microswitch goes bad, which is just crazy for a mouse so expensive. I tried to fix the first one and gave up after a couple of hours, and decided it was worth my time just to go buy a new one. Other than that, it's nice. Also, I've found it a bit less susceptible to interference (and erratic control behavior... which happens from time to time with BT mice/trackpad).
AppleZulu said: Sure, there are plenty of ‘third options’ that might’ve been dreamed up. Of course, each would have its downside, and most that I can think of would actually introduce more expense and design problems than they would solve. Remember the “problem” of the current design is about flipping the mouse over and plugging it in for less time than it takes to get a cup of coffee. ... No, I think their current design for charging the mouse is both reasonable and very intentional, and that some users’ visceral negative reaction to it is more about them not getting it than it is about any actual problem or inconvenience.
Give me the original CAD files in my CAD app of choice and I'll fix the design in about 10 minutes (at least of the shell.. then you'd have to do some internal work). The point isn't that it is unusable, so much as that it is just a silly solution. You could easily put the port in the front and still make it look pretty nice. It just wouldn't be the perfect shape Ive was wanting it to be (ie: no visible ports and such, which seems to be the primary design driver).
That's kind of why I posted the comment earlier about how much weight we put on impact here. This is super-low impact, but it is still (IMO) a bad design. Other designs might be much less 'bad' but have a huge impact (like the MB/MBP keyboard).
DuhSesame said: It’s not just about not getting it, but rightfully rejecting it so my opinion is always correct, like the mouse, the keyboard, one USB-C, so on, so forth. Criticism is good when they makes sense, which so far I haven’t seen but ridiculous opinions like transparent plastic is a sin.
Yeah, and it is important to separate the 'taste' aspect a bit from more UX aspects of the design, and then basic functionality. While it is a balancing act, I think you could order them from most important to less important (ie: a beautiful design that doesn't function is kind of worthless).
I don't see the 3rd gen iPod Shuffle is a bad design, if anything is the manifestation of pure minimalism by Apple, a metal slab with just 1 interaction point. I really regret not getting the polished stainless steel edition of this iPod, I was a broke student at the time.
IMO, the original iPod with scroll wheel was an incredible design in terms of UX and UI, but then the iPods kind of went downhill in that regard. Meanwhile, the buttons on iPhones have gotten better with iteration towards the haptic home button. I think it depends on what it is on whether it will improve by being less physical... which is a bit my fear on where the keyboard design might be headed.
henrybay said: Dubious reliability is only part of the problem. What makes these Butterfly keyboards so horrible is their lack of key travel - typing on them is like pounding your fingers on concrete.
My time on them is still fairly limited, but aside from just not liking it, I do wonder if I ever would or my accuracy would improve. Maybe? But, it also seems that are relying more on autocorrect, which IMO, isn't a great thing with an inaccurate keyboard. When you're using a relatively slow process (like typing on iOS), you often catch the correction issue as you go, which is harder and more distracting with the speed of typing on a real keyboard. It is much easier (at least in my experience), to have autocorrect mistakenly replace things when I'm typing on a real keyboard.. and miss that it happened.
Add AppleTV Remote to the mix if it already hasn’t been. Designed to frustrate. If Ive designed it I guarantee he doesn’t use it. If he did, he would have thrown it against the wall by now.
Yeah, I forgot about those. Apple remotes, in general, are pretty horrible.
AppleZulu said: Sure, there are plenty of ‘third options’ that might’ve been dreamed up. Of course, each would have its downside, and most that I can think of would actually introduce more expense and design problems than they would solve. Remember the “problem” of the current design is about flipping the mouse over and plugging it in for less time than it takes to get a cup of coffee. ... No, I think their current design for charging the mouse is both reasonable and very intentional, and that some users’ visceral negative reaction to it is more about them not getting it than it is about any actual problem or inconvenience.
Give me the original CAD files in my CAD app of choice and I'll fix the design in about 10 minutes (at least of the shell.. then you'd have to do some internal work). The point isn't that it is unusable, so much as that it is just a silly solution. You could easily put the port in the front and still make it look pretty nice. It just wouldn't be the perfect shape Ive was wanting it to be (ie: no visible ports and such, which seems to be the primary design driver).
...
See, that's the thing. People look at the mouse with the charging port on the bottom and think it's a "silly solution" or that Apple missed something or they weren't thinking at all. The thing is, it's none of those things. They very specifically did not want people leaving the mouse plugged in when they use it. It's not only unnecessary, but it's counterproductive. It's a wireless mouse. It takes very little time to charge. There is no good reason to leave it plugged in while using it.
You could do whatever you want with your CAD program of choice, but you're solving a question Apple wasn't asking. The question was never "where can we put the charging port so that it doesn't interrupt our sleek, minimalist design?" The question was "how do we keep people from leaving it plugged in all the time?" The answer to that question is: "put a robust battery in it that will last for a month on a full charge, or for a day on two minutes' charge; then put the charging port on the bottom. "
They didn't put the charging port on the bottom because that was the only place left after they eliminated all the other places where they didn't want to put it. They put the charging port on the bottom because it would prevent people from leaving it plugged in while they use it.
AppleZulu said: They didn't put the charging port on the bottom because that was the only place left after they eliminated all the other places where they didn't want to put it. They put the charging port on the bottom because it would prevent people from leaving it plugged in while they use it.
Any evidence for that? Why haven't they done that with the rest of their products?
AppleZulu said: They didn't put the charging port on the bottom because that was the only place left after they eliminated all the other places where they didn't want to put it. They put the charging port on the bottom because it would prevent people from leaving it plugged in while they use it.
Any evidence for that? Why haven't they done that with the rest of their products?
Well, it seems pretty self-evident, if you're not all tense and offended by the port being on the bottom. Then there's also the fact that the patent for the mouse includes drawing with a cord out the front "for the purposes of example," but notes that "the force sensing mouse may not include a cord in various implementations, and/or may communicate with an associated electronic device utilizing various wireless communication methods such as WiFi, Bluetooth, and so on." So they had a completely elegant-looking design with a cord coming out of the front, but yet when they made it wireless, by golly, the port's on the bottom. It's a wireless mouse. It's not meant to be plugged in while you're using it.
Ironically, there's a popular self-help book called Who Moved My Cheese that seems to address the sort of angst some people feel about the charging port being on the bottom of this wireless mouse.
AppleZulu said: Well, it seems pretty self-evident, if you're not all tense and offended by the port being on the bottom. Then there's also the fact that the patent for the mouse includes drawing with a cord out the front "for the purposes of example," but notes that "the force sensing mouse may not include a cord in various implementations, and/or may communicate with an associated electronic device utilizing various wireless communication methods such as WiFi, Bluetooth, and so on." So they had a completely elegant-looking design with a cord coming out of the front, but yet when they made it wireless, by golly, the port's on the bottom. It's a wireless mouse. It's not meant to be plugged in while you're using it.
Ironically, there's a popular self-help book called Who Moved My Cheese that seems to address the sort of angst some people feel about the charging port being on the bottom of this wireless mouse.
So, self-evident if that's the narrative you prefer? The patent has to cover the bases. There are lots of wireless mice with connection ports on the front. BTW, zero angst. I wouldn't buy one either way. I'm just commenting on it in regards to design.
AppleZulu said: Well, it seems pretty self-evident, if you're not all tense and offended by the port being on the bottom. Then there's also the fact that the patent for the mouse includes drawing with a cord out the front "for the purposes of example," but notes that "the force sensing mouse may not include a cord in various implementations, and/or may communicate with an associated electronic device utilizing various wireless communication methods such as WiFi, Bluetooth, and so on." So they had a completely elegant-looking design with a cord coming out of the front, but yet when they made it wireless, by golly, the port's on the bottom. It's a wireless mouse. It's not meant to be plugged in while you're using it.
Ironically, there's a popular self-help book called Who Moved My Cheese that seems to address the sort of angst some people feel about the charging port being on the bottom of this wireless mouse.
So, self-evident if that's the narrative you prefer? The patent has to cover the bases. There are lots of wireless mice with connection ports on the front. BTW, zero angst. I wouldn't buy one either way. I'm just commenting on it in regards to design.
That’s precisely the reason it’s evident that, after making a nice drawing of a lovely wired version with the wire coming out of the front, they made a conscious decision, apart from vain aesthetics, to put the charging port on the bottom. It’s a wireless mouse. It’s not meant to be plugged in while you’re using it.
P.S. The fact that there are other wireless mice with ports on the front is of little relevance. There are lots of other things competing with every other Apple product that have design features Apple has intentionally chosen not to replicate.
P.P.S. The Apple Watch also can’t be used (apart from as an alarm clock) while its charging. Yet somehow people aren’t claiming that’s an oversight or bad design. That’s because people aren’t accustomed to wearing a watch with a cord coming out of the side. It’s a wireless watch. It’s not meant to be plugged in while you’re wearing it.
AppleZulu said: That’s precisely the reason it’s evident that, after making a nice drawing of a lovely wired version with the wire coming out of the front, they made a conscious decision, apart from vain aesthetics, to put the charging port on the bottom. It’s a wireless mouse. It’s not meant to be plugged in while you’re using it.
What other Apple product can't you even properly set down while charging, because the cord is coming out in such an awkward way? I'm not even talking about having it plugged in while using it. It's a crazy design even when not using it!
AppleZulu said: P.P.S. The Apple Watch also can’t be used (apart from as an alarm clock) while its charging. Yet somehow people aren’t claiming that’s an oversight or bad design. That’s because people aren’t accustomed to wearing a watch with a cord coming out of the side. It’s a wireless watch. It’s not meant to be plugged in while you’re wearing it.
I'm not sure these two things have enough in common with one another for a point to be made.
Comments
For instance, a more robust cable would have to have a distinct, proprietary connector, because people would otherwise end up using and destroying other cables instead, with the same complaints listed previously. And of course, that’s a lot of investment to enable the user to entirely miss the point that it’s a wireless mouse.
Maybe wireless charging isn’t a bad idea, but that adds a lot of expense when the current design allows a two-minute charge to cover a whole workday, and leaving it plugged in overnight will solve the charging problem for a month.
No, I think their current design for charging the mouse is both reasonable and very intentional, and that some users’ visceral negative reaction to it is more about them not getting it than it is about any actual problem or inconvenience.
The hockey puck mouse could easily be fixed by buying a good one, but sealing up devices was and is stupid. And expensive.
Since I was raised on one-buttoners, the first thing I do when configuring a Mac is switching the alternate-click to the left side of the mouse; my standard use case is having index finger on right side of mouse. Maybe this oddball style accounts (or at least helps) for my puck-loving ways.
while Jony Ives is a top designer and has made substantial contributions at Apple perhaps the time is right to move on. Hopefully Apple has a new designer ready to put them back in the hardware game. Selling services for your iPhone is a great option but the most important thing is the iPhone itself which has always been Apples bread and butter
Agree on third gen shuffle. Pure minimalism. It was a bold move and the dollars spoke. I love mine though. I forgot they had a polished stainless model. Pretty sweet.
However on the Pencil, while I agree that the dongle-style charging is not the best, the product overall is stellar. Guess they could have waited a year or however long it took to get the wireless charging crammed in to release, but I've certainly gotten a lot of use out of mine & just can't consider it eligible for a "worst design" list
And, again, since it has a major impact and there isn't a work-around (ie: just buy a different mouse), I think I stand by it being the worst or one of the worst.
No doubt! We're not comparing it to a modern iMac, but the computers at the time!
I'm sure it varies for everyone... but I've owned/used most of the Apple mice over the years. I even bought a Magic Mouse outright (as expensive as they are), but just couldn't continue to use it after a year or two. The shape has something to do with it, but the more problematic thing was how the scrolling worked via the touch surface. It often messed up (even constrained to 1 or 2 gestures like right-click and scroll), and made me keep my fingers in odd positions (like holding the right-click finger slightly off the mouse surface, to make it work properly. IMO, it just didn't work well and was quite uncomfortable for long periods of work.
I've also spent hours at stores trying mice, and the MX Master is about the only one I can tolerate for long, now (I use a Magic Trackpad 2 most of the time, despite it not being as good for graphics/CAD most of the time). In doing so, I've always been a bit shocked at how bad most mice really are. The MX Master could use a slightly different shape for me, but for basic functions (right-click, scroll) it works quite well. The scroll wheel is especially good on it, and especially horrible on most other mice!
That said, I'm now on my 3rd one in like maybe 5ish years. The left-click microswitch goes bad, which is just crazy for a mouse so expensive. I tried to fix the first one and gave up after a couple of hours, and decided it was worth my time just to go buy a new one. Other than that, it's nice. Also, I've found it a bit less susceptible to interference (and erratic control behavior... which happens from time to time with BT mice/trackpad).
That's kind of why I posted the comment earlier about how much weight we put on impact here. This is super-low impact, but it is still (IMO) a bad design. Other designs might be much less 'bad' but have a huge impact (like the MB/MBP keyboard).
Yeah, and it is important to separate the 'taste' aspect a bit from more UX aspects of the design, and then basic functionality. While it is a balancing act, I think you could order them from most important to less important (ie: a beautiful design that doesn't function is kind of worthless).
IMO, the original iPod with scroll wheel was an incredible design in terms of UX and UI, but then the iPods kind of went downhill in that regard. Meanwhile, the buttons on iPhones have gotten better with iteration towards the haptic home button. I think it depends on what it is on whether it will improve by being less physical... which is a bit my fear on where the keyboard design might be headed.
My time on them is still fairly limited, but aside from just not liking it, I do wonder if I ever would or my accuracy would improve. Maybe? But, it also seems that are relying more on autocorrect, which IMO, isn't a great thing with an inaccurate keyboard. When you're using a relatively slow process (like typing on iOS), you often catch the correction issue as you go, which is harder and more distracting with the speed of typing on a real keyboard. It is much easier (at least in my experience), to have autocorrect mistakenly replace things when I'm typing on a real keyboard.. and miss that it happened.
Yeah, I forgot about those. Apple remotes, in general, are pretty horrible.
You could do whatever you want with your CAD program of choice, but you're solving a question Apple wasn't asking. The question was never "where can we put the charging port so that it doesn't interrupt our sleek, minimalist design?" The question was "how do we keep people from leaving it plugged in all the time?" The answer to that question is: "put a robust battery in it that will last for a month on a full charge, or for a day on two minutes' charge; then put the charging port on the bottom. "
They didn't put the charging port on the bottom because that was the only place left after they eliminated all the other places where they didn't want to put it. They put the charging port on the bottom because it would prevent people from leaving it plugged in while they use it.
Ironically, there's a popular self-help book called Who Moved My Cheese that seems to address the sort of angst some people feel about the charging port being on the bottom of this wireless mouse.
BTW, zero angst. I wouldn't buy one either way. I'm just commenting on it in regards to design.
P.S. The fact that there are other wireless mice with ports on the front is of little relevance. There are lots of other things competing with every other Apple product that have design features Apple has intentionally chosen not to replicate.
P.P.S. The Apple Watch also can’t be used (apart from as an alarm clock) while its charging. Yet somehow people aren’t claiming that’s an oversight or bad design. That’s because people aren’t accustomed to wearing a watch with a cord coming out of the side. It’s a wireless watch. It’s not meant to be plugged in while you’re wearing it.
I'm not sure these two things have enough in common with one another for a point to be made.