USB-A is a worldwide, international standard. At some point it makes sense to change, but not at the moment. Adding extra ports to chargers will just make the chargers cost more. For the vast majority of consumers, USB-A is still the primary port they use. It makes absolutely no sense to cater to a small minority of primarily high-tech users, and make everyone else pay for it.
When is the right moment to switch to USB-C? Sometimes, the only way to create change is to force it. This very same thing happened with the floppy drive, and if anything it was worse, as Apple provided no viable alternative to it at the time (Apple didn't add CD-R drives to their computers for a number of years after they killed the floppy).
USB-A is a worldwide, international standard. At some point it makes sense to change, but not at the moment. Adding extra ports to chargers will just make the chargers cost more. For the vast majority of consumers, USB-A is still the primary port they use. It makes absolutely no sense to cater to a small minority of primarily high-tech users, and make everyone else pay for it.
When is the right moment to switch to USB-C? Sometimes, the only way to create change is to force it. This very same thing happened with the floppy drive, and if anything it was worse, as Apple provided no viable alternative to it at the time (Apple didn't add CD-R drives to their computers for a number of years after they killed the floppy).
USB-A is a worldwide, international standard. At some point it makes sense to change, but not at the moment. Adding extra ports to chargers will just make the chargers cost more. For the vast majority of consumers, USB-A is still the primary port they use. It makes absolutely no sense to cater to a small minority of primarily high-tech users, and make everyone else pay for it.
When is the right moment to switch to USB-C? Sometimes, the only way to create change is to force it. This very same thing happened with the floppy drive, and if anything it was worse, as Apple provided no viable alternative to it at the time (Apple didn't add CD-R drives to their computers for a number of years after they killed the floppy).
There’s no need to do it at all. Usb-A vs. usb-c is not the same thing as replacing the floppy drive with CD-ROM. The number of people who need usb-c in any practical way, who are inconvenienced by the lack of uniformity in their tech setups are minute in comparison to the number of people who rely on USB-A worldwide. The floppy needed to be replaced because data size required it. The average consumer does not need USB-C, when the main reason they plug anything into USB-A is for charging purposes. For the average consumer, the world is moving toward wireless, and when that happens USB-A will drop away, and there will likely be a better standard than USB-C for those who do need a wired connection.
MplsP said: What about the old external hard drive I have? It’s USB 3, so plenty fast enough for all I need. Should I trash it and spend a bunch of money on a new one
LOL You're claiming that you have no recourse but to "trash" an external HDD because USB-C exists? Of all the shitty arguments in all the world. Geez.
Or, you could still use that exact same external HDD, but you know that.
Yes - of course I know that USB C is backward compatible with USB A. My point is that there’s no advantage to USB C with my existing external hard drive. It’s USB 3.2 and the speed is the same whether I use a USB C cable or a USB A cable. Everyone seems to think that I’m arguing that stuff wont’ work with USB C. Of course it will work; it just won’t work any better. Hence my point that there’s no push to upgrade. If I have a USB 3.2 drive that works just fine, why would I want to change to USB C? Just so I can get the new connector?
Again - my point is not “usb c sucks;” my point is that for the vast majority of users there’s no significant improvement and thus no incentive to demand a change.
So your argument is the same as all the people that said Apple shouldn’t move from the 30-pin connector because they didn’t have a specific advantage at that given time?
USB-A is a worldwide, international standard. At some point it makes sense to change, but not at the moment. Adding extra ports to chargers will just make the chargers cost more. For the vast majority of consumers, USB-A is still the primary port they use. It makes absolutely no sense to cater to a small minority of primarily high-tech users, and make everyone else pay for it.
When is the right moment to switch to USB-C? Sometimes, the only way to create change is to force it. This very same thing happened with the floppy drive, and if anything it was worse, as Apple provided no viable alternative to it at the time (Apple didn't add CD-R drives to their computers for a number of years after they killed the floppy).
There’s no need to do it at all. Usb-A vs. usb-c is not the same thing as replacing the floppy drive with CD-ROM. The number of people who need usb-c in any practical way, who are inconvenienced by the lack of uniformity in their tech setups are minute in comparison to the number of people who rely on USB-A worldwide. The floppy needed to be replaced because data size required it. The average consumer does not need USB-C, when the main reason they plug anything into USB-A is for charging purposes. For the average consumer, the world is moving toward wireless, and when that happens USB-A will drop away, and there will likely be a better standard than USB-C for those who do need a wired connection.
So because the average consumer doesn't "need" USB-C we should just forget about it? Should Apple not have transitioned from the 30-pin connector to lightning because nobody needed lightning? Should we not have moved on from serial ports to USB because most consumers didn't need USB? Your argument makes zero sense.
Whoever sold you on the lie of USB-C was doing you no favors.
Hold on while we run out and swap all the USB-A ports in everything.
You only need a different cable. I guess you were also one of the hold outs when Apple switch from serial/parallel ports to USB on all Macs. What a disaster that was!
Whoever sold you on the lie of USB-C was doing you no favors.
Hold on while we run out and swap all the USB-A ports in everything.
Incredible that people perpetuate this nonsense.
Have you looked around? Pretty much every single car has a USB A plug. The airplane has a USB A plug. The Hotel has a USB A plug. The combination USB outlet I found at Home Depot is USB A. Virtually every wired mouse and keyboard made is USB A. The onlyplace USB C is at all common is the Apple Store.
USB A is the standard. It may change in the future, but it will take a long time. Apple putting USB C ports on its computers doesn't magically change the rest of the world. As someone mentioned above, though, except for high power devices like MacBooks, it really doesn't matter for charging. You had a USB A to lightning (or Mini USB or micro USB or...) cable. If it doesn't need more than 12W, it really doesn't matter if the other end is USB A or USB C. This is also a reason it will take a long time to change. For the majority of uses, people don't need the power capacity of USB C. It's not unlike coming out with 220V appliances and expecting everyone to start putting 220V plugs in their homes.
USB C is clearly more flexible than USB A - higher power capacity, the ability to handle thunderbolt data in the same port. the problem is, USB C cables are not all the same and can be spec'd differently, so your USB C cable may work for charging but not for thunderbolt or vice versa, essentially adding a whole lot of confusion to the picture.
The USB standards group messed up!
The USB-C connector is not built to handle higher current flows newer laptops will be needing (you can blame Intel for that).
They also failed to define a clear marking for USB-C cables so power only cables can be id'ed from data only cables or other possible configs.
For now its a USB-A world and will be for quite a few years. Don't forget USB-A is still a cheaper solution which is ideal for slower I/O like mice, trackpads, printers and scanners. Many engineering & medical lab systems still use USB-A and I don't see them changing 80~150k devices out just to get a USB-C connection when it is overkill for what they need.
Is USB-C a good thing? Yes! For data for surest ! Power is a bit iffy as long as phones and laptops don't need more power to charge their batteries then it should work (80 watt is about the break point, anything more could cause the cable and connectors to overheat).
FYI the 15” MBP charger is 87 watts!
USB-A is a type of port connector that carries the USB protocol (USB 2 and 3 Gen I) USB-C is also a type port connector but it carries USB 2 and USB 3 Gen I (5 gbps) and Gen II (10gbps). It also carries Thunderbolt, DisplayPort, Ethernet and PCI-e.
in fact, there are USB-C ports that are uSB 2.0 only.
So in actuality the port connector is some what irrelevant.
MplsP said: What about the old external hard drive I have? It’s USB 3, so plenty fast enough for all I need. Should I trash it and spend a bunch of money on a new one
LOL You're claiming that you have no recourse but to "trash" an external HDD because USB-C exists? Of all the shitty arguments in all the world. Geez.
Or, you could still use that exact same external HDD, but you know that.
Yes - of course I know that USB C is backward compatible with USB A. My point is that there’s no advantage to USB C with my existing external hard drive. It’s USB 3.2 and the speed is the same whether I use a USB C cable or a USB A cable. Everyone seems to think that I’m arguing that stuff wont’ work with USB C. Of course it will work; it just won’t work any better. Hence my point that there’s no push to upgrade. If I have a USB 3.2 drive that works just fine, why would I want to change to USB C? Just so I can get the new connector?
Again - my point is not “usb c sucks;” my point is that for the vast majority of users there’s no significant improvement and thus no incentive to demand a change.
There was no improvement in moving from ps2 to usb for mice or keyboards...except that you got more ports that could be used for other things if you didn’t need them. Likewise the improvement from moving from a hdmi port to usb-c is the ability to use that port for something else if desired.
Sure, manufacturers should PROVIDE adapters for about two years and then go full throttle.
Its a great standard and does EVERYTHING.
There is no drawback beyond “well... my old compooter on the farm don’t got that newfangled shape!”
thats what adapters are for. Only the luddites use them (as it should be. They have a different gadget for everything). NOT the ones using one port to save them all in order to clean it up and unify things.
I wish Apple went full bore USB C only.
It would make a lot a lot of things so much simpler. We use all Apple where I work. Having to get different types of cables for iMacs and MacBook pros is annoying.
Why? What advantage is there to me getting a USB C keyboard? How about swapping out my car stereo (nope - I was just shopping for a new car stereo on Crutchfield and none of them are USB C) What about the old external hard drive I have? It’s USB 3, so plenty fast enough for all I need. Should I trash it and spend a bunch of money on a new one just because some technophile as decided that “USB C is the future and I want it NOW so everyone should have to change what they do to suit my views?” Many people said FireWire was the future, but that just stumbled along before dying with a whimper.
Manufacturers aren't stupid. What they do reflects what the consumer demand. It's a fact that even now in July 2019 most computers and devices used worldwide still have USB-A. It's a fact that cannot be denied. And until the average consumer has ditched all those legacy USB-A devices, nothing will change.
You just said that manufacturers won't support USB-C until customers support USB-C which you claim won't happen until manufactures support USB-C. Do you not see a problem with your statement? Do you not see how all technologies have become a common standard?
Regardless of your disdain for USB-C the adoption and use grows every year.
Actually, what you said is exactly right. When USB (A) came along, it was clearly superior and easier and more flexible than the interfaces it was replacing. It took some time, but there was a natural driving force for its adoption. USB C doesn’t have that driving force. Sure, you can charge with it, but for charging, the MagSafe cable on my old MBA actually worked better. Yeah, I can use it for video, but my MBA had a thunderbolt port that worked for video, and I either get a thunderbolt capable USB C cable with an adapter for my non-thunderbolt monitor, or I use a thunderbolt cable - what’s the difference?
The lack of a real need or benefit of USB C for the majority of users is exactly what is going to slow the adoption. People won’t demand something they don’t need and manufacturers won’t respond to demand that isn’t there. (On the contrary, I know of many people who have specifically looked for devices with USB A ports because all their devices and cables are USB A)
The point of usb-c is that is both your MagSafe port and your video port and your high speed data port in one. It is clearly superior to having separate power, video and data ports on a machine.
This is no different than moving from ps2, serial and parallel ports to USB.
Like I said earlier, USB had clear advantages over the PS/2 port for the majority of applications. USB C is clearly more capable but the vast majority of users don’t have a need for those capabilities and so there is not nearly the push. The PS/2 port was really only used for mice/keyboards and at the time USB A came out computers were rarely kept more than 3-4 years meaning there was a natural switch to USB. The installed base of USB A is orders of magnitude larger as is the number of things it’s used for so there is much more ‘inertia’ keeping USB A in use.
As far as having ‘one port, I have 4 USB C ports on my MBP. The vast majority of time I use one of them to charge it. The USB C cable that comes with the MacBookPros is a charging cable, so I can’t use it for data anyway. If you took that one port out and replaced it with a MagSafe it would make *zero* difference in the usability. It would actually make it more usable since the MagSafe was actually superior for charging (it was easier to connect, it had a charging indicator, it disconnected if someone tripped on the cord, the cord laid flat against the machine.) Ditto the video - replace one of the USB C ports with a thunderbolt for video. I have to have a separate thunderbolt-capable USB C cable anyway, so what’s the advantage of using the USB C port vs having a thunderbolt? I’d then have a MagSafe for charging, a thunderbolt for the rare occasions I actually connect to an external monitor and 2 USB’s which is one more than I ever use anyway.
I get that USB C can do it all; my point is that the number of people who need to do all that is very small and the number of people that need 4 separate ports to do it all is much smaller still. If the big advantage is flexibility but very few people actually need that flexibility then it really isn’t much of an advantage and the inconvenience of dealing with new connectors outweighs the supposed benefits.
Because genius, it’s not all about you.
Other folks 1 connection docking.
Others want dual monitors.
Others want eGPU + drives.
That YOU only need 2 high speed digital interconnects is immaterial.
Since you obviously are a genius, I'm surprised you have a hard time understanding that I was simply presenting examples of common use cases where there is no significant advantage.
MplsP said: [...] - replace one of the USB C ports with a thunderbolt for video. I have to have a separate thunderbolt-capable USB C cable anyway, so what’s the advantage of using the USB C port vs having a thunderbolt?
Thunderbolt uses a USB-C connector. What you’re describing is removing the USB-C connector and replacing it with a USB-C connector.
I was referring to the previous, trapezoidal plug.
Regardless, everyone is missing my point - I'm not disputing that USB C has technical and convenience advantages over USB A, rather that for many, probably the majority of current uses those advantages are minimal meaning there will not be a significant push to change. As things progress, I'm sure the drive to change will increase.
MplsP said: What about the old external hard drive I have? It’s USB 3, so plenty fast enough for all I need. Should I trash it and spend a bunch of money on a new one
LOL You're claiming that you have no recourse but to "trash" an external HDD because USB-C exists? Of all the shitty arguments in all the world. Geez.
Or, you could still use that exact same external HDD, but you know that.
Yes - of course I know that USB C is backward compatible with USB A. My point is that there’s no advantage to USB C with my existing external hard drive. It’s USB 3.2 and the speed is the same whether I use a USB C cable or a USB A cable. Everyone seems to think that I’m arguing that stuff wont’ work with USB C. Of course it will work; it just won’t work any better. Hence my point that there’s no push to upgrade. If I have a USB 3.2 drive that works just fine, why would I want to change to USB C? Just so I can get the new connector?
Again - my point is not “usb c sucks;” my point is that for the vast majority of users there’s no significant improvement and thus no incentive to demand a change.
So your argument is the same as all the people that said Apple shouldn’t move from the 30-pin connector because they didn’t have a specific advantage at that given time?
That tells me you haven’t read anything I’ve written. I never said Apple shouldn’t include USB C ports, nor am I saying people should intentionally not buy USB C peripherals just to protest USB C. If you want to use my argument with the 30-pin connector then the best analogy would be to say people shouldn’t get a new phone simply to get the lightning connector.
For power users - people running dual monitors, running external GPUs or transferring large amounts of data to external drives, the new ports are awesome, but those people are relatively few. For the majority of average users these capabilities don’t matter and the switch presents an inconvenience with no benefit and a potential drawback because of the poorly thought out USB C cable system. Power, USB and TB cables all look virtually identical but can’t necessarily be substituted.
Also - in a previous post I was mixing up TB3 and TB2. My mistake. MacBook Pros have a TB3 interface in their USB C ports while the old trapazoidal (technically hexagonal) connector was TB2. Like USB C, TB3 is superior for some uses, but for many/most others is equivalent. If you don’t need to drive 2 4K monitors at once or your external device isn’t capable of utilizing the extra TB3 speeds, then it’s really much the same as USB - there’s no actual advantage. The monitor or drive should work fine with a new cable, but it won’t work any better and people aren’t going to clamor for USB C just so they can buy a new cable with a new connector.
USB-A is a worldwide, international standard. At some point it makes sense to change, but not at the moment. Adding extra ports to chargers will just make the chargers cost more. For the vast majority of consumers, USB-A is still the primary port they use. It makes absolutely no sense to cater to a small minority of primarily high-tech users, and make everyone else pay for it.
When is the right moment to switch to USB-C? Sometimes, the only way to create change is to force it. This very same thing happened with the floppy drive, and if anything it was worse, as Apple provided no viable alternative to it at the time (Apple didn't add CD-R drives to their computers for a number of years after they killed the floppy).
There’s no need to do it at all. Usb-A vs. usb-c is not the same thing as replacing the floppy drive with CD-ROM. The number of people who need usb-c in any practical way, who are inconvenienced by the lack of uniformity in their tech setups are minute in comparison to the number of people who rely on USB-A worldwide. The floppy needed to be replaced because data size required it. The average consumer does not need USB-C, when the main reason they plug anything into USB-A is for charging purposes. For the average consumer, the world is moving toward wireless, and when that happens USB-A will drop away, and there will likely be a better standard than USB-C for those who do need a wired connection.
So because the average consumer doesn't "need" USB-C we should just forget about it? Should Apple not have transitioned from the 30-pin connector to lightning because nobody needed lightning? Should we not have moved on from serial ports to USB because most consumers didn't need USB? Your argument makes zero sense.
Again, the move from 30-pin to Lightning was a necessary move for Apple which was a mixed bag for consumers. The move from serial to USB was mostly a win for consumers, and cheaper for Apple. For general use iOS devices — which are the main product Apple sells — usb-c gains neither Apple nor the consumer anything, and is not necessary for the evolution, or design of the device. It’s primarily used for charging, and little else. It offers only one small fraction of Apples customer base an advantage, and that’s the one using Macs, and plugging in their devices to transfer files, and backup data — something Apple would rather you do via iCloud for their best selling devices. For everyone else, including Apple, it’s an unnecessary headache. Another big difference between serial and 30-pin — they weren’t universal power charging standards, used for multiple devices made by almost every manufacturer worldwide, regulated by government legislatures. The port doesn’t just appear mainly on computers or iPods, as in your example, it’s practically everywhere..
You also haven't addressed the Death Star-sized problem with USB-C for EVERYTHING. The loss of the MagSafe power cable. That was the most brilliant thing Apple ever invented. I'm not even going to fact check that statement to see if Apple was indeed the first one to have a magnetically attached power cable to any device because I think it is that amazing. Its removal from the MacBook line is the biggest mistake Apple ever made. Bigger than the stupid hockey puck mouse, bigger than the structural integrity flaws in various iPhone models, bigger than Steve Jobs saying, "You're holding it wrong", bigger than the first Apple Pencil being charged by sticking out the bottom of the iPad just waiting for it to be snapped off and damaging both devices, the stupid fucking notch on the iPhone, charging the Magic Mouse 2 from the bottom, etc. Every single flaw, small and large, Apple has ever made has nothing on the removal of the MagSafe power cable.
Agreed 10,000%. Apple fucked up big time when they nixed MagSafe. Stupid stupid stupid.
You also haven't addressed the Death Star-sized problem with USB-C for EVERYTHING. The loss of the MagSafe power cable. That was the most brilliant thing Apple ever invented. I'm not even going to fact check that statement to see if Apple was indeed the first one to have a magnetically attached power cable to any device because I think it is that amazing. Its removal from the MacBook line is the biggest mistake Apple ever made. Bigger than the stupid hockey puck mouse, bigger than the structural integrity flaws in various iPhone models, bigger than Steve Jobs saying, "You're holding it wrong", bigger than the first Apple Pencil being charged by sticking out the bottom of the iPad just waiting for it to be snapped off and damaging both devices, the stupid fucking notch on the iPhone, charging the Magic Mouse 2 from the bottom, etc. Every single flaw, small and large, Apple has ever made has nothing on the removal of the MagSafe power cable.
Agreed 10,000%. Apple fucked up big time when they nixed MagSafe. Stupid stupid stupid.
No they didn't. If you oddly require MagSafe in 2019 then there is a cornucopia of options to make that happen.
You also haven't addressed the Death Star-sized problem with USB-C for EVERYTHING. The loss of the MagSafe power cable. That was the most brilliant thing Apple ever invented. I'm not even going to fact check that statement to see if Apple was indeed the first one to have a magnetically attached power cable to any device because I think it is that amazing. Its removal from the MacBook line is the biggest mistake Apple ever made. Bigger than the stupid hockey puck mouse, bigger than the structural integrity flaws in various iPhone models, bigger than Steve Jobs saying, "You're holding it wrong", bigger than the first Apple Pencil being charged by sticking out the bottom of the iPad just waiting for it to be snapped off and damaging both devices, the stupid fucking notch on the iPhone, charging the Magic Mouse 2 from the bottom, etc. Every single flaw, small and large, Apple has ever made has nothing on the removal of the MagSafe power cable.
Agreed 10,000%. Apple fucked up big time when they nixed MagSafe. Stupid stupid stupid.
No they didn't. If you oddly require MagSafe in 2019 then there is a cornucopia of options to make that happen.
With the possible exception of allowing you to charge from either side (which in 8 years of using my MBA I never found a true need for,) give one way in which USB C is superior to MagSafe for charging? Andrew O just wrote an article describing how he had to send his MBP in because the (heavily used) USB C ports were giving out.
Compared to USB C MagSafe was easier to connect. It kept the charging circuitry separate from the buss, kept the cord flat against the machine so it wasn't being bumped and twisted as much, and allowed for no stress on internal components and kept the machine on the desk if someone tripped on the cord making it safer for the machine overall. It also gave an indication of charging status without opening the machine up - I could see from across the room if my MBA was charging, fully charged or unplugged.
Yeah, USB C can be used for charging, but MagSafe was head and shoulders better at it.
kept the cord flat against the machine so it wasn't being bumped and twisted as much
What does this mean? Not disagreeing necessarily, I genuinely don't follow what you're saying.
the USB C plug juts out at a right angle to the side of the machine. This makes it much more likely to get bumped, caught and/or stress the port. The MagSafe connector on my MBA laid flat against the side, like the picture on the wikipedia site: File:MagSafe_9651.jpg
Sure, manufacturers should PROVIDE adapters for about two years and then go full throttle.
Its a great standard and does EVERYTHING.
There is no drawback beyond “well... my old compooter on the farm don’t got that newfangled shape!”
thats what adapters are for. Only the luddites use them (as it should be. They have a different gadget for everything). NOT the ones using one port to save them all in order to clean it up and unify things.
I wish Apple went full bore USB C only.
It would make a lot a lot of things so much simpler. We use all Apple where I work. Having to get different types of cables for iMacs and MacBook pros is annoying.
Why? What advantage is there to me getting a USB C keyboard? How about swapping out my car stereo (nope - I was just shopping for a new car stereo on Crutchfield and none of them are USB C) What about the old external hard drive I have? It’s USB 3, so plenty fast enough for all I need. Should I trash it and spend a bunch of money on a new one just because some technophile as decided that “USB C is the future and I want it NOW so everyone should have to change what they do to suit my views?” Many people said FireWire was the future, but that just stumbled along before dying with a whimper.
Manufacturers aren't stupid. What they do reflects what the consumer demand. It's a fact that even now in July 2019 most computers and devices used worldwide still have USB-A. It's a fact that cannot be denied. And until the average consumer has ditched all those legacy USB-A devices, nothing will change.
You just said that manufacturers won't support USB-C until customers support USB-C which you claim won't happen until manufactures support USB-C. Do you not see a problem with your statement? Do you not see how all technologies have become a common standard?
Regardless of your disdain for USB-C the adoption and use grows every year.
Actually, what you said is exactly right. When USB (A) came along, it was clearly superior and easier and more flexible than the interfaces it was replacing. It took some time, but there was a natural driving force for its adoption. USB C doesn’t have that driving force. Sure, you can charge with it, but for charging, the MagSafe cable on my old MBA actually worked better. Yeah, I can use it for video, but my MBA had a thunderbolt port that worked for video, and I either get a thunderbolt capable USB C cable with an adapter for my non-thunderbolt monitor, or I use a thunderbolt cable - what’s the difference?
The lack of a real need or benefit of USB C for the majority of users is exactly what is going to slow the adoption. People won’t demand something they don’t need and manufacturers won’t respond to demand that isn’t there. (On the contrary, I know of many people who have specifically looked for devices with USB A ports because all their devices and cables are USB A)
The point of usb-c is that is both your MagSafe port and your video port and your high speed data port in one. It is clearly superior to having separate power, video and data ports on a machine.
This is no different than moving from ps2, serial and parallel ports to USB.
Like I said earlier, USB had clear advantages over the PS/2 port for the majority of applications. USB C is clearly more capable but the vast majority of users don’t have a need for those capabilities and so there is not nearly the push. The PS/2 port was really only used for mice/keyboards and at the time USB A came out computers were rarely kept more than 3-4 years meaning there was a natural switch to USB. The installed base of USB A is orders of magnitude larger as is the number of things it’s used for so there is much more ‘inertia’ keeping USB A in use.
As far as having ‘one port, I have 4 USB C ports on my MBP. The vast majority of time I use one of them to charge it. The USB C cable that comes with the MacBookPros is a charging cable, so I can’t use it for data anyway. If you took that one port out and replaced it with a MagSafe it would make *zero* difference in the usability. It would actually make it more usable since the MagSafe was actually superior for charging (it was easier to connect, it had a charging indicator, it disconnected if someone tripped on the cord, the cord laid flat against the machine.) Ditto the video - replace one of the USB C ports with a thunderbolt for video. I have to have a separate thunderbolt-capable USB C cable anyway, so what’s the advantage of using the USB C port vs having a thunderbolt? I’d then have a MagSafe for charging, a thunderbolt for the rare occasions I actually connect to an external monitor and 2 USB’s which is one more than I ever use anyway.
I get that USB C can do it all; my point is that the number of people who need to do all that is very small and the number of people that need 4 separate ports to do it all is much smaller still. If the big advantage is flexibility but very few people actually need that flexibility then it really isn’t much of an advantage and the inconvenience of dealing with new connectors outweighs the supposed benefits.
Because genius, it’s not all about you.
Other folks 1 connection docking.
Others want dual monitors.
Others want eGPU + drives.
That YOU only need 2 high speed digital interconnects is immaterial.
Since you obviously are a genius, I'm surprised you have a hard time understanding that I was simply presenting examples of common use cases where there is no significant advantage.
MplsP said: [...] - replace one of the USB C ports with a thunderbolt for video. I have to have a separate thunderbolt-capable USB C cable anyway, so what’s the advantage of using the USB C port vs having a thunderbolt?
Thunderbolt uses a USB-C connector. What you’re describing is removing the USB-C connector and replacing it with a USB-C connector.
I was referring to the previous, trapezoidal plug.
Regardless, everyone is missing my point - I'm not disputing that USB C has technical and convenience advantages over USB A, rather that for many, probably the majority of current uses those advantages are minimal meaning there will not be a significant push to change. As things progress, I'm sure the drive to change will increase.
Nobody missed your point genius. It’s just wrong.
Then please explain why. The only thing anyone has done has been to take things out of context, or claim that I am arguing things I'm not. So I'll go with I'm right (I'm the genius, after all,) and you're wrong.
kept the cord flat against the machine so it wasn't being bumped and twisted as much
What does this mean? Not disagreeing necessarily, I genuinely don't follow what you're saying.
the USB C plug juts out at a right angle to the side of the machine. This makes it much more likely to get bumped, caught and/or stress the port. The MagSafe connector on my MBA laid flat against the side, like the picture on the wikipedia site: File:MagSafe_9651.jpg
Oh I see, sorry I have the old style Magsafe, forgot they had that later design.
You also haven't addressed the Death Star-sized problem with USB-C for EVERYTHING. The loss of the MagSafe power cable. That was the most brilliant thing Apple ever invented. I'm not even going to fact check that statement to see if Apple was indeed the first one to have a magnetically attached power cable to any device because I think it is that amazing. Its removal from the MacBook line is the biggest mistake Apple ever made. Bigger than the stupid hockey puck mouse, bigger than the structural integrity flaws in various iPhone models, bigger than Steve Jobs saying, "You're holding it wrong", bigger than the first Apple Pencil being charged by sticking out the bottom of the iPad just waiting for it to be snapped off and damaging both devices, the stupid fucking notch on the iPhone, charging the Magic Mouse 2 from the bottom, etc. Every single flaw, small and large, Apple has ever made has nothing on the removal of the MagSafe power cable.
Agreed 10,000%. Apple fucked up big time when they nixed MagSafe. Stupid stupid stupid.
No they didn't. If you oddly require MagSafe in 2019 then there is a cornucopia of options to make that happen.
I'm going to use a saying from one of my old professors: It's ok, you're allowed to be wrong.
Actually he’s right. There are aftermarket MagSafe alternatives. You insert a plug with a magnetic connector into a USB-C port and a cable with a matching magnetic end attaches to that. It pops off under stress the same way MagSafe does
Whoever sold you on the lie of USB was doing you no favors.
Hold on while we run out and swap all the PS/2 ports in everything.
Fixed that for you. You want to live in the early 2000's, go right ahead and get out of the way for the rest of us that haven't looked back.
No you haven't. The entire world is still using USB-A, and no one outside of the little tech bubbles has even begun to care about USB-C.
It is not the savior you were promised: There are at least 15 different cable specs that have a USB-C style connector on them. So much for 1 cable to rule them all.
I'll sit here in the "2000's" as you allege while I await all the vehicles, airplane seats, charging stations, and more to have USB-C deployed. I'll still be waiting in 5 years. It isn't going to happen until USB-A is literally no where, and that will be another solid 20 years.
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USB-A is a type of port connector that carries the USB protocol (USB 2 and 3 Gen I) USB-C is also a type port connector but it carries USB 2 and USB 3 Gen I (5 gbps) and Gen II (10gbps). It also carries Thunderbolt, DisplayPort, Ethernet and PCI-e.
in fact, there are USB-C ports that are uSB 2.0 only.
So in actuality the port connector is some what irrelevant.
For power users - people running dual monitors, running external GPUs or transferring large amounts of data to external drives, the new ports are awesome, but those people are relatively few. For the majority of average users these capabilities don’t matter and the switch presents an inconvenience with no benefit and a potential drawback because of the poorly thought out USB C cable system. Power, USB and TB cables all look virtually identical but can’t necessarily be substituted.
Also - in a previous post I was mixing up TB3 and TB2. My mistake. MacBook Pros have a TB3 interface in their USB C ports while the old trapazoidal (technically hexagonal) connector was TB2. Like USB C, TB3 is superior for some uses, but for many/most others is equivalent. If you don’t need to drive 2 4K monitors at once or your external device isn’t capable of utilizing the extra TB3 speeds, then it’s really much the same as USB - there’s no actual advantage. The monitor or drive should work fine with a new cable, but it won’t work any better and people aren’t going to clamor for USB C just so they can buy a new cable with a new connector.
Compared to USB C MagSafe was easier to connect. It kept the charging circuitry separate from the buss, kept the cord flat against the machine so it wasn't being bumped and twisted as much, and allowed for no stress on internal components and kept the machine on the desk if someone tripped on the cord making it safer for the machine overall. It also gave an indication of charging status without opening the machine up - I could see from across the room if my MBA was charging, fully charged or unplugged.
Yeah, USB C can be used for charging, but MagSafe was head and shoulders better at it.
It is not the savior you were promised: There are at least 15 different cable specs that have a USB-C style connector on them. So much for 1 cable to rule them all.
I'll sit here in the "2000's" as you allege while I await all the vehicles, airplane seats, charging stations, and more to have USB-C deployed. I'll still be waiting in 5 years. It isn't going to happen until USB-A is literally no where, and that will be another solid 20 years.