To be expected from the hater crowd. ONE guy with a national platform complains about his keyboard and it's a bias confirmation orgy from the peanut gallery.
You are aware that this is a very common issue with Apple notebook keyboards since they introduced them in the 12" MacBook, right? Where is the bias? I've had three MBPs with the butterfly keyboards in the last 5 years. I don't care for them, but the benefits of the newer Macs outweigh my slower typing, considerably less comfortable feel of the keyboard, and to a much lesser extent the sound of the keys.
I still have to have to go back to my older MBPs from time-to-time and it's like putting on new socks when my hands get on those old keyboards. They feel so damn good in every way.
Now, I'm not one to say that it's the butterfly mechanism that is the culprit as I've seen no evidence to support the travel, spacing, feel/material, and sound are tied to that specific mechanism; not even the occasional key not working as well as it should because some minuscule particle has got lodged under the key temporarily can be attributed to the mechanism itself. I’d always that an engineer should make the part of the computer with the most exposed moving parts have such tight variants so that tiny particles can be an issue. Only testing in a lab isn't going to yield you real world results.
Additionally, as much as I love the unibody construction I do wonder about the cost to Apple to make it impossible to remove the keyboard from the top cover. That keyboard repair meant all new top covers and every thing removed from the device. That doesn't strike me as good engineering if you haven't thought through the over/under on such things. Maybe they have it was an overall net yield, even with the keyboard repair program, but it's hard for me to make the numbers work out.
Well, this is Apple for you. Some times the design makes sense, but sometimes the design were stubborn and not functional.
Here are some of the examples:
No arrow keys: Apple thought most people will just use the mouse.
No function keys: Only PC needs function keys.
No Esc key: Again, it was a PC thing
No Control keys: Apple already include the "command" and "option" keys
Also I wanted to add that unlike phones, people generally go out of their way to pick the best keyboard (and mouse) for work.
The arrow keys thing was 35 years ago. And 90%+ of users don't need (or ever use) function keys or the Esc key or the Ctrl key. Apple is the only major PC maker willing to jettison legacy junk that the vast majority of people will never miss. But they are also willing to change course if they clearly misjudge the market.
I hate typing on my MBP15 - it really is horrible. The 16 feels so much better - looking forward to changing this spring as AppleCare comes to an end. Something like an XPS15 feels better again, but despite the massive progress made with Win10, I still much prefer MacOS.
That said, most of my typing is with man external keyboard, I just wish they’d integrate TouchID in that...
Uh, yeah Mr. Waititi. They fixed it. Go back to fighting Nazism and making great Thor movies.
They fixed the 16" model but he might not have a 15" or 16". Writers often have lightweight laptops and he mentioned the cramped size. The Air still uses the butterfly keyboard as does the 13" Pro. Here's a photo of a group of writers on Empire, looks like a mix of Air and 13" Pro:
A good laptop for a writer would be a 14" Air/Pro with a scissor keyboard.
Uh, yeah Mr. Waititi. They fixed it. Go back to fighting Nazism and making great Thor movies.
Don't be daft. They updated the keyboard in a single MacBook model line in a single MacBook Pro size. Why assume that he uses a 15" MBP. As a writer who likely hops from meetings to meetings and is on countless commuter trips he may need a smaller laptop as his daily driver. If they had only ever updated the 13" models with the new keyboard I'd probably continue to use ones with the butterfly mechanism because a smaller laptop does not suit my needs and the larger display and other factors outweigh the clearly inferior typing experience. Why is that hard to understand?
But maybe he uses the 16' MBP. Maybe he considers them better than the previous keyboards of the 15" MBP, but still far inferior to the previous 15" MBPs with the scissor mechanisms. There's a lot more that goes into a keyboard than simply the mechanism being used so to assume that it uses a scissor mechanism "fixes" travel, keyboard feel, sound, and other aspects that make the tool a pleasure to use is myopic.
No arrow keys: Apple thought most people will just use the mouse.
No function keys: Only PC needs function keys.
No Esc key: Again, it was a PC thing
No Control keys: Apple already include the "command" and "option" keys
.
As I look down at my MacBook Pro with arrow keys, function keys, esc key, and a control key I wonder why you are arguing about ancient history (in tech terms)?
I'm also conflicted like him, I hate how my car drives but I still buy it to torture myself. I hate how my washer and dryer works but I buy it anyway. People who complain about Apple products and say they want to go back to PCs probably don't realize they have free will. NZ is always behind the tech curve because he probably didn't even try out the keyboard on Macbook Pro 16" because it's a better typing experience now.
I've owned three Macbook Pro's with butterfly keyboards; two are 2016 models; the third, 2019. All three have had to have their keyboards replaced; one of them, twice. I still prefer Macs, but I do wish the butterfly keyboard stayed on the drawing board.
I must be a unicorn. I prefer the new keyboard. I recently worked on my friend's 2012 MBP with the original keyboard and I found it klunky. The new(er) keyboards give that much more snappy feedback. Everyone's different.
So, some guy gets his few minutes of fame and brief access to a bully pulpit to thank his supporters and possibly call the world to action for a noble cause, and he uses this opportunity to whine about his personal issues with a keyboard.
Wow.
You *do* realize the man is a comedic talent? Not everyone has to be Greta Thunburg with their moment of access.
Kiwi sense of humour. What is the most pressing concern for writers today? I am sure there are a number of serious issues but he was not going to be led down that path by anyone.
He was partly making a joke and partly telling the truth. Honestly, he isn't really seriously answering the question posed to him, but instead saying (with a smirk at the end) that the "WGA needs to step in and actually do something" about Mac keyboards.
I do believe he is serious about Mac keyboards sucking, and I totally agree. I have a 2018 13" touchbar Macbook Pro, and it is the worst laptop keyboard I have ever used in my 30 years of using a Mac. Hands down, the worst. Sometimes keys don't respond, sometimes they are mushy, and the travel is nonexistent (although more than my iPhone or iPad, I suppose). I've had the keyboard replaced once already (under warrantee). I am relieved Apple is going back to the scissor mechanics (and away from the crummy butterfly) for future laptop designs. But I would never "move over to a PC" due to the keyboard (comments like that are kind of over the top), but the complaints are legit.
I also recently purchased the new Mac Pro (awesome) which came with the impossibly thin (and similarly crummy) no-travel external keyboard. I immediately replaced it with a third party keyboard (an aluminum Das Keyboard 4 Professional for Mac) and a different mouse (Logitech M720). Yes, this third party keyboard harkens back to the days of the original IBM PC, but it's WAY easier on my hands and arms and posture, and (I know it's strange to say) it's more fun to type with it. Click-clack.
Comments
I still have to have to go back to my older MBPs from time-to-time and it's like putting on new socks when my hands get on those old keyboards. They feel so damn good in every way.
Now, I'm not one to say that it's the butterfly mechanism that is the culprit as I've seen no evidence to support the travel, spacing, feel/material, and sound are tied to that specific mechanism; not even the occasional key not working as well as it should because some minuscule particle has got lodged under the key temporarily can be attributed to the mechanism itself. I’d always that an engineer should make the part of the computer with the most exposed moving parts have such tight variants so that tiny particles can be an issue. Only testing in a lab isn't going to yield you real world results.
Additionally, as much as I love the unibody construction I do wonder about the cost to Apple to make it impossible to remove the keyboard from the top cover. That keyboard repair meant all new top covers and every thing removed from the device. That doesn't strike me as good engineering if you haven't thought through the over/under on such things. Maybe they have it was an overall net yield, even with the keyboard repair program, but it's hard for me to make the numbers work out.
Here are some of the examples:
- No arrow keys: Apple thought most people will just use the mouse.
- No function keys: Only PC needs function keys.
- No Esc key: Again, it was a PC thing
- No Control keys: Apple already include the "command" and "option" keys
Also I wanted to add that unlike phones, people generally go out of their way to pick the best keyboard (and mouse) for work.I'd love to see the survey that backs up that claim. (I'll even take 50% and let you win the argument.)
That said, most of my typing is with man external keyboard, I just wish they’d integrate TouchID in that...
A good laptop for a writer would be a 14" Air/Pro with a scissor keyboard.
But maybe he uses the 16' MBP. Maybe he considers them better than the previous keyboards of the 15" MBP, but still far inferior to the previous 15" MBPs with the scissor mechanisms. There's a lot more that goes into a keyboard than simply the mechanism being used so to assume that it uses a scissor mechanism "fixes" travel, keyboard feel, sound, and other aspects that make the tool a pleasure to use is myopic.
Our entire company was founded on Apple dropping the ball on things. Taika deserves another oscar for this #fire take.
Tom
It's a failed design and Apple is retreating from Ive's blunder.
He was partly making a joke and partly telling the truth. Honestly, he isn't really seriously answering the question posed to him, but instead saying (with a smirk at the end) that the "WGA needs to step in and actually do something" about Mac keyboards.
I do believe he is serious about Mac keyboards sucking, and I totally agree. I have a 2018 13" touchbar Macbook Pro, and it is the worst laptop keyboard I have ever used in my 30 years of using a Mac. Hands down, the worst. Sometimes keys don't respond, sometimes they are mushy, and the travel is nonexistent (although more than my iPhone or iPad, I suppose). I've had the keyboard replaced once already (under warrantee). I am relieved Apple is going back to the scissor mechanics (and away from the crummy butterfly) for future laptop designs. But I would never "move over to a PC" due to the keyboard (comments like that are kind of over the top), but the complaints are legit.
I also recently purchased the new Mac Pro (awesome) which came with the impossibly thin (and similarly crummy) no-travel external keyboard. I immediately replaced it with a third party keyboard (an aluminum Das Keyboard 4 Professional for Mac) and a different mouse (Logitech M720). Yes, this third party keyboard harkens back to the days of the original IBM PC, but it's WAY easier on my hands and arms and posture, and (I know it's strange to say) it's more fun to type with it. Click-clack.