Huawei will be just fine. China wanted to become independent of the West in its technological development by 2024. China can simply stop their people from buying the iPhone and also they can order all iPhone manufacturing in China to be shut down immediately.
After the Coronavirus impact on the economy eases off, there will be an incredible push by the Chinese government to influence (or order) the Chinese consumers to buy domestic products exclusively. Fortunately for China, they can pretty much become economically independent from the West overnight.
The consequences of the Coronavirus epidemic in China will be economic nationalism of never before heard or seen scale. The 2018 boycott of the iPhone by the Chinese consumers will look like a joke compared to what is coming. The Chinese government is pissed at the world for isolating China in these challenging times. China will retaliate once they get a handle on this epidemic.
What’s going for the Chinese brands is a tremendous buying power of the Chinese market and the most robust manufacturing infrastructure in the world. Add the communist ideology and the ability to manipulate consumer sentiment by the government, and you get a powerful cocktail that will allow China to continue to develop without having to rely on the West for the technology or the markets.
Instead of worrying what will happen to Huawei, worry about what will happen to Apple, which has no contingency plan for making its products in the comparable volumes outside of China. Apple also depends heavily on the Chinese market to sell their products. Even though China doesn’t represent the largest share of the Apple’s market, the drop in the China sales of the Apple products will have a profound effect in the Apple’s bottom line and the AAPL share price. Just remember what happened to AAPL at the end of 2018, when Apple’s sales in China dropped by 18%. The AAPL stock lost 40% of its value. Now imagine if the Chinese reduce their purchases of Apple products by 50% or 75%. What will the effect be if the Chinese government shuts down all manufacturing of Apple products in China as a retaliation for the American treatment of Huawei and the imposed isolation of China during the early stages of the Coronavirus epidemic?
Yes, China is planning on making itself independent, but only of Trump's bully tactics and propaganda -- where he suddenly tries to tariff them out of a key market and/or restrict their access to vital services, products and materials.
Otherwise, since Nixon resolved our cold war with them 50 years ago, they have been and plan to continue competing as any other country does in the open and fair international markets. They have no desire to isolate themselves -- that's a Trump thing, not a China thing.
I guess you haven’t heard about the Communist Party goal for China to become technologically independent by 2024.
Like I said the first time:
"Yes, China is planning on making itself independent, but only of Trump's
bully tactics and propaganda -- where he suddenly tries to tariff them
out of a key market and/or restrict their access to vital services,
products and materials.
Otherwise, since Nixon resolved our cold war with them [ended] 50 years ago,
they have been and plan to continue competing as any other country does
in the open and fair international markets. They have no desire to
isolate themselves -- that's a Trump thing, not a China thing."
"The need to confront China’s rising influence in the world has become one of the few strategic agenda items that Americans and Europeans can agree on, in sharp contrast to wider transatlantic disagreements over defence, trade and multilateralism.
Leaders from Austria and Norway on Friday expressed concerns about China’s rising clout, worries similar to those expressed by US lawmakers at the Munich Security Conference, an annual event that gathers experts from around the world.
But comments from officials at the conference made clear that even though there was general agreement on an overall strategy, the US and Europe continue to disagree on tactics."
Interesting! Russia attacked us in 2016 and again in 2018 and is attacking us again in 2020. But we're worried about China while we invite the Russians into our White House. That's odd. Almost like its a distraction or something.
Odd that you can only focus on Trump, not on multiple threats. Heck, even the EU recognizes both Russia and China as threats.
Trump derangement syndrome.
I think the derangement is on your side of the aisle.
Yes, as I said, Russia has attacked us three times (including the present attack on our upcoming election) but all you and Trump can focus on is imaginary attacks by China that have only occured in you delusional brains. Well, Trump is not delusional. He is strategic: He knows China is overtaking us as the world's leading economy so he is responding as he always does: with an attack based on lies. It is his followers who are deranged for believing his lies.
"The need to confront China’s rising influence in the world has become one of the few strategic agenda items that Americans and Europeans can agree on, in sharp contrast to wider transatlantic disagreements over defence, trade and multilateralism.
Leaders from Austria and Norway on Friday expressed concerns about China’s rising clout, worries similar to those expressed by US lawmakers at the Munich Security Conference, an annual event that gathers experts from around the world.
But comments from officials at the conference made clear that even though there was general agreement on an overall strategy, the US and Europe continue to disagree on tactics."
Interesting! Russia attacked us in 2016 and again in 2018 and is attacking us again in 2020. But we're worried about China while we invite the Russians into our White House. That's odd. Almost like its a distraction or something.
Odd that you can only focus on Trump, not on multiple threats. Heck, even the EU recognizes both Russia and China as threats.
Trump derangement syndrome.
I think the derangement is on your side of the aisle.
Yes, as I said, Russia has attacked us three times (including the present attack on our upcoming election) but all you and Trump can focus on is imaginary attacks by China that have only occured in you delusional brains. Well, Trump is not delusional. He is strategic: He knows China is overtaking us as the world's leading economy so he is responding as he always does: with an attack based on lies. It is his followers who are deranged for believing his lies.
Do you realize that the US interferes in every election in the world?
Just a few examples
When Boris Yeltsin was running for the second term, his campaign employed a team of American advisors who worked on Bill Clinton’s campaigns. Back then, Bill Clinton was in office as US president and wanted Yeltsin to be re-elected for a second term even though he was on track to lose the election. The team of American advisors rented an entire floor in a prestigious Moscow hotel. The floor was cordoned off by the security services and no one knew what was going on there until years past that election. Boris Yeltsin won the election while being extremely unpopular in Russia by then. This was a direct interference by a US president into an election in another country, which fundamentally changed history because it resulted in Vladimir Putin being selected by Yeltsin first as PM, and later as successor interim President when Yeltsin resigned on the last day of the 20th century.
US directly interfered in Ukrainian political struggle first during the Orange Revolution and then during the so-called Euro-Maidan revolution of the 2014. The Euro-Maidan deposed the democratically elected Ukrainian President Victor Yanukovich and resulted in the Russian-Ukrainian conflict that has caused thousands of dead, tens of thousands of wounded, and millions of refugees.
US interfered into Chilean politics and brought about the rule of Augusto Pinochet, which resulted in thousands of democracy activists kidnapped by the fascist Pinochet government. Tens of thousands were jailed and thousands were murdered by the police. Chile became a brutal military dictatorship for over two decades because of the US interference.
US tried to interfere into Cuban politics during by launching the failed Bay of Pigs invasion, which resulted in the Cuban government allowing the Soviet nuclear missiles being stationed in Cuba and the world coming to the brink of a nuclear war.
US deposed governments of almost every Central American country. Supported anti-government fighters in Nicaragua, which resulted in a bloody civil war in Nicaragua.
US supported a bloody regime in El Salvador that murdered tens of thousands of its own citizens.
US interfered in Libya and assassinated the Libyan leader, which resulted in the collapse of one of the most prosperous African countries and an endless bloody civil war that is still continuing.
US interfered in Syria, which resulted in a million dead and millions of refugees.
US interfered In Iraq, which resulted in a million dead and the rise if ISIS.
US interfered in Israeli politics on multiple occasions.
SHALL I CONTINUE?
What Russia did to the US in 2016 was child’s play compared to what the US has been doing to others for decades, if not centuries.
All we have is a government trying to destroy a company because everyone is welcome to play, but America must win!
LOL,
You still have no clue about National Security; nations don't buy critical infrastructure from a potential adversary, and China is certainly past being just potential.
That's what Australia and the U.S. decided, independently I might add, and many of the EU have strong misgivings about Huawei, and China, but are concerned about economic backlash from China if they fully ban insecure systems in there 5G buildouts.
In the meantime, there isn't any technical reason that the EU and the U.S. shouldn't go with Ericsson, Nokia, or Samsung, other than the fact that Huawei can offer lower cost or even financing as they have the complete support of the Chinese Government. But, yeah, I agree that the EU is too fucking stupid to not realize that China is eating their lunch, and needs to reconsider it rules and laws against duopolies, because the WTO isn't going to do shit about State support for Huawei from the Chinese Government.
As you have been reminded several times, there is NO national security issue here.
And even if there were, the U.S should not be trying to call the shots on what other sovereign nations should do.
Considering that the U.S. is, and has been, the acknowledged leader of the Free World since the the end of WWII, has spent a huge sum on supporting the Europeans against Russian aggression for something like 60 years, I think that the U.S. should in fact have a say in the critical infrastructure of its Allies, especially those in the EU that have access to our intelligence.
I'm all for EU sovereignty, but the EU has shown disdain for spending its own money to maintain that sovereignty. Then of course, there is the UK, which once ruled the seas, but can barely put together a carrier task group of either the Queen Elizabeth or the Prince of Wales, but not both. Meanwhile, China's PLAN is building out a blue water navy in an attempt to rival the U.S., and that is certainly a National Security issue for democracies in the South Pacifica, especially Australia and New Zealand, not to mention Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, but also Singapore, the Philippines, Indonesia and India.
Were the U.S. not a superpower, I doubt that China would have any compulsion against throwing its weight around and pushing its authoritarian rule, which they are certainly attempting to do with their weaker trading partners.
Yeah, the U.S. is the superpower that has the Navy, Maries, Army, and Air Force, to support Global trade and secure trade routes, often with support of members of NATO, and other regional power, and China with its Authoritarian bent is attempting to compete with that with its BRI and PLAN Buildout
You seem okay with China's authoritarian expansion, because you get the Huawei toys that you want, but ultimately, it's risky behavior for Nations to do that.
Fun fact;
Chna is bullying Sweden, and Sweden is having nothing of it;
“We treat our friends with fine wine,” said the man in black suit from his armchair, adding, “but for our enemies we got shotguns.” This is not a line from the latest blockbuster gangster movie, but a message from China’s ambassador to Sweden, speaking directly to Swedish public radio.
The above line is only one of several threats Ambassador Gui Congyou has been busy issuing since Swedish PEN announced in early November that kidnapped Swedish publisher Gui Minhai will receive the Tucholsky Prize — an annual award to writers and publicists living under threat or in exile — this year.
A couple of days later, the Chinese embassy branded the nomination as a farce in a statement on its website, demanding that Swedish PEN withdraw the prize or face consequences. That statement was later taken down and replaced with a much longer and more assertive text on November 14, the day before the award ceremony was to be held. Some people, the ambassador commented, “shouldn’t feel at ease” after hurting Chinese interests."
Chinese assholes, in operation.
Really, that sounds quite awful. The U.S. is not the leader of the free world. Shudder the thought! The free world could reasonably ask itself, if it is truly free, why there are permanent members on the U.N Security Council?
The U.S cannot defend the world without the help of others. Maybe you've watched to much Marvel. The U.S needs military bases around the globe to maintain its relevance. It needs the dollar as a reserve currency. It needs to pull the strings on world policy (hence its very own sanctions which it expects to be obeyed). It needs to be at the forefront of technology.
Some of that is under serious threat and rightly so. It doesn't have a God given right to it, but that is how your post reads.
Unable to find the evidence to back up its fabricated accusations on Huawei, it is literally reopening previously settled cases from 20 years ago! That is pure desperation.
Anyhow, we've given our opinions on the political side of this coin, which I admit is difficult to untie from Huawei, but can we get back to the topic of the thread?
Please knock it off, man. You’re just a pathetic Huawei shill, and pretty much the whole board knows that (except for the one person who consistently “Likes” to your silly posts: I am guessing that is @GeorgeBMac ).
You’re really getting tiresome.
I have presented the facts, as they stand on Huawei. That isn't being a shill.
After, 'the U.S is the leader of the free world' comment, it was clear that there was nothing I could really add without taking things in a new, unwarranted, direction.
You know, decades of U.S spying (Crypto AG being the last item in a long list of abuse), regime changes (lost count), invasions, corruption (Trump - Ukraine, the latest in another long list). Trump's bullying etc.
If that is the leader of the free world, it isn't really free but I didn't comment after my only reply to that as:
1. It had nothing to do with Huawei. 2. It had nothing to do with the coronavirus. 3. The poster has gone on record as hating China. 4. The poster immediately swings things from Huawei discussion to China discussion.
I had made my point and refrained from commenting more until you stepped in.
The facts on Huawei as they stand today are well known and - most importantly - haven't changed.
Nothing has been brought to the table to support the accusations. All we get are more accusations.
That is reality.
Even some of the latest accusations date back to cases brought in the civil courts - in 2003. Cases which were settled without Huawei having to pay a cent. What does that tell you about what the U.S really has?
What we are seeing is chest beating hysteria from an administration that has already tweeted its objectives to the world. Really, it can't get any clearer than that. We have read it from Trump himself. Huawei has even included his tweets in recent filings. Are you aware of those filings?
The U.S can't lose. The U.S must win. The U.S must be the leader in the 5G race.
No one else has a right to take the lead. Don't forget that.
Just two days ago, the U.S stormed into Munich hell bent on stopping Huawei. It didn't matter that these were sovereign nations and companies meeting to discuss security. The the threats were banded out again. Followed by more tariffs on EU aviation.
Huawei must be stopped. The western world had to come together with a new 5G solution. An alternative to Huawei. But did you hear the overriding comment of all of this? The one that was made loud and clear? You probably didn't so I will serve it on a plate:
Whatever the solution is, "it mustbeled by the United States". Surprise, surprise!
Straight from the the mouth of the U.S delegation.
You are reading that right. The U.S cannot lose. It must win.
Surely you can see why its allies are sick and tired of that attitude and want Trump gone. Especially with the threats, tariffs and arrogance.
Boris Johnson has postponed his trip to visit Trump. Even Boris has had enough.
National Security in the absence of evidence is a ruse. Backdoors? The U.S (with Cisco the best in the class) is an expert on backdoors. You would have thought that with reports from HCSEC and its own efforts, they would have found something by now. They haven't. Huawei as part of the Chinese government? More than twenty years presence in 170 countries speaks for it itself. Not a single complaint. And for all the talk, Australia is still awarding Huawei 4G contracts. Strange, but true.
So, when you actually seek to dive deep into the accusations, you find there is very little there and as the U.S has failed to put anything remotely substantial on the table as evidence, it is resorting to threats. The latest at the security meeting in Munich and regarding NATO.
Nothing new here. Let's not forget last year's threats and how Pence took a beating from Merkel.
All we have is a government trying to destroy a company because everyone is welcome to play, but America must win!
LOL,
You still have no clue about National Security; nations don't buy critical infrastructure from a potential adversary, and China is certainly past being just potential.
That's what Australia and the U.S. decided, independently I might add, and many of the EU have strong misgivings about Huawei, and China, but are concerned about economic backlash from China if they fully ban insecure systems in there 5G buildouts.
In the meantime, there isn't any technical reason that the EU and the U.S. shouldn't go with Ericsson, Nokia, or Samsung, other than the fact that Huawei can offer lower cost or even financing as they have the complete support of the Chinese Government. But, yeah, I agree that the EU is too fucking stupid to not realize that China is eating their lunch, and needs to reconsider it rules and laws against duopolies, because the WTO isn't going to do shit about State support for Huawei from the Chinese Government.
As you have been reminded several times, there is NO national security issue here.
And even if there were, the U.S should not be trying to call the shots on what other sovereign nations should do.
Considering that the U.S. is, and has been, the acknowledged leader of the Free World since the the end of WWII, has spent a huge sum on supporting the Europeans against Russian aggression for something like 60 years, I think that the U.S. should in fact have a say in the critical infrastructure of its Allies, especially those in the EU that have access to our intelligence.
I'm all for EU sovereignty, but the EU has shown disdain for spending its own money to maintain that sovereignty. Then of course, there is the UK, which once ruled the seas, but can barely put together a carrier task group of either the Queen Elizabeth or the Prince of Wales, but not both. Meanwhile, China's PLAN is building out a blue water navy in an attempt to rival the U.S., and that is certainly a National Security issue for democracies in the South Pacifica, especially Australia and New Zealand, not to mention Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, but also Singapore, the Philippines, Indonesia and India.
Were the U.S. not a superpower, I doubt that China would have any compulsion against throwing its weight around and pushing its authoritarian rule, which they are certainly attempting to do with their weaker trading partners.
Yeah, the U.S. is the superpower that has the Navy, Maries, Army, and Air Force, to support Global trade and secure trade routes, often with support of members of NATO, and other regional power, and China with its Authoritarian bent is attempting to compete with that with its BRI and PLAN Buildout
You seem okay with China's authoritarian expansion, because you get the Huawei toys that you want, but ultimately, it's risky behavior for Nations to do that.
Fun fact;
Chna is bullying Sweden, and Sweden is having nothing of it;
“We treat our friends with fine wine,” said the man in black suit from his armchair, adding, “but for our enemies we got shotguns.” This is not a line from the latest blockbuster gangster movie, but a message from China’s ambassador to Sweden, speaking directly to Swedish public radio.
The above line is only one of several threats Ambassador Gui Congyou has been busy issuing since Swedish PEN announced in early November that kidnapped Swedish publisher Gui Minhai will receive the Tucholsky Prize — an annual award to writers and publicists living under threat or in exile — this year.
A couple of days later, the Chinese embassy branded the nomination as a farce in a statement on its website, demanding that Swedish PEN withdraw the prize or face consequences. That statement was later taken down and replaced with a much longer and more assertive text on November 14, the day before the award ceremony was to be held. Some people, the ambassador commented, “shouldn’t feel at ease” after hurting Chinese interests."
Chinese assholes, in operation.
Really, that sounds quite awful. The U.S. is not the leader of the free world. Shudder the thought! The free world could reasonably ask itself, if it is truly free, why there are permanent members on the U.N Security Council?
The U.S cannot defend the world without the help of others. Maybe you've watched to much Marvel. The U.S needs military bases around the globe to maintain its relevance. It needs the dollar as a reserve currency. It needs to pull the strings on world policy (hence its very own sanctions which it expects to be obeyed). It needs to be at the forefront of technology.
Some of that is under serious threat and rightly so. It doesn't have a God given right to it, but that is how your post reads.
Unable to find the evidence to back up its fabricated accusations on Huawei, it is literally reopening previously settled cases from 20 years ago! That is pure desperation.
Anyhow, we've given our opinions on the political side of this coin, which I admit is difficult to untie from Huawei, but can we get back to the topic of the thread?
Please knock it off, man. You’re just a pathetic Huawei shill, and pretty much the whole board knows that (except for the one person who consistently “Likes” to your silly posts: I am guessing that is @GeorgeBMac ).
You’re really getting tiresome.
I have presented the facts, as they stand on Huawei. That isn't being a shill.
After, 'the U.S is the leader of the free world' comment, it was clear that there was nothing I could really add without taking things in a new, unwarranted, direction.
You know, decades of U.S spying (Crypto AG being the last item in a long list of abuse), regime changes (lost count), invasions, corruption (Trump - Ukraine, the latest in another long list). Trump's bullying etc.
If that is the leader of the free world, it isn't really free but I didn't comment after my only reply to that as:
1. It had nothing to do with Huawei. 2. It had nothing to do with the coronavirus. 3. The poster has gone on record as hating China. 4. The poster immediately swings things from Huawei discussion to China discussion.
I had made my point and refrained from commenting more until you stepped in.
The facts on Huawei as they stand today are well known and - most importantly - haven't changed.
Nothing has been brought to the table to support the accusations. All we get are more accusations.
That is reality.
Even some of the latest accusations date back to cases brought in the civil courts - in 2003. Cases which were settled without Huawei having to pay a cent. What does that tell you about what the U.S really has?
What we are seeing is chest beating hysteria from an administration that has already tweeted its objectives to the world. Really, it can't get any clearer than that. We have read it from Trump himself. Huawei has even included his tweets in recent filings. Are you aware of those filings?
The U.S can't lose. The U.S must win. The U.S must be the leader in the 5G race.
No one else has a right to take the lead. Don't forget that.
Just two days ago, the U.S stormed into Munich hell bent on stopping Huawei. It didn't matter that these were sovereign nations and companies meeting to discuss security. The the threats were banded out again. Followed by more tariffs on EU aviation.
Huawei must be stopped. The western world had to come together with a new 5G solution. An alternative to Huawei. But did you hear the overriding comment of all of this? The one that was made loud and clear? You probably didn't so I will serve it on a plate:
Whatever the solution is, "it mustbeled by the United States". Surprise, surprise!
Straight from the the mouth of the U.S delegation.
You are reading that right. The U.S cannot lose. It must win.
Surely you can see why its allies are sick and tired of that attitude and want Trump gone. Especially with the threats, tariffs and arrogance.
Boris Johnson has postponed his trip to visit Trump. Even Boris has had enough.
National Security in the absence of evidence is a ruse. Backdoors? The U.S (with Cisco the best in the class) is an expert on backdoors. You would have thought that with reports from HCSEC and its own efforts, they would have found something by now. They haven't. Huawei as part of the Chinese government? More than twenty years presence in 170 countries speaks for it itself. Not a single complaint. And for all the talk, Australia is still awarding Huawei 4G contracts. Strange, but true.
So, when you actually seek to dive deep into the accusations, you find there is very little there and as the U.S has failed to put anything remotely substantial on the table as evidence, it is resorting to threats. The latest at the security meeting in Munich and regarding NATO.
Nothing new here. Let's not forget last year's threats and how Pence took a beating from Merkel.
All we have is a government trying to destroy a company because everyone is welcome to play, but America must win!
LOL,
You still have no clue about National Security; nations don't buy critical infrastructure from a potential adversary, and China is certainly past being just potential.
That's what Australia and the U.S. decided, independently I might add, and many of the EU have strong misgivings about Huawei, and China, but are concerned about economic backlash from China if they fully ban insecure systems in there 5G buildouts.
In the meantime, there isn't any technical reason that the EU and the U.S. shouldn't go with Ericsson, Nokia, or Samsung, other than the fact that Huawei can offer lower cost or even financing as they have the complete support of the Chinese Government. But, yeah, I agree that the EU is too fucking stupid to not realize that China is eating their lunch, and needs to reconsider it rules and laws against duopolies, because the WTO isn't going to do shit about State support for Huawei from the Chinese Government.
As you have been reminded several times, there is NO national security issue here.
And even if there were, the U.S should not be trying to call the shots on what other sovereign nations should do.
Considering that the U.S. is, and has been, the acknowledged leader of the Free World since the the end of WWII, has spent a huge sum on supporting the Europeans against Russian aggression for something like 60 years, I think that the U.S. should in fact have a say in the critical infrastructure of its Allies, especially those in the EU that have access to our intelligence.
I'm all for EU sovereignty, but the EU has shown disdain for spending its own money to maintain that sovereignty. Then of course, there is the UK, which once ruled the seas, but can barely put together a carrier task group of either the Queen Elizabeth or the Prince of Wales, but not both. Meanwhile, China's PLAN is building out a blue water navy in an attempt to rival the U.S., and that is certainly a National Security issue for democracies in the South Pacifica, especially Australia and New Zealand, not to mention Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, but also Singapore, the Philippines, Indonesia and India.
Were the U.S. not a superpower, I doubt that China would have any compulsion against throwing its weight around and pushing its authoritarian rule, which they are certainly attempting to do with their weaker trading partners.
Yeah, the U.S. is the superpower that has the Navy, Maries, Army, and Air Force, to support Global trade and secure trade routes, often with support of members of NATO, and other regional power, and China with its Authoritarian bent is attempting to compete with that with its BRI and PLAN Buildout
You seem okay with China's authoritarian expansion, because you get the Huawei toys that you want, but ultimately, it's risky behavior for Nations to do that.
Fun fact;
Chna is bullying Sweden, and Sweden is having nothing of it;
“We treat our friends with fine wine,” said the man in black suit from his armchair, adding, “but for our enemies we got shotguns.” This is not a line from the latest blockbuster gangster movie, but a message from China’s ambassador to Sweden, speaking directly to Swedish public radio.
The above line is only one of several threats Ambassador Gui Congyou has been busy issuing since Swedish PEN announced in early November that kidnapped Swedish publisher Gui Minhai will receive the Tucholsky Prize — an annual award to writers and publicists living under threat or in exile — this year.
A couple of days later, the Chinese embassy branded the nomination as a farce in a statement on its website, demanding that Swedish PEN withdraw the prize or face consequences. That statement was later taken down and replaced with a much longer and more assertive text on November 14, the day before the award ceremony was to be held. Some people, the ambassador commented, “shouldn’t feel at ease” after hurting Chinese interests."
Chinese assholes, in operation.
Really, that sounds quite awful. The U.S. is not the leader of the free world. Shudder the thought! The free world could reasonably ask itself, if it is truly free, why there are permanent members on the U.N Security Council?
The U.S cannot defend the world without the help of others. Maybe you've watched to much Marvel. The U.S needs military bases around the globe to maintain its relevance. It needs the dollar as a reserve currency. It needs to pull the strings on world policy (hence its very own sanctions which it expects to be obeyed). It needs to be at the forefront of technology.
Some of that is under serious threat and rightly so. It doesn't have a God given right to it, but that is how your post reads.
Unable to find the evidence to back up its fabricated accusations on Huawei, it is literally reopening previously settled cases from 20 years ago! That is pure desperation.
Anyhow, we've given our opinions on the political side of this coin, which I admit is difficult to untie from Huawei, but can we get back to the topic of the thread?
Please knock it off, man. You’re just a pathetic Huawei shill, and pretty much the whole board knows that (except for the one person who consistently “Likes” to your silly posts: I am guessing that is @GeorgeBMac ).
You’re really getting tiresome.
I have presented the facts, as they stand on Huawei. That isn't being a shill.
After, 'the U.S is the leader of the free world' comment, it was clear that there was nothing I could really add without taking things in a new, unwarranted, direction.
You know, decades of U.S spying (Crypto AG being the last item in a long list of abuse), regime changes (lost count), invasions, corruption (Trump - Ukraine, the latest in another long list). Trump's bullying etc.
If that is the leader of the free world, it isn't really free but I didn't comment after my only reply to that as:
1. It had nothing to do with Huawei. 2. It had nothing to do with the coronavirus. 3. The poster has gone on record as hating China. 4. The poster immediately swings things from Huawei discussion to China discussion.
I had made my point and refrained from commenting more until you stepped in.
The facts on Huawei as they stand today are well known and - most importantly - haven't changed.
Nothing has been brought to the table to support the accusations. All we get are more accusations.
That is reality.
Even some of the latest accusations date back to cases brought in the civil courts - in 2003. Cases which were settled without Huawei having to pay a cent. What does that tell you about what the U.S really has?
What we are seeing is chest beating hysteria from an administration that has already tweeted its objectives to the world. Really, it can't get any clearer than that. We have read it from Trump himself. Huawei has even included his tweets in recent filings. Are you aware of those filings?
The U.S can't lose. The U.S must win. The U.S must be the leader in the 5G race.
No one else has a right to take the lead. Don't forget that.
Just two days ago, the U.S stormed into Munich hell bent on stopping Huawei. It didn't matter that these were sovereign nations and companies meeting to discuss security. The the threats were banded out again. Followed by more tariffs on EU aviation.
Huawei must be stopped. The western world had to come together with a new 5G solution. An alternative to Huawei. But did you hear the overriding comment of all of this? The one that was made loud and clear? You probably didn't so I will serve it on a plate:
Whatever the solution is, "it mustbeled by the United States". Surprise, surprise!
Straight from the the mouth of the U.S delegation.
You are reading that right. The U.S cannot lose. It must win.
Surely you can see why its allies are sick and tired of that attitude and want Trump gone. Especially with the threats, tariffs and arrogance.
Boris Johnson has postponed his trip to visit Trump. Even Boris has had enough.
National Security in the absence of evidence is a ruse. Backdoors? The U.S (with Cisco the best in the class) is an expert on backdoors. You would have thought that with reports from HCSEC and its own efforts, they would have found something by now. They haven't. Huawei as part of the Chinese government? More than twenty years presence in 170 countries speaks for it itself. Not a single complaint. And for all the talk, Australia is still awarding Huawei 4G contracts. Strange, but true.
So, when you actually seek to dive deep into the accusations, you find there is very little there and as the U.S has failed to put anything remotely substantial on the table as evidence, it is resorting to threats. The latest at the security meeting in Munich and regarding NATO.
Nothing new here. Let's not forget last year's threats and how Pence took a beating from Merkel.
Merkel has had to respond to hardliners that want to ban Huawei entirely from a 5G buildout.
"Merkel has struggled to assert control of her China policy in a stand-off that pits trade interests with Beijing against security concerns raised by Washington and her own intelligence agencies.
Inside Merkel’s chancellery, senior officials believe that a ban on Huawei would be futile, since the Chinese could potentially infiltrate another supplier if they were determined to hack into 5G mobile communications infrastructure."
Whenever you state that countries have no security interests in banning Huawei, you are outright lying. That's a fact.
Merkel's problem is that she has to balance out Germany's economic interests in China, with National Security interests, and just like the UK and every other country in the EU, with a few exceptions, National Security is given a lower priority than trade. Given that the EU could embrace the industrialization that would come with a Europe centric approach to 5G, build around Ericsson, Nokia, and Siemens, it's apparent that Chinese trade, and backlash thereof from banning Huawei is the reason.
Still, China's economy is in dire straits from COVID-19, and given that the epidemic is not close to being over, maybe trade with the EU will collapse of its own accord.
"Are China’s official reports, including claims that its control efforts are succeeding and the epidemic will soon peak, credible? Omens look bad. Once praised by the World Health Organization (WHO) and scientists worldwide for its quick, transparent response to the newly named COVID-19, China now faces international vilification and potential domestic unrest as it blunders through continued cover-ups, lies, and repression that have already failed to stop the virus and may well be fanning the flames of its spread."
This is why people like yourself that were advocating for MWC to remain on the schedule are wrong; the risk of a pandemic is too high to justify it. That also is a fact.
As we learn more about COVID-19 and it incubation and transfer characteristics, the world might be able to let down its guard bit, but risking a pandemic is just shortsighted.
All we have is a government trying to destroy a company because everyone is welcome to play, but America must win!
LOL,
You still have no clue about National Security; nations don't buy critical infrastructure from a potential adversary, and China is certainly past being just potential.
That's what Australia and the U.S. decided, independently I might add, and many of the EU have strong misgivings about Huawei, and China, but are concerned about economic backlash from China if they fully ban insecure systems in there 5G buildouts.
In the meantime, there isn't any technical reason that the EU and the U.S. shouldn't go with Ericsson, Nokia, or Samsung, other than the fact that Huawei can offer lower cost or even financing as they have the complete support of the Chinese Government. But, yeah, I agree that the EU is too fucking stupid to not realize that China is eating their lunch, and needs to reconsider it rules and laws against duopolies, because the WTO isn't going to do shit about State support for Huawei from the Chinese Government.
As you have been reminded several times, there is NO national security issue here.
And even if there were, the U.S should not be trying to call the shots on what other sovereign nations should do.
Considering that the U.S. is, and has been, the acknowledged leader of the Free World since the the end of WWII, has spent a huge sum on supporting the Europeans against Russian aggression for something like 60 years, I think that the U.S. should in fact have a say in the critical infrastructure of its Allies, especially those in the EU that have access to our intelligence.
I'm all for EU sovereignty, but the EU has shown disdain for spending its own money to maintain that sovereignty. Then of course, there is the UK, which once ruled the seas, but can barely put together a carrier task group of either the Queen Elizabeth or the Prince of Wales, but not both. Meanwhile, China's PLAN is building out a blue water navy in an attempt to rival the U.S., and that is certainly a National Security issue for democracies in the South Pacifica, especially Australia and New Zealand, not to mention Japan, Taiwan, South Korea, but also Singapore, the Philippines, Indonesia and India.
Were the U.S. not a superpower, I doubt that China would have any compulsion against throwing its weight around and pushing its authoritarian rule, which they are certainly attempting to do with their weaker trading partners.
Yeah, the U.S. is the superpower that has the Navy, Maries, Army, and Air Force, to support Global trade and secure trade routes, often with support of members of NATO, and other regional power, and China with its Authoritarian bent is attempting to compete with that with its BRI and PLAN Buildout
You seem okay with China's authoritarian expansion, because you get the Huawei toys that you want, but ultimately, it's risky behavior for Nations to do that.
Fun fact;
Chna is bullying Sweden, and Sweden is having nothing of it;
“We treat our friends with fine wine,” said the man in black suit from his armchair, adding, “but for our enemies we got shotguns.” This is not a line from the latest blockbuster gangster movie, but a message from China’s ambassador to Sweden, speaking directly to Swedish public radio.
The above line is only one of several threats Ambassador Gui Congyou has been busy issuing since Swedish PEN announced in early November that kidnapped Swedish publisher Gui Minhai will receive the Tucholsky Prize — an annual award to writers and publicists living under threat or in exile — this year.
A couple of days later, the Chinese embassy branded the nomination as a farce in a statement on its website, demanding that Swedish PEN withdraw the prize or face consequences. That statement was later taken down and replaced with a much longer and more assertive text on November 14, the day before the award ceremony was to be held. Some people, the ambassador commented, “shouldn’t feel at ease” after hurting Chinese interests."
Chinese assholes, in operation.
Really, that sounds quite awful. The U.S. is not the leader of the free world. Shudder the thought! The free world could reasonably ask itself, if it is truly free, why there are permanent members on the U.N Security Council?
The U.S cannot defend the world without the help of others. Maybe you've watched to much Marvel. The U.S needs military bases around the globe to maintain its relevance. It needs the dollar as a reserve currency. It needs to pull the strings on world policy (hence its very own sanctions which it expects to be obeyed). It needs to be at the forefront of technology.
Some of that is under serious threat and rightly so. It doesn't have a God given right to it, but that is how your post reads.
Unable to find the evidence to back up its fabricated accusations on Huawei, it is literally reopening previously settled cases from 20 years ago! That is pure desperation.
Anyhow, we've given our opinions on the political side of this coin, which I admit is difficult to untie from Huawei, but can we get back to the topic of the thread?
Please knock it off, man. You’re just a pathetic Huawei shill, and pretty much the whole board knows that (except for the one person who consistently “Likes” to your silly posts: I am guessing that is @GeorgeBMac ).
You’re really getting tiresome.
I have presented the facts, as they stand on Huawei. That isn't being a shill.
After, 'the U.S is the leader of the free world' comment, it was clear that there was nothing I could really add without taking things in a new, unwarranted, direction.
You know, decades of U.S spying (Crypto AG being the last item in a long list of abuse), regime changes (lost count), invasions, corruption (Trump - Ukraine, the latest in another long list). Trump's bullying etc.
If that is the leader of the free world, it isn't really free but I didn't comment after my only reply to that as:
1. It had nothing to do with Huawei. 2. It had nothing to do with the coronavirus. 3. The poster has gone on record as hating China. 4. The poster immediately swings things from Huawei discussion to China discussion.
I had made my point and refrained from commenting more until you stepped in.
The facts on Huawei as they stand today are well known and - most importantly - haven't changed.
Nothing has been brought to the table to support the accusations. All we get are more accusations.
That is reality.
Even some of the latest accusations date back to cases brought in the civil courts - in 2003. Cases which were settled without Huawei having to pay a cent. What does that tell you about what the U.S really has?
What we are seeing is chest beating hysteria from an administration that has already tweeted its objectives to the world. Really, it can't get any clearer than that. We have read it from Trump himself. Huawei has even included his tweets in recent filings. Are you aware of those filings?
The U.S can't lose. The U.S must win. The U.S must be the leader in the 5G race.
No one else has a right to take the lead. Don't forget that.
Just two days ago, the U.S stormed into Munich hell bent on stopping Huawei. It didn't matter that these were sovereign nations and companies meeting to discuss security. The the threats were banded out again. Followed by more tariffs on EU aviation.
Huawei must be stopped. The western world had to come together with a new 5G solution. An alternative to Huawei. But did you hear the overriding comment of all of this? The one that was made loud and clear? You probably didn't so I will serve it on a plate:
Whatever the solution is, "it mustbeled by the United States". Surprise, surprise!
Straight from the the mouth of the U.S delegation.
You are reading that right. The U.S cannot lose. It must win.
Surely you can see why its allies are sick and tired of that attitude and want Trump gone. Especially with the threats, tariffs and arrogance.
Boris Johnson has postponed his trip to visit Trump. Even Boris has had enough.
National Security in the absence of evidence is a ruse. Backdoors? The U.S (with Cisco the best in the class) is an expert on backdoors. You would have thought that with reports from HCSEC and its own efforts, they would have found something by now. They haven't. Huawei as part of the Chinese government? More than twenty years presence in 170 countries speaks for it itself. Not a single complaint. And for all the talk, Australia is still awarding Huawei 4G contracts. Strange, but true.
So, when you actually seek to dive deep into the accusations, you find there is very little there and as the U.S has failed to put anything remotely substantial on the table as evidence, it is resorting to threats. The latest at the security meeting in Munich and regarding NATO.
Nothing new here. Let's not forget last year's threats and how Pence took a beating from Merkel.
Tmay,
"Whenever you state that countries have no security interests in banning Huawei, you are outright lying. That's a fact."
I never lie. Why would I anyway?
Security interests apply to ALL foreign suppliers of sensitive or critical infrastructure. It isn't only Huawei.
ICT Security for interoperable environments knows no boundaries.
There is even some talk (not surprisingly from Huawei) that says all players should be subjected to the exact same scrutiny as it is. Valid point IMO. Ah, that would be applicable to any U.S players involved in 5G too.
Do you think Trump would welcome that?
But that is irrelevant. That fact remains. 170 countries. No problems. How many years now? They just celebrated 20 years in the U.K.
Tmay,
"Whenever you state that countries have no security interests in banning Huawei, you are outright lying. That's a fact."
I never lie. Why would I anyway?
Security interests apply to ALL foreign suppliers of sensitive or critical infrastructure. It isn't only Huawei.
ICT Security for interoperable environments knows no boundaries.
There is even some talk (not surprisingly from Huawei) that says all players should be subjected to the exact same scrutiny as it is. Valid point IMO. Ah, that would be applicable to any U.S players involved in 5G too.
Do you think Trump would welcome that?
But that is irrelevant. That fact remains. 170 countries. No problems. How many years now? They just celebrated 20 years in the U.K.
So, you have no problem with the U.S. banning Huawei for National Security reasons, which is completely acceptable to the WTO, simply because they don't want to have a company from an Authoritarian adversary in their critical infrastructure?
Gee, if only Huawei and the Chinese Government allow that level of scrutiny, but they won't, and Huawei has had plenty of opportunity to allow the West to examine its status as a "private" entity in China. But of course, that won't happen, so National Security means you have to assume that China controls Huawei. End of story.
So, great, then you can move on. But I'll leave this for you, which of course you will ignore as "irrelevant".
"In late 2017, one of Australia’s top intelligence officials selected a team of his brightest telecommunications and cyber experts and assigned them a high priority task.
Simeon Gilding’s job at the Australian Signals Directorate was one of the most secretive in the agency - no mean feat in a place in which even the lowest order business is marked "classified". He was in charge of the people trying to launch attacks on Australia’s adversaries by hacking into phone and computer systems.
In an interview with The Age and The Sydney Morning Herald, Gilding says he asked his team to work out how a foreign adversary could attack Australia’s 5G network based on one critical assumption: that this adversary was able to assert control over the company that was actually supplying and maintaining key components of the 5G network.
Next, Mr Gilding told them to figure out what defences could be put in place to prevent such an attack.
The answers he got informed Australia’s stunning 2018 decision to block Chinese firm Huawei from bidding to build the nation’s 5G network. It also throws into stark relief a decision made this week in Britain when, on Thursday, the UK government announced it would not follow Australia’s lead. Gilding's counterparts in British intelligence had produced a very different assessment to that of Gilding’s ASD officers: in the UK, Huawei will be welcomed to participate in the 5G rollout."
This technology, literally the fifth generation of mobile broadband, will be a crucial component of the "internet of things". It will connect every appliance in our homes and will carry the massive flows of data when trucks, trains, cars, power stations, hospitals and water utilities are automated and driverless. If a network is compromised, those doing the hacking could potentially infiltrate a host of critical infrastructure.
Gilding, who left ASD last year, insists he directed his team to find a way to mitigate the risk that the Chinese government could compel Huawei to compromise these digital superhighways in Australia.
“We wanted to come up with a package of mitigations to let Huawei in, and we put our best people on it,” says Gilding, who has never before been interviewed by the Australian media. “But we found we couldn’t.”
As it stands, cyber offensive teams run by spy agencies in places like China, the US and Australia must expend considerable time and effort to penetrate a secure network. “The costs are very high and it takes a huge amount of work by a big team,” Gilding says."
That is absolutely a case of National Security, and both Australia and the U.S. are livid with the UK allowing Huawei, even a little bit.
Tmay,
"Whenever you state that countries have no security interests in banning Huawei, you are outright lying. That's a fact."
I never lie. Why would I anyway?
Security interests apply to ALL foreign suppliers of sensitive or critical infrastructure. It isn't only Huawei.
ICT Security for interoperable environments knows no boundaries.
There is even some talk (not surprisingly from Huawei) that says all players should be subjected to the exact same scrutiny as it is. Valid point IMO. Ah, that would be applicable to any U.S players involved in 5G too.
Do you think Trump would welcome that?
But that is irrelevant. That fact remains. 170 countries. No problems. How many years now? They just celebrated 20 years in the U.K.
So, you have no problem with the U.S. banning Huawei for National Security reasons, which is completely acceptable to the WTO, simply because they don't want to have a company from an Authoritarian adversary in their critical infrastructure?
Great, then you can move on.
The U.S can do whatever it wants on its own turf. Within reason of course. Telling sovereign nations what to do on their turf is a different story. A completely different story.
Does the WTO find it acceptable that a government is trying to destroy a private company from another country?
As for Australia. They have nothing. If they did, they would have produced it. Long ago.
They worked from an assumption. How about we assume the Chinese gain controlling access to Nokia or Ericsson's equipment (or the U.S!)?
Assumptions are two to the dozen. Hard facts to support those assumptions are just nowhere to be seen. In place of that, there is no end of protectionism, bullying, accusations, threats, rhetoric and chest beating.
"The need to confront China’s rising influence in the world has become one of the few strategic agenda items that Americans and Europeans can agree on, in sharp contrast to wider transatlantic disagreements over defence, trade and multilateralism.
Leaders from Austria and Norway on Friday expressed concerns about China’s rising clout, worries similar to those expressed by US lawmakers at the Munich Security Conference, an annual event that gathers experts from around the world.
But comments from officials at the conference made clear that even though there was general agreement on an overall strategy, the US and Europe continue to disagree on tactics."
Interesting! Russia attacked us in 2016 and again in 2018 and is attacking us again in 2020. But we're worried about China while we invite the Russians into our White House. That's odd. Almost like its a distraction or something.
Odd that you can only focus on Trump, not on multiple threats. Heck, even the EU recognizes both Russia and China as threats.
Trump derangement syndrome.
I think the derangement is on your side of the aisle.
Yes, as I said, Russia has attacked us three times (including the present attack on our upcoming election) but all you and Trump can focus on is imaginary attacks by China that have only occured in you delusional brains. Well, Trump is not delusional. He is strategic: He knows China is overtaking us as the world's leading economy so he is responding as he always does: with an attack based on lies. It is his followers who are deranged for believing his lies.
Do you realize that the US interferes in every election in the world?
Just a few examples
When Boris Yeltsin was running for the second term, his campaign employed a team of American advisors who worked on Bill Clinton’s campaigns. Back then, Bill Clinton was in office as US president and wanted Yeltsin to be re-elected for a second term even though he was on track to lose the election. The team of American advisors rented an entire floor in a prestigious Moscow hotel. The floor was cordoned off by the security services and no one knew what was going on there until years past that election. Boris Yeltsin won the election while being extremely unpopular in Russia by then. This was a direct interference by a US president into an election in another country, which fundamentally changed history because it resulted in Vladimir Putin being selected by Yeltsin first as PM, and later as successor interim President when Yeltsin resigned on the last day of the 20th century.
US directly interfered in Ukrainian political struggle first during the Orange Revolution and then during the so-called Euro-Maidan revolution of the 2014. The Euro-Maidan deposed the democratically elected Ukrainian President Victor Yanukovich and resulted in the Russian-Ukrainian conflict that has caused thousands of dead, tens of thousands of wounded, and millions of refugees.
US interfered into Chilean politics and brought about the rule of Augusto Pinochet, which resulted in thousands of democracy activists kidnapped by the fascist Pinochet government. Tens of thousands were jailed and thousands were murdered by the police. Chile became a brutal military dictatorship for over two decades because of the US interference.
US tried to interfere into Cuban politics during by launching the failed Bay of Pigs invasion, which resulted in the Cuban government allowing the Soviet nuclear missiles being stationed in Cuba and the world coming to the brink of a nuclear war.
US deposed governments of almost every Central American country. Supported anti-government fighters in Nicaragua, which resulted in a bloody civil war in Nicaragua.
US supported a bloody regime in El Salvador that murdered tens of thousands of its own citizens.
US interfered in Libya and assassinated the Libyan leader, which resulted in the collapse of one of the most prosperous African countries and an endless bloody civil war that is still continuing.
US interfered in Syria, which resulted in a million dead and millions of refugees.
US interfered In Iraq, which resulted in a million dead and the rise if ISIS.
US interfered in Israeli politics on multiple occasions.
SHALL I CONTINUE?
What Russia did to the US in 2016 was child’s play compared to what the US has been doing to others for decades, if not centuries.
LOL... So you are saying that rigging an election whether it is done by a foreign country or by a president is normal and OK? How Trumpian of you! Hitler would have agreed with you, but I doubt many of our founding fathers would have.
Tmay,
"Whenever you state that countries have no security interests in banning Huawei, you are outright lying. That's a fact."
I never lie. Why would I anyway?
Security interests apply to ALL foreign suppliers of sensitive or critical infrastructure. It isn't only Huawei.
ICT Security for interoperable environments knows no boundaries.
There is even some talk (not surprisingly from Huawei) that says all players should be subjected to the exact same scrutiny as it is. Valid point IMO. Ah, that would be applicable to any U.S players involved in 5G too.
Do you think Trump would welcome that?
But that is irrelevant. That fact remains. 170 countries. No problems. How many years now? They just celebrated 20 years in the U.K.
So, you have no problem with the U.S. banning Huawei for National Security reasons, which is completely acceptable to the WTO, simply because they don't want to have a company from an Authoritarian adversary in their critical infrastructure?
Gee, if only Huawei and the Chinese Government allow that level of scrutiny, but they won't, and Huawei has had plenty of opportunity to allow the West to examine its status as a "private" entity in China. But of course, that won't happen, so National Security means you have to assume that China controls Huawei. End of story.
So, great, then you can move on. But I'll leave this for you, which of course you will ignore as "irrelevant".
"In late 2017, one of Australia’s top intelligence officials selected a team of his brightest telecommunications and cyber experts and assigned them a high priority task.
Simeon Gilding’s job at the Australian Signals Directorate was one of the most secretive in the agency - no mean feat in a place in which even the lowest order business is marked "classified". He was in charge of the people trying to launch attacks on Australia’s adversaries by hacking into phone and computer systems.
In an interview with The Age and The Sydney Morning Herald, Gilding says he asked his team to work out how a foreign adversary could attack Australia’s 5G network based on one critical assumption: that this adversary was able to assert control over the company that was actually supplying and maintaining key components of the 5G network.
Next, Mr Gilding told them to figure out what defences could be put in place to prevent such an attack.
The answers he got informed Australia’s stunning 2018 decision to block Chinese firm Huawei from bidding to build the nation’s 5G network. It also throws into stark relief a decision made this week in Britain when, on Thursday, the UK government announced it would not follow Australia’s lead. Gilding's counterparts in British intelligence had produced a very different assessment to that of Gilding’s ASD officers: in the UK, Huawei will be welcomed to participate in the 5G rollout."
This technology, literally the fifth generation of mobile broadband, will be a crucial component of the "internet of things". It will connect every appliance in our homes and will carry the massive flows of data when trucks, trains, cars, power stations, hospitals and water utilities are automated and driverless. If a network is compromised, those doing the hacking could potentially infiltrate a host of critical infrastructure.
Gilding, who left ASD last year, insists he directed his team to find a way to mitigate the risk that the Chinese government could compel Huawei to compromise these digital superhighways in Australia.
“We wanted to come up with a package of mitigations to let Huawei in, and we put our best people on it,” says Gilding, who has never before been interviewed by the Australian media. “But we found we couldn’t.”
As it stands, cyber offensive teams run by spy agencies in places like China, the US and Australia must expend considerable time and effort to penetrate a secure network. “The costs are very high and it takes a huge amount of work by a big team,” Gilding says."
That is absolutely a case of National Security, and both Australia and the U.S. are livid with the UK allowing Huawei, even a little bit.
The problem is, Trump is trying to ban Huawei for political reasons -- and to slow down China's economic advance. But, since he can't actually say that -- even the dumb deplorables would fail to support him -- he invents "National Security Concerns". That always plays well with his cult -- just wave the flag and shout "USA! USA! USA!"
And, you are supporting his scam by starting with the assumption that Huawei is an extension of the Chinese government and then compounding your error by saying the Chinese government must be evil simply because it is not a democracy -- while you ignore that your leader is working hard to dismantle our democracy and install himself as a monarch.
Tmay,
"Whenever you state that countries have no security interests in banning Huawei, you are outright lying. That's a fact."
I never lie. Why would I anyway?
Security interests apply to ALL foreign suppliers of sensitive or critical infrastructure. It isn't only Huawei.
ICT Security for interoperable environments knows no boundaries.
There is even some talk (not surprisingly from Huawei) that says all players should be subjected to the exact same scrutiny as it is. Valid point IMO. Ah, that would be applicable to any U.S players involved in 5G too.
Do you think Trump would welcome that?
But that is irrelevant. That fact remains. 170 countries. No problems. How many years now? They just celebrated 20 years in the U.K.
So, you have no problem with the U.S. banning Huawei for National Security reasons, which is completely acceptable to the WTO, simply because they don't want to have a company from an Authoritarian adversary in their critical infrastructure?
Gee, if only Huawei and the Chinese Government allow that level of scrutiny, but they won't, and Huawei has had plenty of opportunity to allow the West to examine its status as a "private" entity in China. But of course, that won't happen, so National Security means you have to assume that China controls Huawei. End of story.
So, great, then you can move on. But I'll leave this for you, which of course you will ignore as "irrelevant".
"In late 2017, one of Australia’s top intelligence officials selected a team of his brightest telecommunications and cyber experts and assigned them a high priority task.
Simeon Gilding’s job at the Australian Signals Directorate was one of the most secretive in the agency - no mean feat in a place in which even the lowest order business is marked "classified". He was in charge of the people trying to launch attacks on Australia’s adversaries by hacking into phone and computer systems.
In an interview with The Age and The Sydney Morning Herald, Gilding says he asked his team to work out how a foreign adversary could attack Australia’s 5G network based on one critical assumption: that this adversary was able to assert control over the company that was actually supplying and maintaining key components of the 5G network.
Next, Mr Gilding told them to figure out what defences could be put in place to prevent such an attack.
The answers he got informed Australia’s stunning 2018 decision to block Chinese firm Huawei from bidding to build the nation’s 5G network. It also throws into stark relief a decision made this week in Britain when, on Thursday, the UK government announced it would not follow Australia’s lead. Gilding's counterparts in British intelligence had produced a very different assessment to that of Gilding’s ASD officers: in the UK, Huawei will be welcomed to participate in the 5G rollout."
This technology, literally the fifth generation of mobile broadband, will be a crucial component of the "internet of things". It will connect every appliance in our homes and will carry the massive flows of data when trucks, trains, cars, power stations, hospitals and water utilities are automated and driverless. If a network is compromised, those doing the hacking could potentially infiltrate a host of critical infrastructure.
Gilding, who left ASD last year, insists he directed his team to find a way to mitigate the risk that the Chinese government could compel Huawei to compromise these digital superhighways in Australia.
“We wanted to come up with a package of mitigations to let Huawei in, and we put our best people on it,” says Gilding, who has never before been interviewed by the Australian media. “But we found we couldn’t.”
As it stands, cyber offensive teams run by spy agencies in places like China, the US and Australia must expend considerable time and effort to penetrate a secure network. “The costs are very high and it takes a huge amount of work by a big team,” Gilding says."
That is absolutely a case of National Security, and both Australia and the U.S. are livid with the UK allowing Huawei, even a little bit.
The problem is, Trump is trying to ban Huawei for political reasons -- and to slow down China's economic advance. But, since he can't actually say that -- even the dumb deplorables would fail to support him -- he invents "National Security Concerns". That always plays well with his cult -- just wave the flag and shout "USA! USA! USA!"
And, you are supporting his scam by starting with the assumption that Huawei is an extension of the Chinese government and then compounding your error by saying the Chinese government must be evil simply because it is not a democracy -- while you ignore that your leader is working hard to dismantle our democracy and install himself as a monarch.
Really, this is your response?
Banning Huawei in the U.S. didn't start with Trump; it started during the Bush Administration, and the reason that it is now a "thing" is because the U.S., both parties, have given up on China due to the rise of Xi Jinping. China, through its actions, has established itself as a country that is a threat to the Democracies of the world.
This isn't even disputable given the massive amount of media available on the internet, and I've already posted a huge number of links that show that.
As for Huawei's connection to China, unless Huawei opens up and shows some transparency to ownership, then we have to assume that the workers that own Huawei are simply a CCP controlled workers Union, and I've already posted about that too.
"We have to keep in mind that China is a very different regime," he told CBC News in a recent interview. "China is not a democratic country. China is an authoritarian system. So we always need to pay close attention."
Since the 1990s, Western countries — with Canada in the vanguard — have pursued a policy of helping Beijing build up an affluent middle class through liberalized trade and investment, in the long-term hope that it would lead to a more democratic country.
Over the last several years, however, it has become apparent, in a variety of ways, that the Chinese leadership has no interest in moving in that direction."
"China's President Xi Jinping, with the full support of his party, rewrote the country's constitution in March 2018 and scrapped term limits, essentially allowing him to stay in office for life.
The surprise move came as Beijing pressed claims over the South China Sea, built up its military and launched a global infrastructure plan known as the Belt and Road Initiative.
The country also drastically enhanced domestic security and enforced ideological purity standards in schools and the media."
Yeah, maybe "evil" is a proper description of China under Xi Jinping.
Tmay,
"Whenever you state that countries have no security interests in banning Huawei, you are outright lying. That's a fact."
I never lie. Why would I anyway?
Security interests apply to ALL foreign suppliers of sensitive or critical infrastructure. It isn't only Huawei.
ICT Security for interoperable environments knows no boundaries.
There is even some talk (not surprisingly from Huawei) that says all players should be subjected to the exact same scrutiny as it is. Valid point IMO. Ah, that would be applicable to any U.S players involved in 5G too.
Do you think Trump would welcome that?
But that is irrelevant. That fact remains. 170 countries. No problems. How many years now? They just celebrated 20 years in the U.K.
So, you have no problem with the U.S. banning Huawei for National Security reasons, which is completely acceptable to the WTO, simply because they don't want to have a company from an Authoritarian adversary in their critical infrastructure?
Great, then you can move on.
The U.S can do whatever it wants on its own turf. Within reason of course. Telling sovereign nations what to do on their turf is a different story. A completely different story.
Does the WTO find it acceptable that a government is trying to destroy a private company from another country?
As for Australia. They have nothing. If they did, they would have produced it. Long ago.
They worked from an assumption. How about we assume the Chinese gain controlling access to Nokia or Ericsson's equipment (or the U.S!)?
Assumptions are two to the dozen. Hard facts to support those assumptions are just nowhere to be seen. In place of that, there is no end of protectionism, bullying, accusations, threats, rhetoric and chest beating.
National Security is all about threats, and giving an adversary easy entry to your critical telecom infrastructure is folly, as the Australians determined.
News. The U.S. and Australia will withdraw from WTO if ever the WTO requires them to install critical infrastructure from a foreign adversary. There is a National Security exemption in the WTO for that very reason, and it will surely be tested if China wants to push it, but I doubt that they will.
"Nancy Pelosi being quite blunt at #MSC2020, "#China is seeking to export its digital autocracy through its telecommunications giant #Huawei, threatening economic retaliation against those who do not adopt their technologies."
Nancy Pelosi, Speaker of the House of Representatives, is the very same person that decided to impeach President Trump, so if you think that the U.S. is divided on Huawei, if you think this is political, you would be completely wrong.
I can't wait until China buys out and absorbs Spain. You'd love that!
"U.S. national security advisor Robert O’Brien recently sought to shut down debate about whether China tech giant Huawei installs “backdoors” in its gear. “We have evidence,” O’Brien announced on February 11, 2020, that wireless networks around the world have been compromised with access points that Beijing mandates. Well known are the concerns this raises for sensitive public and private sector data. Less understood is just how comprehensive Beijing’s strategy is—and how extensive its reach."
"U.S. national security advisor Robert O’Brien recently sought to shut down debate about whether China tech giant Huawei installs “backdoors” in its gear. “We have evidence,” O’Brien announced on February 11, 2020, that wireless networks around the world have been compromised with access points that Beijing mandates. Well known are the concerns this raises for sensitive public and private sector data. Less understood is just how comprehensive Beijing’s strategy is—and how extensive its reach."
Of course, the article goes into the details.
The details that you failed to understand!
This is the kill pill! Congratulations!
But, if the U.S has had this information, why didn't they put it on the table?
"We have evidence!"
So provide it!
Just last week, the U.S had a delegation in Munich participating in security! Precisely to deal with this kind of stuff.
Of course, the balloon slowly deflates as you read through the article, culminating in this very last paragraph:
"Both private and public sectors must increasingly engage with each other constructively to understand and respond to this shared risk"
'risk'?????
If you have evidence, there is no 'risk'. Evidence of these vectors is an absolute. If those vectors are Huawei implemented, act on them NOW! I would have no objections. Nobody leaves a virus on their system because it's a risk. It gets zapped!
Share the evidence!
The truth is, and it throws yet more poor light on the U.S government, that what they are really referring to is what HCSEC has already evaluated and ruledout.
They are literally saying that what HCSEC identified and ruled on, was not to the U.S liking and HCSEC should re-evaluate (presumably, of course, until it is to the U.S's liking)
Here is a message from John Suffolk. It couldn't be any clearer:
Suffolk said Huawei did not make the equipment that network operators used to intercept communications if required, adding that the United States had not produced any evidence to support any of its allegations.
"We just say: 'Don't hide it, don't be shy. Publish it, let the world see it'," he said.
Of course, and not only due to the recent Crypto AG debacle, you could easily re-read that piece and substitute 'China' for 'U.S'. That's how ironic things have got. People would probably relate to that better. I can guarantee you that the U.S has been trying to interfere with Huawei gear for years.
Can we get back to the impact of the Coronavirus now?
Huawei has confirmed that it's big presentation scheduled for Barcelona on the 23rd February will finally go ahead after all, but it will be a virtual show (pre-recorded I believe) with a hands on for the media after the presentation. The date has moved to the 24th February, and earlier that day, HONOR will hold an event too.
In terms of hardware impact, little is known beyond what has already been stated.
Numerous product reveals are expected. Some say the Mate X gen 2 will be announced. Others point to as many as eight new products. In theory the P40 series will get its own presentation in March as previously planned.
Perhaps the shipping dates of the new products will provide an idea of manufacturing delays caused by the virus.
Tmay,
"Whenever you state that countries have no security interests in banning Huawei, you are outright lying. That's a fact."
I never lie. Why would I anyway?
Security interests apply to ALL foreign suppliers of sensitive or critical infrastructure. It isn't only Huawei.
ICT Security for interoperable environments knows no boundaries.
There is even some talk (not surprisingly from Huawei) that says all players should be subjected to the exact same scrutiny as it is. Valid point IMO. Ah, that would be applicable to any U.S players involved in 5G too.
Do you think Trump would welcome that?
But that is irrelevant. That fact remains. 170 countries. No problems. How many years now? They just celebrated 20 years in the U.K.
So, you have no problem with the U.S. banning Huawei for National Security reasons, which is completely acceptable to the WTO, simply because they don't want to have a company from an Authoritarian adversary in their critical infrastructure?
Gee, if only Huawei and the Chinese Government allow that level of scrutiny, but they won't, and Huawei has had plenty of opportunity to allow the West to examine its status as a "private" entity in China. But of course, that won't happen, so National Security means you have to assume that China controls Huawei. End of story.
So, great, then you can move on. But I'll leave this for you, which of course you will ignore as "irrelevant".
"In late 2017, one of Australia’s top intelligence officials selected a team of his brightest telecommunications and cyber experts and assigned them a high priority task.
Simeon Gilding’s job at the Australian Signals Directorate was one of the most secretive in the agency - no mean feat in a place in which even the lowest order business is marked "classified". He was in charge of the people trying to launch attacks on Australia’s adversaries by hacking into phone and computer systems.
In an interview with The Age and The Sydney Morning Herald, Gilding says he asked his team to work out how a foreign adversary could attack Australia’s 5G network based on one critical assumption: that this adversary was able to assert control over the company that was actually supplying and maintaining key components of the 5G network.
Next, Mr Gilding told them to figure out what defences could be put in place to prevent such an attack.
The answers he got informed Australia’s stunning 2018 decision to block Chinese firm Huawei from bidding to build the nation’s 5G network. It also throws into stark relief a decision made this week in Britain when, on Thursday, the UK government announced it would not follow Australia’s lead. Gilding's counterparts in British intelligence had produced a very different assessment to that of Gilding’s ASD officers: in the UK, Huawei will be welcomed to participate in the 5G rollout."
This technology, literally the fifth generation of mobile broadband, will be a crucial component of the "internet of things". It will connect every appliance in our homes and will carry the massive flows of data when trucks, trains, cars, power stations, hospitals and water utilities are automated and driverless. If a network is compromised, those doing the hacking could potentially infiltrate a host of critical infrastructure.
Gilding, who left ASD last year, insists he directed his team to find a way to mitigate the risk that the Chinese government could compel Huawei to compromise these digital superhighways in Australia.
“We wanted to come up with a package of mitigations to let Huawei in, and we put our best people on it,” says Gilding, who has never before been interviewed by the Australian media. “But we found we couldn’t.”
As it stands, cyber offensive teams run by spy agencies in places like China, the US and Australia must expend considerable time and effort to penetrate a secure network. “The costs are very high and it takes a huge amount of work by a big team,” Gilding says."
That is absolutely a case of National Security, and both Australia and the U.S. are livid with the UK allowing Huawei, even a little bit.
The problem is, Trump is trying to ban Huawei for political reasons -- and to slow down China's economic advance. But, since he can't actually say that -- even the dumb deplorables would fail to support him -- he invents "National Security Concerns". That always plays well with his cult -- just wave the flag and shout "USA! USA! USA!"
And, you are supporting his scam by starting with the assumption that Huawei is an extension of the Chinese government and then compounding your error by saying the Chinese government must be evil simply because it is not a democracy -- while you ignore that your leader is working hard to dismantle our democracy and install himself as a monarch.
"U.S. national security advisor Robert O’Brien recently sought to shut down debate about whether China tech giant Huawei installs “backdoors” in its gear. “We have evidence,” O’Brien announced on February 11, 2020, that wireless networks around the world have been compromised with access points that Beijing mandates. Well known are the concerns this raises for sensitive public and private sector data. Less understood is just how comprehensive Beijing’s strategy is—and how extensive its reach."
Of course, the article goes into the details.
The details that you failed to understand!
This is the kill pill! Congratulations!
But, if the U.S has had this information, why didn't they put it on the table?
"We have evidence!"
So provide it!
Just last week, the U.S had a delegation in Munich participating in security! Precisely to deal with this kind of stuff.
Of course, the balloon slowly deflates as you read through the article, culminating in this very last paragraph:
"Both private and public sectors must increasingly engage with each other constructively to understand and respond to this shared risk"
'risk'?????
If you have evidence, there is no 'risk'. Evidence of these vectors is an absolute. If those vectors are Huawei implemented, act on them NOW! I would have no objections. Nobody leaves a virus on their system because it's a risk. It gets zapped!
Share the evidence!
The truth is, and it throws yet more poor light on the U.S government, that what they are really referring to is what HCSEC has already evaluated and ruledout.
They are literally saying that what HCSEC identified and ruled on, was not to the U.S liking and HCSEC should re-evaluate (presumably, of course, until it is to the U.S's liking)
Here is a message from John Suffolk. It couldn't be any clearer:
Suffolk said Huawei did not make the equipment that network operators used to intercept communications if required, adding that the United States had not produced any evidence to support any of its allegations.
"We just say: 'Don't hide it, don't be shy. Publish it, let the world see it'," he said.
Of course, and not only due to the recent Crypto AG debacle, you could easily re-read that piece and substitute 'China' for 'U.S'. That's how ironic things have got. People would probably relate to that better. I can guarantee you that the U.S has been trying to interfere with Huawei gear for years.
Can we get back to the impact of the Coronavirus now?
Huawei has confirmed that it's big presentation scheduled for Barcelona on the 23rd February will finally go ahead after all, but it will be a virtual show (pre-recorded I believe) with a hands on for the media after the presentation. The date has moved to the 24th February, and earlier that day, HONOR will hold an event too.
In terms of hardware impact, little is known beyond what has already been stated.
Numerous product reveals are expected. Some say the Mate X gen 2 will be announced. Others point to as many as eight new products. In theory the P40 series will get its own presentation in March as previously planned.
Perhaps the shipping dates of the new products will provide an idea of manufacturing delays caused by the virus.
See my post above, if you want to get back on COVID-19, which is the preferred name of this variant of Coronavirus.
You appear to be one of the most self-entitled people on this forum if you think it is cool to talk about this virus in the context of Huawei and a Virtual appearance in Barcelona, as if that is even relevant to the discussion. What a douche.
"U.S. national security advisor Robert O’Brien recently sought to shut down debate about whether China tech giant Huawei installs “backdoors” in its gear. “We have evidence,” O’Brien announced on February 11, 2020, that wireless networks around the world have been compromised with access points that Beijing mandates. Well known are the concerns this raises for sensitive public and private sector data. Less understood is just how comprehensive Beijing’s strategy is—and how extensive its reach."
Of course, the article goes into the details.
The details that you failed to understand!
This is the kill pill! Congratulations!
But, if the U.S has had this information, why didn't they put it on the table?
"We have evidence!"
So provide it!
Just last week, the U.S had a delegation in Munich participating in security! Precisely to deal with this kind of stuff.
Of course, the balloon slowly deflates as you read through the article, culminating in this very last paragraph:
"Both private and public sectors must increasingly engage with each other constructively to understand and respond to this shared risk"
'risk'?????
If you have evidence, there is no 'risk'. Evidence of these vectors is an absolute. If those vectors are Huawei implemented, act on them NOW! I would have no objections. Nobody leaves a virus on their system because it's a risk. It gets zapped!
Share the evidence!
The truth is, and it throws yet more poor light on the U.S government, that what they are really referring to is what HCSEC has already evaluated and ruledout.
They are literally saying that what HCSEC identified and ruled on, was not to the U.S liking and HCSEC should re-evaluate (presumably, of course, until it is to the U.S's liking)
Here is a message from John Suffolk. It couldn't be any clearer:
Suffolk said Huawei did not make the equipment that network operators used to intercept communications if required, adding that the United States had not produced any evidence to support any of its allegations.
"We just say: 'Don't hide it, don't be shy. Publish it, let the world see it'," he said.
Of course, and not only due to the recent Crypto AG debacle, you could easily re-read that piece and substitute 'China' for 'U.S'. That's how ironic things have got. People would probably relate to that better. I can guarantee you that the U.S has been trying to interfere with Huawei gear for years.
Can we get back to the impact of the Coronavirus now?
Huawei has confirmed that it's big presentation scheduled for Barcelona on the 23rd February will finally go ahead after all, but it will be a virtual show (pre-recorded I believe) with a hands on for the media after the presentation. The date has moved to the 24th February, and earlier that day, HONOR will hold an event too.
In terms of hardware impact, little is known beyond what has already been stated.
Numerous product reveals are expected. Some say the Mate X gen 2 will be announced. Others point to as many as eight new products. In theory the P40 series will get its own presentation in March as previously planned.
Perhaps the shipping dates of the new products will provide an idea of manufacturing delays caused by the virus.
See my post above, if you want to get back on COVID-19, which is the preferred name of this variant of Coronavirus.
You appear to be one of the most self-entitled people on this forum if you think it is cool to talk about this virus in the context of Huawei and a Virtual appearance in Barcelona, as if that is even relevant to the discussion. What a douche.
Wow! You took this thread so far off topic that you seem to have forgotten what it is about!
It is about the impact of the Coronavirus on Huawei.
Everything I just said on Huawei was relevant to this thread. They had over 10,000sqm of space booked at Fira 2. They announced their presentations just hours before the event was cancelled. A few hours ago they announced the events would go ahead but in a virtual context. Literally until a few hours ago, no one knew what would happen.
During these events we will probably learn more about the impact of the virus on the company. Even if they don't explicitly mention the subject, shipping dates might point to the impact the virus has had.
It's not 'cool'. It's on topic. Entirely relevant and the very latest news.
"U.S. national security advisor Robert O’Brien recently sought to shut down debate about whether China tech giant Huawei installs “backdoors” in its gear. “We have evidence,” O’Brien announced on February 11, 2020, that wireless networks around the world have been compromised with access points that Beijing mandates. Well known are the concerns this raises for sensitive public and private sector data. Less understood is just how comprehensive Beijing’s strategy is—and how extensive its reach."
Of course, the article goes into the details.
The details that you failed to understand!
This is the kill pill! Congratulations!
But, if the U.S has had this information, why didn't they put it on the table?
"We have evidence!"
So provide it!
Just last week, the U.S had a delegation in Munich participating in security! Precisely to deal with this kind of stuff.
Of course, the balloon slowly deflates as you read through the article, culminating in this very last paragraph:
"Both private and public sectors must increasingly engage with each other constructively to understand and respond to this shared risk"
'risk'?????
If you have evidence, there is no 'risk'. Evidence of these vectors is an absolute. If those vectors are Huawei implemented, act on them NOW! I would have no objections. Nobody leaves a virus on their system because it's a risk. It gets zapped!
Share the evidence!
The truth is, and it throws yet more poor light on the U.S government, that what they are really referring to is what HCSEC has already evaluated and ruledout.
They are literally saying that what HCSEC identified and ruled on, was not to the U.S liking and HCSEC should re-evaluate (presumably, of course, until it is to the U.S's liking)
Here is a message from John Suffolk. It couldn't be any clearer:
Suffolk said Huawei did not make the equipment that network operators used to intercept communications if required, adding that the United States had not produced any evidence to support any of its allegations.
"We just say: 'Don't hide it, don't be shy. Publish it, let the world see it'," he said.
Of course, and not only due to the recent Crypto AG debacle, you could easily re-read that piece and substitute 'China' for 'U.S'. That's how ironic things have got. People would probably relate to that better. I can guarantee you that the U.S has been trying to interfere with Huawei gear for years.
Can we get back to the impact of the Coronavirus now?
Huawei has confirmed that it's big presentation scheduled for Barcelona on the 23rd February will finally go ahead after all, but it will be a virtual show (pre-recorded I believe) with a hands on for the media after the presentation. The date has moved to the 24th February, and earlier that day, HONOR will hold an event too.
In terms of hardware impact, little is known beyond what has already been stated.
Numerous product reveals are expected. Some say the Mate X gen 2 will be announced. Others point to as many as eight new products. In theory the P40 series will get its own presentation in March as previously planned.
Perhaps the shipping dates of the new products will provide an idea of manufacturing delays caused by the virus.
See my post above, if you want to get back on COVID-19, which is the preferred name of this variant of Coronavirus.
You appear to be one of the most self-entitled people on this forum if you think it is cool to talk about this virus in the context of Huawei and a Virtual appearance in Barcelona, as if that is even relevant to the discussion. What a douche.
Wow! You took this thread so far off topic that you seem to have forgotten what it is about!
It is about the impact of the Coronavirus on Huawei.
Everything I just said on Huawei was relevant to this thread. They had over 10,000sqm of space booked at Fira 2. They announced their presentations just hours before the event was cancelled. A few hours ago they announced the events would go ahead but in a virtual context. Literally until a few hours ago, no one knew what would happen.
During these events we will probably learn more about the impact of the virus on the company. Even if they don't explicitly mention the subject, shipping dates might point to the impact the virus has had.
It's not 'cool'. It's on topic. Entirely relevant and the very latest news.
"Huawei hit hard by coronavirus in China, new criminal charges in U.S."
You must have forgotten about the criminal charges..which makes my posts relevant.
Comments
When Boris Yeltsin was running for the second term, his campaign employed a team of American advisors who worked on Bill Clinton’s campaigns. Back then, Bill Clinton was in office as US president and wanted Yeltsin to be re-elected for a second term even though he was on track to lose the election. The team of American advisors rented an entire floor in a prestigious Moscow hotel. The floor was cordoned off by the security services and no one knew what was going on there until years past that election. Boris Yeltsin won the election while being extremely unpopular in Russia by then. This was a direct interference by a US president into an election in another country, which fundamentally changed history because it resulted in Vladimir Putin being selected by Yeltsin first as PM, and later as successor interim President when Yeltsin resigned on the last day of the 20th century.
US interfered in Syria, which resulted in a million dead and millions of refugees.
SHALL I CONTINUE?
After, 'the U.S is the leader of the free world' comment, it was clear that there was nothing I could really add without taking things in a new, unwarranted, direction.
You know, decades of U.S spying (Crypto AG being the last item in a long list of abuse), regime changes (lost count), invasions, corruption (Trump - Ukraine, the latest in another long list). Trump's bullying etc.
If that is the leader of the free world, it isn't really free but I didn't comment after my only reply to that as:
1. It had nothing to do with Huawei.
2. It had nothing to do with the coronavirus.
3. The poster has gone on record as hating China.
4. The poster immediately swings things from Huawei discussion to China discussion.
I had made my point and refrained from commenting more until you stepped in.
The facts on Huawei as they stand today are well known and - most importantly - haven't changed.
Nothing has been brought to the table to support the accusations. All we get are more accusations.
That is reality.
Even some of the latest accusations date back to cases brought in the civil courts - in 2003. Cases which were settled without Huawei having to pay a cent. What does that tell you about what the U.S really has?
What we are seeing is chest beating hysteria from an administration that has already tweeted its objectives to the world. Really, it can't get any clearer than that. We have read it from Trump himself. Huawei has even included his tweets in recent filings. Are you aware of those filings?
The U.S can't lose. The U.S must win. The U.S must be the leader in the 5G race.
No one else has a right to take the lead. Don't forget that.
Just two days ago, the U.S stormed into Munich hell bent on stopping Huawei. It didn't matter that these were sovereign nations and companies meeting to discuss security. The the threats were banded out again. Followed by more tariffs on EU aviation.
Huawei must be stopped. The western world had to come together with a new 5G solution. An alternative to Huawei. But did you hear the overriding comment of all of this? The one that was made loud and clear? You probably didn't so I will serve it on a plate:
Whatever the solution is, "it must be led by the United States". Surprise, surprise!
Straight from the the mouth of the U.S delegation.
You are reading that right. The U.S cannot lose. It must win.
Surely you can see why its allies are sick and tired of that attitude and want Trump gone. Especially with the threats, tariffs and arrogance.
Boris Johnson has postponed his trip to visit Trump. Even Boris has had enough.
National Security in the absence of evidence is a ruse. Backdoors? The U.S (with Cisco the best in the class) is an expert on backdoors. You would have thought that with reports from HCSEC and its own efforts, they would have found something by now. They haven't. Huawei as part of the Chinese government? More than twenty years presence in 170 countries speaks for it itself. Not a single complaint. And for all the talk, Australia is still awarding Huawei 4G contracts. Strange, but true.
So, when you actually seek to dive deep into the accusations, you find there is very little there and as the U.S has failed to put anything remotely substantial on the table as evidence, it is resorting to threats. The latest at the security meeting in Munich and regarding NATO.
Nothing new here. Let's not forget last year's threats and how Pence took a beating from Merkel.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2019/02/18/pence-biden-munich-nato-trump-ruining-transatlantic-allialnce-column/2904570002/
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/02/10/merkels-job-and-germanys-future-up-for-grabs-again-113184
Not so well...
https://www.scmp.com/tech/gear/article/3050303/germanys-merkel-seeks-sideline-huawei-hawks-ruling-out-full-ban
Merkel has had to respond to hardliners that want to ban Huawei entirely from a 5G buildout.
"Merkel has struggled to assert control of her China policy in a stand-off that pits trade interests with Beijing against security concerns raised by Washington and her own intelligence agencies.
Inside Merkel’s chancellery, senior officials believe that a ban on Huawei would be futile, since the Chinese could potentially infiltrate another supplier if they were determined to hack into 5G mobile communications infrastructure."
Whenever you state that countries have no security interests in banning Huawei, you are outright lying. That's a fact.
Merkel's problem is that she has to balance out Germany's economic interests in China, with National Security interests, and just like the UK and every other country in the EU, with a few exceptions, National Security is given a lower priority than trade. Given that the EU could embrace the industrialization that would come with a Europe centric approach to 5G, build around Ericsson, Nokia, and Siemens, it's apparent that Chinese trade, and backlash thereof from banning Huawei is the reason.
Still, China's economy is in dire straits from COVID-19, and given that the epidemic is not close to being over, maybe trade with the EU will collapse of its own accord.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/02/15/coronavirus-xi-jinping-chinas-incompetence-endangered-the-world/
"Are China’s official reports, including claims that its control efforts are succeeding and the epidemic will soon peak, credible? Omens look bad. Once praised by the World Health Organization (WHO) and scientists worldwide for its quick, transparent response to the newly named COVID-19, China now faces international vilification and potential domestic unrest as it blunders through continued cover-ups, lies, and repression that have already failed to stop the virus and may well be fanning the flames of its spread."
This is why people like yourself that were advocating for MWC to remain on the schedule are wrong; the risk of a pandemic is too high to justify it. That also is a fact.
As we learn more about COVID-19 and it incubation and transfer characteristics, the world might be able to let down its guard bit, but risking a pandemic is just shortsighted.
https://thehill.com/homenews/sunday-talk-shows/483294-nih-official-says-coronavirus-on-the-verge-of-reaching-global
"Whenever you state that countries have no security interests in banning Huawei, you are outright lying. That's a fact."
I never lie. Why would I anyway?
Security interests apply to ALL foreign suppliers of sensitive or critical infrastructure. It isn't only Huawei.
ICT Security for interoperable environments knows no boundaries. There is even some talk (not surprisingly from Huawei) that says all players should be subjected to the exact same scrutiny as it is. Valid point IMO. Ah, that would be applicable to any U.S players involved in 5G too.
Do you think Trump would welcome that?
But that is irrelevant. That fact remains. 170 countries. No problems. How many years now? They just celebrated 20 years in the U.K.
Gee, if only Huawei and the Chinese Government allow that level of scrutiny, but they won't, and Huawei has had plenty of opportunity to allow the West to examine its status as a "private" entity in China. But of course, that won't happen, so National Security means you have to assume that China controls Huawei. End of story.
So, great, then you can move on. But I'll leave this for you, which of course you will ignore as "irrelevant".
https://www.smh.com.au/national/the-man-who-stopped-huawei-a-former-spook-speaks-out-20200131-p53wi6.html
Simeon Gilding’s job at the Australian Signals Directorate was one of the most secretive in the agency - no mean feat in a place in which even the lowest order business is marked "classified". He was in charge of the people trying to launch attacks on Australia’s adversaries by hacking into phone and computer systems.
In an interview with The Age and The Sydney Morning Herald, Gilding says he asked his team to work out how a foreign adversary could attack Australia’s 5G network based on one critical assumption: that this adversary was able to assert control over the company that was actually supplying and maintaining key components of the 5G network.
Next, Mr Gilding told them to figure out what defences could be put in place to prevent such an attack.
The answers he got informed Australia’s stunning 2018 decision to block Chinese firm Huawei from bidding to build the nation’s 5G network. It also throws into stark relief a decision made this week in Britain when, on Thursday, the UK government announced it would not follow Australia’s lead. Gilding's counterparts in British intelligence had produced a very different assessment to that of Gilding’s ASD officers: in the UK, Huawei will be welcomed to participate in the 5G rollout."
This technology, literally the fifth generation of mobile broadband, will be a crucial component of the "internet of things". It will connect every appliance in our homes and will carry the massive flows of data when trucks, trains, cars, power stations, hospitals and water utilities are automated and driverless. If a network is compromised, those doing the hacking could potentially infiltrate a host of critical infrastructure.
Gilding, who left ASD last year, insists he directed his team to find a way to mitigate the risk that the Chinese government could compel Huawei to compromise these digital superhighways in Australia.
“We wanted to come up with a package of mitigations to let Huawei in, and we put our best people on it,” says Gilding, who has never before been interviewed by the Australian media. “But we found we couldn’t.”
As it stands, cyber offensive teams run by spy agencies in places like China, the US and Australia must expend considerable time and effort to penetrate a secure network. “The costs are very high and it takes a huge amount of work by a big team,” Gilding says."
That is absolutely a case of National Security, and both Australia and the U.S. are livid with the UK allowing Huawei, even a little bit.
Does the WTO find it acceptable that a government is trying to destroy a private company from another country?
As for Australia. They have nothing. If they did, they would have produced it. Long ago.
They worked from an assumption. How about we assume the Chinese gain controlling access to Nokia or Ericsson's equipment (or the U.S!)?
Assumptions are two to the dozen. Hard facts to support those assumptions are just nowhere to be seen. In place of that, there is no end of protectionism, bullying, accusations, threats, rhetoric and chest beating.
LOL... So you are saying that rigging an election whether it is done by a foreign country or by a president is normal and OK? How Trumpian of you! Hitler would have agreed with you, but I doubt many of our founding fathers would have.
Banning Huawei in the U.S. didn't start with Trump; it started during the Bush Administration, and the reason that it is now a "thing" is because the U.S., both parties, have given up on China due to the rise of Xi Jinping. China, through its actions, has established itself as a country that is a threat to the Democracies of the world.
This isn't even disputable given the massive amount of media available on the internet, and I've already posted a huge number of links that show that.
As for Huawei's connection to China, unless Huawei opens up and shows some transparency to ownership, then we have to assume that the workers that own Huawei are simply a CCP controlled workers Union, and I've already posted about that too.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/china-totalitarianism-xi-jinping-canada-japan-1.5465067?__vfz=medium=sharebar
"We have to keep in mind that China is a very different regime," he told CBC News in a recent interview. "China is not a democratic country. China is an authoritarian system. So we always need to pay close attention."
Since the 1990s, Western countries — with Canada in the vanguard — have pursued a policy of helping Beijing build up an affluent middle class through liberalized trade and investment, in the long-term hope that it would lead to a more democratic country.
Over the last several years, however, it has become apparent, in a variety of ways, that the Chinese leadership has no interest in moving in that direction."
"China's President Xi Jinping, with the full support of his party, rewrote the country's constitution in March 2018 and scrapped term limits, essentially allowing him to stay in office for life.
The surprise move came as Beijing pressed claims over the South China Sea, built up its military and launched a global infrastructure plan known as the Belt and Road Initiative.
The country also drastically enhanced domestic security and enforced ideological purity standards in schools and the media."
Yeah, maybe "evil" is a proper description of China under Xi Jinping.
National Security is all about threats, and giving an adversary easy entry to your critical telecom infrastructure is folly, as the Australians determined.
News. The U.S. and Australia will withdraw from WTO if ever the WTO requires them to install critical infrastructure from a foreign adversary. There is a National Security exemption in the WTO for that very reason, and it will surely be tested if China wants to push it, but I doubt that they will.
"Nancy Pelosi being quite blunt at #MSC2020, "#China is seeking to export its digital autocracy through its telecommunications giant #Huawei, threatening economic retaliation against those who do not adopt their technologies."
Nancy Pelosi, Speaker of the House of Representatives, is the very same person that decided to impeach President Trump, so if you think that the U.S. is divided on Huawei, if you think this is political, you would be completely wrong.
I can't wait until China buys out and absorbs Spain. You'd love that!
"U.S. national security advisor Robert O’Brien recently sought to shut down debate about whether China tech giant Huawei installs “backdoors” in its gear. “We have evidence,” O’Brien announced on February 11, 2020, that wireless networks around the world have been compromised with access points that Beijing mandates. Well known are the concerns this raises for sensitive public and private sector data. Less understood is just how comprehensive Beijing’s strategy is—and how extensive its reach."
Of course, the article goes into the details.
This is the kill pill! Congratulations!
But, if the U.S has had this information, why didn't they put it on the table?
"We have evidence!"
So provide it!
Just last week, the U.S had a delegation in Munich participating in security! Precisely to deal with this kind of stuff.
Of course, the balloon slowly deflates as you read through the article, culminating in this very last paragraph:
"Both private and public sectors must increasingly engage with each other constructively to understand and respond to this shared risk"
'risk'?????
If you have evidence, there is no 'risk'. Evidence of these vectors is an absolute. If those vectors are Huawei implemented, act on them NOW! I would have no objections. Nobody leaves a virus on their system because it's a risk. It gets zapped!
Share the evidence!
The truth is, and it throws yet more poor light on the U.S government, that what they are really referring to is what HCSEC has already evaluated and ruled out.
They are literally saying that what HCSEC identified and ruled on, was not to the U.S liking and HCSEC should re-evaluate (presumably, of course, until it is to the U.S's liking)
Here is a message from John Suffolk. It couldn't be any clearer:
Suffolk said Huawei did not make the equipment that network operators used to intercept communications if required, adding that the United States had not produced any evidence to support any of its allegations.
"We just say: 'Don't hide it, don't be shy. Publish it, let the world see it'," he said.
https://www.teiss.co.uk/huawei-cyber-security-chief-says-no-operator-gives-it-access-to-intercept-equipment/
Of course, and not only due to the recent Crypto AG debacle, you could easily re-read that piece and substitute 'China' for 'U.S'. That's how ironic things have got. People would probably relate to that better. I can guarantee you that the U.S has been trying to interfere with Huawei gear for years.
Can we get back to the impact of the Coronavirus now?
Huawei has confirmed that it's big presentation scheduled for Barcelona on the 23rd February will finally go ahead after all, but it will be a virtual show (pre-recorded I believe) with a hands on for the media after the presentation. The date has moved to the 24th February, and earlier that day, HONOR will hold an event too.
In terms of hardware impact, little is known beyond what has already been stated.
Numerous product reveals are expected. Some say the Mate X gen 2 will be announced. Others point to as many as eight new products. In theory the P40 series will get its own presentation in March as previously planned.
Perhaps the shipping dates of the new products will provide an idea of manufacturing delays caused by the virus.
I'll let a Chinese citizen speak about the Chinese Government, and I'll note that she used the word "evil".
See my post above, if you want to get back on COVID-19, which is the preferred name of this variant of Coronavirus.
You appear to be one of the most self-entitled people on this forum if you think it is cool to talk about this virus in the context of Huawei and a Virtual appearance in Barcelona, as if that is even relevant to the discussion. What a douche.
It is about the impact of the Coronavirus on Huawei.
Everything I just said on Huawei was relevant to this thread. They had over 10,000sqm of space booked at Fira 2. They announced their presentations just hours before the event was cancelled. A few hours ago they announced the events would go ahead but in a virtual context. Literally until a few hours ago, no one knew what would happen.
During these events we will probably learn more about the impact of the virus on the company. Even if they don't explicitly mention the subject, shipping dates might point to the impact the virus has had.
It's not 'cool'. It's on topic. Entirely relevant and the very latest news.
"Huawei hit hard by coronavirus in China, new criminal charges in U.S."
You must have forgotten about the criminal charges..which makes my posts relevant.