White House enlists Apple, tech companies in fight against coronavirus pandemic

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 44
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")

    No, the Chinese CDC wasn't gutted.   Ours, in the U.S. has been over the past 3 years.

    I am critical of any country that screws up on this   And the U.S. -- who should have been the gold standard -- has clearly screwed up.  We knew it was coming -- and did nothing.  And, even after it started spreading here, we got denial instead of action from our government.  Now it looks like they're in catch-up mode and also in political mode as they debate whether to help the American people or help the American president get re-elected.  

    Meanwhile China acted decisively and thoroughly and has pretty much brought it under control.   The same is true for South Korea.  Unfortunately, Italy has not responded as well and they have a very serious problem.
    edited March 2020 dysamoria
  • Reply 22 of 44
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    hexclock said:
    hexclock said:
    asdasd said:
    hexclock said:
    ‘It’s just the flu’

    P.S.  ‘All flights to the EU is cancel’ & ‘all meetings on the coronavirus are classified’

    Everything is fine.  Nothing to see here. Please stop selling stock, it’s making me look bad.

    How about some tax breaks?  That will make everyone feel better...


    Ok, so what are your suggestions? Everyone is so quick to criticize everything. What would YOU do?
    Mass mobile testing and self isolation for those who have it.
    Yeah sure, one of the criticisms is that there are not enough tests. How the hell are they supposed to have enough tests when 3 months ago the virus was completely unknown?
    Where was all this handwringing when just ten years ago, H1N1 infected 60 Million people with 300,000 going to the hospital in the US alone!

    Every other country has enough test kits and many are testing more people in a single day than the U.S. been able to do in total.  South Korea has even set up drive thru test sites where you don't even get out of your car.

    Apparently the WHO published information for producing test kits over a month ago but the U.S. refused and decided to go it alone.   As usual that hubris produced an epic fail.
    That’s a fair point if true, but man, these people are working night and day to get a handle on this thing, and the constant negative media bashing is not really helpful at this point. Bash all you want after the smoke clears  

    The ones who screwed up are still playing the political game.   The politicians are trying to get a general tax cut through instead of dealing with the epidemic and its impact on citizens while national health officials are busy making excuses for them.   They deserve a kick in butt.
    dysamoria
  • Reply 23 of 44
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,104member
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")

    No, the Chinese CDC wasn't gutted.   Ours, in the U.S. has been over the past 3 years.
    BS.

    "It’s misleading at best to claim Trump “slashed funding,” when his proposals haven’t taken effect. For instance, Trump’s fiscal 2020 budget proposal would have reduced CDC funding by $750.6 million, compared with what was enacted for fiscal 2019 (see the “program level” line in the linked document). But Congress passed, and Trump signed, a budget that increased CDC funding by $420 million.

    For fiscal 2019, Trump put forth a $1.36 billion cut to CDC’s funding in his budget proposal, but what ended up being enacted was a $261.6 million increase over what was passed the year before. The president proposed a 19.4% reduction, but Congress enacted a 3.7% increase.

    For fiscal 2018, Trump’s first full budget proposal as president, he proposed a 17% reduction in funding for the CDC, but what Congress enacted amounted to a 2.3% drop in funding for the annualized 2018 continuing resolution."


    So proposed is NOT the same as enacted. The CDC budget has not been gutted, and certainly not for three years running. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt one more time and assume you'll try to be an honest poster and simply didn't know any better. Now you do. 


    edited March 2020 dysamoriarazorpitboltsfan17
  • Reply 24 of 44
    h2ph2p Posts: 328member
    hexclock said:
    Yeah sure, one of the criticisms is that there are not enough tests. How the hell are they supposed to have enough tests when 3 months ago the virus was completely unknown?
    Where was all this handwringing when just ten years ago, H1N1 infected 60 Million people with 300,000 going to the hospital in the US alone!
    Oh we can not have handwringing or fomenting of panic in 2009!

    The handwringing would have been unhelpful in selling "ObamaCare" so there was none that I'm aware of.

    My biggest concern is: Has the U.S. government learned nothing from the H1Ni Pandemic!?! Where are the Health Care Emergency Protocols to allow for (perhaps) emergency suspension of HIPPA laws so we can test more widely? Dr Fauci said that the System is "failing" because we are not "set up" to allow the kind of testing ala South Korea, et al!
    GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 25 of 44
    dysamoriadysamoria Posts: 3,430member
    asdasd said:
    revenant said:
    So no quoting President Trump?

    From CNN:
    Trump continued by discarding his own administration's advice to stay home if you're feeling sick: "If we have thousands or hundreds of thousands of people that get better, just by, you know, sitting around and even going to work, some of them go to work, but they get better, and then when you do have a death, like you've had in the state of Washington, like you had one in California, I believe you had one in New York." No deaths have been reported in New York.
    "You know," Trump said, "all of a sudden it seems like 3 or 4%, which is a very high number, as opposed to a fraction of 1%. But again, they don't know about the easy cases because the easy cases don't go to the hospital. They don't report to doctors or the hospital in many cases. So I think that that number is very high. I think the number, personally, I would say the number is way under 1%." 
    to be fair:
    "Every one of these doctors said, 'How do you know so much about this?' Maybe I have a natural ability. Maybe I should have done that instead of running for president."

    the lack of consistency on this terrible, yet not so bad, virus is weird. sit around and go to work does not need apple and other tech companies to help.
    I thought the hysteria about Trump excessive and the Russian allegations preposterous but he is floundering here. 
    At least you’re not impossible.
    GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 26 of 44
    dysamoriadysamoria Posts: 3,430member
    As for the primary story ... oh the irony.
  • Reply 27 of 44
    revenantrevenant Posts: 621member
    hexclock said:
    asdasd said:
    hexclock said:
    ‘It’s just the flu’

    P.S.  ‘All flights to the EU is cancel’ & ‘all meetings on the coronavirus are classified’

    Everything is fine.  Nothing to see here. Please stop selling stock, it’s making me look bad.

    How about some tax breaks?  That will make everyone feel better...


    Ok, so what are your suggestions? Everyone is so quick to criticize everything. What would YOU do?
    Mass mobile testing and self isolation for those who have it.
    Yeah sure, one of the criticisms is that there are not enough tests. How the hell are they supposed to have enough tests when 3 months ago the virus was completely unknown?
    Where was all this handwringing when just ten years ago, H1N1 infected 60 Million people with 300,000 going to the hospital in the US alone!

    korea tests thousands a day. thousands. there are tests, many of them, just not in the US.
    GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 28 of 44
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")

    No, the Chinese CDC wasn't gutted.   Ours, in the U.S. has been over the past 3 years.
    BS.

    "It’s misleading at best to claim Trump “slashed funding,” when his proposals haven’t taken effect. For instance, Trump’s fiscal 2020 budget proposal would have reduced CDC funding by $750.6 million, compared with what was enacted for fiscal 2019 (see the “program level” line in the linked document). But Congress passed, and Trump signed, a budget that increased CDC funding by $420 million.

    For fiscal 2019, Trump put forth a $1.36 billion cut to CDC’s funding in his budget proposal, but what ended up being enacted was a $261.6 million increase over what was passed the year before. The president proposed a 19.4% reduction, but Congress enacted a 3.7% increase.

    For fiscal 2018, Trump’s first full budget proposal as president, he proposed a 17% reduction in funding for the CDC, but what Congress enacted amounted to a 2.3% drop in funding for the annualized 2018 continuing resolution."


    So proposed is NOT the same as enacted. The CDC budget has not been gutted, and certainly not for three years running. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt one more time and assume you'll try to be an honest poster and simply didn't know any better. Now you do. 



    The facts as you admit are that Trump has been trying to gut the agency at every turn -- but (mostly) Democrats stand in his misguided way.

    But, more specific to the Corona Pandemic threatening our nation:
    "a series of cost-cutting decisions made by the Trump administration in preceding years had gutted the nation’s infectious disease defense infrastructure. The “pandemic response team" .... 

    Rear Adm. Timothy Ziemer abruptly departed from his post leading the global health security team on the National Security Council in May 2018 amid a reorganization of the council by then-National Security Advisor John Bolton, and Ziemer’s team was disbanded. Tom Bossert, whom the Washington Post reported “had called for a comprehensive biodefense strategy against pandemics and biological attacks,” had been fired one month prior.

    It’s thus true that the Trump administration axed the executive branch team responsible for coordinating a response to a pandemic and did not replace it, eliminating Ziemer’s position and reassigning others....   forcing the CDC to cancel its efforts to help countries prevent infectious-disease threats from becoming epidemics in 39 of 49 countries in 2018. Among the countries abandoned? China"


    (But nice try defending that idiot!  Which is kind of perplexing why anybody would do that in light of how badly he has bungled the U.S. response to the virus -- more concerned about the stock market than American's health and well being)



    edited March 2020
  • Reply 29 of 44
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,686member
    hexclock said:
    asdasd said:
    hexclock said:
    ‘It’s just the flu’

    P.S.  ‘All flights to the EU is cancel’ & ‘all meetings on the coronavirus are classified’

    Everything is fine.  Nothing to see here. Please stop selling stock, it’s making me look bad.

    How about some tax breaks?  That will make everyone feel better...


    Ok, so what are your suggestions? Everyone is so quick to criticize everything. What would YOU do?
    Mass mobile testing and self isolation for those who have it.
    Yeah sure, one of the criticisms is that there are not enough tests. How the hell are they supposed to have enough tests when 3 months ago the virus was completely unknown?
    Where was all this handwringing when just ten years ago, H1N1 infected 60 Million people with 300,000 going to the hospital in the US alone!
    Why are people so intent on comparing this virus to H1N1, it is clearly more severe.
  • Reply 30 of 44
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,686member

    hexclock said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")
    China screwed this up from the beginning, there is no sugarcoating it. 
    China reacted fairly quickly actually. There's a general consensus about that outside the American media echo chamber. Yes, they hid it from their own media for a while, but when they got going they curtailed the disease fairly quickly. The US, however, has done nothing except a pointless ban on travel fromsome of Europe but not all of it. 
  • Reply 31 of 44
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,104member
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")

    No, the Chinese CDC wasn't gutted.   Ours, in the U.S. has been over the past 3 years.
    BS.

    "It’s misleading at best to claim Trump “slashed funding,” when his proposals haven’t taken effect. For instance, Trump’s fiscal 2020 budget proposal would have reduced CDC funding by $750.6 million, compared with what was enacted for fiscal 2019 (see the “program level” line in the linked document). But Congress passed, and Trump signed, a budget that increased CDC funding by $420 million.

    For fiscal 2019, Trump put forth a $1.36 billion cut to CDC’s funding in his budget proposal, but what ended up being enacted was a $261.6 million increase over what was passed the year before. The president proposed a 19.4% reduction, but Congress enacted a 3.7% increase.

    For fiscal 2018, Trump’s first full budget proposal as president, he proposed a 17% reduction in funding for the CDC, but what Congress enacted amounted to a 2.3% drop in funding for the annualized 2018 continuing resolution."


    So proposed is NOT the same as enacted. The CDC budget has not been gutted, and certainly not for three years running. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt one more time and assume you'll try to be an honest poster and simply didn't know any better. Now you do. 



    The facts as you admit are that Trump has been TRYING (AND NOT SUCCEEDING) to gut the agency at every turn...

    But nice try defending that idiot!


    LOL @ defending. You don't even understand what you say sometimes. Just because you were wrong you try to belittle the one pointing it out? That's not very adult...
    edited March 2020
  • Reply 32 of 44
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")

    No, the Chinese CDC wasn't gutted.   Ours, in the U.S. has been over the past 3 years.
    BS.

    "It’s misleading at best to claim Trump “slashed funding,” when his proposals haven’t taken effect. For instance, Trump’s fiscal 2020 budget proposal would have reduced CDC funding by $750.6 million, compared with what was enacted for fiscal 2019 (see the “program level” line in the linked document). But Congress passed, and Trump signed, a budget that increased CDC funding by $420 million.

    For fiscal 2019, Trump put forth a $1.36 billion cut to CDC’s funding in his budget proposal, but what ended up being enacted was a $261.6 million increase over what was passed the year before. The president proposed a 19.4% reduction, but Congress enacted a 3.7% increase.

    For fiscal 2018, Trump’s first full budget proposal as president, he proposed a 17% reduction in funding for the CDC, but what Congress enacted amounted to a 2.3% drop in funding for the annualized 2018 continuing resolution."


    So proposed is NOT the same as enacted. The CDC budget has not been gutted, and certainly not for three years running. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt one more time and assume you'll try to be an honest poster and simply didn't know any better. Now you do. 



    The facts as you admit are that Trump has been TRYING (AND NOT SUCCEEDING) to gut the agency at every turn...

    But nice try defending that idiot!


    LOL @ defending. You don't even understand what you say sometimes. Just because you were wrong you try to belittle the one pointing it out? That's not very adult...

    As I explained, Trump gutted the CDC and the Pandemic response team.  And we are suffering the consequences of his mismanagement.  That's all I need to understand. 

    And, by the way, by "idiot" I meant Trump not you.   You sound a little overly sensitive there.  Are you feeling foolish about defending that idiot?
  • Reply 33 of 44
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,104member
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")

    No, the Chinese CDC wasn't gutted.   Ours, in the U.S. has been over the past 3 years.
    BS.

    "It’s misleading at best to claim Trump “slashed funding,” when his proposals haven’t taken effect. For instance, Trump’s fiscal 2020 budget proposal would have reduced CDC funding by $750.6 million, compared with what was enacted for fiscal 2019 (see the “program level” line in the linked document). But Congress passed, and Trump signed, a budget that increased CDC funding by $420 million.

    For fiscal 2019, Trump put forth a $1.36 billion cut to CDC’s funding in his budget proposal, but what ended up being enacted was a $261.6 million increase over what was passed the year before. The president proposed a 19.4% reduction, but Congress enacted a 3.7% increase.

    For fiscal 2018, Trump’s first full budget proposal as president, he proposed a 17% reduction in funding for the CDC, but what Congress enacted amounted to a 2.3% drop in funding for the annualized 2018 continuing resolution."


    So proposed is NOT the same as enacted. The CDC budget has not been gutted, and certainly not for three years running. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt one more time and assume you'll try to be an honest poster and simply didn't know any better. Now you do. 



    The facts as you admit are that Trump has been TRYING (AND NOT SUCCEEDING) to gut the agency at every turn...

    But nice try defending that idiot!


    LOL @ defending. You don't even understand what you say sometimes. Just because you were wrong you try to belittle the one pointing it out? That's not very adult...

    As I explained, Trump gutted the CDC and the Pandemic response team.  And we are suffering the consequences of his mismanagement.  That's all I need to understand. 

    And, by the way, by "idiot" I meant Trump not you.   You sound a little overly sensitive there.  Are you feeling foolish about defending that idiot?
    it was clear from the get-go "idiot" was meant for Trump and not me. Your first mistake was assuming the CDC's budget had been "gutted" going back three years. It wasn't.  You were mistaken.

    Your second major error is assuming that pointing out your mistake was me defending Mr. Trump, who I neither voted for nor support today. I simply defend the facts which you keep taking issue with and posting silliness about Republicans and Democrats and OMG Right Wing!! as tho one party was created from the Angels and the other from demons and only one could know the truth.

    Relax. Read more. Check your facts before getting so worked up over something that wasn't true to begin with. If you have a question about a claim try a search engine. Any provider that pleases you and passes your smell test will do. You have choices beyond the most popular one. When you claim someone else is wrong and basing it all on "right-wing media" then try posting your own link that counters it. George B Mac saying so is hardly an authoritative source. Opinions are one thing, we all ahve em, but try avoiding fact twisting or,  it seems more commonly, complete ignorance of them to justify what you believe.

    The current threat from the corona virus is not a political one tied to one party much as you would keep posting it is. It crosses Party lines and some of the blame in reacting to it predates any Trump presidency. (why are there only two parties anyway? There certainly aren't just two political viewpoints)
    https://apnews.com/d36d6c4de29f4d04beda3db00cb46104
    edited March 2020
  • Reply 34 of 44
    hexclockhexclock Posts: 1,232member
    asdasd said:
    hexclock said:
    asdasd said:
    hexclock said:
    ‘It’s just the flu’

    P.S.  ‘All flights to the EU is cancel’ & ‘all meetings on the coronavirus are classified’

    Everything is fine.  Nothing to see here. Please stop selling stock, it’s making me look bad.

    How about some tax breaks?  That will make everyone feel better...


    Ok, so what are your suggestions? Everyone is so quick to criticize everything. What would YOU do?
    Mass mobile testing and self isolation for those who have it.
    Yeah sure, one of the criticisms is that there are not enough tests. How the hell are they supposed to have enough tests when 3 months ago the virus was completely unknown?
    Where was all this handwringing when just ten years ago, H1N1 infected 60 Million people with 300,000 going to the hospital in the US alone!
    Why are people so intent on comparing this virus to H1N1, it is clearly more severe.
    I’m just comparing numbers of cases and the general response by the media and society at large. I think it remains to be seen whether it’s more severe are not, but it was a pandemic and so comparison is warranted. 
     Consider:

    • CDC estimates that between about 2,500 and 6,000 2009 H1N1-related deaths occurred between April and October 17, 2009. The mid-level in this range is about 3,900 2009 H1N1-related deaths.
    • The results of this method confirm previous epidemiological data indicating that this disease primarily affects people younger than 65 year old, with the number of cases, hospitalizations and deaths overwhelmingly occurring in people 64 years and younger. This is very different from seasonal influenza, where about 60 percent of seasonal flu-related hospitalizations and 90 percent of flu-related deathsoccur in people 65 years and older. The proportion of younger people being impacted by 2009 H1N1 is much greater than what occurs during seasonal flu and people 65 and older are much less affected by this virus than what routinely occurs with seasonal influenza.
    edited March 2020
  • Reply 35 of 44
    hexclockhexclock Posts: 1,232member

    asdasd said:

    hexclock said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")
    China screwed this up from the beginning, there is no sugarcoating it. 
    China reacted fairly quickly actually. There's a general consensus about that outside the American media echo chamber. Yes, they hid it from their own media for a while, but when they got going they curtailed the disease fairly quickly. The US, however, has done nothing except a pointless ban on travel fromsome of Europe but not all of it. 
    Yes, they hid it from their media by disappearing a couple of journalists who had done early reporting. Eventually word got out and they had to act. They also denied CDC entry in order to gather information at the point of origin. 
  • Reply 36 of 44
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    hexclock said:
    asdasd said:
    hexclock said:
    ‘It’s just the flu’

    P.S.  ‘All flights to the EU is cancel’ & ‘all meetings on the coronavirus are classified’

    Everything is fine.  Nothing to see here. Please stop selling stock, it’s making me look bad.

    How about some tax breaks?  That will make everyone feel better...


    Ok, so what are your suggestions? Everyone is so quick to criticize everything. What would YOU do?
    Mass mobile testing and self isolation for those who have it.
    Yeah sure, one of the criticisms is that there are not enough tests. How the hell are they supposed to have enough tests when 3 months ago the virus was completely unknown?
    Where was all this handwringing when just ten years ago, H1N1 infected 60 Million people with 300,000 going to the hospital in the US alone!
    Precisely. The self-serving media hysteria is outrageous.
  • Reply 37 of 44
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,686member
    hexclock said:
    asdasd said:
    hexclock said:
    asdasd said:
    hexclock said:
    ‘It’s just the flu’

    P.S.  ‘All flights to the EU is cancel’ & ‘all meetings on the coronavirus are classified’

    Everything is fine.  Nothing to see here. Please stop selling stock, it’s making me look bad.

    How about some tax breaks?  That will make everyone feel better...


    Ok, so what are your suggestions? Everyone is so quick to criticize everything. What would YOU do?
    Mass mobile testing and self isolation for those who have it.
    Yeah sure, one of the criticisms is that there are not enough tests. How the hell are they supposed to have enough tests when 3 months ago the virus was completely unknown?
    Where was all this handwringing when just ten years ago, H1N1 infected 60 Million people with 300,000 going to the hospital in the US alone!
    Why are people so intent on comparing this virus to H1N1, it is clearly more severe.
    I’m just comparing numbers of cases and the general response by the media and society at large. I think it remains to be seen whether it’s more severe are not, but it was a pandemic and so comparison is warranted. 
     Consider:

    • CDC estimates that between about 2,500 and 6,000 2009 H1N1-related deaths occurred between April and October 17, 2009. The mid-level in this range is about 3,900 2009 H1N1-related deaths.
    • The results of this method confirm previous epidemiological data indicating that this disease primarily affects people younger than 65 year old, with the number of cases, hospitalizations and deaths overwhelmingly occurring in people 64 years and younger. This is very different from seasonal influenza, where about 60 percent of seasonal flu-related hospitalizations and 90 percent of flu-related deathsoccur in people 65 years and older. The proportion of younger people being impacted by 2009 H1N1 is much greater than what occurs during seasonal flu and people 65 and older are much less affected by this virus than what routinely occurs with seasonal influenza.
    It looks like you are not even aware of what is happening in Italy. Only a tiny percentage of the population has been infected yet, and without these new measures that will increase exponentially. Look at the statistics in Europe. The US is behind the curve on even the badly handled European reaction. 

    The death rate for normal flu is 0.1%, the best estimate for this virus is 1%, the worse is 3% or so ( WHO). The hospitalisation rate has been as high as 10%. And since the population has no immunity to this virus and it is highly contagious the effect will be enormous, it will overwhelm the health service. In a matter of weeks in fact. Eventually 60% of the population will have it. 
    edited March 2020
  • Reply 38 of 44
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,686member
    hexclock said:

    asdasd said:

    hexclock said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")
    China screwed this up from the beginning, there is no sugarcoating it. 
    China reacted fairly quickly actually. There's a general consensus about that outside the American media echo chamber. Yes, they hid it from their own media for a while, but when they got going they curtailed the disease fairly quickly. The US, however, has done nothing except a pointless ban on travel fromsome of Europe but not all of it. 
    Yes, they hid it from their media by disappearing a couple of journalists who had done early reporting. Eventually word got out and they had to act. They also denied CDC entry in order to gather information at the point of origin. 
    The CDC is an American organisation, so the Chinese are not liable to it. It wasn't journalists they detained but a doctor they silenced. Months later Trump was denying the virus in the US. Pot, and kettle. 
  • Reply 39 of 44
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")

    No, the Chinese CDC wasn't gutted.   Ours, in the U.S. has been over the past 3 years.
    BS.

    "It’s misleading at best to claim Trump “slashed funding,” when his proposals haven’t taken effect. For instance, Trump’s fiscal 2020 budget proposal would have reduced CDC funding by $750.6 million, compared with what was enacted for fiscal 2019 (see the “program level” line in the linked document). But Congress passed, and Trump signed, a budget that increased CDC funding by $420 million.

    For fiscal 2019, Trump put forth a $1.36 billion cut to CDC’s funding in his budget proposal, but what ended up being enacted was a $261.6 million increase over what was passed the year before. The president proposed a 19.4% reduction, but Congress enacted a 3.7% increase.

    For fiscal 2018, Trump’s first full budget proposal as president, he proposed a 17% reduction in funding for the CDC, but what Congress enacted amounted to a 2.3% drop in funding for the annualized 2018 continuing resolution."


    So proposed is NOT the same as enacted. The CDC budget has not been gutted, and certainly not for three years running. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt one more time and assume you'll try to be an honest poster and simply didn't know any better. Now you do. 



    The facts as you admit are that Trump has been TRYING (AND NOT SUCCEEDING) to gut the agency at every turn...

    But nice try defending that idiot!


    LOL @ defending. You don't even understand what you say sometimes. Just because you were wrong you try to belittle the one pointing it out? That's not very adult...

    As I explained, Trump gutted the CDC and the Pandemic response team.  And we are suffering the consequences of his mismanagement.  That's all I need to understand. 

    And, by the way, by "idiot" I meant Trump not you.   You sound a little overly sensitive there.  Are you feeling foolish about defending that idiot?
    it was clear from the get-go "idiot" was meant for Trump and not me. Your first mistake was assuming the CDC's budget had been "gutted" going back three years. It wasn't.  You were mistaken.

    Your second major error is assuming that pointing out your mistake was me defending Mr. Trump, who I neither voted for nor support today. I simply defend the facts which you keep taking issue with and posting silliness about Republicans and Democrats and OMG Right Wing!! as tho one party was created from the Angels and the other from demons and only one could know the truth.

    Relax. Read more. Check your facts before getting so worked up over something that wasn't true to begin with. If you have a question about a claim try a search engine. Any provider that pleases you and passes your smell test will do. You have choices beyond the most popular one. When you claim someone else is wrong and basing it all on "right-wing media" then try posting your own link that counters it. George B Mac saying so is hardly an authoritative source. Opinions are one thing, we all ahve em, but try avoiding fact twisting or,  it seems more commonly, complete ignorance of them to justify what you believe.

    The current threat from the corona virus is not a political one tied to one party much as you would keep posting it is. It crosses Party lines and some of the blame in reacting to it predates any Trump presidency. (why are there only two parties anyway? There certainly aren't just two political viewpoints)
    https://apnews.com/d36d6c4de29f4d04beda3db00cb46104

    LOL...  That's the problem!  Or, rather YOUR problem!   I do check facts -- the real ones rather than your right wing Alternative Versions.

    The right is SO very gullible.   Putin, Steve Bannon, Hannity, Trump, etc., etc., etc.,  lead you by the nose.

    But, you are correct:  the threat of the Corona virus is not a political one -- as much as Trump and the right would try to make it one.   But, since they totally failed to prepare for this before it arrived, then marginalized it and held secret meetings about it after it arrived, they have no choice but to call it "political" when they are called out for their gross negligence, incompetence and corruption.  (Just as they did when they were called out after Trump tried to cheat and undermine our upcoming election.  In fact, the pattern is clear:  whenever they are caught they always cry "hate" and "political" to the facts showing their corruption and ineptness)

    They can do that because the right wing base has shown the same blind loyalty to Trump as Germany did to Hitler in the 30's.  But, you are right when you imply that Trump  is merely a tool of the right wing propaganda machine and, once he is no longer useful to them they will cast him aside and move on to their next agenda.
  • Reply 40 of 44
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,104member
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    gatorguy said:
    felix01 said:
    Does a person develop immunity to COVID-19 after they have acquired it and recovered? 

    The last I heard, probably, but we do not yet know for sure.  There have been reports of people being reinfected, but they are not sure if there might be extenuating circumstances (such as a false positive on a test, etc...)  That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science
    What are the Chinese saying about it? They would be the current worldwide experts on it and have had far more time and incentive to research the disease in depth. 

    That was from the Chinese.  They reported the reinfections but were uncertain of the accuracy of the reports (again, perhaps the original test was a false positive, etc.)   I have not heard anything from the U.S. on it -- which makes sense since we are in the early days of the spread of the infection and too early for re-infection to occur
    So the Chinese agency that would be most similar in tasking to the CDC is also gutted? I wouldn't expect so. If the Chinese don't know with far more exposure samples to work with and time to do so why are you finding fault with the CDC and claiming it's all because it's gutted? More forgiving of the Chinese or just more critical of the US? 
    ("That's one of the problems with having a gutted CDC -- not enough research, not enough science")

    No, the Chinese CDC wasn't gutted.   Ours, in the U.S. has been over the past 3 years.
    BS.

    "It’s misleading at best to claim Trump “slashed funding,” when his proposals haven’t taken effect. For instance, Trump’s fiscal 2020 budget proposal would have reduced CDC funding by $750.6 million, compared with what was enacted for fiscal 2019 (see the “program level” line in the linked document). But Congress passed, and Trump signed, a budget that increased CDC funding by $420 million.

    For fiscal 2019, Trump put forth a $1.36 billion cut to CDC’s funding in his budget proposal, but what ended up being enacted was a $261.6 million increase over what was passed the year before. The president proposed a 19.4% reduction, but Congress enacted a 3.7% increase.

    For fiscal 2018, Trump’s first full budget proposal as president, he proposed a 17% reduction in funding for the CDC, but what Congress enacted amounted to a 2.3% drop in funding for the annualized 2018 continuing resolution."


    So proposed is NOT the same as enacted. The CDC budget has not been gutted, and certainly not for three years running. Let's give you the benefit of the doubt one more time and assume you'll try to be an honest poster and simply didn't know any better. Now you do. 



    The facts as you admit are that Trump has been TRYING (AND NOT SUCCEEDING) to gut the agency at every turn...

    But nice try defending that idiot!


    LOL @ defending. You don't even understand what you say sometimes. Just because you were wrong you try to belittle the one pointing it out? That's not very adult...

    As I explained, Trump gutted the CDC and the Pandemic response team.  And we are suffering the consequences of his mismanagement.  That's all I need to understand. 

    And, by the way, by "idiot" I meant Trump not you.   You sound a little overly sensitive there.  Are you feeling foolish about defending that idiot?
    it was clear from the get-go "idiot" was meant for Trump and not me. Your first mistake was assuming the CDC's budget had been "gutted" going back three years. It wasn't.  You were mistaken.

    Your second major error is assuming that pointing out your mistake was me defending Mr. Trump, who I neither voted for nor support today. I simply defend the facts which you keep taking issue with and posting silliness about Republicans and Democrats and OMG Right Wing!! as tho one party was created from the Angels and the other from demons and only one could know the truth.

    Relax. Read more. Check your facts before getting so worked up over something that wasn't true to begin with. If you have a question about a claim try a search engine. Any provider that pleases you and passes your smell test will do. You have choices beyond the most popular one. When you claim someone else is wrong and basing it all on "right-wing media" then try posting your own link that counters it. George B Mac saying so is hardly an authoritative source. Opinions are one thing, we all ahve em, but try avoiding fact twisting or,  it seems more commonly, complete ignorance of them to justify what you believe.

    The current threat from the corona virus is not a political one tied to one party much as you would keep posting it is. It crosses Party lines and some of the blame in reacting to it predates any Trump presidency. (why are there only two parties anyway? There certainly aren't just two political viewpoints)
    https://apnews.com/d36d6c4de29f4d04beda3db00cb46104

    LOL...  That's the problem!  Or, rather YOUR problem!   I do check facts -- the real ones rather than your right wing Alternative Versions.

    The right is SO very gullible.   Putin, Steve Bannon, Hannity, Trump, etc., etc., etc.,  lead you by the nose.n to their next agenda.
    Yet once again you don't have any links, not even one, to a site where we can check these "real facts rather than the right wing Alternative versions" for ourselves.  Apparently even the AP is too right-wing for your liking. So for a start could you give us just one site you consider a reliable and trustworthy source oh enlightened one. 
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