Apple releases 'major' update to Logic Pro X

13

Comments

  • Reply 41 of 64
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    VoodooCashew
  • Reply 42 of 64
    civaciva Posts: 78member
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    it’s not fault but your own, that you don’t understand how electronic music is MADE. 

    All of the new features Apple provided, including live loops, extends to the PRODUCTION of electronic music. 

    As was said before, Apple has no incentive to cater to just you, and all the incentive to move toward where the industry is going. 

    I know you’ve been avoiding me, since I first pointed this out, however avoidance doesn’t make you right, and it never will. 
    VoodooCashew
  • Reply 43 of 64
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    civa said:
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    it’s not fault but your own, that you don’t understand how electronic music is MADE. 

    All of the new features Apple provided, including live loops, extends to the PRODUCTION of electronic music. 

    As was said before, Apple has no incentive to cater to just you, and all the incentive to move toward where the industry is going. 

    I know you’ve been avoiding me, since I first pointed this out, however avoidance doesn’t make you right, and it never will. 
    I do know how electronic music is made. Musicians make it. DJs dont make music. They leverage and are dependent on the hard work of others.
    edited May 2020 VoodooCashew
  • Reply 44 of 64
    civaciva Posts: 78member
    civa said:
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    it’s not fault but your own, that you don’t understand how electronic music is MADE. 

    All of the new features Apple provided, including live loops, extends to the PRODUCTION of electronic music. 

    As was said before, Apple has no incentive to cater to just you, and all the incentive to move toward where the industry is going. 

    I know you’ve been avoiding me, since I first pointed this out, however avoidance doesn’t make you right, and it never will. 
    I do know how electronic music is made. Musicians make it. DJs dont make music. They leverage and are dependent on the hard work of others.
    Your comment trail speaks otherwise, as to the supposed depths of your knowledge. 
  • Reply 45 of 64
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    Dude, you have demonstrated you are out of touch and have no idea what you are actually talking about. No need to keep going with your tantrum and further prove the point. 
  • Reply 46 of 64
    kamiltonkamilton Posts: 281member
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    I’ve written and recorded superb songs.  Songs that are high, emotional art capable of touching people deeply.  I’m no apologist for poor quality music, like thin beats and mindless  raps.  .001% of the music produced today is worthy of respect.  Just because someone pooped and wants to show me, doesn’t mean I have to appreciate the poop.  
  • Reply 47 of 64
    kamilton said:
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    I’ve written and recorded superb songs.  Songs that are high, emotional art capable of touching people deeply.  I’m no apologist for poor quality music, like thin beats and mindless  raps.  .001% of the music produced today is worthy of respect.  Just because someone pooped and wants to show me, doesn’t mean I have to appreciate the poop.  
    And that "poor quality" music is actually resonating with millions of people on an emotional level and you are Apple Insider's resident music critic ... in the comments section.  Seriously though, no one is saying you have to appreciate it. Musical taste is subjective. Just because you don't like it doesn't make it bad. I'm not a fan of EDM, modern country or much of hip hop, doesn't mean I need to be critical of it. It's great that you like your music and you should be proud of it but your need to trash other peoples art in order to talk yourself up just sounds like bitter resentment because something you don't care for has more success. You and Grandpa Spam should have a joint pity party where you bemoan the fact that popular music isn't your thing. You two sound like you would get along great. 
    edited May 2020
  • Reply 48 of 64
    fahlmanfahlman Posts: 736member
    dysamoria said:
    None of my Macs support Mojave. They are already hacked to run unsupported High Sierra and can’t go further to Mojave.
    You're either a hobbyist who can't afford their hobby. Or a professional who doesn't charge enough, doesn't realize time is money, or both. If it's the former, I feel for you. I wish I could afford an expensive hobby, like fast cars or traveling the world. If it's the latter, charge more money and earn what you deserve.
    fastasleep
  • Reply 49 of 64
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 6,060member
    kamilton said:
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    I’ve written and recorded superb songs.  Songs that are high, emotional art capable of touching people deeply.  I’m no apologist for poor quality music, like thin beats and mindless  raps.  .001% of the music produced today is worthy of respect.  Just because someone pooped and wants to show me, doesn’t mean I have to appreciate the poop.  
    LOL please post links to your music so we can judge for ourselves. PLEASE.
  • Reply 50 of 64
    BeatsBeats Posts: 2,906member
    civa said:
    civa said:
    There’s nothing “professional” about the Live Loops function. It might be adequate for creating a scratch track, but it’s more a tool for amateurs and DJs.
    You can use your own midi in live loops, to work out sequences of parts, scenes, phrases, and ideas. 

    This tells me you’ve never used live loops, Ableton, or bitwig. 
    I used it in GarageBand and found it very limiting. But then again, I’m not a hack DJ.
    Aaaaaaand....you doubled down. Why am I not surprised? 
    Hilariously, Ableton sells more copies than logic, and most Ableton users are on a Mac. 

    That means that Apple, due to being able to see what’s on our machines, has noticed that even though logic is only $200, they are still having their butts handed to them by a program that almost $800. 



    Not true. We don't know who sells the most since they don't share numbers. This discussion goes on for ages. We have come to the conclusion that it is most likely as follows:

    1. Pro Tools
    2. Logic
    3. FL Studio
    4. Ableton
    edited May 2020
  • Reply 51 of 64
    civaciva Posts: 78member
    Beats said:
    civa said:
    civa said:
    There’s nothing “professional” about the Live Loops function. It might be adequate for creating a scratch track, but it’s more a tool for amateurs and DJs.
    You can use your own midi in live loops, to work out sequences of parts, scenes, phrases, and ideas. 

    This tells me you’ve never used live loops, Ableton, or bitwig. 
    I used it in GarageBand and found it very limiting. But then again, I’m not a hack DJ.
    Aaaaaaand....you doubled down. Why am I not surprised? 
    Hilariously, Ableton sells more copies than logic, and most Ableton users are on a Mac. 

    That means that Apple, due to being able to see what’s on our machines, has noticed that even though logic is only $200, they are still having their butts handed to them by a program that almost $800. 



    Not true. We don't know who sells the most since they don't share numbers. This discussion goes on for ages. We have come to the conclusion that it is most likely as follows:

    1. Pro Tools
    2. Logic
    3. FL Studio
    4. Ableton
    Your statement is absolutely not true. You attempted to use studio numbers, while I used actual users. 

    The real hierarchy is as follows: 

    1. Ableton 20.52% 
    2. Logic Pro 19.20% 
    3. ProTools 16.13%
    4. Cubase 10.43%
    5. FL Studio 6.40%
    7. Studio One 5.71%
    8. Reason 4.98% (probably why they drastically slashed their price) 
    9. Reaper 4.96% 
    10. Other 4.28%
    11. Sonar 3.01% 
    12. GarageBand 2.22% 
    13. Bitwig Studio 1.22% (I’m part of that number) 
    14. Digital Performer 0.94% 

    Of course you could also just look at YouTube and most other tutorial sites, and see they’re saturated more with Ableton than anything else, but I know that would be more difficult than taking the first results that come up in google for “best daws 2020” 
    fastasleep
  • Reply 52 of 64
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 6,060member
    civa said:
    Beats said:
    civa said:
    civa said:
    There’s nothing “professional” about the Live Loops function. It might be adequate for creating a scratch track, but it’s more a tool for amateurs and DJs.
    You can use your own midi in live loops, to work out sequences of parts, scenes, phrases, and ideas. 

    This tells me you’ve never used live loops, Ableton, or bitwig. 
    I used it in GarageBand and found it very limiting. But then again, I’m not a hack DJ.
    Aaaaaaand....you doubled down. Why am I not surprised? 
    Hilariously, Ableton sells more copies than logic, and most Ableton users are on a Mac. 

    That means that Apple, due to being able to see what’s on our machines, has noticed that even though logic is only $200, they are still having their butts handed to them by a program that almost $800. 



    Not true. We don't know who sells the most since they don't share numbers. This discussion goes on for ages. We have come to the conclusion that it is most likely as follows:

    1. Pro Tools
    2. Logic
    3. FL Studio
    4. Ableton
    Your statement is absolutely not true. You attempted to use studio numbers, while I used actual users. 

    The real hierarchy is as follows: 

    1. Ableton 20.52% 
    2. Logic Pro 19.20% 
    3. ProTools 16.13%
    4. Cubase 10.43%
    5. FL Studio 6.40%
    7. Studio One 5.71%
    8. Reason 4.98% (probably why they drastically slashed their price) 
    9. Reaper 4.96% 
    10. Other 4.28%
    11. Sonar 3.01% 
    12. GarageBand 2.22% 
    13. Bitwig Studio 1.22% (I’m part of that number) 
    14. Digital Performer 0.94% 

    Of course you could also just look at YouTube and most other tutorial sites, and see they’re saturated more with Ableton than anything else, but I know that would be more difficult than taking the first results that come up in google for “best daws 2020” 
    Interesting. I didn’t realize DP had fallen so far, that’s what I learned on in the 90’s. 
    civa
  • Reply 53 of 64
    sphericspheric Posts: 2,168member

    There’s nothing “professional” about the Live Loops function. It might be adequate for creating a scratch track, but it’s more a tool for amateurs and DJs.
    There are people who are professional DJs. 
    Disc spinning and sample cueing isn’t making music.
    Yay... we have found Grandpa Simpson. 


    To the contrary, DJs aren’t musicians. They’re technicians.
    I suggest you drop this shit now.

    If you're going to disparage collage artists for not being painters, you're going to be technically correct, but still a total idiot. 

    And if you think that someone who makes loop-based music isn't a real musician, then what the fuck are you doing with a DAW? Real artists play a single take straight to tape and don't need editing. 

    Now GTFO or hand the internet machine back to your nurse. 
    civa
  • Reply 54 of 64
    sphericspheric Posts: 2,168member
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    That has applied to pretty much every single musician since about Coltrane. 

    None of us do much of anything original anymore, because it's all been done. Music historians have pretty much reached an agreement that music history ended in around 2000, as every possible combination of sound, style, and technology had been turned into music by then. Everything else is just permutations of what has gone before. 

    You know what? I don't give a shit. 

    I make, create, play and program music to get stuff out there. I have a trio that just recorded a full album in two days, straight live takes. I've also just produced an EP that is heavily programmed, with some instruments played live. If you happen to not like either of them, that's okay. If you feel you need to assert your ego by denigrating stuff you obviously don't want to understand, that's pretty damn sad, but okay, too. 
    edited May 2020 civa
  • Reply 55 of 64
    sphericspheric Posts: 2,168member

    civa said:
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    it’s not fault but your own, that you don’t understand how electronic music is MADE. 

    All of the new features Apple provided, including live loops, extends to the PRODUCTION of electronic music. 

    As was said before, Apple has no incentive to cater to just you, and all the incentive to move toward where the industry is going. 

    I know you’ve been avoiding me, since I first pointed this out, however avoidance doesn’t make you right, and it never will. 
    I do know how electronic music is made. Musicians make it. DJs dont make music. They leverage and are dependent on the hard work of others.
    So… we're talking about Live Loops. 

    That's…not electronic music, because…? 

    and it's actually disk jockeying in what way…? 

    Also, you may want to meet some actual turntablists and DJ artists — especially those "DJ"s who produce their own music. They may have a revelation in store for you. 
    civa
  • Reply 56 of 64
    civaciva Posts: 78member
    spheric said:

    civa said:
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    it’s not fault but your own, that you don’t understand how electronic music is MADE. 

    All of the new features Apple provided, including live loops, extends to the PRODUCTION of electronic music. 

    As was said before, Apple has no incentive to cater to just you, and all the incentive to move toward where the industry is going. 

    I know you’ve been avoiding me, since I first pointed this out, however avoidance doesn’t make you right, and it never will. 
    I do know how electronic music is made. Musicians make it. DJs dont make music. They leverage and are dependent on the hard work of others.
    So… we're talking about Live Loops. 

    That's…not electronic music, because…? 

    and it's actually disk jockeying in what way…? 

    Also, you may want to meet some actual turntablists and DJ artists — especially those "DJ"s who produce their own music. They may have a revelation in store for you. 
    Thank you. 
    Your last line is the point I had been alluding toward, but didn’t want to come right out and say it, because I wanted to see how “knowledgeable” this guy really was. 

    The consensus is: not very. 
  • Reply 57 of 64
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    civa said:
    spheric said:

    civa said:
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    it’s not fault but your own, that you don’t understand how electronic music is MADE. 

    All of the new features Apple provided, including live loops, extends to the PRODUCTION of electronic music. 

    As was said before, Apple has no incentive to cater to just you, and all the incentive to move toward where the industry is going. 

    I know you’ve been avoiding me, since I first pointed this out, however avoidance doesn’t make you right, and it never will. 
    I do know how electronic music is made. Musicians make it. DJs dont make music. They leverage and are dependent on the hard work of others.
    So… we're talking about Live Loops. 

    That's…not electronic music, because…? 

    and it's actually disk jockeying in what way…? 

    Also, you may want to meet some actual turntablists and DJ artists — especially those "DJ"s who produce their own music. They may have a revelation in store for you. 
    Thank you. 
    Your last line is the point I had been alluding toward, but didn’t want to come right out and say it, because I wanted to see how “knowledgeable” this guy really was. 

    The consensus is: not very. 
    I get it. You’re a DJ. That’s still not producing music. That’s playing and editing music.
  • Reply 58 of 64
    civa said:
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    it’s not fault but your own, that you don’t understand how electronic music is MADE. 

    All of the new features Apple provided, including live loops, extends to the PRODUCTION of electronic music. 

    As was said before, Apple has no incentive to cater to just you, and all the incentive to move toward where the industry is going. 

    I know you’ve been avoiding me, since I first pointed this out, however avoidance doesn’t make you right, and it never will. 
    I do know how electronic music is made. Musicians make it. DJs dont make music. They leverage and are dependent on the hard work of others.

    civa said:
    spheric said:

    civa said:
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    it’s not fault but your own, that you don’t understand how electronic music is MADE. 

    All of the new features Apple provided, including live loops, extends to the PRODUCTION of electronic music. 

    As was said before, Apple has no incentive to cater to just you, and all the incentive to move toward where the industry is going. 

    I know you’ve been avoiding me, since I first pointed this out, however avoidance doesn’t make you right, and it never will. 
    I do know how electronic music is made. Musicians make it. DJs dont make music. They leverage and are dependent on the hard work of others.
    So… we're talking about Live Loops. 

    That's…not electronic music, because…? 

    and it's actually disk jockeying in what way…? 

    Also, you may want to meet some actual turntablists and DJ artists — especially those "DJ"s who produce their own music. They may have a revelation in store for you. 
    Thank you. 
    Your last line is the point I had been alluding toward, but didn’t want to come right out and say it, because I wanted to see how “knowledgeable” this guy really was. 

    The consensus is: not very. 
    I get it. You’re a DJ. That’s still not producing music. That’s playing and editing music.
    These comments lead me to believe you are unaware of how the term “DJ” has evolved to include people who are not doing the work of a traditional DJ, that is, someone who merely plays records. There are several well-known artists who call themselves DJs that make all of their own music and are not dependent on works created by others any more than other musicians are.

    My brother is a huge Toto fan and a drummer. I used to hear all about Jeff Porcaro, Toto’s drummer, while I was growing up. You may be familiar with the song “Rosanna”. Porcaro has said that his inspiration for the beat he used in that song came from drum beats created by others. Would you say that Jeff Porcaro was dependent on the hard work of others and thus not a real musician?
    civaspheric
  • Reply 59 of 64
    civaciva Posts: 78member
    civa said:
    spheric said:

    civa said:
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    it’s not fault but your own, that you don’t understand how electronic music is MADE. 

    All of the new features Apple provided, including live loops, extends to the PRODUCTION of electronic music. 

    As was said before, Apple has no incentive to cater to just you, and all the incentive to move toward where the industry is going. 

    I know you’ve been avoiding me, since I first pointed this out, however avoidance doesn’t make you right, and it never will. 
    I do know how electronic music is made. Musicians make it. DJs dont make music. They leverage and are dependent on the hard work of others.
    So… we're talking about Live Loops. 

    That's…not electronic music, because…? 

    and it's actually disk jockeying in what way…? 

    Also, you may want to meet some actual turntablists and DJ artists — especially those "DJ"s who produce their own music. They may have a revelation in store for you. 
    Thank you. 
    Your last line is the point I had been alluding toward, but didn’t want to come right out and say it, because I wanted to see how “knowledgeable” this guy really was. 

    The consensus is: not very. 
    I get it. You’re a DJ. That’s still not producing music. That’s playing and editing music.
    I produce, actually, as a hobby. 
    You clearly do nothing but attempt to troll things you don’t understand, and you’re not even adept at that. 
  • Reply 60 of 64
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    civa said:
    civa said:
    spheric said:

    civa said:
    kamilton said:
    Apple tries to fill the space between top shelf DAWs and Garage Band.  If you are actually playing instruments and recording tracks, Logic is adequate.  However, most of the resources and hardware demands have almost nothing to do with recording music musicians actually play.  Personally, I think that’s the wrong space to address.  It’s sizzle instead of value.  I have 3 albums on iTunes.  I record with Logic.  I play and record gifted musicians.  I don’t make beats from samples and yell over them.  IMO Apple should focus Logic on ease of use and industry standard sound quality.  We need to reproduce the sonic quality captured at EMI, Capital, Gold Star, Record Plant, Criterium, et al.  That would be worthy of the Apple ethos.  Come on now... sling that criticism!  
    I apprehend the point you were making until you said “I don’t make beats and yell over them” ..... You may not make beats but you are needlessly judgmental and condescending. In my experience musicians that have to crap on other peoples art are just compensating.  What you are missing is that what you want really isn’t where music is currently trending. Apple could focus on niche things like you want but that is a bit of a dead end. Instead they are focusing on enabling the creation of music that musicians are making and people want to hear.  As a guitar player I’m pretty happy with Logic and Main Stage and I accept that a huge chunk of Logic will never be geared to me but for the price it’s kinda hard to complain. Seven years of updates is pretty rad.
    DJs are basically editors and technicians. The product they make is called music, but they largely steal/borrow from the hard work of others before them. I know how their shtick works. It’s the business of thieves.
    it’s not fault but your own, that you don’t understand how electronic music is MADE. 

    All of the new features Apple provided, including live loops, extends to the PRODUCTION of electronic music. 

    As was said before, Apple has no incentive to cater to just you, and all the incentive to move toward where the industry is going. 

    I know you’ve been avoiding me, since I first pointed this out, however avoidance doesn’t make you right, and it never will. 
    I do know how electronic music is made. Musicians make it. DJs dont make music. They leverage and are dependent on the hard work of others.
    So… we're talking about Live Loops. 

    That's…not electronic music, because…? 

    and it's actually disk jockeying in what way…? 

    Also, you may want to meet some actual turntablists and DJ artists — especially those "DJ"s who produce their own music. They may have a revelation in store for you. 
    Thank you. 
    Your last line is the point I had been alluding toward, but didn’t want to come right out and say it, because I wanted to see how “knowledgeable” this guy really was. 

    The consensus is: not very. 
    I get it. You’re a DJ. That’s still not producing music. That’s playing and editing music.
    I produce, actually, as a hobby. 
    You clearly do nothing but attempt to troll things you don’t understand, and you’re not even adept at that. 
    Good for you. You’re already more accomplished than a DJ.
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