10.8-inch, 8.5-inch iPads will have 20W charger, iPhone 12 won't, says Ming-Chi Kuo

AppleInsider

In a note to investors about Apple's alleged removal of power adapters from the box of the iPhone 12, TF Securities analyst Ming-Chi Kuo has doubled down on claims two new iPad models are on the way, but crucially will include new 20-watt chargers.

In May, Ming-Chi Kuo offered a prediction that two new iPad models will be shipping in the next year, starting with a 10.8-inch iPad arriving in the second half of 2020. It will apparently be followed by a new iPad mini in the first half of 2021, with the May report suggesting a screen size upgrade to between 8.5 inches and 9 inches.

A new note to investors seen by AppleInsider reiterates those claims, further cementing Kuo's belief on the scheduling and sizes of the models. Furthermore, Kuo has narrowed down the size of the smaller, later model to an 8.5-inch display.

Kuo's comments are made amid other supply chain rumblings in June about iPads, including one report that latches on to the late-2020 scheduling for the 10.8-inch iPad and a new iPad mini. Another at the start of the month pointed to a change in the 10.8-inch replacement for the iPad Air that switches from Lightning to a USB-C connector, similar to the iPad Pro range.

The claims are made as part of a general conversation about what Apple could remove from the boxes of its most important products. According to Kuo, Apple will include a new 20-watt power adapter in the new iPad models, with the adapter said to be entering mass production in Q3 2020.

Existing 5-watt and 18-watt adapters will supposedly cease production in 2020, while the current 12-watt variant will end production "in 9-12 months."

As for what products will have chargers, Kuo expects the existing iPad lineup will continue to include in-box 12-watt power adapters until their end-of-life.

For the iPhone 12, Kuo reiterates a claim made in May that it will ship without EarPods, which will help boost sales of AirPods. At the same time, Apple is tipped to eliminate the in-box power adapter for the iPhone 12, as a cost-saving measure.

It is also unlikely Apple will replace the charger with a form of wireless charging system in the box, but Kuo reckons it will still help benefit wireless charger shipments in general, despite the power-transfer system still not being a "must-have" feature for consumers.

lkrupp

Can someone fill me in. When was the last time this guy was right about something? Isn't he the one that predicted an Apple branded HDTV for years? 

chaicka

Ming-Chi Kuo has been pretty accurate in the past prior to his move to TF. After the move, it is still relatively accurate though not as 'shining' as prior the move.

crowley

lkrupp said:

Can someone fill me in. When was the last time this guy was right about something? Isn't he the one that predicted an Apple branded HDTV for years? 

No.  That was Gene Munster.

macplusplus

Apple must provide the iPhone in working order, without the charger this is not possible. Otherwise they will face an avalanche of lawsuits all over the world. It is even relatively easy to pressure governments to prohibit the sale of phones without a charger, instead of proceeding to long and stressful lawsuits. 

The type of the charger may not be decided yet at this time, and that guy uses that to sneakily attack Apple.

edited June 2020

avon b7

macplusplus said:

Apple must provide the iPhone in working order, without the charger this is not possible. Otherwise they will face a cascade of lawsuits all over the world. It is even relatively easy to pressure governments to prohibit the sale of phones without a charger, as a shortcut to long and painful lawsuits. 

As long as the lack of charger is made clear during the order process there wouldn't be a problem. 

Plenty of devices ship without chargers already. 

The Oculus Go is one big name example. 

macplusplus

avon b7 said:

macplusplus said:

Apple must provide the iPhone in working order, without the charger this is not possible. Otherwise they will face a cascade of lawsuits all over the world. It is even relatively easy to pressure governments to prohibit the sale of phones without a charger, as a shortcut to long and painful lawsuits. 

As long as the lack of charger is made clear during the order process there wouldn't be a problem. 

Plenty of devices ship without chargers already. 

The Oculus Go is one big name example. 

OK but this is Apple, not Oculus that will be sued. China had imposed iPhones that charge without starting up, for example.

Besides, the lack of the charger during the order is a very weak argument for the seller. The courts will mostly ignore that and will judge on behalf of the consumer.

Furthermore, Apple is very strict regarding the use of original chargers. So the argument of providing 3d party options to the user will not help either, because the mandatory use of 3d party chargers then will incite a cascade of electrocutions and explosions, fraudulous or real.

There is only one situation Apple may not include the charger: if this is imposed by the law, namely the EU legislation that may require all smartphones to provide USB charging. Apple may easily comply with this by providing a USB to Lightning charging adapter for Lightning iPhones. Even in that case, the risk of fraudulous electrocution and explosion lawsuits may not go away for Apple.

edited June 2020

cheesefreeze

avon b7 said:

macplusplus said:

Apple must provide the iPhone in working order, without the charger this is not possible. Otherwise they will face a cascade of lawsuits all over the world. It is even relatively easy to pressure governments to prohibit the sale of phones without a charger, as a shortcut to long and painful lawsuits. 

As long as the lack of charger is made clear during the order process there wouldn't be a problem. 

Plenty of devices ship without chargers already. 

The Oculus Go is one big name example. 

The Oculus Go has been killed off. The Oculus Quest does ship with an adapter. 

goofy1958

Funny how Apple has already confirmed that it will ship a 20w charger, at least for the Pro models.

felix amyot

macplusplus said:

avon b7 said:

macplusplus said:

Apple must provide the iPhone in working order, without the charger this is not possible. Otherwise they will face a cascade of lawsuits all over the world. It is even relatively easy to pressure governments to prohibit the sale of phones without a charger, as a shortcut to long and painful lawsuits. 

As long as the lack of charger is made clear during the order process there wouldn't be a problem. 

Plenty of devices ship without chargers already. 

The Oculus Go is one big name example. 

OK but this is Apple, not Oculus that will be sued. China had imposed iPhones that charge without starting up, for example.

Besides, the lack of the charger during the order is a very weak argument for the seller. The courts will mostly ignore that and will judge on behalf of the consumer.

Furthermore, Apple is very strict regarding the use of original chargers. So the argument of providing 3d party options to the user will not help either, because the mandatory use of 3d party chargers then will incite a cascade of electrocutions and explosions, fraudulous or real.

There is only one situation Apple may not include the charger: if this is imposed by the law, namely the EU legislation that may require all smartphones to provide USB charging. Apple may easily comply with this by providing a USB to Lightning charging adapter for Lightning iPhones. Even in that case, the risk of fraudulous electrocution and explosion lawsuits may not go away for Apple.

Why could you sue someone ford ping what they said they would? If they announce no charger in box and deliver no charger in box, what do you want to sue about?

they would probably make the phones a bit cheaper and make sure that customers can purchase a charger on the spot if needed, as one can do now. 

If they ship iPhone with no EarPods and no charger, the package size gets cut in half if not more. The immense savings done in logistics can easily help mitigate any smaller margin made on chargers. 

Plus, everyone has a charger now. 

dangdave

In 2000 Europe put in place their standard for mobile phones which were: 1.) All chargers should be 5 volt USB-A, and 2.) All mobile phones should standardize with a micro-USB port. Europe was most concerned about the electronic waste of the chargers and presumably also wanted to eliminate chargers being purchased with each new mobile phone or other small devices. 

jdb8167

goofy1958 said:

Funny how Apple has already confirmed that it will ship a 20w charger, at least for the Pro models.

Nope. This is all "According to Kuo". In other words, all rumors.

litoloop

should be ready for the new mini when it does become available. i think the small size is suitable for consumption, but the close measurement to the large iphones could confuse consumers 😅

wonkothesane

I look at it from a win-win perspective: I guess some more margin for Apple and less yet-another-charger -/headphone set in my drawer. Oh, and less footprint as well, if you like. I’m good with this. 

bonobob

macplusplus said:

avon b7 said:

macplusplus said:

Apple must provide the iPhone in working order, without the charger this is not possible. Otherwise they will face a cascade of lawsuits all over the world. It is even relatively easy to pressure governments to prohibit the sale of phones without a charger, as a shortcut to long and painful lawsuits. 

As long as the lack of charger is made clear during the order process there wouldn't be a problem. 

Plenty of devices ship without chargers already. 

The Oculus Go is one big name example. 

OK but this is Apple, not Oculus that will be sued. China had imposed iPhones that charge without starting up, for example.

Besides, the lack of the charger during the order is a very weak argument for the seller. The courts will mostly ignore that and will judge on behalf of the consumer.

Furthermore, Apple is very strict regarding the use of original chargers. So the argument of providing 3d party options to the user will not help either, because the mandatory use of 3d party chargers then will incite a cascade of electrocutions and explosions, fraudulous or real.

There is only one situation Apple may not include the charger: if this is imposed by the law, namely the EU legislation that may require all smartphones to provide USB charging. Apple may easily comply with this by providing a USB to Lightning charging adapter for Lightning iPhones. Even in that case, the risk of fraudulous electrocution and explosion lawsuits may not go away for Apple.

There is already at least one situation where Apple does not include a charger.  The Apple Watch Series 3 GPS only model comes with no charger.  

peza

Hahahahahaha has all I can do is laugh at the idea Apple ditches its charger from a 1000 pounds iPhone to ‘cut costs’.. no this is nothing more the pure greed and price gouging and profiteer to keep those share holders happy, the higher that share price goes the more money personally the board makes as they own thousands of shares between them.
If the iPhone 12 keeps the lightning jack, how exactly does Apple expect to gain new customers from Android, can you imagine spending that much in your first iPhone only to find they charge you extra to buy an ‘optional charger’......

But this is a rumour.. at least they still use USB A on one end of the cable but your a bit out of luck if your moving from a USB C Android phone.

edited June 2020

chasm

macplusplus said:

Apple must provide the iPhone in working order, without the charger this is not possible. Otherwise they will face an avalanche of lawsuits all over the world. It is even relatively easy to pressure governments to prohibit the sale of phones without a charger, instead of proceeding to long and stressful lawsuits. 

The type of the charger may not be decided yet at this time, and that guy uses that to sneakily attack Apple.

(EDIT, I misread something from the quoted post)

Given that all iPhones are wireless charging, possibly Apple would include a Qi pad but not the charger for it (the way most of them are sold) or perhaps not include any charger whatsoever, and lower the price by $[whatever amount the charger by itself costs] so that you're not paying a penalty. This would prevent many tons of waste for those -- like me -- that already have a half-dozen eligible chargers around the house, so there's plenty of argument to be made in favour of leaving the charger out. Indeed, Apple might drive sales of the iPhone to the Apple Store by "bundling" the separate charger at a bit of a discount if you buy it all there.

If this report is true, I'd be more upset about the loss of the headphones in the box than the charger -- I think the Lightning EarPods are pretty good for what they are -- but of course YMMV. I've got spare iPhone chargers and spare Qi chargers, so I'm more than good.

edited June 2020

johnbsirius

I’d rather Apple not include the ubiquitous and outdated 5w power adapter... I already have six or seven+ of these in a drawer... along with four or five of the 10w and 12w iPad adapters. Almost every room in my house has at least one of those multi-usb charging bricks, which I admit is a luxury... but I may be a fringe case since my household has 10+ iPhones, iPads and Watches in total.

About the argument for folks switching from android? Don’t most of those phones come with an even better power adapter, and it’s not like companies ask you to include those when you trade-in... So less clutter overall for most people I suppose.

What people are missing is that Apple may forgo the power adapter, but they MUST include an appropriate charging cable, whether that’s lightning to USB-C or 

USB-A... I personally would be fine with that. I did really appreciate my 11 Pro Max being bundled with a 18w power adapter, but it doesn’t get regular use. 

jfc_pa

I’ll pass on all the pearls clutching. I’ve countless EarPods, chargers and cables. And I’d bet everyone posting here does as well. 

Giving people a choice is a good thing: cordless for some, high speed (cooking the battery) for some and slower with longer high battery performance for others. I’m in that last category btw. Haven’t Applecalrrady moved away from the five watt charger? My current iPhone didn’t ship with that, it had an 18w USB-C adapter. 

Hows this any different from “batteries NOT included”? It’s not. 

And it should nicely satisfy that EU charger  “waste” concern shouldn’t it. 

edited June 2020

bestkeptsecret

This seems a pretty implausible. The other rumour, that Apple will not include earphones, seems more likely. A charger is still an essential accessory for the iPhone and I am sceptical about this rumour that it will be excluded from the iPhones.

peza

Ok I’m going to step back a moment, I can understand the viewpoint this would save on electronic waste, however I’ve never known anyone to throw away a charger, mind you it would help if companies like Music Magpie here in the U.K. required you to send your charger and box to them, but they don’t want them and only require the phone thus you end up potentially with a charger and no phone, at least it’s USB.
some have been blaming the new EU rules requiring every device be USB charged, that seems to ignore the fact all iPhones are, maybe it has a lightning socket but it’s always used a USB plug on the other end. So I’m not sure that argument stands.

The issue is, if this is true then Apple must reduce the cost of the iPhone to suite or offer an optional charger for free. But knowing Apple they won’t do either of these and will become a joke offering a 1000 dollar or pounds phone with no charger, that costs extra..

We shall see though. Lots of fans seem pretty upset over this though.