Apple starts trial production of semitransparent lenses for AR devices

Posted:
in General Discussion
Polarized and semi-transparent lenses for "Apple Glass" have reportedly begun trial production runs at Apple supplier Foxconn.

Lenses are going to be among the most complex and critical components of
Lenses are going to be among the most complex and critical components of "Apple Glass"


Apple has reportedly entered trial production with Foxconn for the manufacture of lenses that are expected to be used in "Apple Glass." The lenses are critical to the use of augmented reality and ARkit, in how they will present computer-generated images to the wearer, alongside what that user can see of the real world.

According to The Information, the lenses are at least one to two years away from entering mass production, but they passed the prototype stage two months ago, and are now being manufactured for testing. This testing reportedly follows around three years of development work at Foxconn.

The Information notes that this timescale fits with when Apple bought lens startup firm Akonia Holographics. That company was using an LCD-on silicon display and proprietary lenses. However, it is not confirmed that this is the same technology being used in the new trial run.

Reportedly, the trial lenses are semi-transparent and polarized ones, made from multiple and extremely thin layers of various materials. The lenses have to be made in dust-free clean rooms and, according to The Information's unnamed sources, are slightly larger than ones typically found in spectacles.

Foxconn is believed to have turned over one production line at its plant in Chengdu, southwestern China, to the manufacturer of these lenses. This is the same plant where Foxconn is believed to produce the majority of Apple's iPads.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 39
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    A shame Apple isn’t producing these in the US. Expect whatever tech they’re using to be ripped off and used in $30 knockoffs in no time.
    lkruppJWSCgeorgie01flyingdpwatto_cobra
  • Reply 2 of 39
    JBSloughJBSlough Posts: 92member
    I hope to hell this tech is transferable to prescription glasses. I want this. 
    marc gwatto_cobra
  • Reply 3 of 39
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,822member
    JBSlough said:
    I hope to hell this tech is transferable to prescription glasses. I want this. 
    Didn't Apple already state it would be at extra cost, or was that a rumor?
    edited July 2020 watto_cobra
  • Reply 4 of 39
    XedXed Posts: 2,855member
    MacPro said:
    JBSlough said:
    I hope to hell this tech is transferable to prescription glasses. I want this. 
    Didn't Apple already state it would be at extra cost, or was that a rumor?
    Everything with these glasses is a rumour at this point.
    lkrupprandominternetpersonthtbageljoeyGeorgeBMacmarc gwatto_cobra
  • Reply 5 of 39
    "1 or 2 years" away seems very conservative if they at this stage of production testing.  But I suppose "sometime in 2021 they will have a shipping product" aligns with that timeline.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 6 of 39
    JWSCJWSC Posts: 1,203member

    It is disconcerting that Apple continues to chose to outsource the prototyping of what will be state-of-the-art products to a company that will manufacture in mainland China.  National security and technology transfer to an increasingly authoritarian regime do not appear to be on Apple’s radar.

    Perhaps I wouldn’t be so bothered if China did not represent an increasing threat to the direction of technology development and the rise of the surveillance state.

    The fortunes of Apple are already deeply intertwined with mainland China, which ought to be troubling enough for a company so keen on promoting human rights and equality.  Why is Apple continuing to forge new and deeper dependencies with mainland China?

    I think Tim Cook owes his loyal customers an answer.

    h4y3sSpamSandwichgeorgie01Beats
  • Reply 7 of 39
    h4y3sh4y3s Posts: 85member
    Personally, I can’t wait to get my iGlasses!
    Beatsmarc gwatto_cobra
  • Reply 8 of 39
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 24,627member
    MacPro said:
    JBSlough said:
    I hope to hell this tech is transferable to prescription glasses. I want this. 
    Didn't Apple already state it would be at extra cost, or was that a rumor?
    It was definitely a rumor, tho a patent filing (not issue) was true.
    edited July 2020
  • Reply 9 of 39
    georgie01georgie01 Posts: 437member
    JWSC said:

    It is disconcerting that Apple continues to chose to outsource the prototyping of what will be state-of-the-art products to a company that will manufacture in mainland China.  National security and technology transfer to an increasingly authoritarian regime do not appear to be on Apple’s radar.

    Perhaps I wouldn’t be so bothered if China did not represent an increasing threat to the direction of technology development and the rise of the surveillance state.

    The fortunes of Apple are already deeply intertwined with mainland China, which ought to be troubling enough for a company so keen on promoting human rights and equality.  Why is Apple continuing to forge new and deeper dependencies with mainland China?

    I think Tim Cook owes his loyal customers an answer.

    Yes, it is concerning that a certain political leaning has been defending China when they so clearly do not have anyone interests in mind but their own and will steal and cheat and lie to accomplish their own goals. China is a clear threat.
  • Reply 10 of 39
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 6,452member
    JWSC said:

    It is disconcerting that Apple continues to chose to outsource the prototyping of what will be state-of-the-art products to a company that will manufacture in mainland China.  National security and technology transfer to an increasingly authoritarian regime do not appear to be on Apple’s radar.

    Perhaps I wouldn’t be so bothered if China did not represent an increasing threat to the direction of technology development and the rise of the surveillance state.

    The fortunes of Apple are already deeply intertwined with mainland China, which ought to be troubling enough for a company so keen on promoting human rights and equality.  Why is Apple continuing to forge new and deeper dependencies with mainland China?

    I think Tim Cook owes his loyal customers an answer.

    You know Apple isn't the only company manufacturing AR glasses, right? There are several brands on the market already, probably most if not all manufactured in China. 

    Cook doesn't owe you shit. We all know why — because that's where the manufacturing infrastructure is.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 11 of 39
    JWSCJWSC Posts: 1,203member
    JWSC said:

    It is disconcerting that Apple continues to chose to outsource the prototyping of what will be state-of-the-art products to a company that will manufacture in mainland China.  National security and technology transfer to an increasingly authoritarian regime do not appear to be on Apple’s radar.

    Perhaps I wouldn’t be so bothered if China did not represent an increasing threat to the direction of technology development and the rise of the surveillance state.

    The fortunes of Apple are already deeply intertwined with mainland China, which ought to be troubling enough for a company so keen on promoting human rights and equality.  Why is Apple continuing to forge new and deeper dependencies with mainland China?

    I think Tim Cook owes his loyal customers an answer.

    You know Apple isn't the only company manufacturing AR glasses, right? There are several brands on the market already, probably most if not all manufactured in China. 

    Cook doesn't owe you shit. We all know why — because that's where the manufacturing infrastructure is.
    No one needs reminding that years ago the US had a massive manufacturing infrastructure, before it was hollowed out by American CEOs seeking quarterly profits to increase their near term stock value and their own pocketbooks. It can be reversed.

    But as I said, I wouldn’t be so concerned if the behavior of the mainland Chinese government was more benign. I’m not opposed to US companies manufacturing overseas. They will have to if they want access to most local markets. But the Chinese government hasn’t been behaving well on many fronts. Apple needs to pivot away from them to some degree. Moving manufacturing to India and other nations would be prudent at this time.
  • Reply 12 of 39
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 6,452member
    JWSC said:
    JWSC said:

    It is disconcerting that Apple continues to chose to outsource the prototyping of what will be state-of-the-art products to a company that will manufacture in mainland China.  National security and technology transfer to an increasingly authoritarian regime do not appear to be on Apple’s radar.

    Perhaps I wouldn’t be so bothered if China did not represent an increasing threat to the direction of technology development and the rise of the surveillance state.

    The fortunes of Apple are already deeply intertwined with mainland China, which ought to be troubling enough for a company so keen on promoting human rights and equality.  Why is Apple continuing to forge new and deeper dependencies with mainland China?

    I think Tim Cook owes his loyal customers an answer.

    You know Apple isn't the only company manufacturing AR glasses, right? There are several brands on the market already, probably most if not all manufactured in China. 

    Cook doesn't owe you shit. We all know why — because that's where the manufacturing infrastructure is.
    No one needs reminding that years ago the US had a massive manufacturing infrastructure, before it was hollowed out by American CEOs seeking quarterly profits to increase their near term stock value and their own pocketbooks. It can be reversed.

    But as I said, I wouldn’t be so concerned if the behavior of the mainland Chinese government was more benign. I’m not opposed to US companies manufacturing overseas. They will have to if they want access to most local markets. But the Chinese government hasn’t been behaving well on many fronts. Apple needs to pivot away from them to some degree. Moving manufacturing to India and other nations would be prudent at this time.
    As far as moving manufacturing on this scale to the US, way easier said than done. And they are moving manufacturing to India and other nations.

    https://appleinsider.com/articles/20/07/10/apples-reportedly-pushes-foxconn-to-invest-1b-to-expand-iphone-manufacturing-in-india
  • Reply 13 of 39
    JWSCJWSC Posts: 1,203member
    JWSC said:
    JWSC said:

    It is disconcerting that Apple continues to chose to outsource the prototyping of what will be state-of-the-art products to a company that will manufacture in mainland China.  National security and technology transfer to an increasingly authoritarian regime do not appear to be on Apple’s radar.

    Perhaps I wouldn’t be so bothered if China did not represent an increasing threat to the direction of technology development and the rise of the surveillance state.

    The fortunes of Apple are already deeply intertwined with mainland China, which ought to be troubling enough for a company so keen on promoting human rights and equality.  Why is Apple continuing to forge new and deeper dependencies with mainland China?

    I think Tim Cook owes his loyal customers an answer.

    You know Apple isn't the only company manufacturing AR glasses, right? There are several brands on the market already, probably most if not all manufactured in China. 

    Cook doesn't owe you shit. We all know why — because that's where the manufacturing infrastructure is.
    No one needs reminding that years ago the US had a massive manufacturing infrastructure, before it was hollowed out by American CEOs seeking quarterly profits to increase their near term stock value and their own pocketbooks. It can be reversed.

    But as I said, I wouldn’t be so concerned if the behavior of the mainland Chinese government was more benign. I’m not opposed to US companies manufacturing overseas. They will have to if they want access to most local markets. But the Chinese government hasn’t been behaving well on many fronts. Apple needs to pivot away from them to some degree. Moving manufacturing to India and other nations would be prudent at this time.
    As far as moving manufacturing on this scale to the US, way easier said than done. And they are moving manufacturing to India and other nations.

    https://appleinsider.com/articles/20/07/10/apples-reportedly-pushes-foxconn-to-invest-1b-to-expand-iphone-manufacturing-in-india
    So genius, tell me how easy it was to move manufacturing to China under Deng Xiaoping starting in the early ‘80s, when China had zero infrastructure to begin with? If they coyuld do that, I struggle to see why the reverse could not happen.

    BTW, you’re flippant answer about Tim Cook not owing us shit for an explanation betrays an unsettling lack of concern for our national security and China’s poor behaviors on the world stage. Maybe you don’t think those things are important.  But many people do.
    SpamSandwichcanukstormne1marc g
  • Reply 14 of 39
    mr lizardmr lizard Posts: 354member
    JWSC said:

    It is disconcerting that Apple continues to chose to outsource the prototyping of what will be state-of-the-art products to a company that will manufacture in mainland China.  National security and technology transfer to an increasingly authoritarian regime do not appear to be on Apple’s radar.

    Perhaps I wouldn’t be so bothered if China did not represent an increasing threat to the direction of technology development and the rise of the surveillance state.

    The fortunes of Apple are already deeply intertwined with mainland China, which ought to be troubling enough for a company so keen on promoting human rights and equality.  Why is Apple continuing to forge new and deeper dependencies with mainland China?

    I think Tim Cook owes his loyal customers an answer.

    You could replace “China” with “United States” and your post would still be valid. 
    GeorgeBMacRayz2016samrod
  • Reply 15 of 39
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,822member
    Tangential to AR and so on but I wonder how far off glasses that can autofocus on what you are looking at are away. If anyone could do it it would be Apple perhaps in partnership with Sony.  My Sony Alpha's AF is pretty amazing. Obviously this would require a paradigm shift in lens construction whereby the actual glass properties are altered by electronics.  I am not suggesting a six inch zoom lens lol.
    edited July 2020 marc g
  • Reply 16 of 39
    MplsPMplsP Posts: 4,015member
    MacPro said:
    Tangential to AR and so on but I wonder how far off glasses that can autofocus on what you are looking at are away. If anyone could do it it would be Apple perhaps in partnership with Sony.  My Sony Alpha's AF is pretty amazing. Obviously this would require a paradigm shift in lens construction whereby the actual glass properties are altered by electronics.  I am not suggesting a six inch zoom lens lol.
    All the technologies I’m aware of change the focal length by moving the lens(es). The human eye has the remarkable ability to adjust the shape of the lens to change the focal distance. (As we age the lens becomes less flexible and the ability to focus on close objects is lost, thus the need for bifocals.) It would be cool but I can’t think of a way for optical lenses such as these to accommodate in the way you are suggesting.
  • Reply 17 of 39
    MplsP said:
    MacPro said:
    Tangential to AR and so on but I wonder how far off glasses that can autofocus on what you are looking at are away. If anyone could do it it would be Apple perhaps in partnership with Sony.  My Sony Alpha's AF is pretty amazing. Obviously this would require a paradigm shift in lens construction whereby the actual glass properties are altered by electronics.  I am not suggesting a six inch zoom lens lol.
    All the technologies I’m aware of change the focal length by moving the lens(es). The human eye has the remarkable ability to adjust the shape of the lens to change the focal distance. (As we age the lens becomes less flexible and the ability to focus on close objects is lost, thus the need for bifocals.) It would be cool but I can’t think of a way for optical lenses such as these to accommodate in the way you are suggesting.
    To quote a recent comment i made on May 25th in the AI article “Latest leak has ‘sleek’ Apple Glasses coming out in 2021 instead of 2022”:
    Yes, if they had cameras they could …and today I would even add “quite easily”.
  • Reply 18 of 39
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,822member
    MplsP said:
    MacPro said:
    Tangential to AR and so on but I wonder how far off glasses that can autofocus on what you are looking at are away. If anyone could do it it would be Apple perhaps in partnership with Sony.  My Sony Alpha's AF is pretty amazing. Obviously this would require a paradigm shift in lens construction whereby the actual glass properties are altered by electronics.  I am not suggesting a six inch zoom lens lol.
    All the technologies I’m aware of change the focal length by moving the lens(es). The human eye has the remarkable ability to adjust the shape of the lens to change the focal distance. (As we age the lens becomes less flexible and the ability to focus on close objects is lost, thus the need for bifocals.) It would be cool but I can’t think of a way for optical lenses such as these to accommodate in the way you are suggesting.
    To quote a recent comment i made on May 25th in the AI article “Latest leak has ‘sleek’ Apple Glasses coming out in 2021 instead of 2022”:
    Yes, if they had cameras they could …and today I would even add “quite easily”.
    I am willing to bet it will come about one day not too far off.  Phase shift could be accomplished with two lenses communicating and focal length by emulating the way the human eye lens works, i.e. changing shape.
  • Reply 19 of 39
    thttht Posts: 5,659member
    Anyone have any details on how the AR glasses will work? How will digital images appear to your eyeballs?

    Some the patents have a projector mounted by your temples that projects the images onto a lens surface. As such, there needs to be an opaque enough surface to reflect the projected images for your eyes to see, yet, has to be transparent enough to see the physical world in front of you. There would seem to be a rather gigantic compromise between image quality and transparency that needs to be made. Ideally, I want to have it good enough for the projected image to be like a video or a display monitor. Probably multiple iterations of the product before something like this is possible.

    Anyone other there know anything about transparent films, how they can reflect light? What type of color rendition the reflected light would be? There are multiple implementations in heads-up displays for cars (and airplanes). So, all that needs to be miniaturized and vastly improved in terms of image performance.
  • Reply 20 of 39
    MplsPMplsP Posts: 4,015member
    MplsP said:
    MacPro said:
    Tangential to AR and so on but I wonder how far off glasses that can autofocus on what you are looking at are away. If anyone could do it it would be Apple perhaps in partnership with Sony.  My Sony Alpha's AF is pretty amazing. Obviously this would require a paradigm shift in lens construction whereby the actual glass properties are altered by electronics.  I am not suggesting a six inch zoom lens lol.
    All the technologies I’m aware of change the focal length by moving the lens(es). The human eye has the remarkable ability to adjust the shape of the lens to change the focal distance. (As we age the lens becomes less flexible and the ability to focus on close objects is lost, thus the need for bifocals.) It would be cool but I can’t think of a way for optical lenses such as these to accommodate in the way you are suggesting.
    To quote a recent comment i made on May 25th in the AI article “Latest leak has ‘sleek’ Apple Glasses coming out in 2021 instead of 2022”:
    Yes, if they had cameras they could …and today I would even add “quite easily”.
    You are talking about a fundamentally different technology and approach: A camera that transmits an image to a screen vs a lens that refracts and focuses light. This article talks about lenses that also have an ability to superimpose an image. For this to work, the image your eyes see via the lens needs to be in focus. Using a camera to transmit an image would be tantamount to a VR headset showing you what you’re looking at.
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