HomePod family will support Apple Music Lossless eventually

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 33
    elijahgelijahg Posts: 2,788member
    danox said:
    Japhey said:
    AppleZulu said:
    It’s a typo, I’m sure, but on the linked Apple support page, under “How to listen to lossless on your Apple TV 4K,” it says you should first “update your Apple TV 4K to tvOS 11.4.”

    We’ve had lossless for years and didn’t even know it!
    This has just been a spectacular own-goal from Apple from the jump. The Bluetooth lack of support for Apple Music Lossless wasn't a giant surprise, but the messaging surrounding it all has been replete with holes, wrong information, and modifications for the last five days.
    An “own-goal” is a great way to put it. Some of Apple’s moves the last few months have defied logic. I mean, why even announce lossless until it was supported by the audio lineup? I don’t own a HomePod, but if I did I would be pretty pissed off right now. I’m really hoping WWDC will bring some unexpected new hardware announcements that will make sense of these seemingly erratic decisions. 

    The HomePod having wired in and out audio connections would have made all the difference (future proofed it), a great many more people would have bought the HomePod.
    You might want to double-check your comprehension of the concept of "future-proofing". Just as a hint, it does not involve integrating more legacy support for technologies that will be used less and less in the future.
    Only analog audio will never go away, because we as humans can only hear analog audio, not digital. The 3.5" jacks will always be present in the future for things like headphones, especially because they're good enough for 99% of the population to listen to music with. So yes, that would have been future proofing. Moreover, Airplay will eventually be abandoned, 802.11ac will become legacy, Apple Music will drop support for HomePods, and the Home app will no longer be able configure HomePods; much like the Airport configuration utility doesn't work for older Airport base stations. Then it won't be possible to play anything on HomePods at all. But with an analog connector, connecting to a HP would always be possible from almost any device, without having to deal with compatibility issues and the whims of Apple's software teams. 
    edited May 2021 avon b7spock1234muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 22 of 33
    mikethemartianmikethemartian Posts: 1,428member
    You might want to double-check your comprehension of the concept of "future-proofing". Just as a hint, it does not involve integrating more legacy support for technologies that will be used less and less in the future.
    That old fashioned “obsolete” analog 3.5mm plug isn’t the cause of the bottleneck here. It will still be around long after people remember what an iPhone is.
    williamlondonelijahgZeebler
  • Reply 23 of 33
    ZeeblerZeebler Posts: 19member
    A quick refresher...

    2017:  - "HomePod is going to do to audio what the iPhone did to smartphones"
               - "Audiophiles are going to dump their $50,000 systems for one of these"
               - "I was at the Apple Store and an Audiophile said it was best thing he has ever heard"
               - "Apple is going to take over home-audio with these"
               - "Apple is going to destroy Google and Amazon with the HomePod"

    2021:  - "I hope my discontinued product can play cd quality music files one day..."
    crowley
  • Reply 24 of 33
    thedbathedba Posts: 771member
    Zeebler said:
    A quick refresher...

    2017:  - "HomePod is going to do to audio what the iPhone did to smartphones"
               - "Audiophiles are going to dump their $50,000 systems for one of these"
               - "I was at the Apple Store and an Audiophile said it was best thing he has ever heard"
               - "Apple is going to take over home-audio with these"
               - "Apple is going to destroy Google and Amazon with the HomePod"

    2021:  - "I hope my discontinued product can play cd quality music files one day..."
    Maybe giving us some links on who made those claims, would be helpful. 
    jahblade
  • Reply 25 of 33
    thedbathedba Posts: 771member
    elijahg said:
    danox said:
    Japhey said:
    AppleZulu said:
    It’s a typo, I’m sure, but on the linked Apple support page, under “How to listen to lossless on your Apple TV 4K,” it says you should first “update your Apple TV 4K to tvOS 11.4.”

    We’ve had lossless for years and didn’t even know it!
    This has just been a spectacular own-goal from Apple from the jump. The Bluetooth lack of support for Apple Music Lossless wasn't a giant surprise, but the messaging surrounding it all has been replete with holes, wrong information, and modifications for the last five days.
    An “own-goal” is a great way to put it. Some of Apple’s moves the last few months have defied logic. I mean, why even announce lossless until it was supported by the audio lineup? I don’t own a HomePod, but if I did I would be pretty pissed off right now. I’m really hoping WWDC will bring some unexpected new hardware announcements that will make sense of these seemingly erratic decisions. 

    The HomePod having wired in and out audio connections would have made all the difference (future proofed it), a great many more people would have bought the HomePod.
    You might want to double-check your comprehension of the concept of "future-proofing". Just as a hint, it does not involve integrating more legacy support for technologies that will be used less and less in the future.
    Only analog audio will never go away, because we as humans can only hear analog audio, not digital. The 3.5" jacks will always be present in the future for things like headphones, especially because they're good enough for 99% of the population to listen to music with. So yes, that would have been future proofing. Moreover, Airplay will eventually be abandoned, 802.11ac will become legacy, Apple Music will drop support for HomePods, and the Home app will no longer be able configure HomePods; much like the Airport configuration utility doesn't work for older Airport base stations. Then it won't be possible to play anything on HomePods at all. But with an analog connector, connecting to a HP would always be possible from almost any device, without having to deal with compatibility issues and the whims of Apple's software teams. 
    The reason why the HomePod does not have an Aux input jack is because it would probably sound like crap. 
    The power of HomePod and speakers like the more modern Sonos line, is in computational audio. Read the room and adjust accordingly. 

    williamlondonjahblade
  • Reply 26 of 33
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member
    thedba said:
    elijahg said:
    danox said:
    Japhey said:
    AppleZulu said:
    It’s a typo, I’m sure, but on the linked Apple support page, under “How to listen to lossless on your Apple TV 4K,” it says you should first “update your Apple TV 4K to tvOS 11.4.”

    We’ve had lossless for years and didn’t even know it!
    This has just been a spectacular own-goal from Apple from the jump. The Bluetooth lack of support for Apple Music Lossless wasn't a giant surprise, but the messaging surrounding it all has been replete with holes, wrong information, and modifications for the last five days.
    An “own-goal” is a great way to put it. Some of Apple’s moves the last few months have defied logic. I mean, why even announce lossless until it was supported by the audio lineup? I don’t own a HomePod, but if I did I would be pretty pissed off right now. I’m really hoping WWDC will bring some unexpected new hardware announcements that will make sense of these seemingly erratic decisions. 

    The HomePod having wired in and out audio connections would have made all the difference (future proofed it), a great many more people would have bought the HomePod.
    You might want to double-check your comprehension of the concept of "future-proofing". Just as a hint, it does not involve integrating more legacy support for technologies that will be used less and less in the future.
    Only analog audio will never go away, because we as humans can only hear analog audio, not digital. The 3.5" jacks will always be present in the future for things like headphones, especially because they're good enough for 99% of the population to listen to music with. So yes, that would have been future proofing. Moreover, Airplay will eventually be abandoned, 802.11ac will become legacy, Apple Music will drop support for HomePods, and the Home app will no longer be able configure HomePods; much like the Airport configuration utility doesn't work for older Airport base stations. Then it won't be possible to play anything on HomePods at all. But with an analog connector, connecting to a HP would always be possible from almost any device, without having to deal with compatibility issues and the whims of Apple's software teams. 
    The reason why the HomePod does not have an Aux input jack is because it would probably sound like crap. 
    The power of HomePod and speakers like the more modern Sonos line, is in computational audio. Read the room and adjust accordingly. 
    Why would an aux input sound like crap?  Other speaker systems manage just fine, why can't Apple's?
    muthuk_vanalingamZeebler
  • Reply 27 of 33
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member
    thedba said:
    Zeebler said:
    A quick refresher...

    2017:  - "HomePod is going to do to audio what the iPhone did to smartphones"
               - "Audiophiles are going to dump their $50,000 systems for one of these"
               - "I was at the Apple Store and an Audiophile said it was best thing he has ever heard"
               - "Apple is going to take over home-audio with these"
               - "Apple is going to destroy Google and Amazon with the HomePod"

    2021:  - "I hope my discontinued product can play cd quality music files one day..."
    Maybe giving us some links on who made those claims, would be helpful. 
    It's a joke, not a legal citation.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 28 of 33
    thedbathedba Posts: 771member
    crowley said:
    thedba said:
    elijahg said:
    danox said:
    Japhey said:
    AppleZulu said:
    It’s a typo, I’m sure, but on the linked Apple support page, under “How to listen to lossless on your Apple TV 4K,” it says you should first “update your Apple TV 4K to tvOS 11.4.”

    We’ve had lossless for years and didn’t even know it!
    This has just been a spectacular own-goal from Apple from the jump. The Bluetooth lack of support for Apple Music Lossless wasn't a giant surprise, but the messaging surrounding it all has been replete with holes, wrong information, and modifications for the last five days.
    An “own-goal” is a great way to put it. Some of Apple’s moves the last few months have defied logic. I mean, why even announce lossless until it was supported by the audio lineup? I don’t own a HomePod, but if I did I would be pretty pissed off right now. I’m really hoping WWDC will bring some unexpected new hardware announcements that will make sense of these seemingly erratic decisions. 

    The HomePod having wired in and out audio connections would have made all the difference (future proofed it), a great many more people would have bought the HomePod.
    You might want to double-check your comprehension of the concept of "future-proofing". Just as a hint, it does not involve integrating more legacy support for technologies that will be used less and less in the future.
    Only analog audio will never go away, because we as humans can only hear analog audio, not digital. The 3.5" jacks will always be present in the future for things like headphones, especially because they're good enough for 99% of the population to listen to music with. So yes, that would have been future proofing. Moreover, Airplay will eventually be abandoned, 802.11ac will become legacy, Apple Music will drop support for HomePods, and the Home app will no longer be able configure HomePods; much like the Airport configuration utility doesn't work for older Airport base stations. Then it won't be possible to play anything on HomePods at all. But with an analog connector, connecting to a HP would always be possible from almost any device, without having to deal with compatibility issues and the whims of Apple's software teams. 
    The reason why the HomePod does not have an Aux input jack is because it would probably sound like crap. 
    The power of HomePod and speakers like the more modern Sonos line, is in computational audio. Read the room and adjust accordingly. 
    Why would an aux input sound like crap?  Other speaker systems manage just fine, why can't Apple's?
    Because once you pump in the already processed analog signal, which speaker inside of the HomePod would do what? Other than a woofer tweeter breakdown what would the speakers encircling the device do? Pump out all the same sound? Definitely not meant to function like that. 
    Think of plugging in your iPhone to a car’s audio jack. What does that sound like in your car’s audio system?
    Now connect same iPhone to car’s Apple CarPlay system. I’m willing to bet the latter sounds much better. 
    williamlondon
  • Reply 29 of 33
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 7,884member
    thedba said:
    crowley said:
    thedba said:
    elijahg said:
    danox said:
    Japhey said:
    AppleZulu said:
    It’s a typo, I’m sure, but on the linked Apple support page, under “How to listen to lossless on your Apple TV 4K,” it says you should first “update your Apple TV 4K to tvOS 11.4.”

    We’ve had lossless for years and didn’t even know it!
    This has just been a spectacular own-goal from Apple from the jump. The Bluetooth lack of support for Apple Music Lossless wasn't a giant surprise, but the messaging surrounding it all has been replete with holes, wrong information, and modifications for the last five days.
    An “own-goal” is a great way to put it. Some of Apple’s moves the last few months have defied logic. I mean, why even announce lossless until it was supported by the audio lineup? I don’t own a HomePod, but if I did I would be pretty pissed off right now. I’m really hoping WWDC will bring some unexpected new hardware announcements that will make sense of these seemingly erratic decisions. 

    The HomePod having wired in and out audio connections would have made all the difference (future proofed it), a great many more people would have bought the HomePod.
    You might want to double-check your comprehension of the concept of "future-proofing". Just as a hint, it does not involve integrating more legacy support for technologies that will be used less and less in the future.
    Only analog audio will never go away, because we as humans can only hear analog audio, not digital. The 3.5" jacks will always be present in the future for things like headphones, especially because they're good enough for 99% of the population to listen to music with. So yes, that would have been future proofing. Moreover, Airplay will eventually be abandoned, 802.11ac will become legacy, Apple Music will drop support for HomePods, and the Home app will no longer be able configure HomePods; much like the Airport configuration utility doesn't work for older Airport base stations. Then it won't be possible to play anything on HomePods at all. But with an analog connector, connecting to a HP would always be possible from almost any device, without having to deal with compatibility issues and the whims of Apple's software teams. 
    The reason why the HomePod does not have an Aux input jack is because it would probably sound like crap. 
    The power of HomePod and speakers like the more modern Sonos line, is in computational audio. Read the room and adjust accordingly. 
    Why would an aux input sound like crap?  Other speaker systems manage just fine, why can't Apple's?
    Because once you pump in the already processed analog signal, which speaker inside of the HomePod would do what? Other than a woofer tweeter breakdown what would the speakers encircling the device do? Pump out all the same sound? Definitely not meant to function like that. 
    Think of plugging in your iPhone to a car’s audio jack. What does that sound like in your car’s audio system?
    Now connect same iPhone to car’s Apple CarPlay system. I’m willing to bet the latter sounds much better. 
    I don't see why that would make them sound like crap.

    I don't have a HomePod but an AUX port would have been a great option, especially when it fell from front line action in the home. It would also have kept the unit going long beyond software support was dropped.

    At worst it would probably sound like my JBL Charge, which sounds great. 
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 30 of 33
    doggonedoggone Posts: 386member
    Devices like the HomePod that connect via Wifi should be able to play lossless.  It just a question of a software update to enable the ability.  

    I still don't get how Apple didn't have at least one dedicated sound device be able to play lossless.  Fair point on the limitations of bluetooth but not getting the HomePods up to snuff prior to the release was a bit dumb. Advertising that the iPhone can play lossless is laughable given how tinny the speakers are.

    It sounds to me that Apple wanted to beat the competition to the punch and rush out the service as a result.
    williamlondon
  • Reply 31 of 33
    ZeeblerZeebler Posts: 19member
    thedba said:
    crowley said:
    thedba said:
    elijahg said:
    danox said:
    Japhey said:
    AppleZulu said:
    It’s a typo, I’m sure, but on the linked Apple support page, under “How to listen to lossless on your Apple TV 4K,” it says you should first “update your Apple TV 4K to tvOS 11.4.”

    We’ve had lossless for years and didn’t even know it!
    This has just been a spectacular own-goal from Apple from the jump. The Bluetooth lack of support for Apple Music Lossless wasn't a giant surprise, but the messaging surrounding it all has been replete with holes, wrong information, and modifications for the last five days.
    An “own-goal” is a great way to put it. Some of Apple’s moves the last few months have defied logic. I mean, why even announce lossless until it was supported by the audio lineup? I don’t own a HomePod, but if I did I would be pretty pissed off right now. I’m really hoping WWDC will bring some unexpected new hardware announcements that will make sense of these seemingly erratic decisions. 

    The HomePod having wired in and out audio connections would have made all the difference (future proofed it), a great many more people would have bought the HomePod.
    You might want to double-check your comprehension of the concept of "future-proofing". Just as a hint, it does not involve integrating more legacy support for technologies that will be used less and less in the future.
    Only analog audio will never go away, because we as humans can only hear analog audio, not digital. The 3.5" jacks will always be present in the future for things like headphones, especially because they're good enough for 99% of the population to listen to music with. So yes, that would have been future proofing. Moreover, Airplay will eventually be abandoned, 802.11ac will become legacy, Apple Music will drop support for HomePods, and the Home app will no longer be able configure HomePods; much like the Airport configuration utility doesn't work for older Airport base stations. Then it won't be possible to play anything on HomePods at all. But with an analog connector, connecting to a HP would always be possible from almost any device, without having to deal with compatibility issues and the whims of Apple's software teams. 
    The reason why the HomePod does not have an Aux input jack is because it would probably sound like crap. 
    The power of HomePod and speakers like the more modern Sonos line, is in computational audio. Read the room and adjust accordingly. 
    Why would an aux input sound like crap?  Other speaker systems manage just fine, why can't Apple's?
    Because once you pump in the already processed analog signal, which speaker inside of the HomePod would do what? Other than a woofer tweeter breakdown what would the speakers encircling the device do? Pump out all the same sound? Definitely not meant to function like that. 
    Think of plugging in your iPhone to a car’s audio jack. What does that sound like in your car’s audio system?
    Now connect same iPhone to car’s Apple CarPlay system. I’m willing to bet the latter sounds much better. 

    I have a $400 aux cable running to a Dragonfly Red DAC to an adapter to an iPhone 11 - kills the USB CarPlay system in sound quality. How you feed the amp matters - regardless of the connection type. The mini aux jack is not going away anytime soon. Apple isn’t even a blip on the radar in the world of audio gear. This isn’t like the floppy drive or CD drive - they dropped the jack from their phones... that’s it. Besides, I wouldn’t point to a failed and discontinued product as an Industry trend-setting innovation. Lots of people hated the decision to drop the jack and I’m sure Apple could buy a small island on the back of lightning to mini adaptors they sold. Apple did it to push the sales of AirPods - not because the mini jack sounds bad. Reducing the footprint on a small device - sure, but again, nothing to do with sound quality.
    williamlondonmuthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 32 of 33
    thedbathedba Posts: 771member
    avon b7 said:
    thedba said:
    crowley said:
    thedba said:
    elijahg said:
    danox said:
    Japhey said:
    AppleZulu said:
    It’s a typo, I’m sure, but on the linked Apple support page, under “How to listen to lossless on your Apple TV 4K,” it says you should first “update your Apple TV 4K to tvOS 11.4.”

    We’ve had lossless for years and didn’t even know it!
    This has just been a spectacular own-goal from Apple from the jump. The Bluetooth lack of support for Apple Music Lossless wasn't a giant surprise, but the messaging surrounding it all has been replete with holes, wrong information, and modifications for the last five days.
    An “own-goal” is a great way to put it. Some of Apple’s moves the last few months have defied logic. I mean, why even announce lossless until it was supported by the audio lineup? I don’t own a HomePod, but if I did I would be pretty pissed off right now. I’m really hoping WWDC will bring some unexpected new hardware announcements that will make sense of these seemingly erratic decisions. 

    The HomePod having wired in and out audio connections would have made all the difference (future proofed it), a great many more people would have bought the HomePod.
    You might want to double-check your comprehension of the concept of "future-proofing". Just as a hint, it does not involve integrating more legacy support for technologies that will be used less and less in the future.
    Only analog audio will never go away, because we as humans can only hear analog audio, not digital. The 3.5" jacks will always be present in the future for things like headphones, especially because they're good enough for 99% of the population to listen to music with. So yes, that would have been future proofing. Moreover, Airplay will eventually be abandoned, 802.11ac will become legacy, Apple Music will drop support for HomePods, and the Home app will no longer be able configure HomePods; much like the Airport configuration utility doesn't work for older Airport base stations. Then it won't be possible to play anything on HomePods at all. But with an analog connector, connecting to a HP would always be possible from almost any device, without having to deal with compatibility issues and the whims of Apple's software teams. 
    The reason why the HomePod does not have an Aux input jack is because it would probably sound like crap. 
    The power of HomePod and speakers like the more modern Sonos line, is in computational audio. Read the room and adjust accordingly. 
    Why would an aux input sound like crap?  Other speaker systems manage just fine, why can't Apple's?
    Because once you pump in the already processed analog signal, which speaker inside of the HomePod would do what? Other than a woofer tweeter breakdown what would the speakers encircling the device do? Pump out all the same sound? Definitely not meant to function like that. 
    Think of plugging in your iPhone to a car’s audio jack. What does that sound like in your car’s audio system?
    Now connect same iPhone to car’s Apple CarPlay system. I’m willing to bet the latter sounds much better. 
    I don't see why that would make them sound like crap.

    I don't have a HomePod but an AUX port would have been a great option, especially when it fell from front line action in the home. It would also have kept the unit going long beyond software support was dropped.

    At worst it would probably sound like my JBL Charge, which sounds great. 
    OK. Maybe I exaggerated when I said it would sound like crap.
    The magic of the HomePod comes from its computational audio algorithms. Not necessarily from you pairing it with another HP to create a stereo pair. In fact the pairing into a stereo set came later.
    We who bought into the idea, knew about this beforehand. 
    I got my first one in 2018 and got myself 2nd one last year.
    Too bad it’s being discontinued but wouldn’t have changed anything for us, even if Apple had released an HP2 with super surround sound, Airplay 3 or any other tech. It’s just the nature of modern day electronic equipment.
  • Reply 33 of 33
    thedbathedba Posts: 771member
    Zeebler said:
    thedba said:
    crowley said:
    thedba said:
    elijahg said:
    danox said:
    Japhey said:
    AppleZulu said:
    It’s a typo, I’m sure, but on the linked Apple support page, under “How to listen to lossless on your Apple TV 4K,” it says you should first “update your Apple TV 4K to tvOS 11.4.”

    We’ve had lossless for years and didn’t even know it!
    This has just been a spectacular own-goal from Apple from the jump. The Bluetooth lack of support for Apple Music Lossless wasn't a giant surprise, but the messaging surrounding it all has been replete with holes, wrong information, and modifications for the last five days.
    An “own-goal” is a great way to put it. Some of Apple’s moves the last few months have defied logic. I mean, why even announce lossless until it was supported by the audio lineup? I don’t own a HomePod, but if I did I would be pretty pissed off right now. I’m really hoping WWDC will bring some unexpected new hardware announcements that will make sense of these seemingly erratic decisions. 

    The HomePod having wired in and out audio connections would have made all the difference (future proofed it), a great many more people would have bought the HomePod.
    You might want to double-check your comprehension of the concept of "future-proofing". Just as a hint, it does not involve integrating more legacy support for technologies that will be used less and less in the future.
    Only analog audio will never go away, because we as humans can only hear analog audio, not digital. The 3.5" jacks will always be present in the future for things like headphones, especially because they're good enough for 99% of the population to listen to music with. So yes, that would have been future proofing. Moreover, Airplay will eventually be abandoned, 802.11ac will become legacy, Apple Music will drop support for HomePods, and the Home app will no longer be able configure HomePods; much like the Airport configuration utility doesn't work for older Airport base stations. Then it won't be possible to play anything on HomePods at all. But with an analog connector, connecting to a HP would always be possible from almost any device, without having to deal with compatibility issues and the whims of Apple's software teams. 
    The reason why the HomePod does not have an Aux input jack is because it would probably sound like crap. 
    The power of HomePod and speakers like the more modern Sonos line, is in computational audio. Read the room and adjust accordingly. 
    Why would an aux input sound like crap?  Other speaker systems manage just fine, why can't Apple's?
    Because once you pump in the already processed analog signal, which speaker inside of the HomePod would do what? Other than a woofer tweeter breakdown what would the speakers encircling the device do? Pump out all the same sound? Definitely not meant to function like that. 
    Think of plugging in your iPhone to a car’s audio jack. What does that sound like in your car’s audio system?
    Now connect same iPhone to car’s Apple CarPlay system. I’m willing to bet the latter sounds much better. 

    I have a $400 aux cable running to a Dragonfly Red DAC to an adapter to an iPhone 11 - kills the USB CarPlay system in sound quality. How you feed the amp matters - regardless of the connection type. The mini aux jack is not going away anytime soon. Apple isn’t even a blip on the radar in the world of audio gear. This isn’t like the floppy drive or CD drive - they dropped the jack from their phones... that’s it. Besides, I wouldn’t point to a failed and discontinued product as an Industry trend-setting innovation. Lots of people hated the decision to drop the jack and I’m sure Apple could buy a small island on the back of lightning to mini adaptors they sold. Apple did it to push the sales of AirPods - not because the mini jack sounds bad. Reducing the footprint on a small device - sure, but again, nothing to do with sound quality.
    So you would run a digital source (say your iPhone), to Dragonfly DAC, to an amp, to the now dumb speaker HomePod?
    Sort of defeats the purpose of the simplicity of the HomePod or even the Sonos line of wireless speakers.

    You’re correct in saying that Apple did drop the headphone jack from the iPhone, but that act didn’t happen alone in a vacuum. They offered users an alternative, a little something called the AirPods. And while everybody may have mocked them, guess what happened after?…. They all followed.
    The headphone jack hasn’t disappeared from the entire lineup. It has its place, just not on the iPhone and definitely not on the HomePod.

    The HomePod may not have succeeded in the market but the engineering that went into it phenomenal and many of the innovations are in the form of computational audio and yes the convenience of no wires. 

    If you’ve been following Apple over the years, the trend is towards no ports and no wires.
    edited May 2021 williamlondon
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