Dick Cheney + Halliburton = 1 billion buck deal...

24

Comments

  • Reply 21 of 63
    matsumatsu Posts: 6,558member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by alcimedes

    hey kneel, can you do me a quick favor.



    can you find out how many professional, high capacity oil well capping companies there are out there? oh, and these people need to be able to cap both flowing well and burning wells.



    while you're at it, can you find out how many have the experience of capping a few hundred wells in desert conditions?



    when you have that list, let's both look it over and see how many companies there are to choose from.




    Well the company with the most relevant and up to date experience, the guys who did the job in '91 are Canadians. They'd love to do it again, but the US gave them a huge lead time in '91 as this was an expected tactic, so they had months to prepare, the US hasn't talked to them since 9-11, so the decision to use someone else had to have been made well in advance.



    Edit: They were the firefighters that blew out the burning wells so that they could be capped. iDunno if they did the actual capping. While not a huge outfit (but plenty big), they have to be considered THE experts in fighting oil fires, after the first gulf war they blew out a well per day for months, anybody else you can find in the world may have fought one or two such fires in a whole year, if that.
  • Reply 22 of 63
    alcimedesalcimedes Posts: 5,486member
    yeah, i read up on that canadian firm, they sounded good. i would guess that canada's stance on the way with Iraq, and their lack of troops were the deciding factor on them not getting the call.



    i'm sure they were only shopping among US and British businesses when deciding who's going to do what.
  • Reply 23 of 63
    By the sounds of it, they were pretty much only shopping among American businesses until a day or so ago. Or so say the Brits.
  • Reply 24 of 63
    Quote:

    Originally posted by alcimedes

    ok, except this is in the desert, not the ocean. try again.



    Quote:

    Global Industries' other operations include trucking company Pelican Transportation and The Red Adair Company, the legendary oil field fire-fighting unit.



    http://www.hoovers.com/co/capsule/9/...,13409,00.html
  • Reply 25 of 63
    splinemodelsplinemodel Posts: 7,311member
    The bidding process takes quite a long time. My father's construction company does a lot af government work (albeit not 1 billion dollar jobs) and during the anthrax scare they got some no-bid offers to upgrade various components in municipal facilities that were considered to be targets. They also had some offers to build postal facilities for the purpose of screening mail for anthrax. Again, no bidding.



    Bidding can take months, especially for a large project. It's very common for the government to hand out contracts in times where speed is the issue.



    Furthermore, Halliburton capped more wells for less money than any of the firms utilized in the last gulf war. Do your research before crying about conspiracy. Nobody seems to complain, even the asinine Jon Stewart, about the rampant pork barrelling that goes on in so many states. Perhaps that's because the sagacious democratic party does plenty of this as well, and obviously anything Clinton approved of is OK. . .



    I'm coming to hate the daily show. Ever since Louis Black left, it just hasn't been as good, and Jon Stewart is spending too much effort trying to convince people that he's smart. Jon Stewart is a comedian. He's pretty good at that, but I know too many people with quicker wits AND 1000 times more knowledge. His correspondants do a much better job keeping it comedy.
  • Reply 26 of 63
    brussellbrussell Posts: 9,812member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by alcimedes

    yeah, i read up on that canadian firm, they sounded good. i would guess that canada's stance on the way with Iraq, and their lack of troops were the deciding factor on them not getting the call.



    i'm sure they were only shopping among US and British businesses when deciding who's going to do what.




    They ought to stick only with Middle Eastern and Arab local groups. This kind of thing just plays right into the "no war for oil" sentiment.
  • Reply 27 of 63
    alcimedesalcimedes Posts: 5,486member
    man that's weird, i went through their whole site and i can't find any references to Adair, but i remember them. i think there was a special on Discovery or PBS on them.



    they were good.



    'course, the're also a Texas company. i'm sure someone could find a link between Bush or Chenney too.



    i just don't think there are that many US companies that do this work. it's not a normal/typical job.
  • Reply 28 of 63
    sammi josammi jo Posts: 4,634member
    Don't forget:



    If this war hadn't have started, nobody would have gotten these contracts.



    Certain parties lobbied furiously for this war



    Now we are at war.
  • Reply 29 of 63
    alcimedesalcimedes Posts: 5,486member
    Quote:

    Certain parties lobbied furiously for this war



    got links for that?
  • Reply 30 of 63
    groveratgroverat Posts: 10,872member
    I was under the impression that Cheney couldn't have financial links to Halliburton and be Veep. Perhaps I was wrong.



    alc:



    You're supposed to just assume it's true. Smoke-filled rooms and all that jazz.
  • Reply 31 of 63
    bungebunge Posts: 7,329member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by alcimedes

    i would guess that canada's stance on the way with Iraq, and their lack of troops were the deciding factor on them not getting the call.



    That's called nepotism.
  • Reply 32 of 63
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Splinemodel

    Halliburton capped more wells for less money than any of the firms utilized in the last gulf war.



    Do you have a link for this? I was unable to find any sources indicating Halliburton is necessarily the best company to go to...and the fact that the actual firefighting work is sub-contracted out to other companies suggests to me that any oil services provider could act as middleman.



    Quote:

    Originally posted by alcimedes

    'course, the're also a Texas company. i'm sure someone could find a link between Bush or Cheney too.



    There probably is. The oil industry seems pretty close knit (the founders of Boots & Coots both came from The Red Adair Company). The other oil firefighting company I checked up on - Wild Well Control -also does a lot of contract work for Halliburton.
  • Reply 33 of 63
    matsumatsu Posts: 6,558member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by sammi jo

    Don't forget:



    If this war hadn't have started, nobody would have gotten these contracts.



    Certain parties lobbied furiously for this war



    Now we are at war.




    That's some shockingly bad reasoning. The case for this war has been building for a long long time within the intelligence community. Business and diplomacy, well, you're not up to an appreciation of that distinction yet, maybe in a few years.



    Your head is swimming with way too much info right now. Too bad, you could be interesting if only you thought a bit harder about your rabid jumps to conspiracy.
  • Reply 34 of 63
    THT, yah thats what I said! Shouldn't neighbouring countries be coersed into getting into business with thier Iraq first?!! Its their region and their economies.



    Quote:

    I swear, sometimes the amount of stupidity here amazes me.



    Bad enough you drop in and dump-a-diss, but you don't even set up a position. Are you talking to yourself again? Its ok, just play with kitty and things might be clearer this afternoon...







    Quote:

    they were pretty much only shopping among American businesses



    Thats what I was reading in the newspaper, the United States wanted to hand out contracts to all American businesses.







    Quote:

    I was under the impression that Cheney couldn't have financial links to Halliburton



    Oh?

    Quote:

    Cheney's close relations with folks like Ken Lay of Enron have made this one of the most corporation-friendly administrations in history.



    and much more from:here
  • Reply 35 of 63
    splinemodelsplinemodel Posts: 7,311member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by kneelbeforezod

    Do you have a link for this? I was unable to find any sources indicating Halliburton is necessarily the best company to go to...and the fact that the actual firefighting work is sub-contracted out to other companies suggests to me that any oil services provider could act as middleman.





    There probably is. The oil industry seems pretty close knit (the founders of Boots & Coots both came from The Red Adair Company). The other oil firefighting company I checked up on - Wild Well Control -also does a lot of contract work for Halliburton.




    I remeber reading that North American efforts dring the first Gulf War far outpaced European efforts, for the same amount of money. I'm almost positive that the European teams were lead by a European general contractor.



    You clearly don't understand the responsibilities of a general contractor. Even if you have the best subs in the world, if you have a bad general, it's not going to hapeen. General contractors usually coordinate everything and send in their own men & equipment to fill in the gaps. So basically you need a really solid team. In construction, I could say that, for example, Clark construction just put up another building. But they have lots of subs. There are probably more men of subcontracting teams than there are men with Clark working on the building. Probably 10 to 1. But the sucees of the whole operation is always credited to the general contractor. Every project that's at all substantial is a cooperation of many subs. Without a good general, though, there is no coordination between the subs, and there's not the generals own team filling in the gaps.



    The entire project is far greater in scope than just putting out the fires. That's why they didn't just hire one of the subcontractors.
  • Reply 36 of 63
    I wasn't questioning the fact that the contract went to a US company (nor that a good general is a prerequisite in any large scale project involving a number of agencies) just the fact that it went to a US company with such close ties to the government. If Halliburton were demonstrably the best in the business, I would find the situation less dubious. However, a review of their valuation over the last two years (stock price went down from $51 to around $20 - last split was in 1997) shows that Wall Street believes there are better.
  • Reply 37 of 63
    costiquecostique Posts: 1,084member
    I've done a little research and here are some interesting (though obvious) results:

    How oil fuels Bush administration "war on terrorism"
    Quote:

    An Institute for Afghan Studies report put it simply: oil and gas reserves in this arena are worth approximately $3 trillion.



    Cheney's Black Gold

    Quote:

    Because of the instability in the Persian Gulf, Cheney and his fellow oilmen have zeroed in on the world's other major source of oil--the Caspian Sea. Its rich oil and gas resources are estimated at $4 trillion by U.S. News and World Report. The Washington-based American Petroleum Institute, voice of the major U.S. oil companies, called the Caspian region, "the area of greatest resource potential outside of the Middle East." Cheney told a gaggle of oil industry executives in 1998, "I can't think of a time when we've had a region emerge as suddenly to become as strategically significant as the Caspian."



    Control of Oil Behind Bush Drive for War with Iraq
    Quote:

    The fact is that America has become dependent on oil from the Persian Gulf since World War II. We rely on Persian Gulf oil for a significant share of our total energy supply, and that dependency is growing all the time. ... Bush administration is worried about is the fact that the United States is running out of oil.



    www.nrdc.org
    Quote:

    Furthermore, given the projected increase in demand for motor vehicle fuels by 2002 in the United States, it is critical that the United States develop an energy policy that expedites the expansion of facilities critical to production, transportation, and manufacturing of oil, natural gas, and petroleum products.



    Article about Bush & Cheeney oil stock options



    Greasing the machine ? more figures.



    The Bush cabinet: a government of the financial oligarchy ? even more figures



    Bush family's little dirty secrets
    Quote:

    The Bush-controlled oil business eventually ended up being folded into Harken Energy Corp., a Dallas-based corporation. Mr. Bush joined Harken as a director in 1986 and was given 212,000 shares of Harken stock. Bush used his White House connections to land a lucrative contract for the obscure Harken Energy Corp. with the Middle Eastern government of Bahrain. On June 20, 1990, George W. Bush sold his Harken stock for $848,000 and paid off the loan he took out to buy his small share in the Texas Rangers.



    Quote:

    Abdullah Taha Bakhsh, the Arab who cosigned the $25 million cash infusion into George W. Bush?s Harken Energy Corporation, appointed Talat Othman to manage his 17.6 percent share in Harken Energy Corp. ... Bakhsh also bought a 9.6 percent stake in Worthen Banking Corporation, the Arkansas bank controlled by Jack Stephens. Abdullah Bakhsh?s share was the identical percentage as the amount of shares sold by Mochtar Riady, the godfather of the wealthy Indonesian family with close ties to the Chinese communists, Bill Clinton and evangelist Pat Robertson._ Bakhsh is represented by Rogers & Wells, a well-connected Republican law firm in New York whose partners include former Secretary of State William P. Rogers.



    Deciphering the Bush Administration's Motives for War



    Bush's Cabinet Mostly Millionaires
    Quote:

    There is a legitimate question about how sensitive and how acutely aware you can be when you're a millionaire in dealing with everyday issues like prescription drugs and Social Security payments.



    The roots of the Bush-Cheeney oil government ? total gloom and doom.



    Does anyone seriously believe that these oil mongers can think about freedom, Geneva conventions, war on terrorism etc. in the region where oil costs $2 per barrel?
  • Reply 38 of 63
    got this from corpwatch.org:



    Quote:

    The influence of big energy corporations in the Bush Administration is no secret. But the story of Dick Cheney and his former company, Halliburton Co., has received little attention -- and it may be the most important.



    Prospects for democracy in post-Taliban Afghanistan appear dimmed by the bare-knuckled oil services deal-cutting overseen by the victor, the United States. Last December, the US Department of Defense made a no-cap, cost-plus-award contract to Halliburton KBR's Government Operations division. The Dallas-based company is contracted to build forward operating bases to support troop deployments for the next nine years wherever the President chooses to take the anti-terrorism war.



    "Augmenting our military troops with contractor-provided support has proven to be an invaluable force multiplier," boasted Halliburton CEO Dave Lesar, celebrating the deal in a euphemistic language that is understood both as military triumphalism -- and to Wall Street -- as a cue that the new military mobilization could punch up the company's flagging stocks. In an October press release, the CEO who was compensated $11.3 million last year, had forecasted a good fourth quarter for profits in engineering and construction.



    A Jan. 29 Washington Post article drew comparisons between Halliburton and Enron, pointing out that both their stocks plunged last fall, and that they share the same accountant, Arthur Andersen. (Halliburton has been plagued with lawsuits over its use of asbestos, discouraging investor confidence.) Another similarity is that their CEOs both cashed out before fall. In Halliburton's case, Vice President Dick Cheney cashed out $20.6 million in stocks before retiring as CEO. With Halliburton now ailing financially, it's only natural that the Defense Department, over which Cheney presided in the administration of Bush I, would provide the bailout.



    The Pentagon posts all contract announcements exceeding $5 million on its Website, but in Halliburton's case declined to disclose the estimated value of the award. A spokesperson for Halliburton gave $2.5 billion as the amount the company earned from base support services in the 1990s, acknowledging that the contract value could exceed that number assuming that the scope of US military actions widens in the next decade.



    The part I highlighted in the second paragraph means that the more taxpayers money Halliburton spend, the more profit they make. Nice.
  • Reply 39 of 63
    costiquecostique Posts: 1,084member
    I like this one:
    Quote:

    "Augmenting our military troops with contractor-provided support has proven to be an invaluable force multiplier," boasted Halliburton CEO Dave Lesar.



    In other words, it's just normal to occupy a sovereign country to make money on its resources. If I were Halliburton, I wouldn't even bother to remember about tax payers because they pay too little. Tax payers suck, that is.
  • Reply 40 of 63
    giantgiant Posts: 6,041member
    Here's the Cheney/Halliburton timeline from CCR:



    http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/c...lliburton.html



    It points out all of the contracts done through Cheney. One of the largest is the recent 10-year contract. What's also interesting is how they are paid:



    Quote:

    The 'war on terrorism' has considerably improved the business climate for Halliburton's subsidiary, Kellog Brown and Root (KBR), which has recently been provided with numerous lucrative jobs by the Department of Defense. After the Bush administration launched its 'war on terrorism' the U.S. ?Defense? Department awarded a lucrative 10-year contract on December 14 to KBR for the construction of forward operating bases for the U.S. military. The services that it provides under this deal, known as the Logistics Civil Augmentation Program (LOGCAP), include: Planning, base camp maintenance, facilities maintenance, laundry services, food services, airfield services, property accountability and supply operations. The contract is to last ten years and it guarantees Halliburton business wherever Bush, Cheney, and their successors decide to send U.S. troops in their fight against ?terror.? So far, evidence has surfaced that Brown and Root will be providing the services at the Bagram base in Afghanistan, the Khanabad Air Base in Uzbekistan, as well as the Guatanamo base in Cuba. (Greene 2-1-2002; Chatterjee 5-2-2002a; Corpwatch 5-2-2002; Hennessey 5-23-2002; Gerth and Van Natta 7-13-2002; Pace 8-5-2002)



    Halliburton stands to make a handsome profit from the deal as the contract stipulates that the company's compensation will be based on a percentage of its total spending, i.e., the more taxpayer money Halliburton spends, the larger its profits will be.



    Note that Halliburton has a long, long history of deliberately overcharging.



    Note also that Halliburton has a long, long history of conducting business with every nation we are at odds with. This includes rebuilding Iraq after the 1st Gulf War. Note that Cheney headed the company at the time (the same person who, as Sec of Defence, destroyed it).



    This includes a disregard for human rights, including knowingly allowing slave labor to be used in some of its work in Burma.



    Quote:

    Disregard for Human Rights.



    Halliburton was accused by local villagers of being involved in the shooting of a protester by Nigeria's Mobile Police Unit. Dick Cheney has lobbied heavily to prevent or eliminate federal laws that restrict Halliburton's ability to do business in this country. (Bruno and Vallette 2000; Flanders 10-06-2001)



    Halliburton did a significant amount of business with the notorious regime in Burma. An investigation by EarthRights International in 2000 documented Halliburton's complicity in major human rights violations - including the murder, torture, rape, forced labor and forced relocation of some of Burma?s indigenous populations. (Bruno and Vallette 9-2000)




    The company is nothing less than criminal, as can be seen in the profile under Subverting Democratic Values and the Rule of Law - Criminal Activity. I think CCR sums it up pretty well:



    Quote:

    Americans should find the relationship between Halliburton and the U.S. government appalling. There are several reasons why. For one, while millions of Americans have to operate in a competitive and harsh work environment that has become even more difficult in the current economic slowdown, the wealthy class of elite escape the so-called ?discipline? of the market by using their connections to guarantee an income stream that is financed by the taxes of everyone else. Additionally, the manipulative practices of Halliburton undermine the ideals of freedom and democracy that so many Americans are led to believe is the defining quality of America?s contribution to the world. Is Halliburton an exception? Of course not, the quest for profit is not an activity based on lofty values and principles. Rather, it is essentially pragmatic. No CEO, who wishes to remain in that position, would purposefully make a decision on any criteria other than the potential for profit. Hence when the drive for profit is subsidized by the political power of the state, everyone, but the wealthiest 1%, loses.



    And some of you guys still think your politicans are so just and moral.



    Hell, didn't anyone see the big article on Perle's war profiteering with Trireme in the New Yorker a week ago? As one member of the Defence Policy Board, which makes our strategic military decisions and is chaired by Perle, put it when he found out about it from the author:



    Quote:

    ?Oh, get out of here. He?s the chairman! If you had a story about me setting up a company for homeland security...I?d be had?



    It's called war profiteering. Find out what it means
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