Apple to ask all employees to voluntarily report Covid vaccination status

AppleInsider

Apple will reportedly ask all of its employees to provide their vaccination status in an effort to better inform its Covid-19 policies, but it isn't mandating the reporting or vaccination in general.

Credit: Apple

The Cupertino-based company is asking staffers to "voluntarily" report vaccination status by the middle of September, regardless of whether they are working in-office or remotely, Bloomberg reported Wednesday.

"As Apple's Covid-19 response continues to evolve, our primary focus remains keeping our team members, their friends and families, and our entire community healthy," Apple said in an internal memo obtained by Bloomberg.

According to the memo, Apple said that it will use the employee vaccination data to inform its Covid-19 response efforts and work policies. Previously, the company asked for vaccination status in California, Washington, and New Jersey in compliance with location regulations.

The company says it will keep vaccinate data "confidential and secure," and won't inform managers of the responses. However, it did note that vaccination status "may be used in an identifiable manner, along with other information about your general work environment such as your building location, if we determine or, if it is required that, this information is necessary in order to ensure a healthy and safe work environment."

Apple has been ramping up its Covid-19 response in recent months as the more infectious delta variant surges. Back in August, the company began encouraging its employees to get vaccinated and expanded its Covid-19 testing programs.

Unlike other major tech companies, however, Apple is not currently mandating vaccinations among its employees. However, it does appear to be mulling such a requirement.

Apple initially planned to bring back corporate employees to offices in September, but delayed the return -- first to October and then to at least January 2022 -- because of an uptick in cases across the U.S. largely caused by the delta variant. Although employees have pushed back against the return to in-office work, Apple appears to be pressing on ahead with those plans.

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sflocal

We had one a-hole coworker here that died a couple weeks ago.  She was anti-vaccine.  Now, I couldn't care less that COVID is thinning the herd of these Darwin-award winners, but the prior week before she died she was at the office, without a care in the world.  Her ignorant, stupid, selfish decision that it was "my body, my choice" affected others in her department.  We had to shut down the entire department she worked in, which was a vital, production department and all the employees had to quarantine because of it.

Your "freedom" to take the vaccine or not stops when your selfish decision affects other people.  I have quite a few fully-vaccinated friends that got hit with the delta-variant and one got hit hard.  It's because of these selfish a-holes that refuse to get vaccinated is why we're still dealing with it.

I hope Apple and other companies fire any able-bodied anti-vaxxer.  Unless you have a bonafide, actual medical reason signed off by an actual, science-based doctor excusing you from the vaccine, consider yourself unemployed.

I'm so fed up with these people.  These anti-vaxxers honestly should pay all the health-care costs of their hospitalization, or be denied hospital treatment altogether.  What an embarrassment.

lkrupp

Volunteer reporting is about as useless as self-nominating surveys. There is no way that volunteer reporting will produce any worthwhile data concerning the status of employee vaccinations. Even if Apple were to mandate a response people would lie through their teeth, especially the hard corp anti-vaxxers. The only way to get any semblance of accurate data would be to require employees to show proof of vaccination. Sure, there might be few that would resort to counterfeit vaccination cards but it would be much harder than simply lying on a survey.

The people who run surveys and volunteer reporting always forget about human nature. Personally I love screwing around with telephone surveys. I always respond to their crafted questions with answers that go against what they want to hear. Political surveys from politicians are the most fun to mess with.

byronl

i’m glad they aren’t forcing employees to get vaccinated. no one should be forced to take the vaccine.

davgreg

Science does not care what your politics are or where you go to worship (or not).

I work in healthcare and am directly exposed to confirmed positive and potential Covid infected people every shift I work and I am quite tired of these people who will believe everyone but a qualified and informed scientist or Physician. I had to throw a family member out of our ER last week who refused to comply with our policy and opposed the most polite and reasonable requests to conform. It is tedious to repeatedly deal with this and their behavior is dangerous to staff, visitors and patients.

I am not the lawyer of the family but it seems such a policy could open Apple to potential lawsuits later on. Tim should plainly tell them to get vaccinated or find other work and that they will not be eligible for rehire for refusing to follow policy.

We are far from done with Covid as most of the people on our planet are not vaccinated and the virus will continue to mutate. The Delta variant that is the current dominant one in the US came from India. Expect more waves later on until the bulk of humanity has been vaccinated.

Nobody is more tired of PPE and all the rest than I, but it is well past time we all start acting like responsible adults and do what is necessary to protect the vulnerable and get this virus under control.

jib

byronl said:

i’m glad they aren’t forcing employees to get vaccinated. no one should be forced to take the vaccine.

Perhaps no one should be "forced" to get vaccinated, but I have no problem with having a policy that says you must be vaccinated to work here.  You're not forced -- you can look elsewhere for a job.

lkrupp

byronl said:

i’m glad they aren’t forcing employees to get vaccinated. no one should be forced to take the vaccine.

There’s a difference between ‘forcing’ and ‘encouraging’. Delta airlines, for example now has a policy the requires unvaccinated employees pay an extra $200/mo for their health care plans and be tested weekly (hopefully at the employee’s expense) It probably won’t be long before insurance companies raise rates for the unvaccinated, like they did for tobacco users. And how about hospitals prioritize ER /ICU patients and make the unvaccinated covid patients go to the back of the line. It’s amazing how a big hit in the wallet or being placed last in line for services  will change people’s minds. Oh, let’s add in insurance companies altering coverage by refusing to pay for the care of unvaccinated members. See, there are almost inexhaustible ways to ‘encourage’ people to get vaccinated without ‘forcing’ them to. Money talks and bullshit walks.

So I suppose you are also against school districts requiring children be properly vaccinated before they can attend.

By the way, please explain to us how Small Pox and Polio were eradicated in the twentieth century. You know, of course, that the small pox virus only exists in laboratories these days, having been wiped off the face of the earth by, guess what, a vaccine. Did you know there was a Small Pox vaccine in 1786 already?

Finally, it has been legally established that companies and organizations do indeed have the power to require their employees to be vaccinated. Don't want to get vaccinated? You can’t work here, goodbye and good luck.

edited September 2021

sflocal

byronl said:

i’m glad they aren’t forcing employees to get vaccinated. no one should be forced to take the vaccine.

Nor should a company be forced to keep you employed with them if you're not vaccinated.  Your choice, your consequence.

edited September 2021

rinosaur

Great decision Apple in this regard, really proud.

dewme

I really like the analogy that refusing to get a vaccine is the same as consciously deciding to run through a stop sign or red light while you're driving.

You might get away with it.

You might get hurt physically and/or financially.

You might kill someone.

You might be killed.

Yeah, it's your choice. But don't for one second deceive yourself into believing that you are the only person who can suffer the consequences of your ignorance.

daalseth

jib said:

byronl said:

i’m glad they aren’t forcing employees to get vaccinated. no one should be forced to take the vaccine.

Perhaps no one should be "forced" to get vaccinated, but I have no problem with having a policy that says you must be vaccinated to work here.  You're not forced -- you can look elsewhere for a job.

Where I work we had to get vaccinated for Hepatitis. No the did not force us, but if you were going to be on the company payroll and insurance you had to be. If you choose not to be, then there’s the door. 

loopless

byronl said:

i’m glad they aren’t forcing employees to get vaccinated. no one should be forced to take the vaccine.

They can get a new job if they don't like vaccinations being a requirement at their place of employment.

entropys

lkrupp said:

Volunteer reporting is about as useless as self-nominating surveys. There is no way that volunteer reporting will produce any worthwhile data concerning the status of employee vaccinations. Even if Apple were to mandate a response people would lie through their teeth, especially the hard corp anti-vaxxers. The only way to get any semblance of accurate data would be to require employees to show proof of vaccination. Sure, there might be few that would resort to counterfeit vaccination cards but it would be much harder than simply lying on a survey.

The people who run surveys and volunteer reporting always forget about human nature. Personally I love screwing around with telephone surveys. I always respond to their crafted questions with answers that go against what they want to hear. Political surveys from politicians are the most fun to mess with.

Same. Especially fun to work out which political outfit has paid for the survey and state the opposite of what they clearly want you to say.  I reckon it comes with the cynicism of middle age, having seen it all before.

So in this case I am vaccinated but I don’t really think I should be voluntarily telling anyone that I got up and wiped my bum after going to the dunny. 

I am not at all keen on this compulsive desire to “show us your papers”. I get the issue around health risk management. But we should not discount the risk of a permanent loss of rights, or the rapid acceleration in the growth of the surveillance state either. It’s quite easy for intrusive procedures originally introduced for good to morph into the bad.  Once introduced these policies never seem to go away.

edited September 2021

ofer

lkrupp said:

Volunteer reporting is about as useless as self-nominating surveys. There is no way that volunteer reporting will produce any worthwhile data concerning the status of employee vaccinations. Even if Apple were to mandate a response people would lie through their teeth, especially the hard corp anti-vaxxers. The only way to get any semblance of accurate data would be to require employees to show proof of vaccination. Sure, there might be few that would resort to counterfeit vaccination cards but it would be much harder than simply lying on a survey.

The people who run surveys and volunteer reporting always forget about human nature. Personally I love screwing around with telephone surveys. I always respond to their crafted questions with answers that go against what they want to hear. Political surveys from politicians are the most fun to mess with.

I suspect we’re on opposite ends of the political spectrum. But on this we can definitely agree. And I do the same thing with pollsters and most political surveys.

jeffythequick

sflocal said:

We had one a-hole coworker here that died a couple weeks ago.  She was anti-vaccine.  Now, I couldn't care less that COVID is thinning the herd of these Darwin-award winners, but the prior week before she died she was at the office, without a care in the world.  Her ignorant, stupid, selfish decision that it was "my body, my choice" affected others in her department.  We had to shut down the entire department she worked in, which was a vital, production department and all the employees had to quarantine because of it.

Your "freedom" to take the vaccine or not stops when your selfish decision affects other people.  I have quite a few fully-vaccinated friends that got hit with the delta-variant and one got hit hard.  It's because of these selfish a-holes that refuse to get vaccinated is why we're still dealing with it.

I hope Apple and other companies fire any able-bodied anti-vaxxer.  Unless you have a bonafide, actual medical reason signed off by an actual, science-based doctor excusing you from the vaccine, consider yourself unemployed.

I'm so fed up with these people.  These anti-vaxxers honestly should pay all the health-care costs of their hospitalization, or be denied hospital treatment altogether.  What an embarrassment.

OK, so your coworker died and you had to shut down the entire department and stay home.  Actions/consequences, I guess.

Next up, the whole "anti-vaxxer" vs. "pro-vaxxers" both got sick.  Kind of negates your first argument.  From the way you word your argument, it looks like there are two different groups of people.  From your testimony, caccinated people get sick too, and if they did something that you don't agree with (like helping those that are sick with COVID), should they die too?

Finally, denying hospital treatment... there was a series of MTV movies entitled as another name for a donkey, and since they're doing what society calls idiotic things, do they get denied in the emergency room as well?

Your illogic boils down to, "I don't like what you do, and you should die after being fired."  Maybe a job in selling greeting cards is in the offing.

Lastly, and this is a story about a less toxic subject:  A high risk pregnancy (and I think we can all agree on the outcome, so please read, and I am treading lightly on this):

My sister in law had a high risk pregnancy, where the placenta attached near the Fallopian tubes, and when discovered, she was advised to terminate the pregnancy.  She and her husband decided not to, and that required her to be flown from Montana to Seattle to be checked in to UW Hospital.  She was continually advised to terminate the pregnancy, as if things ruptured, she would bleed out in 2 minutes.  She had a port put in her arm as a precaution.  When asked the final time, she said, "Listen, I want you to stop asking me about terminating the pregnancy.  You will get one of two outcomes.  The first is that I'll die, and you can use my body to figure out what went wrong, and the second is that we'll have the baby, and you can use everything you've learned to help others in this condition."  She had a C-Section at 30 weeks (2 weeks later), as well as a hysterectomy (too much damage to her uterus).

My niece, who I saw last week is a 7 year old bundle of love, her mother is doing well, and UW has a wealth of knowledge of how to handle women who have high risk pregnancies of this type.

The point of this story is that life is complex, and there are a number of things that are not known by the spectating (and commenting) crowd, and flushing a whole group of people down the drain because you don't agree with them is a bit, well, harsh.  Remember:  what ever you do, at least 90% of the people in the world will find fault.

jeffythequick

designr said:

lkrupp said:

Volunteer reporting is about as useless as self-nominating surveys. There is no way that volunteer reporting will produce any worthwhile data concerning the status of employee vaccinations. Even if Apple were to mandate a response people would lie through their teeth, especially the hard corp anti-vaxxers. The only way to get any semblance of accurate data would be to require employees to show proof of vaccination. Sure, there might be few that would resort to counterfeit vaccination cards but it would be much harder than simply lying on a survey.

The people who run surveys and volunteer reporting always forget about human nature. Personally I love screwing around with telephone surveys. I always respond to their crafted questions with answers that go against what they want to hear. Political surveys from politicians are the most fun to mess with.

Except...what will happen is that if asked, and they lie and are later shown to have lied, this will become grounds (cause) for dismissal.

Yep, that's what my employer said, but they had benefits for those that got vaccinated, like being able to walk around unmasked, until the variants appeared.  Lying was very clearly stated:  You can get fired for doing that.

bluefire1

I can’t tell you how many stores I’ve seen that have a sign on the door that says “wear a mask if not vaccinated”. That’s about as effective as giving students a take-home exam and have them promise not to cheat. I’m not a believer in the honor system, because too many people lie and wind up putting  others at unnecessary risk. Either show proof of your vaccination status or wear a mask or shop elsewhere.

edited September 2021

applezulu

jeffythequick said:

sflocal said:

We had one a-hole coworker here that died a couple weeks ago.  She was anti-vaccine.  Now, I couldn't care less that COVID is thinning the herd of these Darwin-award winners, but the prior week before she died she was at the office, without a care in the world.  Her ignorant, stupid, selfish decision that it was "my body, my choice" affected others in her department.  We had to shut down the entire department she worked in, which was a vital, production department and all the employees had to quarantine because of it.

Your "freedom" to take the vaccine or not stops when your selfish decision affects other people.  I have quite a few fully-vaccinated friends that got hit with the delta-variant and one got hit hard.  It's because of these selfish a-holes that refuse to get vaccinated is why we're still dealing with it.

I hope Apple and other companies fire any able-bodied anti-vaxxer.  Unless you have a bonafide, actual medical reason signed off by an actual, science-based doctor excusing you from the vaccine, consider yourself unemployed.

I'm so fed up with these people.  These anti-vaxxers honestly should pay all the health-care costs of their hospitalization, or be denied hospital treatment altogether.  What an embarrassment.

OK, so your coworker died and you had to shut down the entire department and stay home.  Actions/consequences, I guess.

Next up, the whole "anti-vaxxer" vs. "pro-vaxxers" both got sick.  Kind of negates your first argument.  From the way you word your argument, it looks like there are two different groups of people.  From your testimony, caccinated people get sick too, and if they did something that you don't agree with (like helping those that are sick with COVID), should they die too?

Finally, denying hospital treatment... there was a series of MTV movies entitled as another name for a donkey, and since they're doing what society calls idiotic things, do they get denied in the emergency room as well?

Your illogic boils down to, "I don't like what you do, and you should die after being fired."  Maybe a job in selling greeting cards is in the offing.

Lastly, and this is a story about a less toxic subject:  A high risk pregnancy (and I think we can all agree on the outcome, so please read, and I am treading lightly on this):

My sister in law had a high risk pregnancy, where the placenta attached near the Fallopian tubes, and when discovered, she was advised to terminate the pregnancy.  She and her husband decided not to, and that required her to be flown from Montana to Seattle to be checked in to UW Hospital.  She was continually advised to terminate the pregnancy, as if things ruptured, she would bleed out in 2 minutes.  She had a port put in her arm as a precaution.  When asked the final time, she said, "Listen, I want you to stop asking me about terminating the pregnancy.  You will get one of two outcomes.  The first is that I'll die, and you can use my body to figure out what went wrong, and the second is that we'll have the baby, and you can use everything you've learned to help others in this condition."  She had a C-Section at 30 weeks (2 weeks later), as well as a hysterectomy (too much damage to her uterus).

My niece, who I saw last week is a 7 year old bundle of love, her mother is doing well, and UW has a wealth of knowledge of how to handle women who have high risk pregnancies of this type.

The point of this story is that life is complex, and there are a number of things that are not known by the spectating (and commenting) crowd, and flushing a whole group of people down the drain because you don't agree with them is a bit, well, harsh.  Remember:  what ever you do, at least 90% of the people in the world will find fault.

I am tired of this BS of either woeful or willful ignorance. Probabilities are real. Everything is not 50/50 he-said-she-said. The vaccine is not a magic video game armor that makes people 100% assured of protection. It significantly increases the probability of protection. The idiots refusing vaccination have a much higher probability of infection and are rapidly becoming prolific disease vectors, catching Delta Covid in large numbers and greatly increasing the likelihood that even the vaccinated people around them will become exposed. Some of those exposed vaccinated people will get the virus, though far fewer than those who are not vaccinated. Some of those will also get sick, but vastly fewer than those who were unvaccinated. A few will even die, but astronomically fewer than those who are not vaccinated.

Pretending that getting vaccinated makes no difference because some vaccinated people also get it is being ignorant of probabilities and is just profoundly dumb. If everyone who was eligible got the vaccine, transmission rates of even the Delta variant would be much, much lower right now, to the point it likely wouldn't even be much discussed. Instead, people jacked up on their politics are ignoring probabilities, dismissing incontrovertible medical evidence, refusing vaccines backed by all that, but taking horse dewormer after they get sick because somebody on the internet said it works. People are dying in large numbers because of all this. I am tired of catering to the willfully ignorant, worrying that being too harsh will put them off. The hell with that. Act like a responsible adult member of civilization and get the damn vaccine.

sflocal

jeffythequick said:

OK, so your coworker died and you had to shut down the entire department and stay home.  Actions/consequences, I guess.

Next up, the whole "anti-vaxxer" vs. "pro-vaxxers" both got sick.  Kind of negates your first argument.  From the way you word your argument, it looks like there are two different groups of people.  From your testimony, caccinated people get sick too, and if they did something that you don't agree with (like helping those that are sick with COVID), should they die too?

Finally, denying hospital treatment... there was a series of MTV movies entitled as another name for a donkey, and since they're doing what society calls idiotic things, do they get denied in the emergency room as well?

Your illogic boils down to, "I don't like what you do, and you should die after being fired."  Maybe a job in selling greeting cards is in the offing.

Lastly, and this is a story about a less toxic subject:  A high risk pregnancy (and I think we can all agree on the outcome, so please read, and I am treading lightly on this):

My sister in law had a high risk pregnancy, where the placenta attached near the Fallopian tubes, and when discovered, she was advised to terminate the pregnancy.  She and her husband decided not to, and that required her to be flown from Montana to Seattle to be checked in to UW Hospital.  She was continually advised to terminate the pregnancy, as if things ruptured, she would bleed out in 2 minutes.  She had a port put in her arm as a precaution.  When asked the final time, she said, "Listen, I want you to stop asking me about terminating the pregnancy.  You will get one of two outcomes.  The first is that I'll die, and you can use my body to figure out what went wrong, and the second is that we'll have the baby, and you can use everything you've learned to help others in this condition."  She had a C-Section at 30 weeks (2 weeks later), as well as a hysterectomy (too much damage to her uterus).

My niece, who I saw last week is a 7 year old bundle of love, her mother is doing well, and UW has a wealth of knowledge of how to handle women who have high risk pregnancies of this type.

The point of this story is that life is complex, and there are a number of things that are not known by the spectating (and commenting) crowd, and flushing a whole group of people down the drain because you don't agree with them is a bit, well, harsh.  Remember:  what ever you do, at least 90% of the people in the world will find fault.

*yawn*

I'd respond, but the ignorance you're showing is not worth the effort.

edited September 2021

macxpress

My company is requiring that you submit your vaccination status along with the dates, provider of the vaccine(s) shots and location. While you don't have to upload proof at the moment, they do state they may ask for proof at a later date and if there are discrepancies this could be grounds for immediate termination. We currently do not require team members get vaccinated at the moment. They're just strongly recommending it and providing onsite vaccinations. 

I just wish this entire thing wasn't politicized and this stupid my body my choice movement hadn't happened as large as it has. Yes, its your body but your choices effect others including their bodies. This can then have an effect on someone else's family members of any age and eventually the delta variant can develop into something where the vaccine doesn't do much if anything. We were getting so close in the month of June to being almost back to normality (at least where I live) and now were just back to square 1 again and actually in worse condition than ever before. All because people have this antivax BS in their head. Its so just god damn frustrating, infuriating to be honest. Everyone wants this to go away and certain people don't want to help make it go away or at least get it to a point where its manageable. Just as frustrating when I did everything I was supposed to do, wear my mask, get fully vaccinated and now because assholes just don't want to get vaccinated I have keep wearing my mask, things in the area are going back to covid protocols again, etc. It just sucks. 

edited September 2021

dws-2

byronl said:

i’m glad they aren’t forcing employees to get vaccinated. no one should be forced to take the vaccine.

I agree. They should have the option of finding another job.