I would rather have had another TB4 port than HDMI. What a wasted hole inside the case!
Everyone who needs HDMI already owns a USB C / HDMI dongle. I've even seen some companies use an Apple TV and AirPlay.
If you're going to include HDMI then why only support 60Hz. If I'm a video editor pro and really need the HDMI port wouldn't I want 120Hz?
Perhaps it's useful for a Sales guy using an MacBook Air and I could be wrong but I don't see MacBook Pro users using HDMI.
This is a solution for a problem that no longer still exists.
…and you actually need 4 TB4 ports? There are plenty of people who have older MacBooks who don’t have a dongle. Then there are the people like me who have a dongle that quit working. And all the dongles that got left behind in conference rooms. Or lost when someone else borrowed them and forgot to return them….
Just because it’s not a problem for you doesn’t mean it’s not a problem for anyone.
How do you think he M1 Max supports 3 6K displays and 1 HDTV.
Guessing Apple added the HDMI b/c the M1 Max cannot support 4 6K displays.
Think about what you're saying- you're effectively complaining that a laptop can't support four 6k displays! How many other laptops even come close to that? If you need that kind of power a laptop is not the right choice for you. As it stands the new MBPs are incredibly powerful and capable; they blow away most other computers on the market, laptop or desktop.
There may be a handful of users who would actually use four TB4 ports, but for each one of those there are many more for whom the SD port or HDMI port is much more valuable.
I am not complying that the laptop cannot run 4 6K displays. I said, I would rather have 4 TB4 ports.
You're only considering the utility of TB4 ports as display ports and not as power, data transfer and display. Very few will use the SD and even less will use the HDMI.
The M1 Max probably cannot support 4 TB ports or if it can, it cannot run 4 6K external displays plus the internal display. The internal display has a higher PPI than the Pro Display XDR and the same XDR specs. So it appears that the M1 Max can support 4 6K displays but not 5, which makes sense. So instead Apple added the SD and HDMI ports which are less resource intensive and do not require educating the customer.
The current MB Pro supports 4 4K displays or 2 5K displays but to do the later requires me to plug each 5K display in different sides of the laptop. I cannot plug them into the same side b/c the controller doesn't support it, which is fine but I need to know that.
The people "complaining" have moved on to USB C buying the dongles needed and been following Apple's direction of USB C and wireless (AirDrop, AirPlay). This is a confusing step backward.
Well, power is supplied separately by the MagSafe port which can actually supply more power than the USB C ports, so that's a non issue, and no one has ignored the other uses of the TB ports, I was simply responding to your earlier post. What I and everyone else have said is that when it comes down to the utility of having a 4th TB4 port vs having the utility and convenience of a HDMI port the HDMI wins. It's not a step backwards, it's actually a step forward for usability and convenience IMO. Not everyone has 'moved on' and even for those who have the convenience of not having to keep track of a dongle is not insignificant.
Case in point - my daughter is at college and needed a laptop. When I asked her what she wanted she said "I don't really want a Mac because it doesn't have the video connection and when I have to do presentations in class I don't want to deal with remembering the connector." I find it laughable when people try to argue that 'pro' is better than convenience or usability.
It's also ironic when people complain about 'the people complaining.' There are a lot of people here that have expressed their happiness over the HDMI port because it makes their life easier. All of the people complaining that Apple brought it back seem to be doing so because it's "a step backwards," not because they actually need the 4th TB port. So one group is glad for a machine that is more usable and the other is mad because of some principled notion of what 'modern' should be. Count me among the people who buy a computer for what it can do rather than what ideals it represents.
Well, power is supplied separately by the MagSafe port which can actually supply more power than the USB C ports, so that's a non issue, and no one has ignored the other uses of the TB ports, I was simply responding to your earlier post. What I and everyone else have said is that when it comes down to the utility of having a 4th TB4 port vs having the utility and convenience of a HDMI port the HDMI wins. It's not a step backwards, it's actually a step forward for usability and convenience IMO. Not everyone has 'moved on' and even for those who have the convenience of not having to keep track of a dongle is not insignificant.
Case in point - my daughter is at college and needed a laptop. When I asked her what she wanted she said "I don't really want a Mac because it doesn't have the video connection and when I have to do presentations in class I don't want to deal with remembering the connector." I find it laughable when people try to argue that 'pro' is better than convenience or usability.
It's also ironic when people complain about 'the people complaining.' There are a lot of people here that have expressed their happiness over the HDMI port because it makes their life easier. All of the people complaining that Apple brought it back seem to be doing so because it's "a step backwards," not because they actually need the 4th TB port. So one group is glad for a machine that is more usable and the other is mad because of some principled notion of what 'modern' should be. Count me among the people who buy a computer for what it can do rather than what ideals it represents.
The MBP can also be powered by the TB4 port. Your point about MagSafe is a good one I forgot about that so that does open up a port for something else. I haven't read where MagSafe supplies "more" power only that the brick supports fast charging. Maybe you read more? But regardless.
"I" find it strange that a college student would purchase a MBP for essentially word processing, spreadsheets, presentations and web surfing. Unless the student is a some sort of art/visual effects or computer science major and requires the processing power of a MBP.
I think we are seeing people complain b/c the MBP audience doesn't need nor want HDMI, SDXC or a headphone jack. In fact, I don't even want the MagSafe cable, similar to what your daughter mentioned it's one more thing to forget. Instead, I'll carry the brick, a couple of TB4 cables and some USB C lightening cables.
The folks that do typically want HDMI also want a lightweight and less expensive machine, but you have a use case for it and I can ignore other ports. So alls good. That's what make the world go round.
I would rather have had another TB4 port than HDMI. What a wasted hole inside the case!
Everyone who needs HDMI already owns a USB C / HDMI dongle. I've even seen some companies use an Apple TV and AirPlay.
If you're going to include HDMI then why only support 60Hz. If I'm a video editor pro and really need the HDMI port wouldn't I want 120Hz?
Perhaps it's useful for a Sales guy using an MacBook Air and I could be wrong but I don't see MacBook Pro users using HDMI.
This is a solution for a problem that no longer still exists.
…and you actually need 4 TB4 ports? There are plenty of people who have older MacBooks who don’t have a dongle. Then there are the people like me who have a dongle that quit working. And all the dongles that got left behind in conference rooms. Or lost when someone else borrowed them and forgot to return them….
Just because it’s not a problem for you doesn’t mean it’s not a problem for anyone.
How do you think he M1 Max supports 3 6K displays and 1 HDTV.
Guessing Apple added the HDMI b/c the M1 Max cannot support 4 6K displays.
Think about what you're saying- you're effectively complaining that a laptop can't support four 6k displays! How many other laptops even come close to that? If you need that kind of power a laptop is not the right choice for you. As it stands the new MBPs are incredibly powerful and capable; they blow away most other computers on the market, laptop or desktop.
There may be a handful of users who would actually use four TB4 ports, but for each one of those there are many more for whom the SD port or HDMI port is much more valuable.
I am not complying that the laptop cannot run 4 6K displays. I said, I would rather have 4 TB4 ports.
You're only considering the utility of TB4 ports as display ports and not as power, data transfer and display. Very few will use the SD and even less will use the HDMI.
The M1 Max probably cannot support 4 TB ports or if it can, it cannot run 4 6K external displays plus the internal display. The internal display has a higher PPI than the Pro Display XDR and the same XDR specs. So it appears that the M1 Max can support 4 6K displays but not 5, which makes sense. So instead Apple added the SD and HDMI ports which are less resource intensive and do not require educating the customer.
The current MB Pro supports 4 4K displays or 2 5K displays but to do the later requires me to plug each 5K display in different sides of the laptop. I cannot plug them into the same side b/c the controller doesn't support it, which is fine but I need to know that.
The people "complaining" have moved on to USB C buying the dongles needed and been following Apple's direction of USB C and wireless (AirDrop, AirPlay). This is a confusing step backward.
Well, power is supplied separately by the MagSafe port which can actually supply more power than the USB C ports, so that's a non issue, and no one has ignored the other uses of the TB ports, I was simply responding to your earlier post. What I and everyone else have said is that when it comes down to the utility of having a 4th TB4 port vs having the utility and convenience of a HDMI port the HDMI wins. It's not a step backwards, it's actually a step forward for usability and convenience IMO. Not everyone has 'moved on' and even for those who have the convenience of not having to keep track of a dongle is not insignificant.
Case in point - my daughter is at college and needed a laptop. When I asked her what she wanted she said "I don't really want a Mac because it doesn't have the video connection and when I have to do presentations in class I don't want to deal with remembering the connector." I find it laughable when people try to argue that 'pro' is better than convenience or usability.
It's also ironic when people complain about 'the people complaining.' There are a lot of people here that have expressed their happiness over the HDMI port because it makes their life easier. All of the people complaining that Apple brought it back seem to be doing so because it's "a step backwards," not because they actually need the 4th TB port. So one group is glad for a machine that is more usable and the other is mad because of some principled notion of what 'modern' should be. Count me among the people who buy a computer for what it can do rather than what ideals it represents.
The MBP can also be powered by the TB4 port. Haven't read where MagSafe supplies "more" power only that the brick supports fast charging. Maybe you read more? But regardless.
I find it strange that a college student would purchase a MBP for essentially word processing, spreadsheets, presentations and web surfing. Unless the student is a computer science or some sort of art/visual effects or other major that requires a MBP.
I think we are seeing people "complain" b/c the MBP audience doesn't need nor want HDMI, SDXC or a headphone jack. In fact, I don't even want the MagSafe cable, like your daughter mentioned it's one more thing to forget. Instead, I'll carry the brick, a couple of TB4 cables and some USB C lightening cables.
The folks that do typically want HDMI also want a lightweight and less expensive machine, but you have a use case for it and I can ignore it. So alls good. That's what make the world go round.
I do hardware and software development for my job. I would say that makes me a “pro”. I frequently use the HDMI port for presentations on my 13” 2015 MBP, I use the 3.5” mini jack for sound and the SD card to import from my $1300 mirrorless camera. At uni, I used all 3 ports just the same. I want those ports. There you go, a first hand rebuttal from a pro, not you who is claiming to speak on behalf of pros.
Regarding the MagSafe cable, good for you. Most people will use the high power MagSafe cable that comes with their Macs. You’re moaning that there’s only 3 TB ports then saying you’re going to waste one by only using USB-C. Let’s be honest, you’ve no intention of buying one at all, you’re just trolling. Either way, having both MagSafe and USB-C charging is good. It’s called choice, much like the choice HDMI/SD gives users. The same choice you’re saying shouldn’t be there. Maybe Apple should remove all ports except MagSafe so then you’d be forced to use MagSafe only, would that make you happier?
@MpIsP never said his daughter wanted a MBP specifically, he said she didn’t want a Mac because of dongle hell.
USB-to-HDMI 2.1 adapters should work at full bandwidth on these Thunderbolt 4 ports. (But I get that the purpose of complaining online isn't to find answers; it is to complain)
I do hardware and software development for my job. I would say that makes me a “pro”. I frequently use the HDMI port for presentations on my 13” 2015 MBP, I use the 3.5” mini jack for sound and the SD card to import from my $1300 mirrorless camera. At uni, I used all 3 ports just the same. I want those ports. There you go, a first hand rebuttal from a pro, not you who is claiming to speak on behalf of pros.
Regarding the MagSafe cable, good for you. Most people will use the high power MagSafe cable that comes with their Macs. You’re moaning that there’s only 3 TB ports then saying you’re going to waste one by only using USB-C. Let’s be honest, you’ve no intention of buying one at all, you’re just trolling. Either way, having both MagSafe and USB-C charging is good. It’s called choice, much like the choice HDMI/SD gives users. The same choice you’re saying shouldn’t be there. Maybe Apple should remove all ports except MagSafe so then you’d be forced to use MagSafe only, would that make you happier?
@MpIsP never said his daughter wanted a MBP specifically, he said she didn’t want a Mac because of dongle hell.
So you have wired headphones and a prosumer camera. Like I said enjoy the ports and I will ignore them b/c Apple isn't changing for either of us.
You don't know me from Adam, so you shouldn't make assumptions about people and their skillsets, but since you want to make it personal this is my last post on the topic. Either way its been beat it to death.
The MagSafe cable nor the brick is "high power" the device/computer is "Fast-charge capable with included 140W USB-C Power Adapter". Which probably means that the device/computer and power adapter can negotiate with each other and support USB PD, the ONLY thing the MagSafe brings to the table is the magnet which unlike the iPhone has NOTHING to do w/how fast the device/computer charges. Being in hardware you would think you would understand the details and be a bit more pedantic when attempting to dress someone down. If when Apple releases more information we may learn whether or not the MagSafe port is the only port to support USB PD or if one of the TB4 ports also supports USB PD. Nice but not particularly important for how I use my laptop.
Lastly, I didn't say the fellow's daughter wanted a MBP. Maybe you should take some of that anger and redirect it to your reading comprehension.
I do hardware and software development for my job. I would say that makes me a “pro”. I frequently use the HDMI port for presentations on my 13” 2015 MBP, I use the 3.5” mini jack for sound and the SD card to import from my $1300 mirrorless camera. At uni, I used all 3 ports just the same. I want those ports. There you go, a first hand rebuttal from a pro, not you who is claiming to speak on behalf of pros.
Regarding the MagSafe cable, good for you. Most people will use the high power MagSafe cable that comes with their Macs. You’re moaning that there’s only 3 TB ports then saying you’re going to waste one by only using USB-C. Let’s be honest, you’ve no intention of buying one at all, you’re just trolling. Either way, having both MagSafe and USB-C charging is good. It’s called choice, much like the choice HDMI/SD gives users. The same choice you’re saying shouldn’t be there. Maybe Apple should remove all ports except MagSafe so then you’d be forced to use MagSafe only, would that make you happier?
@MpIsP never said his daughter wanted a MBP specifically, he said she didn’t want a Mac because of dongle hell.
So you have wired headphones and a prosumer camera. Like I said enjoy the ports and I will ignore them b/c Apple isn't changing for either of us.
You don't know me from Adam, so you shouldn't make assumptions about people and their skillsets, but since you want to make it personal this is my last post on the topic. Either way its been beat it to death.
The MagSafe cable nor the brick is "high power" the device/computer is "Fast-charge capable with included 140W USB-C Power Adapter". Which probably means that the device/computer and power adapter can negotiate with each other and support USB PD, the ONLY thing the MagSafe brings to the table is the magnet which unlike the iPhone has NOTHING to do w/how fast the device/computer charges. Being in hardware you would think you would understand the details and be a bit more pedantic when attempting to dress someone down. If when Apple releases more information we may learn whether or not the MagSafe port is the only port to support USB PD or if one of the TB4 ports also supports USB PD. Nice but not particularly important for how I use my laptop.
Lastly, I didn't say the fellow's daughter wanted a MBP. Maybe you should take some of that anger and redirect it to your reading comprehension.
I never mentioned headphones, but 3.5" jacks are common to connect up to existing sound systems in board rooms, lecture theatres etc.
You were the one who claimed the MBP audience didn't want SD/HDMI, so one could reasonably assume that's not you, else you would have said "I".
140w is high power compared to the previous MagSafe max of 85w. As you point out, only MagSafe is 140w, meaning my previous post was right: people will use the included MagSafe cable and not a USB-C cable. So they won't be losing the port that you will by insisting on using USB-C for charging.
Lastly, I didn't say the fellow's daughter wanted a MBP. Maybe you should take some of that anger and redirect it to your reading comprehension.
Well, you did:
I find it strange that a college student would purchase a MBP for essentially word processing, spreadsheets, presentations and web surfing. Unless the student is a computer science or some sort of art/visual effects or other major that requires a MBP.
But calling you a troll was a little harsh, I apologise. You just seemed insistent on telling everyone what "pros" wanted when no "pro" I've seen posting or writing has complained about having more ports.
Translation: They are NOT SO PRO! Spend all that money and still no 2.1 port... *SMH*
OMG what are we to do? (Price seen below is in Canadian dollars)
This is the problem with these online sellers. HDMI 2.1 is 48gb/s and Thunderbolt tops out at 40gb/s. One cannot run HDMI 2.1 and 4K@120hz over Thunderbolt and these cheap Chinese knockoffs just through misleading advertisements like these.
Well, power is supplied separately by the MagSafe port which can actually supply more power than the USB C ports, so that's a non issue, and no one has ignored the other uses of the TB ports, I was simply responding to your earlier post. What I and everyone else have said is that when it comes down to the utility of having a 4th TB4 port vs having the utility and convenience of a HDMI port the HDMI wins. It's not a step backwards, it's actually a step forward for usability and convenience IMO. Not everyone has 'moved on' and even for those who have the convenience of not having to keep track of a dongle is not insignificant.
Case in point - my daughter is at college and needed a laptop. When I asked her what she wanted she said "I don't really want a Mac because it doesn't have the video connection and when I have to do presentations in class I don't want to deal with remembering the connector." I find it laughable when people try to argue that 'pro' is better than convenience or usability.
It's also ironic when people complain about 'the people complaining.' There are a lot of people here that have expressed their happiness over the HDMI port because it makes their life easier. All of the people complaining that Apple brought it back seem to be doing so because it's "a step backwards," not because they actually need the 4th TB port. So one group is glad for a machine that is more usable and the other is mad because of some principled notion of what 'modern' should be. Count me among the people who buy a computer for what it can do rather than what ideals it represents.
The MBP can also be powered by the TB4 port. Your point about MagSafe is a good one I forgot about that so that does open up a port for something else. I haven't read where MagSafe supplies "more" power only that the brick supports fast charging. Maybe you read more? But regardless.
The MagSafe cable nor the brick is "high power" the device/computer is "Fast-charge capable with included 140W USB-C Power Adapter". Which probably means that the device/computer and power adapter can negotiate with each other and support USB PD, the ONLY thing the MagSafe brings to the table is the magnet which unlike the iPhone has NOTHING to do w/how fast the device/computer charges. Being in hardware you would think you would understand the details and be a bit more pedantic when attempting to dress someone down. If when Apple releases more information we may learn whether or not the MagSafe port is the only port to support USB PD or if one of the TB4 ports also supports USB PD. Nice but not particularly important for how I use my laptop.
I suggest you do a bit more reading and edit your claims.
USB Power Delivery v3.1 specifies power profiles up to 240W but it was just released in May, 2021. Thunderbolt 4 was released July 2020 and only goes up to 100W.
Everyone I know uses one when connecting to a tv for a presentation. All the pros are happy about this. In fact, show me one legitimate pro who says Apple should never have a HDMI and or SD card.
Most Mac pro users are software devs per Craig F. I'm one of them. I don't use HDMI; nor a memory card barely at all, tho when I do it isn't a consumer grade SD, it's beefier CF.
My recollection of what he said is different to what you are claiming.
So bandwidth budget of the M1 Pro is what? 3 x Thunder bolt = 40 x 3 1 x HDMI/SD = 40 SSD = what at least 2x PCIe4 Screen and webcam = another 40 given the size and promotion. Misc
The M1 Pro and Max must have what at least 16 x PCIe 4 interface?
It is. That adapter (and every other) doesn’t support 4k @120 from a Mac…. HDMI 2.1 does. So if you have an LG OLED C1, and want to also use it as a Mac Monitor there is no way to connect it and not be hobbled. Not a huge deal to me right now, but a new MacBook Pro should last many many years. Sucks to start it off with an HDMI port from years ago.
Well, it doesn't support higher than 60Hz on any external displays regardless of how they're connected, HDMI or not. Do other computers support 120Hz on external displays?
(fellow LG C1 owner here, what a beautiful TV it is)
Well, power is supplied separately by the MagSafe port which can actually supply more power than the USB C ports, so that's a non issue, and no one has ignored the other uses of the TB ports, I was simply responding to your earlier post. What I and everyone else have said is that when it comes down to the utility of having a 4th TB4 port vs having the utility and convenience of a HDMI port the HDMI wins. It's not a step backwards, it's actually a step forward for usability and convenience IMO. Not everyone has 'moved on' and even for those who have the convenience of not having to keep track of a dongle is not insignificant.
Case in point - my daughter is at college and needed a laptop. When I asked her what she wanted she said "I don't really want a Mac because it doesn't have the video connection and when I have to do presentations in class I don't want to deal with remembering the connector." I find it laughable when people try to argue that 'pro' is better than convenience or usability.
It's also ironic when people complain about 'the people complaining.' There are a lot of people here that have expressed their happiness over the HDMI port because it makes their life easier. All of the people complaining that Apple brought it back seem to be doing so because it's "a step backwards," not because they actually need the 4th TB port. So one group is glad for a machine that is more usable and the other is mad because of some principled notion of what 'modern' should be. Count me among the people who buy a computer for what it can do rather than what ideals it represents.
The MBP can also be powered by the TB4 port. Your point about MagSafe is a good one I forgot about that so that does open up a port for something else. I haven't read where MagSafe supplies "more" power only that the brick supports fast charging. Maybe you read more? But regardless.
The MagSafe cable nor the brick is "high power" the device/computer is "Fast-charge capable with included 140W USB-C Power Adapter". Which probably means that the device/computer and power adapter can negotiate with each other and support USB PD, the ONLY thing the MagSafe brings to the table is the magnet which unlike the iPhone has NOTHING to do w/how fast the device/computer charges. Being in hardware you would think you would understand the details and be a bit more pedantic when attempting to dress someone down. If when Apple releases more information we may learn whether or not the MagSafe port is the only port to support USB PD or if one of the TB4 ports also supports USB PD. Nice but not particularly important for how I use my laptop.
I suggest you do a bit more reading and edit your claims.
USB Power Delivery v3.1 specifies power profiles up to 240W but it was just released in May, 2021. Thunderbolt 4 was released July 2020 and only goes up to 100W.
If you read the AppleInsider article it links to the Verge article where I pulled the information. If you say what I wrote is incorrect either I copied it incorrectly or the article was incorrect. Either way if your right then my mistake.
But I think we said the same thing? Though I can use the brick and USB PD v3.1 complaint cable, I can only fast charge up to 100W b/c that’s all the TB4 port supports. To get the full 140W that the brick is capable of I must use the MagSafe cable and port.
Which I explained in my EDIT that you didn’t quote.
It depends on how you look at it. When it was plugged in before, you'd get 3x TB4 ports. Now with Mag-safe, you get 3x TB4 ports plus HDMI. When it was unplugged before, you'd get 4x TB4 ports. Now unplugged, you get 3x TB4 plus HDMI.
Unplugged it replaces a port; plugged in, it gives an extra display option. I'd say this is a better compromise as it's unlikely someone would plug in 4x TB4 cables when unplugged from power.
Translation: They are NOT SO PRO! Spend all that money and still no 2.1 port... *SMH*
OMG what are we to do? (Price seen below is in Canadian dollars)
This is the problem with these online sellers. HDMI 2.1 is 48gb/s and Thunderbolt tops out at 40gb/s. One cannot run HDMI 2.1 and 4K@120hz over Thunderbolt and these cheap Chinese knockoffs just through misleading advertisements like these.
Someone please explain to me how an M1Pro MBP can support 2 external 6K Apple XDR displays at 60Hz, M1 Max can support 3 external 6K Apple XDR displays at 60Hz but somehow a Τhunterbolt to HDMI cable downgrades all this to 4K 60Hz?
It depends on how you look at it. When it was plugged in before, you'd get 3x TB4 ports. Now with Mag-safe, you get 3x TB4 ports plus HDMI. When it was unplugged before, you'd get 4x TB4 ports. Now unplugged, you get 3x TB4 plus HDMI.
Unplugged it replaces a port; plugged in, it gives an extra display option. I'd say this is a better compromise as it's unlikely someone would plug in 4x TB4 cables when unplugged from power.
I was looking at it in the exact words you used, "It's not replacing another port" — it quite literally is. I'm not complaining, but eat most certainly is using up a TB port that some people might want when they have no use for HDMI.
Translation: They are NOT SO PRO! Spend all that money and still no 2.1 port... *SMH*
OMG what are we to do? (Price seen below is in Canadian dollars)
This is the problem with these online sellers. HDMI 2.1 is 48gb/s and Thunderbolt tops out at 40gb/s. One cannot run HDMI 2.1 and 4K@120hz over Thunderbolt and these cheap Chinese knockoffs just through misleading advertisements like these.
Someone please explain to me how an M1Pro MBP can support 2 external 6K Apple XDR displays at 60Hz, M1 Max can support 3 external 6K Apple XDR displays at 60Hz but somehow a Τhunterbolt to HDMI cable downgrades all this to 4K 60Hz?
Because it's not 120Hz? They only support 60Hz externally.
It depends on how you look at it. When it was plugged in before, you'd get 3x TB4 ports. Now with Mag-safe, you get 3x TB4 ports plus HDMI. When it was unplugged before, you'd get 4x TB4 ports. Now unplugged, you get 3x TB4 plus HDMI.
Unplugged it replaces a port; plugged in, it gives an extra display option. I'd say this is a better compromise as it's unlikely someone would plug in 4x TB4 cables when unplugged from power.
I was looking at it in the exact words you used, "It's not replacing another port" — it quite literally is. I'm not complaining, but eat most certainly is using up a TB port that some people might want when they have no use for HDMI.
potentially, but on the other hand the HDMI port is a significant convenience for a large number of people.
As I've said before, I'd be willing to bet the number of people who will use the HDMI port significantly outnumber the number of people who would use 4 TB4 ports, especially unplugged from power. Just looking here on AI, there are a lot of people complaining about 'loosing' the 4th TB4 port, but I haven't seen a single one who actually needed it. On the other hand I've seen a large number of people who will use the HDMI & SD ports.
Honestly, these are incredibly powerful machines. Even 3 TB4 ports is a ton of potential - how many laptops on the market can even hold a candle to them?
Translation: They are NOT SO PRO! Spend all that money and still no 2.1 port... *SMH*
OMG what are we to do? (Price seen below is in Canadian dollars)
This is the problem with these online sellers. HDMI 2.1 is 48gb/s and Thunderbolt tops out at 40gb/s. One cannot run HDMI 2.1 and 4K@120hz over Thunderbolt and these cheap Chinese knockoffs just through misleading advertisements like these.
Someone please explain to me how an M1Pro MBP can support 2 external 6K Apple XDR displays at 60Hz, M1 Max can support 3 external 6K Apple XDR displays at 60Hz but somehow a Τhunterbolt to HDMI cable downgrades all this to 4K 60Hz?
Because it's not 120Hz? They only support 60Hz externally.
Can one not run a 4K 120Hz display via the TB ports? Just looking at bandwidth, the HDMI 2.0 spec tops out at 20 Gbps. A 6K 60Hz display needs about 30 Gbps and a 4k 120Hz needs about 25 Gbps so it should be possible.
The HDMI 2.1 spec goes up to 48 Gbps so there is no way a TB4 port can fully support it. I don't know if it's allowable/possible to have a HDMI 2.1 cable with incomplete support or if the spec would require downgrading to HDMI 2.0.
Comments
Case in point - my daughter is at college and needed a laptop. When I asked her what she wanted she said "I don't really want a Mac because it doesn't have the video connection and when I have to do presentations in class I don't want to deal with remembering the connector." I find it laughable when people try to argue that 'pro' is better than convenience or usability.
It's also ironic when people complain about 'the people complaining.' There are a lot of people here that have expressed their happiness over the HDMI port because it makes their life easier. All of the people complaining that Apple brought it back seem to be doing so because it's "a step backwards," not because they actually need the 4th TB port. So one group is glad for a machine that is more usable and the other is mad because of some principled notion of what 'modern' should be. Count me among the people who buy a computer for what it can do rather than what ideals it represents.
"I" find it strange that a college student would purchase a MBP for essentially word processing, spreadsheets, presentations and web surfing. Unless the student is a some sort of art/visual effects or computer science major and requires the processing power of a MBP.
I think we are seeing people complain b/c the MBP audience doesn't need nor want HDMI, SDXC or a headphone jack. In fact, I don't even want the MagSafe cable, similar to what your daughter mentioned it's one more thing to forget. Instead, I'll carry the brick, a couple of TB4 cables and some USB C lightening cables.
The folks that do typically want HDMI also want a lightweight and less expensive machine, but you have a use case for it and I can ignore other ports. So alls good. That's what make the world go round.
@MpIsP never said his daughter wanted a MBP specifically, he said she didn’t want a Mac because of dongle hell.
(But I get that the purpose of complaining online isn't to find answers; it is to complain)
You don't know me from Adam, so you shouldn't make assumptions about people and their skillsets, but since you want to make it personal this is my last post on the topic. Either way its been beat it to death.
The MagSafe cable nor the brick is "high power" the device/computer is "Fast-charge capable with included 140W USB-C Power Adapter". Which probably means that the device/computer and power adapter can negotiate with each other and support USB PD, the ONLY thing the MagSafe brings to the table is the magnet which unlike the iPhone has NOTHING to do w/how fast the device/computer charges. Being in hardware you would think you would understand the details and be a bit more pedantic when attempting to dress someone down. If when Apple releases more information we may learn whether or not the MagSafe port is the only port to support USB PD or if one of the TB4 ports also supports USB PD. Nice but not particularly important for how I use my laptop.
Lastly, I didn't say the fellow's daughter wanted a MBP. Maybe you should take some of that anger and redirect it to your reading comprehension.
EDIT: Seems the MBP, power brick and all the TB4 support USB PD. On the 14" MBP the power delivery is the same regardless of port but b/c the TB4 standard was prior to the USB-C Power Delivery 3.1 standard it tops out at 100W and cannot provide the full 140W of the brick to the 16" MBP, https://www.theverge.com/2021/10/19/22734233/apple-140w-macbook-charging-brick-gan-usb-c-pd-3-1-third-party-chargers
You were the one who claimed the MBP audience didn't want SD/HDMI, so one could reasonably assume that's not you, else you would have said "I".
140w is high power compared to the previous MagSafe max of 85w. As you point out, only MagSafe is 140w, meaning my previous post was right: people will use the included MagSafe cable and not a USB-C cable. So they won't be losing the port that you will by insisting on using USB-C for charging.
Well, you did:
But calling you a troll was a little harsh, I apologise. You just seemed insistent on telling everyone what "pros" wanted when no "pro" I've seen posting or writing has complained about having more ports.
USB Power Delivery v3.1 specifies power profiles up to 240W but it was just released in May, 2021. Thunderbolt 4 was released July 2020 and only goes up to 100W.
https://appleinsider.com/articles/21/10/19/apples-new-16-inch-macbook-pro-charger-uses-gan-to-stay-small
3 x Thunder bolt = 40 x 3
1 x HDMI/SD = 40
SSD = what at least 2x PCIe4
Screen and webcam = another 40 given the size and promotion.
Misc
The M1 Pro and Max must have what at least 16 x PCIe 4 interface?
But I think we said the same thing? Though I can use the brick and USB PD v3.1 complaint cable, I can only fast charge up to 100W b/c that’s all the TB4 port supports. To get the full 140W that the brick is capable of I must use the MagSafe cable and port.
When it was plugged in before, you'd get 3x TB4 ports. Now with Mag-safe, you get 3x TB4 ports plus HDMI.
When it was unplugged before, you'd get 4x TB4 ports. Now unplugged, you get 3x TB4 plus HDMI.
Unplugged it replaces a port; plugged in, it gives an extra display option. I'd say this is a better compromise as it's unlikely someone would plug in 4x TB4 cables when unplugged from power.
As I've said before, I'd be willing to bet the number of people who will use the HDMI port significantly outnumber the number of people who would use 4 TB4 ports, especially unplugged from power. Just looking here on AI, there are a lot of people complaining about 'loosing' the 4th TB4 port, but I haven't seen a single one who actually needed it. On the other hand I've seen a large number of people who will use the HDMI & SD ports.
Honestly, these are incredibly powerful machines. Even 3 TB4 ports is a ton of potential - how many laptops on the market can even hold a candle to them?
Can one not run a 4K 120Hz display via the TB ports? Just looking at bandwidth, the HDMI 2.0 spec tops out at 20 Gbps. A 6K 60Hz display needs about 30 Gbps and a 4k 120Hz needs about 25 Gbps so it should be possible.
The HDMI 2.1 spec goes up to 48 Gbps so there is no way a TB4 port can fully support it. I don't know if it's allowable/possible to have a HDMI 2.1 cable with incomplete support or if the spec would require downgrading to HDMI 2.0.