U.S. antitrust officials ask to be heard in Epic vs. Apple appeal

AppleInsiderAppleInsider
Posted:
in General Discussion edited September 2022
The US Department of Justice has requested to participate in the appeals hearing regarding Epic's case against Apple's App Store policies.




Apple and Epic Games are heading back to court in October, with each party appealing against aspects of the antitrust rulings of a previous lawsuit.

Now, officials from the U.S. Department of Justice are asking to take part in the oral arguments, according to court documents seen by Reuters.

"The United States believes that its participation at oral argument would be helpful to the court, especially in explaining how the errors (in antitrust law interpretation) could significantly harm antitrust enforcement beyond the specific context of this case," the Justice Department wrote in the filing.

Neither party opposed the move. Apple has stated that it wants the Justice Department's argument time to come out of Epic's time or be granted additional time.

While Apple won its case against Epic Games, the company objects to the ruling's "anti-steering" provisions.

Epic maintains that the judge had made too many legal mistakes in her ruling and is seeking a complete retrial.

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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 45
    B-Mc-CB-Mc-C Posts: 41member
    Is that a thing now – the government “participating” or intervening in civil cases between two private parties? Merrick Garland has crossed the line. Such an abuse of power. If you hate Apple, sue them yourselves.
    lolliverdanoxbshank9secondkox2bloggerblogwilliamlondonwatto_cobrazeus423
  • Reply 2 of 45
    KuyangkohKuyangkoh Posts: 838member
    Did Epic sue Google too? Why not Epic
    lolliverbloggerblogmobirdwatto_cobraB-Mc-Czeus423
  • Reply 3 of 45
    mobirdmobird Posts: 758member
    What says the US Justice Dept. is correct in their interpretation?

    I have problems with this move.
    lolliverbshank9secondkox2docbburkwatto_cobraB-Mc-C
  • Reply 4 of 45
    KTRKTR Posts: 280member
    I guess the government don’t like the privacy that the apple store hav to offer.  If wasn’t for the apple store, people would have MORE OVER HEAD 
    lolliver9secondkox2bloggerblogwatto_cobraB-Mc-C
  • Reply 5 of 45
    thttht Posts: 5,611member
    It’s going to be interesting what the government is going to say. Their only real recourse is “steering” the interpretation of US antitrust law towards EU competition laws. The EU laws are sufficiently vague enough such that they can make a minority player run afoul of competition laws. 

    If it is just you plain USA antitrust, they’ve got nothing. Not only that, the market opportunities for developers has only increased since the lawsuit started. If the trial was today, it should be laughed out of court as Epic has multiple ways to get in front of iOS users now, and it has more mobile platforms that is available to them. 
    lolliverwatto_cobraFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 6 of 45
    danoxdanox Posts: 3,278member
    In the future a closed ecosystem maybe better, five thousand programs might be you all you need….. Future software ecosystems won’t be anywhere near as big. Currently Sony, Nintendo, X-Box, and Apple Watch and maybe a future Apple Glasses device will have a relatively small software catalog on purpose.

    Sony, Nintendo, X-Box, and the Apple Watch are full fledged computer ecosystems (in their own right) and all are their own grandpa. (New age Gatekeepers)

    Regional iPhones are coming due to the relentless government interference, they will not stop.

    Under most misguided western government interference in tech, China wins long term as in the Art of War…
    edited September 2022 Madbumwatto_cobraB-Mc-C
  • Reply 7 of 45
    bshankbshank Posts: 257member
    Judges aren’t smart enough to make decisions on their own now?
    9secondkox2watto_cobraFileMakerFellerB-Mc-C
  • Reply 8 of 45
    danoxdanox Posts: 3,278member
    bshank said:
    Judges aren’t smart enough to make decisions on their own now?
    That sentiment applies to all current populations across the world, but the 3% is the group that will hurt you..
    FileMakerFellerzeus423
  • Reply 9 of 45
    22july201322july2013 Posts: 3,695member
    Let the courts do their job. I trust the US Judiciary, even though my trust is moot since I'm not American. Whether you like it or not, bad judgments (in the US) can be appealed, (and often are, as this one was) and if the appeal goes high enough, and Congress doesn't like the judicial ruling by a federal judge, Congress can impeach and the Senate can convict. If it's a state judge (which it isn't in this case), then the US state can impeach. (Every US state except Oregon allows for impeachment of judges.) I think the US Congress has impeached over a dozen federal judges throughout history (perhaps half of them ended up with convictions.) If a judge is impeached for misdeeds on a particular case, that particular case would likely qualify for a retrial, and whichever judge took the case would likely not repeat the same misdeeds that got the former judge impeached, meaning the judgment might flip.
    FileMakerFeller
  • Reply 10 of 45
    9secondkox29secondkox2 Posts: 3,024member
    B-Mc-C said:
    Is that a thing now – the government “participating” or intervening in civil cases between two private parties? Merrick Garland has crossed the line. Such an abuse of power. If you hate Apple, sue them yourselves.
    Unbelievable. Way out of line. 
    Madbumwatto_cobraB-Mc-Czeus423
  • Reply 11 of 45
    MadbumMadbum Posts: 536member
    Now Our current DOJ is taking the side of EPIC, a company that is 49 percent Chinese owned against  Apple, a great American company who is doing so much to better people lives with health features on watch, crash detection and satellite sos .

    Government go to hell, taking side of the Chinese! What is wrong with this government? 
    edited September 2022 9secondkox2watto_cobraB-Mc-C
  • Reply 12 of 45
    MadbumMadbum Posts: 536member
    B-Mc-C said:
    Is that a thing now – the government “participating” or intervening in civil cases between two private parties? Merrick Garland has crossed the line. Such an abuse of power. If you hate Apple, sue them yourselves.
    Unbelievable. Way out of line. 
    Garland might be raiding Tim Cook and his partners underwear drawer next with Bidens blessing

    i friggin voted for the guy!! These people are way out of line! 

    Taking side of Chinese company against Apple and acting like some third world shit hole government raiding political opponents?
    edited September 2022 9secondkox2mobirdwilliamlondonwatto_cobraB-Mc-Czeus423
  • Reply 13 of 45
    9secondkox29secondkox2 Posts: 3,024member
    tht said:
    It’s going to be interesting what the government is going to say. Their only real recourse is “steering” the interpretation of US antitrust law towards EU competition laws. The EU laws are sufficiently vague enough such that they can make a minority player run afoul of competition laws. 

    If it is just you plain USA antitrust, they’ve got nothing. Not only that, the market opportunities for developers has only increased since the lawsuit started. If the trial was today, it should be laughed out of court as Epic has multiple ways to get in front of iOS users now, and it has more mobile platforms that is available to them. 
    If things go according to actual law and the way American court works, the government WONT GET TO SAY ANYTHING. This isn’t government business. This is a private sector dispute between two civil companies. Any government intervention is illegal - hence the request instead of just taking over. Apple is foolish to not oppose such an unconstitutional and illegal interference by the current administration. 

    Kind of seems like we are getting a peak behind the door of what Epics out-of-nowhere lawsuit is really about and who is involved. Sweeney is a goofy dudebro. Not the brightest guy and not a maverick. For him to go there was strange. And now we have to wonder if this doesn’t originate in deeper unexpected places. 
    watto_cobraFileMakerFellerB-Mc-Czeus423
  • Reply 14 of 45
    MadbumMadbum Posts: 536member
    9secondkox2 said:
    tht said:
    It’s going to be interesting what the government is going to say. Their only real recourse is “steering” the interpretation of US antitrust law towards EU competition laws. The EU laws are sufficiently vague enough such that they can make a minority player run afoul of competition laws. 

    If it is just you plain USA antitrust, they’ve got nothing. Not only that, the market opportunities for developers has only increased since the lawsuit started. If the trial was today, it should be laughed out of court as Epic has multiple ways to get in front of iOS users now, and it has more mobile platforms that is available to them. 
    If things go according to actual law and the way American court works, the government WONT GET TO SAY ANYTHING. This isn’t government business. This is a private sector dispute between two civil companies. Any government intervention is illegal - hence the request instead of just taking over. Apple is foolish to not oppose such an unconstitutional and illegal interference by the current administration. 

    Kind of seems like we are getting a peak behind the door of what Epics out-of-nowhere lawsuit is really about and who is involved. Sweeney is a goofy dudebro. Not the brightest guy and not a maverick. For him to go there was strange. And now we have to wonder if this doesn’t originate in deeper unexpected places. 
    Epic and Sweeney is bought and paid for by the Chinese commies. And our DOJ is helping the Chinese commies

    i regret voting Biden in , god help me 
    9secondkox2williamlondonwatto_cobrazeus423
  • Reply 15 of 45
    dope_ahminedope_ahmine Posts: 258member
    9secondkox2 said:
    tht said:
    It’s going to be interesting what the government is going to say. Their only real recourse is “steering” the interpretation of US antitrust law towards EU competition laws. The EU laws are sufficiently vague enough such that they can make a minority player run afoul of competition laws. 

    If it is just you plain USA antitrust, they’ve got nothing. Not only that, the market opportunities for developers has only increased since the lawsuit started. If the trial was today, it should be laughed out of court as Epic has multiple ways to get in front of iOS users now, and it has more mobile platforms that is available to them. 
    If things go according to actual law and the way American court works, the government WONT GET TO SAY ANYTHING. This isn’t government business. This is a private sector dispute between two civil companies. Any government intervention is illegal - hence the request instead of just taking over. Apple is foolish to not oppose such an unconstitutional and illegal interference by the current administration. 

    Kind of seems like we are getting a peak behind the door of what Epics out-of-nowhere lawsuit is really about and who is involved. Sweeney is a goofy dudebro. Not the brightest guy and not a maverick. For him to go there was strange. And now we have to wonder if this doesn’t originate in deeper unexpected places. 
    Deeper, yes. Unexpected, no.
    watto_cobraB-Mc-Czeus423
  • Reply 16 of 45
    mikethemartianmikethemartian Posts: 1,472member
    B-Mc-C said:
    Is that a thing now – the government “participating” or intervening in civil cases between two private parties? Merrick Garland has crossed the line. Such an abuse of power. If you hate Apple, sue them yourselves.
    Yes that has been a thing since long before you have been born since a judge’s ruling sets binding precedent and effects all other antitrust cases that come after it that the DOJ and other third parties will be involved with.
    thtbaconstangwatto_cobradarkvader
  • Reply 17 of 45
    mikethemartianmikethemartian Posts: 1,472member
    dope_ahmine said:
    9secondkox2 said:
    tht said:
    It’s going to be interesting what the government is going to say. Their only real recourse is “steering” the interpretation of US antitrust law towards EU competition laws. The EU laws are sufficiently vague enough such that they can make a minority player run afoul of competition laws. 

    If it is just you plain USA antitrust, they’ve got nothing. Not only that, the market opportunities for developers has only increased since the lawsuit started. If the trial was today, it should be laughed out of court as Epic has multiple ways to get in front of iOS users now, and it has more mobile platforms that is available to them. 
    If things go according to actual law and the way American court works, the government WONT GET TO SAY ANYTHING. This isn’t government business. This is a private sector dispute between two civil companies. Any government intervention is illegal - hence the request instead of just taking over. Apple is foolish to not oppose such an unconstitutional and illegal interference by the current administration. 

    Kind of seems like we are getting a peak behind the door of what Epics out-of-nowhere lawsuit is really about and who is involved. Sweeney is a goofy dudebro. Not the brightest guy and not a maverick. For him to go there was strange. And now we have to wonder if this doesn’t originate in deeper unexpected places. 
    Deeper, yes. Unexpected, no.
    What exact provision of the US Constitution is it violating?
    crowleybaconstang13485
  • Reply 18 of 45
    bulk001bulk001 Posts: 780member
    B-Mc-C said:
    Is that a thing now – the government “participating” or intervening in civil cases between two private parties? Merrick Garland has crossed the line. Such an abuse of power. If you hate Apple, sue them yourselves.
    A very stable genius with presidential armchair ambitions! Given that the case is regarding antitrust issues, it is not an over reach for the government to get involved. The government creates the laws that is being used to determine who is and isn’t right in this case.  :facepalm: 
    baconstangdarkvader
  • Reply 19 of 45
    bloggerblogbloggerblog Posts: 2,502member
    There’s too much money and power in the AppStore so government officials want a piece of it. Apple doing things right by the consumer isn’t a good thing because [insert contradicting reasons here]
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 20 of 45
    foregoneconclusionforegoneconclusion Posts: 2,805member
    Per the Reuters link provide by the article, the Justice Department isn't taking sides in the case but wants an opportunity to present its own view on the correct interpretation of the Sherman Antitrust Act.

    IMO, it doesn't really matter what the Justice Department says or doesn't say about the Sherman Antitrust Act since Apple has pointed out that Epic has never provided any evidence of harm to their business. Fortnite was ported to iOS/Android to make some extra $$ after it had already been a smash hit on consoles and PC. By any definition it was also very successful financially on mobile before Epic decided to intentionally break the rules of the iOS platform as a prelude to filing a lawsuit. As Apple has consistently stated, Fortnite represents a business dispute and not an antitrust issue. Another federal court already dismissed an antitrust lawsuit against Apple by BlueMail by citing the financial success that BlueMail achieved on other platforms with the same app.
    edited September 2022 thtwilliamlondonbaconstangwatto_cobraFileMakerFellerzeus423
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