and the one bad apple matters a lot to the people he kills...
ur right but i'm confused on where u stand, r u saying people shouldn't have guns because of that little incident?
JUST incase ur saying that, i will ask u if u are one of those people who thinks school shootings are a major problem? they are a problem but statistically with all the kids that attend school even throughout the US, the amount of things that happen 2day are still statistically low...relatively high but statistically low
was i making sense? i'm saving my brain juices for the SAT's 2morrow
Now, I wonder how many people who think that this is a good thing also think that teaching kids how to use condoms is a bad thing? Too many, I'm afraid. (Hypocrisy sucks)
That analogy is terrible: teaching guns versus teachng condoms?
the only similarity is that on the unconsciouse register the mind associates guns with the phallus; with active-control; with oral/anal and genital aggression . . .
and you missed the obviouse mr. "resident psychologist"?
other than that there is a simple catagory mistake in your logic: associating the adult-like responsibility of safe sex and keeping procreation out of sex/pleasure and learning how to fire a gun.
I personally think that there is nothing wrong with teaching gun control . . . I do find it strange, though, that anyone would equate learning how to shoot a gun with some kind of "responsibleness," or discipline or even that we can't see the obviouse and see it for its silly equation with masculinity
That analogy is terrible: teaching guns versus teachng condoms?
the only similarity is that on the unconsciouse register the mind associates guns with the phallus; with active-control; with oral/anal and genital aggression . . .
and you missed the obviouse mr. "resident psychologist"?
other than that there is a simple catagory mistake in your logic: associating the adult-like responsibility of safe sex and keeping procreation out of sex/pleasure and learning how to fire a gun.
I personally think that there is nothing wrong with teaching gun control . . . I do find it strange, though, that anyone would equate learning how to shoot a gun with some kind of "responsibleness," or discipline or even that we can't see the obviouse and see it for its silly equation with masculinity
It has nothing to do with masculinity unless you see it that way. My point was that the military is trying to teach responsibility. The spokesperson seemed to equate it with "what one is equipped with." So the natural conclusion is that the military thinks that there is nothing wrong with teaching one how to use what one is equipped with.
Don't read too much into that pfflam. It just seems that they are trying to justify their 'education' with 'it's only natural.'
I'm afraid that you'll need more explanation before I understand your p.o.v.
That analogy is terrible: teaching guns versus teachng condoms?
the only similarity is that on the unconsciouse register the mind associates guns with the phallus; with active-control; with oral/anal and genital aggression . . .
and you missed the obviouse mr. "resident psychologist"?
other than that there is a simple catagory mistake in your logic: associating the adult-like responsibility of safe sex and keeping procreation out of sex/pleasure and learning how to fire a gun.
I personally think that there is nothing wrong with teaching gun control . . . I do find it strange, though, that anyone would equate learning how to shoot a gun with some kind of "responsibleness," or discipline or even that we can't see the obviouse and see it for its silly equation with masculinity
What the hell are you saying boy? No, really. What? Your post is very difficult to follow- perhaps you misread torifile?
out of curiosity, why do you hate it so much. what is your benchmark for good journalisim?
First of all I don't believe that a radio station should receive government funds. I'm not even sure if they do anymore, but even so, I don't like the self righteous attitude exhibited on NPR, nor do I like the fact that it has a bias towards promoting aristocratic socialism. i.e. they wish America were Europe.
I don't want to live in Europe. If I did, I'd move there.
to respond to the SAT-taker (good luck -- or hope it went well), i dont see a reason for most people in this country to own a gun any gun. recreational hunting is just that a recreation, as is muddin' through marshes, one is illegal the other is not and i see no reason why it shouldnt be illegal. my idea is that if you want to hunt in any manner then there should be a set area where that hunting takes place, where you are trained in a weapon which you rent, recieve the appropriate gear for the afternoon, and you leave with a taxodermy nightmare... that would suit the interests of those who currently have to follow the hunting season regulations and would get guns off of the street for the most part. if this is too much for the NRA types -- i dont believe that there is any rational argument for why guns shouldnt have finger print identifiers built in, only the person buying the gun should be able to shoot it and in the eventuality that a murder did occur the gun and thus the murderer would be easily tracked.
as far as the question of the school shootings, i dont think its a problem in regards to the state's gun culture but is a direct indication that our social structures around young adults are producing depressive people with some sort of suicidal urge to take a few out when they go down... and since at that point in their life their family and their school are the two predominant social structures that set the stage for the way they view the world, those are the two institutions where people get killed when a rampaging "little shit" decides to use some guns... basically someone needs to be observing these kids throughout their schooling, i was ultraviolent in school from grades 0 through 3, and my temper is still somewhat short, but in school snapping was just that much easier, i went to a shrink in 3rd grade, and basically wasnt councilled because what the hell are you going to council a 3rd grader in (your mother is still a deep figure in your life, does that make you anxious? do you think you should move out? etc etc). the psychologist just gave me something intellectually stimulating to do in the afternoons outsmarting him in uno, checkers, word games etc, enough that i gained some independent confidence. and damned if anyone would describe me as humble now...
What the hell are you saying boy? No, really. What? Your post is very difficult to follow- perhaps you misread torifile?
Here is what I am saying:
We are a mind that is a small part Consciouseness and large part repressed Uncosciousness.
The unconsciouse mind associates everything in the real world, symbolically to repressed desires.
It works like this:
the develoopment process of an infant involves learning to repress desires and urges while also learning to use that repressed energy through the body . . . the repressed energy is localized in/as different errogenous zones
in other words an infant learns to control certain body functions as they learn to reroute repressed energies to zones of the body
this happens in three stages with three different errogenous zones corresponding to three stages of Body/motor activity developement (they are the Oral, Anal, and Genital phases) and in each phase there is a splitting of active and passive activity which ultimately, in the Genital phase is associated with active--masculinity/passive-feminine: 'Active' moves towards aggression-Sadism, while 'Passive' moves towards Masochism when pushed far
ultimately the energy held back from immediate expression (urges/desires/fears) becomes the Consciousness . . . becomes the EGO
this is basic
The thing about the mind is that the repressed desires and urges never go away
they show themselves repeatedly albeit in repressed form that allows the consciouse mind to acknowledge them yet not be overwhelmed by their reality
Dreams are a realm of pure symbol, where the symbol reveals our wishes and vaguely satisfies the consciouse mind: they are what analysts call "Wish Fullfillment"
The Consciouse mind (EGO) is still like dreams in that it sees every object in the world as both the object that it is, as well as a symbol for some sort of Unconsciuse desire or wish.
Guns are seen as 'Active' and they are overtly aggresive, thus they are associated with masculine and the genital zone as penis
and all that is not even going into the 'Castration Complex' that comes when the child aquires language and recognizes that the body of thier ultimate desires (body of the infant's Mother) is fallible and gendered (castrated)
anyway, another way of saying all this is that boys love their guns cause they make them feel sexy and allow them to simultaneously pretend that they don't want to stroke penises while they symbolically do just that
then, the other thing that I said was that I can not undestand what kind of thinking assumes that learning how to use a gun equates with responsibility and discipline
I mean think about this:
gun usage=adult responsibility (!?!?!?)
I can think of many many other things that really do involve adult responsibility why is gun usage one of them?
its as if, in the minds of gun fan, gun usage is some sacred magical realm with an aura of extra heavy duty juju, the teenager is ceremonially allowed to touch their gun and learn the sacred mysteries
. . . and "now young Johnny, now that you have the juju of the carbine you are truly a man . . . go forth and hit your target"
I mean what the hey?!?! there is nothing special about firing a gun!
It is not responsible, or, not any more so thtn any other thing.
I also was saying that Torofile made a simple mistake of equating rubbers and their usage (which involves the sex act - active penetration of a body with a penis and depositing its 'bullet' of semen) with shooting a gun
However, I think that perhaps I did msread Torifile, and that perhaps he was pointing out the same sort of misreading of adult responsibilities on the part of gun lovers who are also over the top sexuality moralists: how they misread real responsibility (safe sex and sexuality) with th enot necessary responsibility of shooting a gun.
would that be right?
now along with all that I also said that I have no problem with teaching teens to fire guns . . . I just think that it is strange that it is such a big deal, and that anyone would feel that it is in anyway 'special,' or something to go out of the way for.
We should demystify guns of their stupid aura of power and the kind of ritualistic significance they are accorded and see them for the stupid tools that they are
First of all I don't believe that a radio station should receive government funds. I'm not even sure if they do anymore, but even so, I don't like the self righteous attitude exhibited on NPR, nor do I like the fact that it has a bias towards promoting aristocratic socialism. i.e. they wish America were Europe.
I don't want to live in Europe. If I did, I'd move there.
i can certainly understand why some of you would be agianst government funding for public broadcasting even though i disagree with you in that regard. it may not be vital, but government funding in the form of grants and the like to intities such as public radio seems to serve a greater purpose that can not or will not be achieved by comercial broadcast. but hey, i tend to be somewhat of an idealist when come to these type of things. as for the amount of funding, below is a link that breaks down where NPR gets it's money. i was suprised to see how little money they get from the government teat.
regarding the comment about "aristocratic socialism", i'm not sure i understand how you come up with that. NPR certainly offers up some progarming that has a world view, ala the BBC, but i'd hardly call it anything more than one perspective of many. can you shed some more light on that for me? thanks.
i dont think all the psychological analysis really relates. i mean, i think i understand what you're saying, that gun usage subconsciously is acting out the same kind of aggression that penetration may be acting on, but i dont think its necessarily a bad thing for kids. i mean, i understand how some kids may take it the wrong way, become terrible criminals and use the knowledge against mankind, but those are extreme and rare cases. its not bad for people to get out their urges and aggressions. if they can do that in a controlled environment, i think its ok. teaching kids how to use guns isn't like some right of passage or something (atleast, when i was a scout it wasn't). it wasnt like, and now i'm a man because i've shot a gun, and i dont think the elders were even trying to push that idea. its more like, i felt a little more responsible and a little bit further along the line toward growing up, because adults taught me and trusted me with this weapon. the act of firing the weapon, while fun in itself, didn't leave as lasting an impression as being allowed to use the weapon. it wasn't the end of the road, just a notable mark along the way.
Nothing is more dangerous than kids who have no training in firearms safety having access to a gun/guns.
Just like I think kids should learn how to drink alcohol from responsible adults, I think kids should learn how to handle firearms from trained/responsible adults.
Just one kid who knows what's what with guns can save lives. (Although that's just my opinion) Otherwise you get a room full of jackasses waving a loaded weapon around and *BAM* next think you know a kid is dead.
I though you were talking about the great comeback by the Detroit Pistons, after they were down 3-1 against the Orlando Magic in this year's basketball playoffs.
I guess that's just "good", and not necessarily the "best".
Comments
Originally posted by Eugene
"Yo."
"Yo, let's go shoot some people."
* they go outside to shoot people
"Screw that, it's f**kin' cold."
i was told i was the new EmAn so...
Originally posted by billybobsky
two words:
dc sniper
and the one bad apple matters a lot to the people he kills...
ur right but i'm confused on where u stand, r u saying people shouldn't have guns because of that little incident?
JUST incase ur saying that, i will ask u if u are one of those people who thinks school shootings are a major problem? they are a problem but statistically with all the kids that attend school even throughout the US, the amount of things that happen 2day are still statistically low...relatively high but statistically low
was i making sense? i'm saving my brain juices for the SAT's 2morrow
Originally posted by torifile
Now, I wonder how many people who think that this is a good thing also think that teaching kids how to use condoms is a bad thing? Too many, I'm afraid. (Hypocrisy sucks)
That analogy is terrible: teaching guns versus teachng condoms?
the only similarity is that on the unconsciouse register the mind associates guns with the phallus; with active-control; with oral/anal and genital aggression . . .
and you missed the obviouse mr. "resident psychologist"?
other than that there is a simple catagory mistake in your logic: associating the adult-like responsibility of safe sex and keeping procreation out of sex/pleasure and learning how to fire a gun.
I personally think that there is nothing wrong with teaching gun control . . . I do find it strange, though, that anyone would equate learning how to shoot a gun with some kind of "responsibleness," or discipline or even that we can't see the obviouse and see it for its silly equation with masculinity
Originally posted by pfflam
That analogy is terrible: teaching guns versus teachng condoms?
the only similarity is that on the unconsciouse register the mind associates guns with the phallus; with active-control; with oral/anal and genital aggression . . .
and you missed the obviouse mr. "resident psychologist"?
other than that there is a simple catagory mistake in your logic: associating the adult-like responsibility of safe sex and keeping procreation out of sex/pleasure and learning how to fire a gun.
I personally think that there is nothing wrong with teaching gun control . . . I do find it strange, though, that anyone would equate learning how to shoot a gun with some kind of "responsibleness," or discipline or even that we can't see the obviouse and see it for its silly equation with masculinity
It has nothing to do with masculinity unless you see it that way. My point was that the military is trying to teach responsibility. The spokesperson seemed to equate it with "what one is equipped with." So the natural conclusion is that the military thinks that there is nothing wrong with teaching one how to use what one is equipped with.
Don't read too much into that pfflam. It just seems that they are trying to justify their 'education' with 'it's only natural.'
I'm afraid that you'll need more explanation before I understand your p.o.v.
Originally posted by pfflam
That analogy is terrible: teaching guns versus teachng condoms?
the only similarity is that on the unconsciouse register the mind associates guns with the phallus; with active-control; with oral/anal and genital aggression . . .
and you missed the obviouse mr. "resident psychologist"?
other than that there is a simple catagory mistake in your logic: associating the adult-like responsibility of safe sex and keeping procreation out of sex/pleasure and learning how to fire a gun.
I personally think that there is nothing wrong with teaching gun control . . . I do find it strange, though, that anyone would equate learning how to shoot a gun with some kind of "responsibleness," or discipline or even that we can't see the obviouse and see it for its silly equation with masculinity
What the hell are you saying boy? No, really. What? Your post is very difficult to follow- perhaps you misread torifile?
Originally posted by running with scissors
out of curiosity, why do you hate it so much. what is your benchmark for good journalisim?
First of all I don't believe that a radio station should receive government funds. I'm not even sure if they do anymore, but even so, I don't like the self righteous attitude exhibited on NPR, nor do I like the fact that it has a bias towards promoting aristocratic socialism. i.e. they wish America were Europe.
I don't want to live in Europe. If I did, I'd move there.
as far as the question of the school shootings, i dont think its a problem in regards to the state's gun culture but is a direct indication that our social structures around young adults are producing depressive people with some sort of suicidal urge to take a few out when they go down... and since at that point in their life their family and their school are the two predominant social structures that set the stage for the way they view the world, those are the two institutions where people get killed when a rampaging "little shit" decides to use some guns... basically someone needs to be observing these kids throughout their schooling, i was ultraviolent in school from grades 0 through 3, and my temper is still somewhat short, but in school snapping was just that much easier, i went to a shrink in 3rd grade, and basically wasnt councilled because what the hell are you going to council a 3rd grader in (your mother is still a deep figure in your life, does that make you anxious? do you think you should move out? etc etc). the psychologist just gave me something intellectually stimulating to do in the afternoons outsmarting him in uno, checkers, word games etc, enough that i gained some independent confidence. and damned if anyone would describe me as humble now...
Originally posted by serrano
What the hell are you saying boy? No, really. What? Your post is very difficult to follow- perhaps you misread torifile?
Here is what I am saying:
We are a mind that is a small part Consciouseness and large part repressed Uncosciousness.
The unconsciouse mind associates everything in the real world, symbolically to repressed desires.
It works like this:
the develoopment process of an infant involves learning to repress desires and urges while also learning to use that repressed energy through the body . . . the repressed energy is localized in/as different errogenous zones
in other words an infant learns to control certain body functions as they learn to reroute repressed energies to zones of the body
this happens in three stages with three different errogenous zones corresponding to three stages of Body/motor activity developement (they are the Oral, Anal, and Genital phases) and in each phase there is a splitting of active and passive activity which ultimately, in the Genital phase is associated with active--masculinity/passive-feminine: 'Active' moves towards aggression-Sadism, while 'Passive' moves towards Masochism when pushed far
ultimately the energy held back from immediate expression (urges/desires/fears) becomes the Consciousness . . . becomes the EGO
this is basic
The thing about the mind is that the repressed desires and urges never go away
they show themselves repeatedly albeit in repressed form that allows the consciouse mind to acknowledge them yet not be overwhelmed by their reality
Dreams are a realm of pure symbol, where the symbol reveals our wishes and vaguely satisfies the consciouse mind: they are what analysts call "Wish Fullfillment"
The Consciouse mind (EGO) is still like dreams in that it sees every object in the world as both the object that it is, as well as a symbol for some sort of Unconsciuse desire or wish.
Guns are seen as 'Active' and they are overtly aggresive, thus they are associated with masculine and the genital zone as penis
and all that is not even going into the 'Castration Complex' that comes when the child aquires language and recognizes that the body of thier ultimate desires (body of the infant's Mother) is fallible and gendered (castrated)
anyway, another way of saying all this is that boys love their guns cause they make them feel sexy and allow them to simultaneously pretend that they don't want to stroke penises while they symbolically do just that
then, the other thing that I said was that I can not undestand what kind of thinking assumes that learning how to use a gun equates with responsibility and discipline
I mean think about this:
gun usage=adult responsibility (!?!?!?)
I can think of many many other things that really do involve adult responsibility why is gun usage one of them?
its as if, in the minds of gun fan, gun usage is some sacred magical realm with an aura of extra heavy duty juju, the teenager is ceremonially allowed to touch their gun and learn the sacred mysteries
. . . and "now young Johnny, now that you have the juju of the carbine you are truly a man . . . go forth and hit your target"
I mean what the hey?!?! there is nothing special about firing a gun!
It is not responsible, or, not any more so thtn any other thing.
I also was saying that Torofile made a simple mistake of equating rubbers and their usage (which involves the sex act - active penetration of a body with a penis and depositing its 'bullet' of semen) with shooting a gun
However, I think that perhaps I did msread Torifile, and that perhaps he was pointing out the same sort of misreading of adult responsibilities on the part of gun lovers who are also over the top sexuality moralists: how they misread real responsibility (safe sex and sexuality) with th enot necessary responsibility of shooting a gun.
would that be right?
now along with all that I also said that I have no problem with teaching teens to fire guns . . . I just think that it is strange that it is such a big deal, and that anyone would feel that it is in anyway 'special,' or something to go out of the way for.
We should demystify guns of their stupid aura of power and the kind of ritualistic significance they are accorded and see them for the stupid tools that they are
Anyway, my point wasn't an analogy at all. It was an outloud wondering about consistency in beliefs.
Originally posted by Splinemodel
First of all I don't believe that a radio station should receive government funds. I'm not even sure if they do anymore, but even so, I don't like the self righteous attitude exhibited on NPR, nor do I like the fact that it has a bias towards promoting aristocratic socialism. i.e. they wish America were Europe.
I don't want to live in Europe. If I did, I'd move there.
i can certainly understand why some of you would be agianst government funding for public broadcasting even though i disagree with you in that regard. it may not be vital, but government funding in the form of grants and the like to intities such as public radio seems to serve a greater purpose that can not or will not be achieved by comercial broadcast. but hey, i tend to be somewhat of an idealist when come to these type of things. as for the amount of funding, below is a link that breaks down where NPR gets it's money. i was suprised to see how little money they get from the government teat.
regarding the comment about "aristocratic socialism", i'm not sure i understand how you come up with that. NPR certainly offers up some progarming that has a world view, ala the BBC, but i'd hardly call it anything more than one perspective of many. can you shed some more light on that for me? thanks.
NPR funding
Just like I think kids should learn how to drink alcohol from responsible adults, I think kids should learn how to handle firearms from trained/responsible adults.
Just one kid who knows what's what with guns can save lives. (Although that's just my opinion) Otherwise you get a room full of jackasses waving a loaded weapon around and *BAM* next think you know a kid is dead.
I though you were talking about the great comeback by the Detroit Pistons, after they were down 3-1 against the Orlando Magic in this year's basketball playoffs.
I guess that's just "good", and not necessarily the "best".