Why do they make it sound like you have to get it from an online order and not the stores?
right, and make it sound like it's built in,
quote:
Bluetooth-ready
Support for Bluetooth is built into every new iBook G4 model. Like AirPort Extreme, Bluetooth connects wirelessly to digital devices like Bluetooth-enabled mobile phones, handhelds and peripherals. What?s more, you can even choose to enjoy a cable-free desktop with Apple?s Bluetooth-enabled wireless keyboard and mouse. Operating within a short range, it enables wireless data transfers between a rapidly growing list of Bluetooth-savvy peripherals. Using iSync, for instance, you can use Bluetooth to synchronize your personal information between your iBook, your mobile phone and your Palm OS-based handheld.
Someone over in the MacRumors forums pointed out that nowhere on the new iBook pages is any mention made of the Velocity Engine. Since I was looking for a break from getting ready for my dissertation proposal I became intrigued.
Sure enough, on every other G4-based system mention is made of AltiVec under Tech Specs. Heck, for the iMac and eMac there is even a special G4 tab that has a little picture of what the VE does!
Propbably this is nothing more than intriguing, but I wonder if there is any chance this means anything (and seeing as how there is no Developers Note up yet, looks like we can't find out until someone gets to play with one of these).
That is kinda weird. I highly doubt it's some kind of G4 without Altivec though. It's an integral part of the chip.
I'm still surprised they didn't use the 7457/7447 in the iBook. The whole transition to that chip, which has been awaited for years now, was really quite a let down, because the new PowerBooks didn't seem to increase in battery life, and by all accounts don't feel any cooler, and to top it off, they dropped the L3 cache. In that sense, the PowerBooks got worse when they went to the 7457.
I think the reason this isn't beng promted highly by apple is because it really isn't that much of an upgrade. I'm begining to wonder if it is the same motherboard with a few new chips soldered in place. I'm begining to believe this is just a grab for the holiday market.
Lets face it the base ram is 128M soldered in and another 128 in the expansion slot. This release is nothing more than a slight tweak to the old machines. It will be interesting to see the perfromance figures though.
Initially like everyone else I was very excited with this new iBook. Now that I've had a few minutes to digest the product it looks a bit lacking. Maybe the performance figures will change my mind, but at this point I'm not hopeing for all that much.
Dave
Quote:
Originally posted by thuh Freak
why the fvck would apple have not changed their fp for this? I go to the front page, and I see a big advert for a free program, FOR WINDOWS! I would think that the iBook line is more important than iTunes+iTMS. And yet iBook G4 gets a small mention in the bottom corner.
I really like the PBG5 possibilities now though. I was trying to be pessimistic, and hope in a year. Now it looks far too likely for January.
I think the reason this isn't beng promted highly by apple is because it really isn't that much of an upgrade. I'm begining to wonder if it is the same motherboard with a few new chips soldered in place. I'm begining to believe this is just a grab for the holiday market.
On the up side reloading the Apple front page will ocassionally show the new iBook as the big center graphic (relegating iTunes to one of the small squares at the bottom).
FYI to all - the Radeon 9200 is pretty weak. Don't know about the mobile version, but the desktop version of the 9200 is slapped around by the desktop version of the FX 5200 in the pb 12" see
All this after it was pretty much settled that the Mobility 7500 in the iBooks was at least as good as the FX 5200go in the pb 12"
I really hope this isn't a downgrade in overall performance. And of course losing the monitor spanning hack would be even worse if the new cards can't be uncrippled.
The figures that the ATI Radeon 9200 is posting in the review aren't bad at all.
Put it this way, I have the GeForce 4 Ti4200 at home in my PC, and all of the cards in the review are in the same ballpark performance-wise.
Yes but apple is advertising that the cache (L2) runs at full processor speed. I thought at one time that the cahce (L2) on the 7455 ran at half speed. Maybe somebody with a motorola manual can verify this. It is still a mystery to me which processor is actually in these machines.
Thanks
dave
Quote:
Originally posted by BRussell
It appears to be using the old 7455/7445 G4s instead of the new 7s (because of the 256 rather than 512 cache). I wonder why.
First of all this rocks for most people! Now folks can get a low end ibook with combo drive for 1100 or less if you are a student. This is hugely important psychologically. Students will see an immediate improvement in MP3 ripping times 8)
Seriously though, The very cheap portable G4 will tempt some creative windows types to get one as a little video editor or photo studio. And great timing with the panther publicity. I can see lots of macheads owning much older machines making this their bridge machine to get current while they wait for the G5s to fall in price and spread downward in the lineup.
There are just several issues for us "iBook power users" that might be disconcerting. \
If indeed this chip is an older 7455 this is mixed news - what about the ibook's famed battery life? Did Apple put the rest of the components on a tighter power budget or something or will we see battery life drop from the 3.5+ hours to the 2+ hours range where the powerbooks have been hovering recently? If this is not the 7455 could it be an IBM G3+Altivec rebranded? Is there something in the bus speed/ L2 cache numbers which say definitively either way?
Also, what about all of the work that went into hacking the ATI 7500 graphix cards to support monitor spanning? That hack made the iBook into suitable main computer for poorer 2D creatives who need screen real estate but not the horsepower for video encoding and such. I hope that the ATI 9200 has not been sealed off by Apple from enabling these supported features in order to protect the now precarious position of the little powerbooks. I do have a suspicion that this is why the video cards changed though.
Lastly and least importantly, it seems Apple is taking some cues from people that the all white look was not going over so well. The new iBooks appear to be clad similarly to the previous G3 800 generation internally (Silver inner faces), but has the transparent outer shell returned? To my mind the opaque white outer casing on the G3 900 iBooks looks terrible, and I can't tell from the gallery photos whether the outer is back the the good old days. If they do have a transparent casing with this slot loading drive I deem these the most beautiful iBooks ever!
So in essence, I'm hopefull, but uneasy until some of the uncertainty is cleared up.
Peace,
Curufinwe
It's far more likely that Apple has chosen the ATI Radeon 9200 because:
a) Apple wants the iBook to have a competitive graphics chip. The ATI 7500 was showing its age...
or
b) ATI may have EOL'd (end of lifed) the Radeon 7500. If so the chip would not be available to OEMs for much longer.
I think I've mentioned here before that I have been giving strong consideration to buying a laptop for my 4th year of school.
I'm a University student, so as far as my budget goes, iBook G4 = I'm sold!!!
Very nice update.
I also believe that this bump to the iBook line means that we will see G5 Powerbooks soon. Does this mean it will happen tomorrow? No. In the near future though? Definately.
AFAIK, the bluetooth on the BTO machines is internal. I think if you don't get it BTO, then you have to get an external bluetooth module.
From technical specs on the Apple website:
"optional internal Bluetooth module available"
You are right. Actually, I had edited my post at the top of this page with a "as far as I can tell" at the end... didn't take for some reason though.
After my first read through the specs page I didn't notice the internal reference, and was making that assumption based on these images (from the online store):
For the iMac's customization page (which I know is internal):
Now from the iBook's customization page:
I took the lack of "internal" there as an indication that it was an external module. Bad murbot, research properly before opening your pie hole.
Comments
Why do they make it sound like you have to get it from an online order and not the stores?
EDIT: I just saw this at Apple's iBook tech specs section:
AirPort Extreme ready; optional internal Bluetooth module available
Now I'm confused...
Originally posted by pscates
Oh, is this that Dlink thing then?
Why do they make it sound like you have to get it from an online order and not the stores?
right, and make it sound like it's built in,
quote:
Bluetooth-ready
Support for Bluetooth is built into every new iBook G4 model. Like AirPort Extreme, Bluetooth connects wirelessly to digital devices like Bluetooth-enabled mobile phones, handhelds and peripherals. What?s more, you can even choose to enjoy a cable-free desktop with Apple?s Bluetooth-enabled wireless keyboard and mouse. Operating within a short range, it enables wireless data transfers between a rapidly growing list of Bluetooth-savvy peripherals. Using iSync, for instance, you can use Bluetooth to synchronize your personal information between your iBook, your mobile phone and your Palm OS-based handheld.
nice books though so i'll buy the 15" 1.25Ghz PB
From technical specs on the Apple website:
"optional internal Bluetooth module available"
Originally posted by Gabid
Someone over in the MacRumors forums pointed out that nowhere on the new iBook pages is any mention made of the Velocity Engine. Since I was looking for a break from getting ready for my dissertation proposal I became intrigued.
Sure enough, on every other G4-based system mention is made of AltiVec under Tech Specs. Heck, for the iMac and eMac there is even a special G4 tab that has a little picture of what the VE does!
Propbably this is nothing more than intriguing, but I wonder if there is any chance this means anything (and seeing as how there is no Developers Note up yet, looks like we can't find out until someone gets to play with one of these).
That is kinda weird. I highly doubt it's some kind of G4 without Altivec though. It's an integral part of the chip.
I'm still surprised they didn't use the 7457/7447 in the iBook. The whole transition to that chip, which has been awaited for years now, was really quite a let down, because the new PowerBooks didn't seem to increase in battery life, and by all accounts don't feel any cooler, and to top it off, they dropped the L3 cache. In that sense, the PowerBooks got worse when they went to the 7457.
Now all Apple's computer run altivec. This is a great new for more altivec optimisation, even in the OS.
Lets face it the base ram is 128M soldered in and another 128 in the expansion slot. This release is nothing more than a slight tweak to the old machines. It will be interesting to see the perfromance figures though.
Initially like everyone else I was very excited with this new iBook. Now that I've had a few minutes to digest the product it looks a bit lacking. Maybe the performance figures will change my mind, but at this point I'm not hopeing for all that much.
Dave
Originally posted by thuh Freak
why the fvck would apple have not changed their fp for this? I go to the front page, and I see a big advert for a free program, FOR WINDOWS! I would think that the iBook line is more important than iTunes+iTMS. And yet iBook G4 gets a small mention in the bottom corner.
I really like the PBG5 possibilities now though. I was trying to be pessimistic, and hope in a year. Now it looks far too likely for January.
Originally posted by wizard69
I think the reason this isn't beng promted highly by apple is because it really isn't that much of an upgrade. I'm begining to wonder if it is the same motherboard with a few new chips soldered in place. I'm begining to believe this is just a grab for the holiday market.
On the up side reloading the Apple front page will ocassionally show the new iBook as the big center graphic (relegating iTunes to one of the small squares at the bottom).
Originally posted by Curufinwe
FYI to all - the Radeon 9200 is pretty weak.
The mobility Radeon 9200 is actually pretty good. Its no MR9600 but still way better than the 7500.
Originally posted by Curufinwe
FYI to all - the Radeon 9200 is pretty weak. Don't know about the mobile version, but the desktop version of the 9200 is slapped around by the desktop version of the FX 5200 in the pb 12" see
http://www.neoseeker.com/Articles/Ha...92p/index.html
All this after it was pretty much settled that the Mobility 7500 in the iBooks was at least as good as the FX 5200go in the pb 12"
I really hope this isn't a downgrade in overall performance. And of course losing the monitor spanning hack would be even worse if the new cards can't be uncrippled.
The figures that the ATI Radeon 9200 is posting in the review aren't bad at all.
Put it this way, I have the GeForce 4 Ti4200 at home in my PC, and all of the cards in the review are in the same ballpark performance-wise.
Thanks
dave
Originally posted by BRussell
It appears to be using the old 7455/7445 G4s instead of the new 7s (because of the 256 rather than 512 cache). I wonder why.
Originally posted by Curufinwe
Arghh!!! Feeling... So... Conflicted...
First of all this rocks for most people! Now folks can get a low end ibook with combo drive for 1100 or less if you are a student. This is hugely important psychologically. Students will see an immediate improvement in MP3 ripping times 8)
Seriously though, The very cheap portable G4 will tempt some creative windows types to get one as a little video editor or photo studio. And great timing with the panther publicity. I can see lots of macheads owning much older machines making this their bridge machine to get current while they wait for the G5s to fall in price and spread downward in the lineup.
There are just several issues for us "iBook power users" that might be disconcerting.
If indeed this chip is an older 7455 this is mixed news - what about the ibook's famed battery life? Did Apple put the rest of the components on a tighter power budget or something or will we see battery life drop from the 3.5+ hours to the 2+ hours range where the powerbooks have been hovering recently? If this is not the 7455 could it be an IBM G3+Altivec rebranded? Is there something in the bus speed/ L2 cache numbers which say definitively either way?
Also, what about all of the work that went into hacking the ATI 7500 graphix cards to support monitor spanning? That hack made the iBook into suitable main computer for poorer 2D creatives who need screen real estate but not the horsepower for video encoding and such. I hope that the ATI 9200 has not been sealed off by Apple from enabling these supported features in order to protect the now precarious position of the little powerbooks. I do have a suspicion that this is why the video cards changed though.
Lastly and least importantly, it seems Apple is taking some cues from people that the all white look was not going over so well. The new iBooks appear to be clad similarly to the previous G3 800 generation internally (Silver inner faces), but has the transparent outer shell returned? To my mind the opaque white outer casing on the G3 900 iBooks looks terrible, and I can't tell from the gallery photos whether the outer is back the the good old days. If they do have a transparent casing with this slot loading drive I deem these the most beautiful iBooks ever!
So in essence, I'm hopefull, but uneasy until some of the uncertainty is cleared up.
Peace,
Curufinwe
It's far more likely that Apple has chosen the ATI Radeon 9200 because:
a) Apple wants the iBook to have a competitive graphics chip. The ATI 7500 was showing its age...
or
b) ATI may have EOL'd (end of lifed) the Radeon 7500. If so the chip would not be available to OEMs for much longer.
I'm a University student, so as far as my budget goes, iBook G4 = I'm sold!!!
Very nice update.
I also believe that this bump to the iBook line means that we will see G5 Powerbooks soon. Does this mean it will happen tomorrow? No. In the near future though? Definately.
...
..
..
It is still a mystery to me which processor is actually in these machines.
Its a 7455 without the ext L3 cache. Don't you think that Moto now has a few of these lying around and at a pretty low price.
G4 in an iBook at a low price--for the masses. If you want bleeding edge get a G5.
Originally posted by Kecksy
Pretty nice deal, for $899.
Not really, it only has a CD-ROM drive. For $300 more, get a combo, G4, slot loading, video card etc...
But I know what you're saying.
Originally posted by rajk
AFAIK, the bluetooth on the BTO machines is internal. I think if you don't get it BTO, then you have to get an external bluetooth module.
From technical specs on the Apple website:
"optional internal Bluetooth module available"
You are right. Actually, I had edited my post at the top of this page with a "as far as I can tell" at the end... didn't take for some reason though.
After my first read through the specs page I didn't notice the internal reference, and was making that assumption based on these images (from the online store):
For the iMac's customization page (which I know is internal):
Now from the iBook's customization page:
I took the lack of "internal" there as an indication that it was an external module. Bad murbot, research properly before opening your pie hole.
the linked PC card review page mentions the 9200 has "twin monitor support"
however, it also mentions that some features are "locked" and require BIOS flash
give it a few days and we'll see if the OF Spanning Hack works
(emailed the guy at macparts.de/ibook to ask if he'll test it)
if you can still Hack to get spanning, this iBook will fly.
800MHz PowerPC G4
12-inch TFT Display
256MB DDR266 memory
DVD/CD-RW drive
ATI Mobility Radeon 9200
+40GB Ultra ATA drive and Pather 1000?. Finally a mac that I can afford (I´am a student). I´am so happy