After that you suddenly go "oh, the article doesn't actually matter,
Where did I say that?
Quote:
Originally posted by Gon
and Chomsky does not matter either, but the people who listen to Chomsky are dangerous".
You yourself describe him as an anarchist.
Quote:
Originally posted by Gon
But you haven't read Chomsky, so you haven't the faintest idea what Chomsky stands for.
You already know that that's a fallacy. And I've given you plenty of examples. I need not have read Hitler or Marx to know what Nazism or Communism is about.
Quote:
Originally posted by Gon
Sorry, but this is thundering idiocy. I don't even think of Chomsky as being far to the left politically. He's more of an anarchist, and actually does not oppose things like free markets, only the bad leadership that comes when you let the market influence the government instead of democratic process. I am very much in favor of capitalism, yet I find most of Chomsky's commentary convincing.
To what end? Would you be against Labour unions endorsing political candidates?
Ah. Aha. Ahahaha. Aheeheeheeheeheeheehee ha ha. A BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. HOOOOOOOOOOOOhoohoohooohoohoohoohoohoohoohoohoohoo hoohoohoohoo.
Ah. Aha. Ahahaha. Aheeheeheeheeheeheehee ha ha. A BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. HOOOOOOOOOOOOhoohoohooohoohoohoohoohoohoohoohoohoo hoohoohoohoo.
And please explain to me what's right wing about (National) Socialism?
Quote:
Originally posted by JewelsVernz
I need not have read Hitler or Marx to know what Nazism or Communism is about.
If you don't know what is right wing about what the Nazi party referred to as National Socialism (and the extent to which it is about as different from Marxist International Socialism as chalk is from cheese) you obviously do need to do some reading.
Mein Kampf might not be the best place for you to start, however...
If you don't know what is right wing about what the Nazi party referred to as National Socialism (and the extent to which it is about as different from Marxist International Socialism as chalk is from cheese) you obviously do need to do some reading.
Mein Kampf might not be the best place for you to start, however...
I'm waiting on Harald to elucidate on the subject. Please don't interrupt Hassan.
Bash America. Now answer the question posed to you.
No, that's not Chomsky's thesis. You lose.
Now, "socialism" is often considered as the workers owning the means of production. It is considered by, well, everyone, as being left wing (but not as left wing as you can get, which is communism).
Nazism is a violent nationlist movement characterised by extreme racism and hatred. It is considered to be as right wing as you can get.
Hope this helps! For further reading try ANY SOURCE ANYWHERE.
Sorry I couldn't match "bash America" for its insight etc.
So according to this, Hitler called his Nazi party such because he wished to discredit Socialism. I suppose Stalin called himself communist because he wished to discredit Communism.
So according to this, Hitler called his Nazi party such because he wished to discredit Socialism. I suppose Stalin called himself communist because he wished to discredit Communism.
The document I linked to does not say that at all. Either you didn't read it or your reading comprehension is sub-par.
Let's look at it this way. North Korea refers to itself as the 'Democratic Peoples Republic of Korea' when it is in fact an authoritarian Stalinist dictatorship.
Some things are a matter of opinion and some things are a matter of fact. The Earth is round. Things fall when you drop them and Nazism != Socialism.
Now, "socialism" is often considered as the workers owning the means of production. It is considered by, well, everyone, as being left wing (but not as left wing as you can get, which is communism).
Nazism is a violent nationlist movement characterised by extreme racism and hatred. It is considered to be as right wing as you can get.
Hope this helps! For further reading try ANY SOURCE ANYWHERE.
Sorry I couldn't match "bash America" for its insight etc.
LOL
So although the Nazi party has all the ideological hallmarks of Socialism, it's not really left wing because,.. because the Nazi movement was also characterized by extreme racism and hatred. So naturally it is right wing.
I wonder what Stalin or Saddam would have to say about that.
So although the Nazi party has all the ideological hallmarks of Socialism.
This is false.
Here, to save you clicking on the link I provided are the facts...
Quote:
Reasons Nazism is considered socialist
Self-depiction: the German Nazi Party called itself the "National Socialist Worker's Party", and in 1927, Hitler said, "We are socialists."
The Left Wing (examples include Gregor Strasser and Ernst Röhm), and working class brownshirts (or Sturmabteilung) within the Nazi Party supported socialist programs.
One writer, Lew Rockwell at the Ludwig von Mises Institute, suggests that the chief difference beween Nazism and (as he puts it) others forms of socialism is that the Hitler's socialism was nationalistic while other forms (such as Communism) were internationalist.
The Nazis implemented an extensive system of wage and price controls, as well as pervasive government controls on investment and international trade.
Reasons Nazism is not considered socialist
Throughout its rise to power and rule, the Nazis were strongly opposed by left-wing and socialist parties, and Nazi rhetoric was virulently anti-Marxist, attacking both communists and social democrats. A central appeal of Nazism was its opposition to Marxism and other forms of socialism and its claim to be a bulwark against Bolshevism and this is why they recieved so much material and political support from industrialists and conservatives.
The Nazi ideology saw socialist collectivism as part of a Jewish conspiracy (Judeo-Bolshevism) meant to undermine the elitist principle.
Nazis proposed that only people who were considered "racially pure" or Aryan would benefit from their policies. This can be seen as contrary to the socialist ideal of a society for the benefit of all.
In his rise to power, Hitler reassured German industrialists that he would respect private property and fight labor unions. To the extent that permitting private property to exist is contrary to "socialism", then Nazism was not "socialist". On the other hand, some democratic countries (like Sweden) have adopted some (but not all) socialist ideas while retaining a degree of freedom to own private property and have labor unions.
Hitler received strong support from conservatives for the "Enabling Act." This legislation was opposed by social democrats.
After coming to power, Hitler sent thousand of communists, social democrats and unionists to concentration camps and killed communist leaders in Germany. He outlawed labor unions and guaranteed corporate profits for Krupp & Co.
The profits of large corporations soared under the Nazis. With the exception of Jewish property which was seized and sold, capitalist enterprises were not expropriated or nationalised but remained in private hands.
The Nazis were anti-egalitarian believing in neither equality (either among Germans or between Germans and non-Germans), collectivism, nor the rights of the "masses". According to Hitler biographer Ian Kershaw they had an elitist view of society and asserted that in competition with each other the superior individual would emerge on top. Despite the use of slogans such as "the common good comes before the private good" their vision of social relations, in practice, was in line with the ideas of Nietzche rather than Karl Marx.
During the party's ascendency in the 1930s, so called "left wing" Nazis such as Gregor Strasser and Ernst Röhm were ruthlessly purged and even killed.
For reasons that ought to be obvious this thread is closed for time being
EDIT: After thinking about it (and reading the last page) I see no reason to reopen this even after this little operation. Please feel free to start another thread if the subject interest you.
Comments
Originally posted by Gon
After that you suddenly go "oh, the article doesn't actually matter,
Where did I say that?
Originally posted by Gon
and Chomsky does not matter either, but the people who listen to Chomsky are dangerous".
You yourself describe him as an anarchist.
Originally posted by Gon
But you haven't read Chomsky, so you haven't the faintest idea what Chomsky stands for.
You already know that that's a fallacy. And I've given you plenty of examples. I need not have read Hitler or Marx to know what Nazism or Communism is about.
Originally posted by Gon
Sorry, but this is thundering idiocy. I don't even think of Chomsky as being far to the left politically. He's more of an anarchist, and actually does not oppose things like free markets, only the bad leadership that comes when you let the market influence the government instead of democratic process. I am very much in favor of capitalism, yet I find most of Chomsky's commentary convincing.
To what end? Would you be against Labour unions endorsing political candidates?
Ha.
God.
Shit, that's pretty funny.
What's right wing about Nazism?
Anyone?
Originally posted by Harald
Ah. Aha. Ahahaha. Aheeheeheeheeheeheehee ha ha. A BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. HOOOOOOOOOOOOhoohoohooohoohoohoohoohoohoohoohoohoo hoohoohoohoo.
Ha.
God.
Shit, that's pretty funny.
What's right wing about Nazism?
Anyone?
How about you answer it?
Originally posted by JewelsVernz
I need not have read Hitler or Marx to know what Nazism or Communism is about.
Great!
What's Chomsky's thesis then?
Originally posted by kneelbeforezod
Gesundheit
Good one Hassan.
Originally posted by JewelsVernz
How about you answer it?
OK, if I answer that (shouldn't be too hard) will you tell us all what Chomsky's thesis is?
No Google now!
Originally posted by Harald
Great!
What's Chomsky's thesis then?
Bash America. Now answer the question posed to you.
Originally posted by JewelsVernz
And please explain to me what's right wing about (National) Socialism?
Originally posted by JewelsVernz
I need not have read Hitler or Marx to know what Nazism or Communism is about.
If you don't know what is right wing about what the Nazi party referred to as National Socialism (and the extent to which it is about as different from Marxist International Socialism as chalk is from cheese) you obviously do need to do some reading.
Mein Kampf might not be the best place for you to start, however...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Socialism
Originally posted by kneelbeforezod
If you don't know what is right wing about what the Nazi party referred to as National Socialism (and the extent to which it is about as different from Marxist International Socialism as chalk is from cheese) you obviously do need to do some reading.
Mein Kampf might not be the best place for you to start, however...
I'm waiting on Harald to elucidate on the subject. Please don't interrupt Hassan.
Originally posted by JewelsVernz
Bash America. Now answer the question posed to you.
No, that's not Chomsky's thesis. You lose.
Now, "socialism" is often considered as the workers owning the means of production. It is considered by, well, everyone, as being left wing (but not as left wing as you can get, which is communism).
Nazism is a violent nationlist movement characterised by extreme racism and hatred. It is considered to be as right wing as you can get.
Hope this helps! For further reading try ANY SOURCE ANYWHERE.
Sorry I couldn't match "bash America" for its insight etc.
Originally posted by kneelbeforezod
Start here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Socialism
LOL.
So according to this, Hitler called his Nazi party such because he wished to discredit Socialism. I suppose Stalin called himself communist because he wished to discredit Communism.
Originally posted by JewelsVernz
So according to this, Hitler called his Nazi party such because he wished to discredit Socialism. I suppose Stalin called himself communist because he wished to discredit Communism.
The document I linked to does not say that at all. Either you didn't read it or your reading comprehension is sub-par.
Let's look at it this way. North Korea refers to itself as the 'Democratic Peoples Republic of Korea' when it is in fact an authoritarian Stalinist dictatorship.
Some things are a matter of opinion and some things are a matter of fact. The Earth is round. Things fall when you drop them and Nazism != Socialism.
Originally posted by Harald
No, that's not Chomsky's thesis. You lose.
Now, "socialism" is often considered as the workers owning the means of production. It is considered by, well, everyone, as being left wing (but not as left wing as you can get, which is communism).
Nazism is a violent nationlist movement characterised by extreme racism and hatred. It is considered to be as right wing as you can get.
Hope this helps! For further reading try ANY SOURCE ANYWHERE.
Sorry I couldn't match "bash America" for its insight etc.
LOL
So although the Nazi party has all the ideological hallmarks of Socialism, it's not really left wing because,.. because the Nazi movement was also characterized by extreme racism and hatred. So naturally it is right wing.
I wonder what Stalin or Saddam would have to say about that.
Originally posted by JewelsVernz
So although the Nazi party has all the ideological hallmarks of Socialism.
This is false.
Here, to save you clicking on the link I provided are the facts...
Reasons Nazism is considered socialist
Reasons Nazism is not considered socialist
Post removed. I should know better then get into arguments with anti-semites like Mika.
Originally posted by kneelbeforezod
...
I asked that you please don't interrupt. (I deal with you later).
EDIT: After thinking about it (and reading the last page) I see no reason to reopen this even after this little operation. Please feel free to start another thread if the subject interest you.