I don't believe that "either offive or plain nothin'" story anyway. But, just stretching, if that story contains any sort of truth in it, THAN indeed it is simply called "blackmailing", isn't it?
It's closer to coercion, but this is Microsoft, they get away with it all the time.
(Blackmail = 'getting money through intimidation'. Coercion = 'compelling by force of authority')
Jobs showed Microsoft the early Mac prototypes. Gates liked the ideas and agreed to write Mac applications.
Gates later threatened to pull their apps at the last minute before release unless Jobs agreed to -
A) Apple had to license some of the MacUI for MS-Applications on the PC. This Application suite later grew into Windows 1.0 and Office. Remember, Windows started off as an Application Suite, not an OS-Shell
So are you saying because Jobs tried to be a nice guy that we're in the Windows/Mac world today? Or would have Gates gotten his hands on the code anyway?
It seems like Apple made a wrong move even getting involved with apps from MS....guess there were no decent programmers to write the Mac's own productivity suite at the time?
So are you saying because Jobs tried to be a nice guy that we're in the Windows/Mac world today? Or would have Gates gotten his hands on the code anyway?
It seems like Apple made a wrong move even getting involved with apps from MS....guess there were no decent programmers to write the Mac's own productivity suite at the time?
I'm saying that in the past, when Microsoft found it advantageous to threaten pulling Office from the Mac, they did so.
Apple needed Mac applications commercially available at launch, and they knew that Microsoft was trying to get into producing Applications. I'm guessing Apple had a good experience with Microsoft licensing Applesoft Basic for the II+ from them in '79 (IIRC)?
Apple wont steal MS thunder as MS has the $ to make thunder.
No kidding with that kind of money you can buy the weather. Hell they could have the thunder and and buy a plain to do "cloud salting" and have a pretty rainbow too.
Dobby wouldn't that make a funny t-shirt, you know the kind, where it says "All I got from the OS X release was a lousy t-shirt!" on it
My only question is with all the apps Apple has come up with of late that are FAR superior to anything you can find on windows (GarageBand, Mail, iCal, iPhoto, iTunes) is it REALLY that hard to make a WORD PROCESSING PROGRAM (and dont say appleworks because frankly, it sucks as it is currently) and just bundle it with OSX and be like "Here, in OSX, you get EVERYTHING FOR FREE, mail, photo, music, word, contacts, dvd authoring, ......." and at the same time also screw MS with them not recieving their 200$+ for every copy of office they sell. Come on apple....just write 1 little program that will help push all those educational computers you want to keep selling!
you mean longhorn in 2007 as in 2006 is when its susposto go to beta testers so i think we will have OSX 10.6 befor longhorn comes out. and watch ms steal some udeas from osx to put in it. they allways steal others ideas
At the same time, Sculley became locked in a battle with Microsoft's Bill Gates over the introduction of Windows 1.0, which had many similarities to the Mac GUI. Gates finally agreed to sign a statement to the effect that Microsoft would not use Mac technology in Windows 1.0--it said nothing of future versions of Windows, and Gates' lawyers made sure it was airtight. Apple had effectively lost exclusive rights to its interface design. This would prove to be an important document in future lawsuits between Apple and Microsoft, involving the Windows interface.
If you overthink it, sculley is the reasson why windows has the right to exist. it's all his fault.
Longhorn is also going to have the new user interface. they call it Aero. it'll be similar to Quartz. so expect Longhorn to have innovative and original interface stuff like genie effects and pulsing buttons and magnifying dock icons...
...in otherwords, the current 'visual' advantage Mac Os has will be in direct competition with Windows by then...
Longhorn is also going to have the new user interface. they call it Aero. it'll be similar to Quartz. so expect Longhorn to have innovative and original interface stuff like genie effects and pulsing buttons and magnifying dock icons...
...in otherwords, the current 'visual' advantage Mac Os has will be in direct competition with Windows by then...
what a pity. i thought the battle is won, now and forever.
BTW: could someone explain me the meaning of innovation.
...in otherwords, the current 'visual' advantage Mac Os has will be in direct competition with Windows by then...
But by "then" Quartz won't be in its "current" incarnation either.
Besides, has MS figured out what to do that's useful with this rendering and compositing model? Actually, it is just compositing (Quartz compositing) and not rendering (Quartz 2D) we're talking about with Aero?
But by "then" Quartz won't be in its "current" incarnation either.
Besides, has MS figured out what to do that's useful with this rendering and compositing model? Actually, it is just compositing (Quartz compositing) and not rendering (Quartz 2D) we're talking about with Aero?
i have no idea :P but i'll take blind swing at it...
...sometime ago i read a rumor that Microsoft was interested in aquiring some of the technology from Creature House. i'm not sure what this means or even if it is true (maybe i should be doing some research on this again). Creature House produces a vector imaging software called Expression. it renders natural media effects...
Microsoft has indeed acquired Creature House, mainly for this application :: http://www.creaturehouse.com/lcels.htm. Rumour has it they will be using this for their 'Quatz' version of the graphics layer, and also they are working on their own (OS) integrated version of flash together with Macromedia. Can't quite remember where I read all this but if true it's a scary thought. I'll mean all future flash content creation will be tied to the PC platform or that some specific flash stuff will only be playable on a PC.
Microsoft has indeed acquired Creature House, mainly for this application :: http://www.creaturehouse.com/lcels.htm. Rumour has it they will be using this for their 'Quatz' version of the graphics layer, and also they are working on their own (OS) integrated version of flash together with Macromedia. Can't quite remember where I read all this but if true it's a scary thought. I'll mean all future flash content creation will be tied to the PC platform or that some specific flash stuff will only be playable on a PC.
thanks for the update. i was wondering if the purchase was related to the Windows Os..
But by "then" Quartz won't be in its "current" incarnation either.
hmm ... yes it would be interesting to see what sort of graphical elements Apple has planned for future Aqua... if it's still going to be Aqua?!?!... as it is, the Mac Os seems to be following a path of Cirque Du Soleil-izations... (figuratively speaking)
I was thinking in terms of behavioral changes, as it's given that the looks will change in some fashionable way.
While Microsoft it sounds will implement this vector-based graphics rendering into Longhorn or the next major release of Windows, again, like people were asking of OS X when it first came out, what are the beneficial side effects of this technology? That's not to doubt its usefulness, I'm interested in how people figure out how to take advantage of this stuff in a way that actually makes the user's experience easier or delivers more options to them.
I look back at where Mac OS X came from on both the Mac and NeXT sides, and the path they describe I think can help point to future ideas for UIs as well as omissions that might find life again. It's also interesting to see how the (to use a pretentious word) philosophy of Apple's UI development begins to differ more from Microsoft's approach to UI design. I think they're on divergent paths, both having the desktop metaphor as the common root and have very different ideas about what users are trying to get from their computers. I bet that though both the Mac OS and Windows will have the same graphics technology in one sense or another, they will each have very different implementations of this technology in a practical way. Windows seems to be interested in handling all sorts of data with a common set of tools whose behaviors change per the kind of data. The Mac OS is attempting to handle all different kinds of data in a consistent fashion, thereby creating a myriad of discrete tools. So how the same basic graphic technology is used by these developers could make them look and feel totally dissimilar.
I think what apple should do is to come out with totally redesigned OS's each time windows come out with new OS's which look like the current mac os's. Eventually MS would get sick of playing catch up and start to make its own OS and stop copying Macs.
Comments
Originally posted by Vox Barbara
I don't believe that "either offive or plain nothin'" story anyway. But, just stretching, if that story contains any sort of truth in it, THAN indeed it is simply called "blackmailing", isn't it?
It's closer to coercion, but this is Microsoft, they get away with it all the time.
(Blackmail = 'getting money through intimidation'. Coercion = 'compelling by force of authority')
But it wouldn't be the first time:
Jobs showed Microsoft the early Mac prototypes. Gates liked the ideas and agreed to write Mac applications.
Gates later threatened to pull their apps at the last minute before release unless Jobs agreed to -
A) Apple had to license some of the MacUI for MS-Applications on the PC. This Application suite later grew into Windows 1.0 and Office. Remember, Windows started off as an Application Suite, not an OS-Shell
It seems like Apple made a wrong move even getting involved with apps from MS....guess there were no decent programmers to write the Mac's own productivity suite at the time?
Originally posted by Phroggy
It's closer to coercion, but this is Microsoft, they get away with it all the time.
(Blackmail = 'getting money through intimidation'. Coercion = 'compelling by force of authority')
But it wouldn't be the first time:
Anyway, ... er ... i like your signature. It is very well thought out.
Originally posted by fred_lj
So are you saying because Jobs tried to be a nice guy that we're in the Windows/Mac world today? Or would have Gates gotten his hands on the code anyway?
It seems like Apple made a wrong move even getting involved with apps from MS....guess there were no decent programmers to write the Mac's own productivity suite at the time?
I'm saying that in the past, when Microsoft found it advantageous to threaten pulling Office from the Mac, they did so.
Apple needed Mac applications commercially available at launch, and they knew that Microsoft was trying to get into producing Applications. I'm guessing Apple had a good experience with Microsoft licensing Applesoft Basic for the II+ from them in '79 (IIRC)?
Vox: uh... thanks? ... I think...
Apple wont steal MS thunder as MS has the $ to make thunder.
No kidding with that kind of money you can buy the weather. Hell they could have the thunder and and buy a plain to do "cloud salting" and have a pretty rainbow too.
Dobby wouldn't that make a funny t-shirt, you know the kind, where it says "All I got from the OS X release was a lousy t-shirt!" on it
At the same time, Sculley became locked in a battle with Microsoft's Bill Gates over the introduction of Windows 1.0, which had many similarities to the Mac GUI. Gates finally agreed to sign a statement to the effect that Microsoft would not use Mac technology in Windows 1.0--it said nothing of future versions of Windows, and Gates' lawyers made sure it was airtight. Apple had effectively lost exclusive rights to its interface design. This would prove to be an important document in future lawsuits between Apple and Microsoft, involving the Windows interface.
If you overthink it, sculley is the reasson why windows has the right to exist. it's all his fault.
...in otherwords, the current 'visual' advantage Mac Os has will be in direct competition with Windows by then...
Originally posted by ghiangelo
Longhorn is also going to have the new user interface. they call it Aero. it'll be similar to Quartz. so expect Longhorn to have innovative and original interface stuff like genie effects and pulsing buttons and magnifying dock icons...
...in otherwords, the current 'visual' advantage Mac Os has will be in direct competition with Windows by then...
what a pity. i thought the battle is won, now and forever.
BTW: could someone explain me the meaning of innovation.
Originally posted by ghiangelo
...in otherwords, the current 'visual' advantage Mac Os has will be in direct competition with Windows by then...
But by "then" Quartz won't be in its "current" incarnation either.
Besides, has MS figured out what to do that's useful with this rendering and compositing model? Actually, it is just compositing (Quartz compositing) and not rendering (Quartz 2D) we're talking about with Aero?
Originally posted by dobby
All I got from the OS X release was a lousy t-shirt!
I got a rock.
Sorry, couldn't resist.
Originally posted by BuonRotto
But by "then" Quartz won't be in its "current" incarnation either.
Besides, has MS figured out what to do that's useful with this rendering and compositing model? Actually, it is just compositing (Quartz compositing) and not rendering (Quartz 2D) we're talking about with Aero?
i have no idea :P but i'll take blind swing at it...
...sometime ago i read a rumor that Microsoft was interested in aquiring some of the technology from Creature House. i'm not sure what this means or even if it is true (maybe i should be doing some research on this again). Creature House produces a vector imaging software called Expression. it renders natural media effects...
Originally posted by macanoid?
Microsoft has indeed acquired Creature House, mainly for this application :: http://www.creaturehouse.com/lcels.htm. Rumour has it they will be using this for their 'Quatz' version of the graphics layer, and also they are working on their own (OS) integrated version of flash together with Macromedia. Can't quite remember where I read all this but if true it's a scary thought. I'll mean all future flash content creation will be tied to the PC platform or that some specific flash stuff will only be playable on a PC.
thanks for the update. i was wondering if the purchase was related to the Windows Os..
Originally posted by BuonRotto
But by "then" Quartz won't be in its "current" incarnation either.
hmm ... yes it would be interesting to see what sort of graphical elements Apple has planned for future Aqua... if it's still going to be Aqua?!?!... as it is, the Mac Os seems to be following a path of Cirque Du Soleil-izations... (figuratively speaking)
While Microsoft it sounds will implement this vector-based graphics rendering into Longhorn or the next major release of Windows, again, like people were asking of OS X when it first came out, what are the beneficial side effects of this technology? That's not to doubt its usefulness, I'm interested in how people figure out how to take advantage of this stuff in a way that actually makes the user's experience easier or delivers more options to them.
I look back at where Mac OS X came from on both the Mac and NeXT sides, and the path they describe I think can help point to future ideas for UIs as well as omissions that might find life again. It's also interesting to see how the (to use a pretentious word) philosophy of Apple's UI development begins to differ more from Microsoft's approach to UI design. I think they're on divergent paths, both having the desktop metaphor as the common root and have very different ideas about what users are trying to get from their computers. I bet that though both the Mac OS and Windows will have the same graphics technology in one sense or another, they will each have very different implementations of this technology in a practical way. Windows seems to be interested in handling all sorts of data with a common set of tools whose behaviors change per the kind of data. The Mac OS is attempting to handle all different kinds of data in a consistent fashion, thereby creating a myriad of discrete tools. So how the same basic graphic technology is used by these developers could make them look and feel totally dissimilar.