Bush: Hypocrite?
Ahhhh rember a few months ago that little flap about the moveon contest where one entry equated Bush with Adolf? Rember all the buzz associated with that unjust comparison?
Well, it seems Bush has now resorted to that very tactic. No, this isn't some contest entry for an unaffiliated organizations contest, this is right on the Bush web site.
Here it is: Kerry=Hitler the BushCo spin
http://www.georgewbush.com/blog/arch...20.html#001194
click on Kerry's head
Have fun boys and girls.
Well, it seems Bush has now resorted to that very tactic. No, this isn't some contest entry for an unaffiliated organizations contest, this is right on the Bush web site.
Here it is: Kerry=Hitler the BushCo spin
http://www.georgewbush.com/blog/arch...20.html#001194
click on Kerry's head
Have fun boys and girls.
Comments
DOOMED I SAY!
Bush isn't comparing anyone to Hitler.
That piece is merely footage of anti-Bush speeches and the Hitler bit is FROM moveon.org's ad. It's to show how hopelessly over the top and embarrassing the drooling, rabid, anyone-but-Bush-at-all-costs freaks are.
And this is coming from someone that isn't a Republican (me). I did not and will not vote for Bush.
I think the piece sucks for many reasons (not focused enough for one). But it is not equating anyone with Hitler.
If you see "Hitler" in any of the speakers body language and rage blame the various Democrats and (whatever the Left wants to be called today) themselves. They lowered themselves in their craven appeal to mob rally mentality. The spittle and flushed cheeks are their own fault, not Bush's.
The piece clearly depicts moveon.org's comparison of Bush to Hitler. That certain people have acted out of control on video is their own fault. The vast majority of voters do not want screaming, flushed, breathless, spiteful hyperbole.
When Bush is re-elected (God forbid) you'll know why, based on the behavior depicted in this ad.
But this is what the world has come to. One cannot speak eloquently and be heard. There are truly no worthy candidates. They are all apes.
Originally posted by superkarate monkeydeathcar
if the G.O.P. were to run that spot they'd be doomed.....
DOOMED I SAY!
What an obnoxious post. I still don't see anything.
(double post)
Originally posted by ShawnJ
I don't see it...
hmmm...neither do I.... perhaps they canned it?
Originally posted by johnq
Wow. You t-h-o-r-o-u-g-h-l-y don't get it.
Bush isn't comparing anyone to Hitler.
That piece is merely footage of anti-Bush speeches and the Hitler bit is FROM moveon.org. It's to show how hopelessly over the top and embarrasing the drooling, rabid, anyone-but-Bush-at-all-costs freaks are.
And this is coming from someone that isn't a Republican (me).
I think the piece sucks for many reasons (not focused enough for one). But it is not equating anyone with Hitler.
If you see "Hitler" in any of the speakers body language and rage blame the various Democrats and (whatever the Left wants to be called today) themselves. They lowered themselves in their craven appeal to mob rally mentality. The spittle and flushed cheeks are their own fault, not Bush's.
But this is what the world has come to. One cannot speak eloquently and be heard. There are truly no worthy candidates. They are all apes.
It seems like you're arguing two separate things here: 1) that the clip doesn't compare any democrat to hitler (which ignores the very similar oratorical snippets from gore, kerry, dean, gephardt, and moore) and 2) it's not the bush campaign's fault any of the above democrats sound similar to Hitler.
Which is it?
and It shows them as fired up and passionate . . .
It is pretty poorly made. It could only be meaningful in the way that it is intended if you allready thought Gore was 'insane' like the echo-chamber wants us to believe.
But I do see what you (faust9) are saying, they are takinng the moveon.org stuff and through juxtaposition trying to make us associate it with the speakers pictured . . . as well as trying to also show the 'rage and pessimism' of the Dems . .
Reminds me of a good bumper sticker: if you are not outraged then you are not paying attention.
Originally posted by SDW2001
Seriously...I don't see how how you can claim Kerry is being compared to Hitler. I had just watched it before coming to the boards tonight, and I didn't even think of that. There's really no new material. That's all from the MoveOn.org spot. It's a compilation making an obvious point...whether you agree with that particular point or not.
For Christ's sake man. You have to click Kerry's head to watch it. The entire clip is interspersed with Hitler moments (on Bush's web site mind you) and just before the positive Bush message we see a Kerry photo with the words "This is not the time for pessimism and rage."
JohnQ you are off base. They are trying to link the current democratic "rage" with Nazi Germany.
PS. those who can't see it, click on the \\black and white photo of Kerry center screen near the bottom of the web page or look for the words "Kerry's Coalition of the Wild-eyed" and click that link.
Originally posted by faust9
For Christ's sake man. You have to click Kerry's head to watch it. The entire clip is interspersed with Hitler moments (on Bush's web site mind you) and just before the positive Bush message we see a Kerry photo with the words "This is not the time for pessimism and rage."
JohnQ you are off base. They are trying to link the current democratic "rage" with Nazi Germany.
PS. those who can't see it, click on the \\black and white photo of Kerry center screen near the bottom of the web page or look for the words "Kerry's Coalition of the Wild-eyed" and click that link.
You're insane. These are pre-existing anti-Bush attack ads and spots that Bush's campaign is using to show how angry the opposition is. The ads directly compare BUSH to Hitler, not Kerry. I'm not saying you have to agree with the Bush campaign position, but get real.
Originally posted by ShawnJ
It seems like you're arguing two separate things here: 1) that the clip doesn't compare any democrat to hitler (which ignores the very similar oratorical snippets from gore, kerry, dean, gephardt, and moore) and 2) it's not the bush campaign's fault any of the above democrats sound similar to Hitler.
Which is it?
1) The clip doesn't compare any Democrat to Hitler and 2) it's not the Bush campaign's fault any of the above Democrats sound similar to Hitler.
The clip, to me, says (mind you, I am merely phrasing it as I would imagine BushCo phrasing it - it is NOT my actual opinion, although I don't like the examples of over the top behavior either. It hurts MY side.):
"Here are some really out of control folks from the left, watch them yell and rant, oh, and look! They are even comparing me to Hitler! Isn't that outrageous? Is there no respect or dignity left? Do you really want people that will stoop to comparing people to Hitler so readily? Isn't it a shame that this screaming, red-faced, swearing pack of haters are the best the other side has to offer?"
That's the point, not to literally compare Kerry et al to Hitler. He is showing moveon.org's Hitler/Bush comparison specifically to say that doing so is outrageous.
Originally posted by SDW2001
You're insane. These are pre-existing anti-Bush attack ads and spots that Bush's campaign is using to show how angry the opposition is. The ads directly compare BUSH to Hitler, not Kerry. I'm not saying you have to agree with the Bush campaign position, but get real.
Moveon ad unaffiliated with Kerry. Bush ad PAID for by GWB. See the difference?
Originally posted by johnq
1) The clip doesn't compare any Democrat to Hitler and 2) it's not the Bush campaign's fault any of the above Democrats sound similar to Hitler.
Then why did the Bush campaign choose strikingly similar clips of Democrats and Hitler-- much like the MoveOn ad does with Bush and Hitler? Yeesh, John. It's a comparison, like it or not.
Originally posted by johnq
1) The clip doesn't compare any Democrat to Hitler and 2) it's not the Bush campaign's fault any of the above Democrats sound similar to Hitler.
The subtext is very clear - there are men speaking in loud voices on TV - Gore, Hitler, Dean, Moore, Gephardt, Hitler again, Kerry. The ad is entitled "the faces of the Democratic party." I don't usually go for the deconstructionist approach, but you have to be quite objective and distant not to see the similar way Hitler's speech is presented with the Democrats'. The juxtaposition of Hitler and his voice with the Democrats and their voices just hits you in the face.
And although the Hitler ad was beyond the pale, it was submitted by some anonymous person to an open ad contest. There was nothing wrong with any of the other speeches. I remember when Kerry said that, and he was smiling and laughing when he did. They cut the clip right before the humor was evident - and I think the humor was evident even in the clip it showed. Gore was giving a rousing speech to a rambunctious crowd, Moore wasn't saying anything any op-ed writers say every day, etc. It was the Hitler clip that provided the glue to the whole ad, which is why they dispersed the Hitler shots among the Democrats. The other clips alone would have meant nothing without the Hitler interspersed in there.
Originally posted by johnq
Wow. You t-h-o-r-o-u-g-h-l-y don't get it.
Bush isn't comparing anyone to Hitler.
That piece is merely footage of anti-Bush speeches and the Hitler bit is FROM moveon.org's ad. It's to show how hopelessly over the top and embarrassing the drooling, rabid, anyone-but-Bush-at-all-costs freaks are.
And this is coming from someone that isn't a Republican (me). I did not and will not vote for Bush.
I think the piece sucks for many reasons (not focused enough for one). But it is not equating anyone with Hitler.
If you see "Hitler" in any of the speakers body language and rage blame the various Democrats and (whatever the Left wants to be called today) themselves. They lowered themselves in their craven appeal to mob rally mentality. The spittle and flushed cheeks are their own fault, not Bush's.
The piece clearly depicts moveon.org's comparison of Bush to Hitler. That certain people have acted out of control on video is their own fault. The vast majority of voters do not want screaming, flushed, breathless, spiteful hyperbole.
When Bush is re-elected (God forbid) you'll know why, based on the behavior depicted in this ad.
But this is what the world has come to. One cannot speak eloquently and be heard. There are truly no worthy candidates. They are all apes.
John Q.....hang on. Moveon.org as an organization never compared Bush to Hitler. Last year, moveon.org ran a contest ("Bush in 30 seconds") in which they appealed to independent videographers, both amateur and professional, to submit a 30 second ad against Bush. More than 1500 entries were received, and there was one which was inspired by a Flash amination by "Symbolman" on the progressive/alternative media website
http://www.takebackthemedia.com
This Flash animation also does not actually compare Bush to Hitler, personally. It takes certain elements of Hitler's pre World War 2 rise to power starting with the burning of the Reichstag, and makes a comparison with the Bush regime's policies primarily post 9-11 (before 9-11 they were virtually directionless)
To complicate things a little, "Symbolman" from Take Back The Media teamed up with two videographers and they readapted another of his Flash animations, "Army of One", a take-off of the US Army's series of TV ads, the parody featuring the Bush Administration's treatment of war veterans: (slashed veterans' benefits, cut military family housing, attempted to cut extra benefits for troops being shot at in combat zones (Iraq and Afghanistan), and disallowed health care for reservists, and more). This commercial was accepted into the final 15, and they were asked to attend the moveon.org awards/judging in New York in January at the Hammerstein Theater, but when moveon.org discovered that amongst the entries, one was a comparison between Bush and Hitler, I believe they disowned and disqualified it. Furthermore, now being under the (mistaken) impression that Take Back the Media was also responsible, Eli Pariser, the founder of moveon.org emailed "Symbolman" and partners "People to People TV" in a very terse fashion. Both parties received several strongly worded emails on this subject, asking specifically if they endorsed comparing President Bush to Adolf Hitler personally, with the inference that the top 15 selected "Army of One" commercial would also be disqualified if they so did. Both parties assured Pariser vehemently that they DID NOT SANCTION THE COMPARISON.
Here's the rub: The GOP, not knowing (or bothering to find out) the true facts behind the case, decided to jump on it, and tarred Moveon.org as reckless and spiteful. Predictable, *this* part of the story got plenty of airing on the corporate media. I believe that both CNN and Fox made a meal of it, amongst others.
I am (very) anti-Bush myself, but I do not compare the two leaders personally. Perhaps the wellknown fact that GWB's grandfather, Prescott, who was busted on two counts under the US "Trading with the Enemy Act" for supporting Nazi Germany under Hitler may have helped foment some of the confusion.
Bush and Hitler are two entirely different propositions. GWB seems like a pretty affable guy who is in the wrong job and out of his depth, and he is surrounded by folk who control his every move, and have done and still doing some pretty awful stuff. But Hitler....don't even go there....the man was a truly evil monster of unparalleled proportion. You cannot make a credible comparison, period.
My 3.5¢
Originally posted by pfflam
I think its funny beccause I agree with everything that the Dems are saying in the clip, and to have them saying those things on a GOP website must get a few to thinking a little . .
and It shows them as fired up and passionate . . .
This is one of my other reasons for saying the piece is bad (from a technical or logical perspective).
It simply says far too many things that, if I were Bush, I certainly would not want to give any additional air time to these statements, no matter that the delivery of the lines is over the top. It simply isn't worth giving the other side the free publicity.
Dumb of them, but hey, if it makes him lose, fine by me.
It doesn't matter to Bush and supporters (and likely any prospective Bush voters) what connection moveon.org actually had to the Hitler/Bush piece, all that matters is that a supporter (no matter how unrepresentative) of moveon.org saw fit to create a piece that compared Bush to Hitler. Fair? Hell no. It's dirty politics, no doubt. But perception is everything and moveon.org's contest provided the Right (if unintentionally) with plenty of fodder.
Truth and reality doesn't matter to Bush and ~50% of the country. I hope you realize that. If you are relying on Americans to rally around speakers of the truth, we're dead already. The fact that moveon.org didn't make the piece will not matter to them (and won't really ever be made known anyway).
The onus is on the Democrats etc. to act respectably, responsibly, and set a better example of leadership and statesmanship than Bush - NOT to stoop to his level or play into his hands by using scare tactics, hateful rhetoric and rousing the mobs to into a fury. Doing so simply gives Bush more examples of the Hitlerian public speaking style.
Take the high road and DON'T GIVE BUSH ANYTHING THAT HE CAN USE AGAINST YOU.
I can't say it any more clearly than that.
Originally posted by johnq
Take the high road and DON'T GIVE BUSH ANYTHING THAT HE CAN USE AGAINST YOU.
I can't say it any more clearly than that.
While I agree that people shouldn't generally act like idiots (who can disagree with that?), the clips in the bush video are perfectly acceptable in their original contexts. Clipping only the more passionate moments and interspersing them with passionate Hitler clips is not acceptable. Is the Bush campaign responsible for that? Of course they are.