If it was a guy teacher with a girl student he'd be in for life or a for a looong time. So why not use the same standards. It's that simple. Girls are just as horny as guys even at age 14. But even if they want to have sex they shouldn't be allowed to with someone so much older or even at all since they don't know the seriousness and importance of birth control and STD protection. I think the current laws in the US are about right. Age of consent is 16 most places right?
You think by cutting off the adults, these 14 yr old girls will suddenly not have sex? If they are bold enough, you can be sure they will find it. So that then means they'll just be having sex with other like-aged persons...who have even less experience with birth control and STD's, not to mention a less responsible grasp on the matter, not to mention less expertise in actually making it pleasurable (i.e., doing the job "right"). So nothing was served here with that silly rule, except putting them into a comparatively worse situation.
I believe the standard should be the same for adult male and adult female, but more importantly, the standard should be eliminated altogether. It's a silly standard based on archaic principles.
Now I'm not advocating for dirty old men to scour the streets to molest the youngest girls they can find. There is definitely something wrong there. However, if a coupling between 2 consential persons occurs, we should not be so quick to say that wrong has been done. It entirely depends on the details of the incident, and if someone is indeed "complaining" for action.
The two-pronged approach of having a age of consent, combined with a defence of nearness in age only really makes sense if you look at it in terms of the actual relationship between the parties and the conclusions you can draw from them.
Where there's a big gap in age and experience, as pfflam has pointed out, there's likely to be a pretty big imbalance in the power relationship between the parties, and that opens up the possibility for a pretty serious abuse of trust on the part of the older corespondent. The kinds of pressure we're talking about are things like: pressure to consent, pressure not to talk about it, assertions that the activity/pressure is normal and shouldn't be complained about... people who don't think this kind of thing is a problem should go and read some trial transcripts from child sex abuse cases. Children (and I think 14 y.o.'s generally are children) really can't stand up for themselves in the face of concerted pressure from an adult in many situations. The fact that it was a teacher in this case only makes this more obvious.
Where you've got two people of the same age, however, they're much more likely to be able to meet the other party on the same terms, and so, at least for an outsider, it's much easier to surmise that consent is genuine.
Frankly, as an adult, I don't think it's possible to assume (or even know) that consent with a partner this young is genuine, and I think that proceeding with sex in that situation is culpable enough to deserve punishment.
Responsibility in having sex (contraception and safe-sex) is a bit of a furphy here... I'm not convinced that the kind of person who takes advantage of the vulnerability of young people is the kind of person who cares about that kind of thing.
From a personal point of view, I would have been scared shitless if a teacher had come on to me when I was 14... I very much doubt I would have enjoyed it.
Children (and I think 14 y.o.'s generally are children) really can't stand up for themselves in the face of concerted pressure from an adult in many situations.
This I would agree with, except the "concerted pressure" is something that should be ascertained, not assumed. Concerted pressure can happen at any age, really. There's ever so many strategies and ploys used to manipulate a 24 yr old into bed, as well. When you get down to it, it gets pretty far from simple consent, regardless of age.
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Where you've got two people of the same age, however, they're much more likely to be able to meet the other party on the same terms, and so, at least for an outsider, it's much easier to surmise that consent is genuine.
Violations of consent are no more clearer here, either, when you factor in very real pressures to "be cool", "follow the hip crowd", and "act grown-up". There is hardly the preponderance of innocence in a sexually-charged middle-school/high school environment.
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Frankly, as an adult, I don't think it's possible to assume (or even know) that consent with a partner this young is genuine, and I think that proceeding with sex in that situation is culpable enough to deserve punishment.
This is an assumptive leap, a justification to ignore the details of the incident and just affix a punishment.
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Responsibility in having sex (contraception and safe-sex) is a bit of a furphy here... I'm not convinced that the kind of person who takes advantage of the vulnerability of young people is the kind of person who cares about that kind of thing.
This makes another assumption of a type of person. If the details of the case match, then fine, but it is simply wrong to just look at the external details and then shoehorn the "offender" into a necessarily sinister profile.
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From a personal point of view, I would have been scared shitless if a teacher had come on to me when I was 14... I very much doubt I would have enjoyed it.
Some 14 yr olds are psychologically ready for such an encounter and some are not. It entirely depends on the "real" age of the person, and the closeness of the relationship. Maybe they had developed a closer than casual bond (meaning that perhaps it wasn't perceived as being hit on by your "teacher", but seemingly by the "coolest" friend you have at the moment)? The whole notion of biological age is riddled with fault in assessing a situation.
The whole notion of biological age is riddled with fault in assessing a situation.
What's the age of consent in the Netherlands, 11? I think that's what I heard. If you have the permission of the parents you can date an 11 year old. Does anyone know?
What's the age of consent in the Netherlands, 11? I think that's what I heard. If you have the permission of the parents you can date an 11 year old. Does anyone know?
I believe it is 14, I don't think it is 11, thats just plain wrong by anyones standards.
Its interesting though, that here in the UK it is 16, I could theoretically, go to another country and legally have sex, while if I did that here, I'd be locked away, have to register with the police weekly as a sex offender, for life. lose all chance of a normal life, and be labelled as a sick pervert. Fortunately, I find most girls under 23 to be so fucking irratating and obnoxious little self centered bitches that I've made a rule not to hit anyone under 20.
Likewise, an American could come to the UK and do the same. I doubt most people here would make a fuss if you came over here and hit a 16/17 y/o, (as long as you're not 30+) but you'd be labelled badly if you did it at home.
I first did the nasty, when I was 14, with a 15 y/o girl, Thats been pretty harmless for the both of us. Most girls i've had have been within 1-2 years of my age (*cough* apart from xxxxx's mum!*cough*) Im sure that sex is pretty common around 14+ years, some people get really hurt, some wish they had waited a bit longer in retrospect, and some people are comfortable with it. There are people who cannot handle sex at any age. I think its just a fact of life that people have been having sex regardless of the rules for thousands of years, and as long as its consentual I dont really think there needs to be a huge fuss. If someone gets emotionally hurt through their choice, its just a lesson of life. I'd question the morals of someone of 20+ having consential sex with a 14 y/o. Over 25, i'd probably press to prosecute, under 20, I'd just warn them it was stupid.
I'd place a large bet that this kid loved every second of it - and the grass was simply jealous. No doubt the kid will sue for emotional distress - thats America.
Comments
I believe the standard should be the same for adult male and adult female, but more importantly, the standard should be eliminated altogether. It's a silly standard based on archaic principles.
Now I'm not advocating for dirty old men to scour the streets to molest the youngest girls they can find. There is definitely something wrong there. However, if a coupling between 2 consential persons occurs, we should not be so quick to say that wrong has been done. It entirely depends on the details of the incident, and if someone is indeed "complaining" for action.
Where there's a big gap in age and experience, as pfflam has pointed out, there's likely to be a pretty big imbalance in the power relationship between the parties, and that opens up the possibility for a pretty serious abuse of trust on the part of the older corespondent. The kinds of pressure we're talking about are things like: pressure to consent, pressure not to talk about it, assertions that the activity/pressure is normal and shouldn't be complained about... people who don't think this kind of thing is a problem should go and read some trial transcripts from child sex abuse cases. Children (and I think 14 y.o.'s generally are children) really can't stand up for themselves in the face of concerted pressure from an adult in many situations. The fact that it was a teacher in this case only makes this more obvious.
Where you've got two people of the same age, however, they're much more likely to be able to meet the other party on the same terms, and so, at least for an outsider, it's much easier to surmise that consent is genuine.
Frankly, as an adult, I don't think it's possible to assume (or even know) that consent with a partner this young is genuine, and I think that proceeding with sex in that situation is culpable enough to deserve punishment.
Responsibility in having sex (contraception and safe-sex) is a bit of a furphy here... I'm not convinced that the kind of person who takes advantage of the vulnerability of young people is the kind of person who cares about that kind of thing.
From a personal point of view, I would have been scared shitless if a teacher had come on to me when I was 14... I very much doubt I would have enjoyed it.
Originally posted by staphbaby
Children (and I think 14 y.o.'s generally are children) really can't stand up for themselves in the face of concerted pressure from an adult in many situations.
This I would agree with, except the "concerted pressure" is something that should be ascertained, not assumed. Concerted pressure can happen at any age, really. There's ever so many strategies and ploys used to manipulate a 24 yr old into bed, as well. When you get down to it, it gets pretty far from simple consent, regardless of age.
Quote:
Where you've got two people of the same age, however, they're much more likely to be able to meet the other party on the same terms, and so, at least for an outsider, it's much easier to surmise that consent is genuine.
Violations of consent are no more clearer here, either, when you factor in very real pressures to "be cool", "follow the hip crowd", and "act grown-up". There is hardly the preponderance of innocence in a sexually-charged middle-school/high school environment.
Quote:
Frankly, as an adult, I don't think it's possible to assume (or even know) that consent with a partner this young is genuine, and I think that proceeding with sex in that situation is culpable enough to deserve punishment.
This is an assumptive leap, a justification to ignore the details of the incident and just affix a punishment.
Quote:
Responsibility in having sex (contraception and safe-sex) is a bit of a furphy here... I'm not convinced that the kind of person who takes advantage of the vulnerability of young people is the kind of person who cares about that kind of thing.
This makes another assumption of a type of person. If the details of the case match, then fine, but it is simply wrong to just look at the external details and then shoehorn the "offender" into a necessarily sinister profile.
Quote:
From a personal point of view, I would have been scared shitless if a teacher had come on to me when I was 14... I very much doubt I would have enjoyed it.
Some 14 yr olds are psychologically ready for such an encounter and some are not. It entirely depends on the "real" age of the person, and the closeness of the relationship. Maybe they had developed a closer than casual bond (meaning that perhaps it wasn't perceived as being hit on by your "teacher", but seemingly by the "coolest" friend you have at the moment)? The whole notion of biological age is riddled with fault in assessing a situation.
Originally posted by Randycat99
The whole notion of biological age is riddled with fault in assessing a situation.
What's the age of consent in the Netherlands, 11? I think that's what I heard. If you have the permission of the parents you can date an 11 year old. Does anyone know?
Originally posted by bunge
What's the age of consent in the Netherlands, 11? I think that's what I heard. If you have the permission of the parents you can date an 11 year old. Does anyone know?
I believe it is 14, I don't think it is 11, thats just plain wrong by anyones standards.
Its interesting though, that here in the UK it is 16, I could theoretically, go to another country and legally have sex, while if I did that here, I'd be locked away, have to register with the police weekly as a sex offender, for life. lose all chance of a normal life, and be labelled as a sick pervert. Fortunately, I find most girls under 23 to be so fucking irratating and obnoxious little self centered bitches that I've made a rule not to hit anyone under 20.
Likewise, an American could come to the UK and do the same. I doubt most people here would make a fuss if you came over here and hit a 16/17 y/o, (as long as you're not 30+) but you'd be labelled badly if you did it at home.
I first did the nasty, when I was 14, with a 15 y/o girl, Thats been pretty harmless for the both of us. Most girls i've had have been within 1-2 years of my age (*cough* apart from xxxxx's mum!*cough*) Im sure that sex is pretty common around 14+ years, some people get really hurt, some wish they had waited a bit longer in retrospect, and some people are comfortable with it. There are people who cannot handle sex at any age. I think its just a fact of life that people have been having sex regardless of the rules for thousands of years, and as long as its consentual I dont really think there needs to be a huge fuss. If someone gets emotionally hurt through their choice, its just a lesson of life. I'd question the morals of someone of 20+ having consential sex with a 14 y/o. Over 25, i'd probably press to prosecute, under 20, I'd just warn them it was stupid.
I'd place a large bet that this kid loved every second of it - and the grass was simply jealous. No doubt the kid will sue for emotional distress - thats America.